Is Playing a DVD Harder Than Rocket Science?

dacut writes "After successfully repairing the Hubble Space Telescope, astronauts aboard the shuttle Atlantis found themselves with a free day due to thunderstorms which delayed their return. They attempted to pass the time by watching movies, only to find that their laptops did not have the proper software, and Houston was unable to help. No word, alas, on what software was involved, though we can assume that software/codec updates are a tad difficult when you're orbiting the planet at 17,200MPH."

Comments

VLC

[jeffhenson]

Too bad vlc wasn't part of their default software.

Re:VLC

[rxan]

I was just going to say, shoulda got VLC. My buddy had a DVD that wouldn't even play on DVD players or a PS2. Got VLC, no problem.

Re:VLC

[fractoid]

Isn't there a small issue with this being a government-funded space mission, and VLC being somewhat in breach of the DMCA or software patents or something due to its inclusion of a not-paid-up DVD decoder? I may be out of date on this issue, but I'm pretty sure they wouldn't have VLC for the same reason they wouldn't encode mp3s with LAME.

Re:VLC

[Opportunist]

And that's why Russian spacecraft will always outlast US spacecraft. They may be prone to a wee bit more error, but in general you get the feeling the underlying idea is "screw protocol, what matters is it works!"

But then again... After all, the Soviet Union also failed because sticking to doctrine and doing it "the marxist way" was more important than logic, reason and real life requirements (amongst other shortcomings). It could now be the downfall of "our western" system as well. It doesn't matter anymore what is logic, reasonable or actually required. It seems more and more "looking good" and "doing the 'right' thing" is more important than accomplishing anything.

Re:VLC

[fractoid]

Plus the Russians will always be more relaxed because, you know, they've got cool tunes to listen to.

Actually, I think lack of respect for patents and copyright laws is probably one of the big drivers in the Chinese economic boom. Because there's no artificial limitations on what you can build and sell, all manner of artefacts are effectively 'open source'.

Re:VLC

[sentientbeing]

The DMCA doesnt apply outside US borders.

Re:VLC

[sumdumass]

Yes and no. The DMCA applies to WIPO countries which have signed onto the WCT and the WPPT. the penalties might not be the same but the countries are obligated to the effects of the DMCA because it was pulled almost directly from those two treaties less the punishments.

This is how the US was able to extradite an Australian citizen to America for a violation of it. This is also why you see a lot of countries attempting to implement DMCA style laws.

Re:VLC

[hughk]

EU countries for example, have the reverse engineering exemption. If we have te right to use data, we can use whatever technical means to get at that data including reverse engineering for interoperability. The US doesn't like this and has been trying to force a change but it seems that it isn't going to happen.

Re:VLC

[Anonymous Coward]

Of course, one of the biggest obstacles to linux adoption is that Windows is effectively "open source".

That's the stupidest thing I ever heard. You are full of shit.

Re:VLC

[Rogerborg]

It's also cheaper to manufacture something if you don't have to pay your own design, research, development and marketing costs, and just clone someone else's work and sell into the market that they created.

Re:VLC

[mike2R]

Actually, I think lack of respect for patents and copyright laws is probably one of the big drivers in the Chinese economic boom. Because there's no artificial limitations on what you can build and sell, all manner of artefacts are effectively 'open source'.

It's a sensible way to develop an economy. Which is why the US didn't recognise foreign copyrights or patents until 1891.

Re:VLC

[TheRaven64]

Aircraft and ships come under rules similar to embassies of their country of registration and so that country's laws apply inside. I presume the same is true of spacecraft. They could use VLC if they took their laptop on a spacewalk though...

Re:VLC

[PsychoSlashDot]

It's also cheaper to manufacture something if you don't have to pay your own design, research, development and marketing costs, and just clone someone else's work and sell into the market that they created.

That's an interesting point. Manufacturing your widget in North America might cost X per widget. Having it mass-produced in a Chinese fab might cost X/2. But if the Chinese factory leaks your specs and a knock-off is released into your market, reducing your profits, that impacts your savings. Might the reduced profit justify paying the full X per widget and having it made somewhere with stricter rules?

Example: there are already some knock-off reproductions of the toys for the upcoming Transformers 2 movie. The original toys haven't even been released yet. (Tomorrow.)

Re:VLC

[JoeMerchant]

Plus the Russians will always be more relaxed because, you know, they've got cool tunes to listen to. Actually, I think lack of respect for patents and copyright laws is probably one of the big drivers in the Chinese economic boom. Because there's no artificial limitations on what you can build and sell, all manner of artefacts are effectively 'open source'.

Yes, and no. An awful lot of what's made in China in this "open source" manner is made by people who barely grasp what they are doing - a businessman hires a tech away from a rival company to set up some widget machine, so the other company limps along until their machine breaks and then they get someone to patch it together with chewing gum, and even the guy that hired the "expert" only pays him as little as possible to keep him around, so the "expert" likely learned about the machine in an apprentice sort of fashion working at yet another rival plant, etc. etc.

A lot of what they turn out is good, usable product at an amazing (low low Wal Mart) price, but a lot of it is on the ragged edge of being worthless junk when new, and you should expect 90% of it to fail within a very short time.

Harbor Freight vs Snap-On tools is a good case study. At Harbor Freight, you can equip a mechanic's toolbox for about 5 to 10% of the price of the same tools from Snap-On. Sure, the tools are crap, but almost all of them will work at least the first time you use them, and usually they'll last about 5 to 10% as long as the Snap-On tools, so, as long as you don't mind working with crap that falls apart on you 10 to 20 times as often, you're getting fair value from Harbor Freight, and really, 90% of the tools in the toolbox aren't used enough to make the Harbor Freight variety wear out, anyway - so it makes damn good sense to stock them, for those things that you really don't use often, or at all.

By the way, don't reply with any "you get what you pay for" cliche's, by stroke of fate, I have been given two $3K notebook PCs in the past 3 years (MacBook Pro and Sony Vaio), the first has a bad heat-sink on the GPU (that's really damn difficult to get at to repair) that causes the screen to lock-up every hour or so, and the second is sitting on my desk right now in a dozen pieces because the on-site warranty repair tech couldn't figure out how to get it back together after replacing the backlight, which started to flicker out to black after only 3 months. At some point, luxury tech starts to resemble owning a 1960's Jaguar - beautiful, but it costs more to maintain it in running order for 5000 miles than it does to purchase, and purchasing it ain't cheap.

Re:VLC

[John Hasler]

The DMCA explicitly permits "reverse-engineering" for interoperability. DMCA .

Re:VLC

[Anonymous Coward]

Isn't there a small issue with this being a government-funded space mission, and VLC being somewhat in breach of the DMCA or software patents or something due to its inclusion of a not-paid-up DVD decoder? I may be out of date on this issue, but I'm pretty sure they wouldn't have VLC for the same reason they wouldn't encode mp3s with LAME.

Well, we (~50,000 user enterprise) had that discussion with Microsoft ...

"We have 50k desks with XP and an enterprise license that says we're entitled to Vista, right?"
"Yes."

"But XP doesn't have MPEG2 codecs, does it?"
"No, but Vista does! You should upgrade. Urgently."

"Vista smells funny, so we won't be upgrading. But why don't you let us have the Vista MPEG2 codecs that we're entitled to, and we'll install them under XP."
"Em, no. We don't .. eh, support .. that configuration, you need to migrate to Vista!"

"Well, why don't we go ahead an install VLC codecs and call it even?"
"Aha! Because, per the Wikipedia page on MPEG2, you will need to pay the Motion Picture people a license for every desktop! You should install Vista, because it is fully licensed with the Motion Picture people, on your behalf - which makes it, like, free!"

"I see, so if you've paid the Motion Picture people for MPEG2 licensing on our behalf, but you won't provide us with the MPEG2 codecs, then we should be legally entitled to use the VLC win32 MPEG2 codecs, right?"
"Ahh .. ehhh .. "

lol.

Re:VLC

[Rogerborg]

'into the market that they created'? i think not. either the market was already there or it wasn't

How can a market "already be there" for a new product?

The iPod - the original iPod, when the alternatives were CD walkmen and minidisc players - created the market and the demand for Chinese iPod clones.

If you believe otherwise, I'd like a hit of what you're toking on.

Re:VLC

[fractoid]

But if the Chinese factory leaks your specs and a knock-off is released into your market, reducing your profits, that impacts your savings.

Leaks your specs? Nah, they just do another complete production run using the same factory line that they used to build your order.

When it becomes interesting is when they actually tweak your design a little, add a few more features that you missed. It seems to me that a totally free market like this actually drives innovation far harder than a traditional, copyright-and-patent-protected market because if the only market exclusivity your product has is the three months it takes your competitors to clone it, you'd damn well better come up with something new and _good_ in those three months to stay ahead of the curve. I would say that in 10 to 20 years' time, Chinese products will be more advanced than 'western' ones, purely due to this incredible market force.

Re:VLC

[jsoderba]

That's a good point. Most developed countries didn't get seriously concerned with IP law until they started exporting IP themselves. Japanese companies made a lot of knock-offs in the 1950s and 60s; Korea, Hong Kong and Taiwan followed in the 70s and 80s. Is it surprising then that China, India, Vietnam etc. do the same? The difference is perhaps that it is easier to spot in todays better informed market.

Re:VLC

[John Hasler]

> Borders extend vertically only in US law, not in the rest of the world...

They extend diagonally in the rest of the world? Your nation claims no airspace?

> ...another law that does not apply outside the USA

What law might that be?

While Congress has never enacted legislation formally defining the upper limit of US air space the most common administrative limit is 50 miles (80km). The USA certainly does not claim that its borders extend vertically to infinity. Space is clearly recognized by the US government as international territory.

Re:VLC

[Silentknyght]

How can a market "already be there" for a new product?

In economic terms, its called a substitute good. Any product, even nonexistent, exists in a market to which it is/will be a substitute good for some other product. I have a difficult time believing that any unrealized or otherwise imagined product could NOT be a substitute for a current good/service.

Re:VLC

[Steauengeglase]

Somewhat off-topic, but this is probably the single biggest argument for and against laissez-faire. On one hand, the guy selling cheapest is the guy selling most. On the other hand, well the people who say they are tired of regulation and taxation, never say they are sick and tired of patent protection.

Re:VLC

[bored]

Harbor Freight vs Snap-On tools is a good case study. At Harbor Freight, you can equip a mechanic's toolbox for about 5 to 10% of the price of the same tools from Snap-On. Sure, the tools are crap, but almost all of them will work at least the first time you use them, and usually they'll last about 5 to 10% as long as the Snap-On tools.

For the shade tree mechanic, lasting 10% as long as the quality tool, is still far longer than necessary. In other words I'm only using that drill for a couple hours a year instead of on a daily basis. The cheap Chinese junk is fantastic when you need some special tool to avoid having to call the "expert" to come out and charge you $1000 for a hours work. When your done you just throw the tool away. Frankly, in my opinion its a sign of how imbalanced the economy is.

That said, the problem with a lot of the HF tools is that they are simply junk, they sell machine tools that have so much play in them its impossible to produce anything but rough cuts. Their welders are incapable of maintaining any kind of reasonable duty cycle, etc.

By the way, don't reply with any "you get what you pay for" cliche's, by stroke of fate, I have been given two $3K notebook PCs in the past 3 years (MacBook Pro and Sony Vaio), the first has a bad heat-sink on the GPU

This has been true for a long time, and is one of the reasons I run windows on my machine. Using windows its pretty rare for me to think "how come no one else has seen this problem". My problems are rarer, and generally when i'm having one a quick google search turns up a solution. With other OS's (big UNIX's as well as linux). I'm always sitting around thinking "how did this get out of test, its completely broken, as I wait months for a vendor patch" which finally arrives and makes everything works as expected. I used to tell people I was cursed because the weirdest things would happen to me, then I realized it was because I was an unusual customer always checking out that cool new feature or buying some rare product. Now, I just buy junk unless its something I expect to use for a while, in those cases I also consider how long its been on the market or if what I'm doing is common.

Obligatory Family Guy quote

[phillymjs]

Brian [on phone with Jillian]: Uh huh. Uh huh. Uh, you gotta hit, uh, "DVD" and then "menu" and then "select." Yeah... Yeah, the DVD needs to be face-up when you put it in. Uh huh. You should be able to see the words "Mr. 3000" Yeah... Still nothing? Is it plugged in? Okay, so, plug it in...

~Philly

Likely cause...

[Manip]

Because DVD Playback requires a basic $5~ codec (for all the patent holders etc) some versions of Windows do not ship with it and thus without third party applications like PowerDVD or WinDVD that supply a codec, DVD Playback is "impossible."

I'm not sure I know a workaround without sending data to the station, either a codec or third party software that has a built-in decoder.

Another day, another victory for DRM!

Re:Likely cause...

[fuzzyfuzzyfungus]

Given that NASA's competence extends to wacky stunts like patching mars rover code by radio, and further given that DeCSS is pretty damn short, when you come right down to it they could probably have just gotten somebody on the ground to read it to them.

The bigger, more serious, question remains: "You are in space! Why are you watching DVDs?"

Re:Likely cause...

[syousef]

Because DVD Playback requires a basic $5~ codec (for all the patent holders etc) some versions of Windows do not ship with it and thus without third party applications like PowerDVD or WinDVD that supply a codec, DVD Playback is "impossible."

Pirates! Theives! No one sold them a license to play the DVD in space! Unless it's region 0 it must be illegal. Either that or your software would have to play one DVD per region in the Shuttle's orbit (and of synchronise switching between players while switching other players off to avoid licensing violations). No the lag they'd experience with playback is not an excuse!

Re:Likely cause...

[node 3]

Hubble is not in the normal space shuttle/ISS orbit, which made getting an Internet connection more difficult than usual. In their normal orbit, they just time their Internet downloads for when they are passing over Cringely's Pringles can WiFi antenna...

Re:Likely cause...

[DigiShaman]

Did I hear that right? They are the first Space Pirates ever? AWSOME!

Re:Likely cause...

[Anonymous Coward]

The bigger, more serious, question remains: "You are in space! Why are you watching DVDs?"

The view out the window is soooooo boring. Just a big blue and white ball, the moon and a billion stars you could just reach out and touch.

Re:Likely cause...

[fractoid]

So what you're saying is "If you stare too long into the abyss, you get bored and wanna watch DVDs"?

Re:Likely cause...

[MaskedSlacker]

Yes, but I wish I had said it like you did.

Re:Likely cause...

[Jurily]

"and further given that DeCSS is pretty damn short, when you come right down to it"

To clarify:

#include<stdlib.h>
typedef unsigned int uint;
char ctb[512]="33733b2663236b763e7e362b6e2e667bd393db0643034b96de9ed60b4e0e4\
69b57175f82c787cf125a1a528fca8ac21fd999d10049094190d898d001480840913d7d35246\
d2d65743c7c34256c2c6475dd9dd5044d0d4594dc9cd4054c0c449559195180c989c11058185\
081c888c011d797df0247074f92da9ad20f4a0a429f53135b86c383cb165e1e568bce8ec61bb\
3f3bba6e3a3ebf6befeb6abeeaee6fb37773f2267276f723a7a322f6a2a627fb9f9b1a0e9a9e\
1f0b8f8b0a1e8a8e0f15d1d5584cd8dc5145c1c5485cc8cc415bdfdb5a4edade5f4bcfcb4a5e\
cace4f539793120692961703878302168286071b7f7bfa2e7a7eff2bafab2afeaaae2ff";
typedef unsigned char uchar;uint tb0[11]={5,0,1,2,3,4,0,1,2,3,4};uchar* F=NULL;
uint lf0,lf1,out;void ReadKey(uchar* key){int i;char hst[3]; hst[2]=0;if(F==\
NULL){F=malloc(256);for(i=0;i<256;i++){hst[0]=ctb[2*i];hst[1]=ctb[2*i+1];F[i]=\
strtol(hst,NULL,16);}}out=0;lf0=(key[1]<<9)|key[0]|0x100;lf1=(key[4]<<16)|(key\
[3]<<8)|key[2];lf1=((lf1&0xfffff8)<<1)|(lf1&0x7)|0x8;}uchar Cipher(int sw1,\
int sw2){int i,a,b,x=0,y=0;for(i=0;i<8;i++){a=((lf0>>2)^(lf0>>16))&1;b=((lf1\
>>12)^(lf1>>20)^(lf1>>21)^(lf1>>24))&1;lf0=(lf0<<1)|a;lf1=(lf1<<1)|b;x=(x>>1)\
|(a<<7);y=(y>>1)|(b<<7);}x^=sw1;y^=sw2;return out=(out>>8)+x+y;} void \
CSSdescramble(uchar *sec,uchar *key){uint i;uchar *end=sec+0x800;uchar KEY[5];
for(i=0;i<5;i++)KEY[i]=key[i]^sec[0x54+i];ReadKey(KEY);sec+=0x80;while(sec!=\
end)*sec++=F[*sec]^Cipher(255,0);}void CSStitlekey1(uchar *key,uchar *im)
{uchar k[5];int i; ReadKey(im);for(i=0;i<5;i++)k[i]=Cipher(0,0);for(i=9;i>=0;\
i--)key[tb0[i+1]]=k[tb0[i+1]]^F[key[tb0[i+1]]]^key[tb0[i]];}void CSStitlekey2\
(uchar *key,uchar *im){uchar k[5];int i;ReadKey(im);for(i=0;i<5;i++)k[i]=\
Cipher(0,255);for(i=9;i>=0;i--)key[tb0[i+1]]=k[tb0[i+1]]^F[key[tb0[i+1]]]^key\
[tb0[i]];}void CSSdecrypttitlekey(uchar *tkey,uchar *dkey){int i;uchar im1[6];
uchar im2[6]={0x51,0x67,0x67,0xc5,0xe0,0x00};for(i=0;i<6;i++)im1[i]=dkey[i];
CSStitlekey1(im1,im2);CSStitlekey2(tkey,im1);}

Re:Likely cause...

[Fred_A]

Unless it's region 0 it must be illegal.

Not at all. That's specifically what region 8 is for.

Re:Likely cause...

[ubersoldat2k7]

Unless it's region 0 it must be illegal.

Not at all. That's specifically what region 8 is for.

Oh My God! Stupid lawyers always a step ahead!

Re:Likely cause...

[Jurily]

/*     efdtt.c     Author:  Charles M. Hannum <root@ihack.net>             */
/*                                                                         */
/*     Thanks to Phil Carmody <fatphil@asdf.org> for additional tweaks.    */
/*                                                                         */
/*     Length:  434 bytes (excluding unnecessary newlines)                 */
/*                                                                         */
/*     Usage is:  cat title-key scrambled.vob | efdtt >clear.vob           */

#define m(i)(x[i]^s[i+84])<<
unsigned char x[5],y,s[2048];main(n){for(read(0,x,5);read(0,s,n=2048);write(1,s
,n))if(s[y=s[13]%8+20]/16%4==1){int i=m(1)17^256+m(0)8,k=m(2)0,j=m(4)17^m(3)9^k
*2-k%8^8,a=0,c=26;for(s[y]-=16;--c;j*=2)a=a*2^i&1,i=i/2^j&1<<24;for(j=127;++j<n
;c=c>y)c+=y=i^i/8^i>>4^i>>12,i=i>>8^y<<17,a^=a>>14,y=a^a*8^a<<6,a=a>>8^y<<9,k=s
[j],k="7Wo~'G_\216"[k&7]+2^"cr3sfw6v;*k+>/n."[k>>4]*2^k*257/8,s[j]=k^(k&k*2&34)
*6^c+~y;}}

Whoops, my finger slipped.

Re:Likely cause...

[drizek]

No, they're the first people to get screwed by DRM in space.

Take that you commies!

Re:Likely cause...

[el3mentary]

We are scientists are we not?

Test the Theory:

DRM Sucks.

Re:Likely cause...

[Sj0]

After sticking the DVDs into a pressurized glass vessel with pitot tubes to measure air movement, there was no difference between DRM and control.

Therefore, DRM doesn't suck. It is ridiculous, however. We ridicule it on a daily basis.

Waste of fuel

[fatp]

So they bought DVDs without verifying that they could be played?

Completely waste of fuel...

Re:Waste of fuel

[xednieht]

Absolutely, how retarded is NASA to waste payload capacity on the medium when the movie itself is weightless.

They never heard of K-Lite?

[NotSoHeavyD3]

I mean if they don't want to use VLC. Doesn't media player classic also do DVD's?

I'm not surprised.

[ZombieRoboNinja]

Any idea how hard it is to get DVDs in the "Outer Space" region encoding?

Re:I'm not surprised.

[identity0]

There is no "outer space" region code, obviously. One simply switches the region code (or swap the disk in another player) each time the shuttle crosses over to a different region.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DVD_region_code

(on a more serious note, it seems there is a special region code for international venues such as aircraft)

Re:I'm not surprised.

[Opportunist]

Given the average content industry logic, it's probably "None. The market is too small so we can't find a local distributor, but no other distributor has the right to sell it there and you can't import it yourself due to restrictions. Sorry that you can't have that certain content in your outer space region."

license issues?

[Tim4444]

does drm cover space shuttles? i'd think they'd need some kinda special license for that. there's probably a nominal fee - maybe proportional to the velocity at time of viewing. or maybe someone had already watched the copy before launch so it had expired. there must be a patent on watching movies in 0g so someone needs to be paid.

Wow. They're in space and want to watch movies?!

[deek]

I guess even the view from space becomes boring after a while.

Maybe they could kick off the first ever game of Zero Gee Football. Surely they'd have a Red Dwarf fan amongst the crew who could suggest it.

Lifting dvds into space, why?

[Anonymous Coward]

Problem 1: Not testing that the laptops would be able to play the dvds before launching it all into space.

Problem 2: Has space flight become so routine and, dare I say it, boring for astronauts that they would prefer to watch dvds?

Problem 3: They honsetly spent taxpayer money to lift the mass of some DVDs into low orbit, when they should have just ripped the movies to the laptop's hard drive?

In ripped format there would be no fragile disks floating around in freefall, likely playable even with video players lacking actual DVD support, and most importantly wouldn't add to the fuel cost of lifting the shuttle into low orbit.

Yet another common sense fail by NASA.

Re:Lifting dvds into space, why?

[nausea_malvarma]

Then again, if they ripped the dvds, the MPAA would probably sue nasa or some shit.

Re:Lifting dvds into space, why?

[fwarren]

Someone like "Amazon" or "Apple" should provide Movies for the space missions. It is great PR. Each astronaut picks 5 movies or so, which get loaded onto the laptop. It saves NASA and the taxpayers money, because you don't have to pay for the fuel to lift the DVDs. Someone has made sure the software to view the movies is on the Laptop in whatever OS they are using. And who ever pulls off this PR stunt pays 1 or 2 bucks in royalties to the studios.

It sounds like a win-win to everyone involved.

A minor nit...

[HotNeedleOfInquiry]

It is not at all clear that they "repaired the Hubble successfully". They performed their jobs well, but we won't know whether the Hubble has been successfully repaired until it is calibrated and producing images.

When you're in space ...

[HW_Hack]

no one can hear you scream "AAARRRGGGHHHHHHHHHH" !

Re:When you're in space ...

[PhxBlue]

But they can hear you scream "KHHAAAAAAAAAANNN!"

Bored in orbit ???

[Lexor]

I'll likely remain Earthbound for my entire life yet I usually find plenty to do before I'm tempted by mass media. Spare time or not, I can't imagine being so bored during a relatively short Shuttle mission that I'd want to fire up a movie. Instead, why not grab a camera and inspire other people who won't ever get the chance to orbit our planet.

Re:Bored in orbit ???

[artor3]

You find plenty to do on Earth. Now lock yourself in a small room with a few other people for a few weeks, and see if you never get bored.

Oh, wait, Slashdot... being locked in a small room with a few people is probably more stimulating than normal.

Re:Bored in orbit ???

[Anonymous Coward]

Perhaps *you* might not be bored in space, but these are astronauts whose *job* it is to be in space. One can only be awed by the beauty of the sight of earth from space for so long, then it becomes old news. Ditto for the space shuttle itself - it might be awesome, interesting, and new to someone who *isn't* already an astronaut and had the inner workings of every piece of tech on it drilled into their head so many times they could do it all in their sleep, but I'm sure its all terribly 'the same old stuff' to those who are.

Also, there is an awful lot more room on the earth, things you haven't already seen, than there is on the shuttle for the astronauts. They are certainly intimately familiar with every square inch of space that they might go to 'find plenty to do' - pretty much all the gear and equipment they have is all there with the purpose of their mission - there isn't much in terms of 'things to do'. (Well, I heard somewhere they did bring some movies on DVD, presumably ones they haven't already seen)

And "grab a camera" ? - I'm sure so many pictures have been taken from orbit, and of the inside of the shuttle, that any more would just be a waste of storage/film. I'm sure that there were even cameras rolling (and/or snapping) for their entire set of spacewalks working on Hubble, as well. What on earth could now they take pictures of that would be new?

Oh come on!

[93 Escort Wagon]

There are already people posting "well, they should have checked to make sure their computer could play DVDs." Why? This is a reasonable expectation of what a computer should be able to do out of the box! My Mac certainly came with the ability to play DVDs, and nowadays most Linux installs do too - so we're almost certainly talking about a Windows box. Sure, you can download and install VLC - as a matter of fact, that's what I had to resort to with my wife's old Windows laptop before she (thankfully) switched to a Mac. But why the heck are all you Windows users so tolerant of the stupidity that leaves a stock operating system unable to do exactly the sort of thing the average user will expect to be able to do?

I was a DOS user and then a Windows user from way back. But silly little things like this always bugged me, and eventually I wised up.

Re:Oh come on!

[Anonymous Coward]

Can't speak for other distribs since it's been too long since I've used them, but last I checked ubuntu throws up a message on the first attempt at playing a DVD using totem telling you that if you want to play the dvd you have to click ok and allow it to download codecs, which may or may not be legal depending on the laws of your country.

And yes, ubuntu is my main OS (although I haven't done a fresh install in a pretty long time).

Re:Oh come on!

[BikeHelmet]

It's okay - the MPAA are shooting themselves in the foot. Every time a Windows user can't figure out how to play a DVD, a new pirate is born. :D

Re:Oh come on!

[arkhan_jg]

Same reason that linux doesn't playback MP3, DVDs and h.264 by default. US-only software patents covering the codecs. Without paying the fee, and getting the licences to use the patents, it's illegal to ship it in your US product.

XP added limited MP3 playback, Windows Vista added built in MPEG2 playback, and 7 adds h.264 playback. Yes, XP should have had MPEG2 playback built in, it came out three years after DVD became widely available.

Linux at least has the excuse that free distros can't pay the patent fees and thus can't ship them in the default package to US users (so usually have a 'download it now' option when you first need it, where you promise you don't live in the US, and download from a mirror elsewhere in the world). This is annoying when you do live outside the US, and have to put up with software patent bullshit in everything, even non-US software projects, because they don't want to get sued.

What about the mission?

[earlymon]

Yeah, easy to hate on Win, love OS X and yadda yadda yadda.

The laptops must have been there for a reason. Perhaps someone in configuration management said, "Gee, it's going into space, it might be mission-critical at some point, so let's not load it up with entertainment stuff and bloatware."

I don't know - I'm in a more than usual snarky mood.

Watching movies? Really?

[paulwye]

Um, am I the only one who read that and thought, "They're aboard the shuttle...in space...and they're going to watch a movie? Really? That's the first choice for how to spend a day in a circumstance that basically nobody else on the goddamn planet is going to have a shot at for a really, really long time?

But perhaps more importantly: what were they going to watch?

Actually, I just got an idea for a poll.

when you're orbiting the planet at 17,200MPH

[AftanGustur]

Have you any idea how many "regions" you're going through in just 20 minutes ..

No wonder they didn't make it through the "Thy shall not copy this DVD" part.

Region 8 (sideways)

[grepya]

Don't they know, outer space is region 8 (*laid down sideways). MPAA is still working on the technology to allow playback there.

Re:MPC Home Cinema VLC

[Jah-Wren Ryel]

VLC isn't supported very well and should be your last-resort if all else fails.

Media Player Classic Home Cinema is a much superior player that also has built-in playback codecs.

What does "isn't supported very well" mean? VLC's got a lot more active a community behind it - just compare the size of the forums for each.
The big thing that VLC has over MPC and most other DVD players on windows is that it is completely independent of Microsoft's DirectShow filter system which is pretty much the equivalent of DLL hell, but for codecs.

VLC may not have the slickest user interface and it may not be the most efficient media player since it has virtually no support for hardware acceleration, but it in its current form it is pretty much bullet proof - no matter what kind of system configuration problems you've got, it usually "just works." It isn't my player of choice, but it is my last ditch player because it pretty much plays anything.

Re:Watching movies? Really?

[clgoh]

Probably not Apollo 13...

Chatty Tech Support..

[spokedoke]

From TFA, they worked with tech support for "More than an hour".

Astronauts must go through some seriously painful training if they can spend that much time on the phone with IT

Uhh...Did you try restarting the computer?

Re:FFSSP

[MaskedSlacker]

I bet the ISS has several working players, one for each region code with a member state.

Re:MPC Home Cinema VLC

[BikeHelmet]

Yes, I agree with most of your points. VLC is very well supported, on a lot of operating systems - but certain parts of it just aren't good.

For example, the lack of acceleration makes compatibility great across the board, but it makes it dog slow on every OS. Until recently it was also single threaded - actually, it might still be. 1080p isn't even possible on most CPUs, while with MPC-HC, DirectShow + GPU acceleration, you'd be looking at 15-20% CPU usage max. (and you get to enable quality enhancing shaders)

I'm not saying it's bad; it just has a different featureset, with compatibility prioritized over...

-An intuitive UI
-A good hotkey scheme
-Hardware acceleration
-GPU shader/codec support
-Ability to use (impressive) directshow codecs

Unfortunately for me, compatibility hasn't been so great on my computers. I've always had less trouble with MPC-HC. VLC doesn't play audio on one of my computers, and it gets aspect ratios screwed up on another. (How? No clue. It doesn't have any acceleration, so I'm totally baffled.)

I've also repeatedly come across videos that it has no support for. In the end, if MPC-HC + KliteMega can't open it, I just go for MPlayer. (which almost never fails, but has an even worse UI. Or rather, it has no UI; it's just a box with the video playing in it. :x

To each his own. My Uncle has a Mac, and he says VLC beats the pants off Quicktime. Heh - I agree with him! :P

I just wouldn't take VLC if I had the chance to get a nice DirectShow media player(like MPC-HC) and ffdshow.

Re:MPC Home Cinema VLC

[x2A]

Err... how?!

Google -> search 'media player classic home cinema' -> click top result -> click 'download' on the left -> choose the version you want (win32/x86_64) and click the 'download' link on the right -> gives you list of versions (somewhat redundant here), click the full filename (eg, mplayerc_homecinema_x86_v1.2.908.0.zip), save it to disk. How can you go wrong?

Re:MPC Home Cinema VLC

[Barny]

Then, load both :)

When I pre-install computers for my customers, they get both pre-loaded (use CCCP for MPC, it loads the codecs needed, and configures it for it automagically).

I agree though, MPC is much nicer interface than VLC, but when you are troubleshooting VLC is the best thing on the planet, it "just works".

What's with the UI???

[Anonymous Coward]

It's a frigging DVD player.

Play. Stop. Pause. FFW, REW.

What's there for the bloody UI??? My hardware DVD player doesn't have a "UI". Why must my software one?

Re:I hate DVDs

[Haeleth]

Oh, please. You're as bad as the people who go on endlessly about "technically, a Mac is a PC". Drop the etymological reductionism and acknowledge that the meaning of a phrase is defined by its usage, not by the sum of the meanings of its components.

In the real world so unfamiliar to the endless horde of quibblers and nitpickers, there is no distinction between "laser disc" and "LaserDisc". The generic term used for media such as LDs and DVDs is "optical disc", not "laser disc".

Re:Watching movies? Really?

[TornCityVenz]

I would think just about ANYTHING you could do in space would be a better use of your time that watching a stupid movie.

Re:LOL

[digitalchinky]

It's simple: There is no rule, just one (1) statement.

(Excuse my profanity)
You're in Fucking Space! SPACE! At best this is going to happen only a handful of times in the average astronauts lifetime, more likely only once, what the hell are they doing with a DVD player!?!

In the ask slashdot submission queue:

[Fr05t]

"I'm currently orbiting the Earth for an extra 24 hours because of weather delays and trying to watch a DVD..."

A DVD player in earth orbit

[Markee]

Hey astronauts, maybe you should not have set a new country code every 15 minutes while passing over the next continent....

Re:LOL

[initialE]

Yeah! Have sex! even gay sex! anything is better than the latest crap you would have gotten at the nearest blockbuster back home.

Re:LOL

[multi io]

what the hell are they doing with a DVD player!?!

Watch latest sequels of "Earthlight -- Breathtaking pictures of Earth from Space" in HD?

I guess you can't Stream it

[Onyma]

It's suggest they stream the movie to them but you know what they say... In space, no one can hear your stream.

Re:Watching movies? Really?

[DerCed]

Watching planet earth from outer space will be fascinating for an hour and the fascination will be renewed whenever lighting chances or any other circumstances lead to a new view. However, staring 8 hours at a blue ball will not be fascinating enough.
Maybe for a Zen buddhist, yes, but not for scientists/astronaut hybrids.

Modems

[CobaltBlueDW]

If NASA can get internet, and NASA communicates with the space station... What era is NASA living in, if the space station can't get an internet connection. The internet solves all problems, especially missing codec problems.

I'm scratching "Be an Astronaut" off my life goals list. Seriously, stuck in a room for months and months on end with OUT an internet connection?!

No pizza, and no internet make homer... something, something.

Re:LOL

[Tisha_AH]

Yes, going into space would be cool, a once in a lifetime event and almost every breathing human being would be utterly flabbergasted by the view and the opportunity. I think that there is an aspect that you are overlooking;

The activities that NASA assigns the shuttle crew, mission specialists and spacewalkers is very intensive and intellectually exhausting. Being in space for a week to two weeks and having nearly every minute of your time mapped out and assigned creates an incredible amount of stress.

Working on earth, in a conventional job. Let's say as a programmer, working 16 hour days with a team of bosses standing right behind you and monitoring your every keystroke, you would find yourself exhausted and looking for a mental margarita after a very short time.

NASA cannot make it to the Mos Eisley Cantina on the planet Tatooine where the crew can have a few beers and tease the imperial storm troopers (Star Wars reference). Being able to take 2-3 hours out of a mission to watch a movie is most certainly a welcome diversion.

For a historical reference look up what happened on Skylab 3 when NASA ground controllers assigned too many tasks to the station crew. After a few days the Skylab 3 crew "went out on strike" for a day and refused to answer any ground communications unless it was an emergency. They needed the downtime to rest and relax. After that incident NASA became a bit more relaxed in how many micromanaged tasks they would burden astronauts with and began to put relaxation time into their mission planning.

Re:LOL

[Tsunayoshi]

think about it like being on a vacation. you can't fill every minute of every day with something unique and fun

You obviously haven't been on a vacation with my wife, her goal is exactly that (much to my frustration).

Re:LOL

[FlyingGuy]

No need to get all gay ( not saying there is anything wrong with that ) I mean they had Megan up there, she could have done the boys a turn.

Re:LOL

[iamhassi]

"I mean they had Megan [wikipedia.org] up there, she could have done the boys a turn."

Wow you must have a big thing for chicks in giant puffy astronaut suits because that photo on her wiki does absolutely nothing for me. Got links to a pic of her in a bikini?

Re:LOL

[roguetrick]

Pretentious.

Acronym Police

[Asmor]

DRM - Devil's wRong Maintenance

Holy fuck, man, if you're going to force an acronym that hard at least make it one that's good and/or makes sense. That looks like you just took one word that sounded bad and started with a D, one word that sounded bad and had an R near the front, and one word that just happened to be a noun starting with M.

Dude, they're ASTRONAUTS.

[Chris Burke]

There are people in the world who are just boring and unimaginitive. People who aren't stupid, but just don't think of interesting things to do, and aren't interested in doing them anyway, even if someone else thinks of them and invites them along.

Apparently, the space program has become so routine that such people have found their way there. I've no idea how that's even possible (if you're that dull, what would possess you to apply for astronaut training?)

Uh-huh. Yeah, it's that these astronauts are just boring, mundane, unimaginative people.

Either that, or it's that these astronauts have spent weeks up to their necks in a combination of Awesome, Challenge, and Danger as they float around in fucking OUTER SPACE, fixing an incredible yet delicate scientific instrument that both expands our scientific horizons and blows our minds with crazy images, with their clunky suits and a tether to their space ship being the only thing keeping them alive as they work, and their office view consisting of the little blue globe they call home and the vastness of space.

These peoples' bowel movements are more amazing than anything you do here on earth, and your example of something "interesting" is an attraction at Chuck-E-Cheese?

I mean would you seriously tell an experimental jet test pilot (which many astronauts were before they decided to do something even cooler) who after flying around at supersonic speeds all day pushing both their body and mind to the limit constantly decides that when they land back at base to spend the rest of the day chilling in the rec room watching American Idol, that they're dull?

Maybe, just maybe, after two weeks of being responsible for one of the most complicated machines ever made (which in case I haven't mentioned is a fucking space ship) where every action has the potential to be a matter of life and death on the boundaries of human adaptability, "dull" has a certain appeal, you know, as a change of pace.

Here's my example of unimaginative: Someone who thinks an astronaut has to play "space-tag" to make their life exciting and interesting.

Re:LOL

[thousandinone]

Don't be so hasty. I'd personally switch teams for a day just for a chance to try it in zero G. Go ahead and troll me, haters!

Re:It's not JUST the hardware stu...

[neBelcnU]

I totally agree with the parent. Just because Marketing said it had to be in there, and Engineering figgered out how to wedge in, doesn't mean that it amounts to an enhancement.

And I'm no great fan of "Designers" or Programmers/UI Experts, but when they get it right, it SINGS. And--call it a variation on "Creepy Valley"--a near miss is almost worse than not having the feature at all.

Personally, Samsung does this to me all the time: something about their UI-philosophy I don't get. Oppositely, Motorola must be built in to me somewhere. Those examples are purely my personal weaknesses, but I believe they're legit data points on the broader curve of my argument. (See also, cockpit design philosophies of Airbus v. Boeing, or Raytheon v. (everyone else) and iDrive v. the rest of the automotive informatics.)

The parent deserves to be modded up.