Qualcomm Demos Eee PC Running Android OS

angry tapir writes "Qualcomm has showed off a version of Asustek Computer's Eee PC based on its Snapdragon processor at the Computex exhibition, including one running Google's Android operating system. The new laptop — which Qualcomm calls a smartbook — is thinner and lighter than current members of Asustek's Eee PC netbook lineup because the 1GHz Snapdragon processor that it uses does not require a heat sink or a cooling fan."

Comments

Because Snapdragon Is an ARM Processor!

[eldavojohn]

The new laptop -- which Qualcomm calls a smartbook -- is thinner and lighter than current members of Asustek's Eee PC netbook lineup because the 1GHz Snapdragon processor that it uses does not require a heat sink or a cooling fan.

Yes, of course, because of an important point in the article:

Qualcomm's Snapdragon includes a 1GHz Arm processor core, a 600MHz digital-signal processor and hardware video codecs. Currently, Asustek's Eee PC line of netbooks relies on Intel processors, in particular the low-cost, low-power Atom chip, which has an x86 processor core.

Which makes complete sense, because of its low power consumption you're going to see less heat and longer battery life (why do you think OLPC moved to it). And for those of you skeptical of the speed:

When the first Snapdragon-based devices hit the market later this year, they will have a 1GHz Arm processor core but that will increase to 1.3GHz next year, with the release of Qualcomm's Snapdragon 8650A, Pineda said.

Every single eee PC available (with Atom processors) on the market is x86, to my knowledge.

This headline really got my hopes up as I just bout an eee PC 1000HE last weekend and have it dual booting to Windows XP & Easy Peasy Ubuntu. I love it. It's totally replaced my 5 year old laptop. I was hoping this meant I could partition out some space for Android but it looks like I'm left to emulating it (pretty much not an option considering the overhead). Maybe Google just doesn't see a point of porting Android to x86 since it's probably pretty dependent on the power efficiency of ARM?

Pare away the heat sink and all that junk, add super small RAM and flash storage and ... hand held computers (like the article notes from Toshiba). Microsoft better not be resting on its laurels and should either be beefing up Windows Mobile or porting Windows 7 to ARM ... or they're going to miss out big time again.

Has anyone found anything on how Android applications dependent on cell phone-ish hardware (like GPS location and the like) will be handled inside a device like the eee PC?

Re:Because Snapdragon Is an ARM Processor!

[Anonymous Coward]

No, that's not the important point at all...at least not the most important point.

1. Android is "free" (unlike XP or Vista or Windows 7 or even Ubuntu on ARM)
2. ARM is considerably cheaper than Intel processors
3. Longer battery life from power consumption benefits (obviously a nice bonus but the big guns are going for a cheaper way to make netbooks)

I work for one of the companies that is making software for these new devices and Asus is going to bring out netbook based devices as well. Oh there is Android for x86 as well (again cost cutting measures) but whether that comes out for the public remains to be seen. I've installed and used Android on several netbooks and this is old news.

Re:Because Snapdragon Is an ARM Processor!

[Hal_Porter]

Pare away the heat sink and all that junk, add super small RAM and flash storage and ... hand held computers (like the article notes from Toshiba). Microsoft better not be resting on its laurels and should either be beefing up Windows Mobile or porting Windows 7 to ARM ... or they're going to miss out big time again.

People keep saying this sort of thing, but I really don't see it being viable. A Snapdragon is probably going to end up being at best the same speed as an Atom for native code. Windows 7 is probably quite portable and from the tests I've done on the Beta on Atoms might run quite okish on an 1Ghz Snapdragon if it were ported. Even there we're talking about a 1Ghz in order core with a memory controller designed for cellphone SDRAM. High performance desktop memory is really different to the stuff used in cellphones - the buses are narrower and slower. Here's are the details for an Atom

http://processorfinder.intel.com/details.aspx?sSpec=SLB73

Note the bus speed, 533Mhz and the cache size, 512KB. By desktop standards the Atom is slow. Most Arm systems run memory much slower than this and have less cache. Look at the Snapdragon based Toshiba L01

http://pdadb.net/index.php?m=specs&id=1855&view=1&c=toshiba_l01

It uses "mobile DDR SDRAM". I don't know the clock speed, but look at this

http://www.eetasia.com/ART_8800457078_499486_NP_197bb814.HTM
Hynix claims 'fastest' 512Mbit mobile DDR SDRAM with a 185Mhz clock speed.

See the thing is that the sort of memory you get in a cellphone is a lot slower than the stuff you get in a desktop because the power budget is so much less. If you want to run desktop applications or emulate an x86 that will really bite you.

Once you get past the OS it gets worse. Office is probably less portable than Windows and Office 200x runs terribly on an Atom and would be worse on Snapdragon given the lower performance memory. Most Windows applications will not be ported and will run even worse in emulation - a Snapdragon emulating x86 will be unusably slow.

Of course maybe ARM will do a Jazelle style extension where common x86 instructions are turned into ARM ones via an extra pipeline stage. I think that would mean a Snapdragon chip would run x86 code say 90% as fast as an Atom at the same clockspeed. Still a 1Ghz Atom is not a quick chip.

Re:Because Snapdragon Is an ARM Processor!

[pseudonomous]

Microsoft already has Operating Systems that will run on the Arm architecture, Windows Mobile / WinCE, but I don't see what benefit you would get from using them, both taking your suggestion or using Windows Mobile would still leave an operating system that might look vaguely familiar, but still doesn't act quite like users would expect, that doesn't run much in the terms of familiar applications. I would think that, like with the Linux-based acer and msi netbooks, you would get a very high return rate on something like this.

Re:Because Snapdragon Is an ARM Processor!

[Taxman415a]

See the thing is that the sort of memory you get in a cellphone is a lot slower than the stuff you get in a desktop because the power budget is so much less. If you want to run desktop applications or emulate an x86 that will really bite you.

All interesting information you added, but for a netbook platform where the battery is an order of magnitude larger than a cellphone, what makes you think they can't put in a different memory controller with a wider bus to run regular sodimms? You'd still get all the power savings from the lower power chip and no active cooling, but without the performance hit you refer to.

Re:Because Snapdragon Is an ARM Processor!

[Bert64]

The problem with windows ce/mobile is that it's advertised as being windows when it really isn't.. This creates the expectation of compatibility with desktop windows. The mobile versions of windows however are not compatible at all, either at the binary or source level (and most apps don't even come with source), such that there are very few available apps...
An arm version of linux on the other hand really is linux, and has 99% of the same applications available for it, since in most cases it's just a case of a recompile.

Re:Because Snapdragon Is an ARM Processor!

[Locutus]

you do not know Microsoft. They live and breath by Windows and the Windows APIs and that product is why they still exist. It would be a very small fraction of todays company that would promote the use of another OS instead of Windows. The Windows OS brings in most of their profits and the extents they go to protect that marketshare should be an indicator of how tied to it they are.
 

You'll see them making offers companies can't refuse and dumping billions into stopping the move to Linux before you'll see an MS Linux. They'll push Windows Mobile onto this platform or even port XP to ARM before there's an MS Linux or any MS nonWindows OS. IMO.
 

LoB

Re:Because Snapdragon Is an ARM Processor!

[horza]

ARM + chipset runs at 0.5 watts, according to this CNET article from last June.

Phillip.

Wait for Pandora

[tepples]

I ask for ARM UMPCs and get ARM netbooks.

Is an "ARM UMPC" essentially a PDA with a keyboard? If so, then wait for Pandora to enter mass production.

Re:Overhead

[Sinning]

Sorry for the confusion, I was referring more to this.

Rather than running the Android SDK emulator.

It looks to be a much more promising alternative to emulating the entire android OS.

Re:Keep an eye on google...

[doti]

Cm'on, their motto is "do no evil".
What can go wrong?

Yes, but obvious question...

[dvh.tosomja]

Does it run windows?

'Asustek puts Android netbook on ice'

[snydeq]

Asustek appears to have already scuttled this project, calling the technology 'not mature' and disavowing any pressure from Microsoft and Intel over the use of Android and Snapdragon in the Eee PC.

Of course, the Android-based Eee was demonstrated by Qualcomm, not Asustek. Yet, Asustek's distancing itself from the machine while competitors like Acer are announcing Android plans is a little bit intriguing.

Re:'Asustek puts Android netbook on ice'

[Locutus]

probably under contract with Microsoft. You know, the fine print that keeps showing up after 20 years of company lawyers being surprised by Microsoft's tactics. The funny thing about lawyers, each one thinks _they_ are smarter than the other lawyers and keep signing deals with Microsoft thinking they're getting away with something.
 

It was obvious to me that they signed a deal with the devil when the next gen eEEPC's shipped. They used the 50/50 rule to say they ship 50% Linux systems and 50% Windows systems and that's why there were no Linux netbooks on store shelves. They boosted the hardware so Windows would run but then boosted the hardware more for the Linux versions and charged more for Linux. These are all signs of a "special" deal with Microsoft and they seem to be locked into this deal at the expense of the ARM systems. After all, if they can't ship Linux, how can they ship a viable ARM based system? So, ASUS can't play in this ARM netbook or Smartbook game and all they can do is try to put it down in an attempt to limit it's value and growth with marketing speak.
 

  So ASUS is out of the netbook/Smartbook game until their contract with Microsoft ends as far as I'm concerned. Windows is just not efficient enough to make a compelling small device OS.
 

LoB

Re:That's great, but...

[Locutus]

there should be no need for supporting "mobile broadband cards" with the universal 3G radio built into the Smartbooks. Unless they are misusing the term universal. The only difference between a netbook and a Smartbook is that the Smartbooks have the 3G radio builtin and the software to use it.

I think Qualcomm has a hit here.

LoB

How will current apps cope?

[riflemann]

There are ~3500 android apps out there now, virtually every one of them written assuming HTC Dream hardware.

It will be very interesting to see how they all cope when run on emerging hardware with vastly different characteristics and screens to the opening device.

My own Android game is not exempt and will need better adaptability (yeah, hypocrite).

I've only got one more point on my list unsolved

[Qbertino]

As far as modern day handheld computers go, I have to say that the Asus EEE induced second coming of the Netbook and its liklings has had extremley positive side effects on the market in the last two years.

Portability? Check.
Openess and flexibility of plattform? Check.
Price? Check.
Versatility? Check.

However, there is just one more thing I want before I can say they are on par with the mid-nineties PC handhelds that where available back then and could easyly keep up with their big desktop brothers in terms of getting the job done: Battery Uptime and/or easy replacement of battery.

Let me explain: The HP 200LX, Sharp PC 3000, 3100 and its non-name rebrands ran on AA cells. And while the off-grid uptime was a meager 3,5 hours at max, you could easyly replace them with rechargeables or - in an emergency - with fresh AA cells from the next gas station or convenience store.
I want that kind of battery time or convenience from todays handhelds aswell. If convenience is not an option, I want the same uptime I could get from my old Palm m105 with folding keyboard attached or from the original Psion Netbook: 40 hours. ... On the Palm that uptime came from 3 or 4 AAA cells btw - but that's another story.

Substancially increased battery uptime without outlandish pricing - then handhelds are back in the game for me. It would be about time.

My 2 cents.

So let me get this straight...

[ChaoticCoyote]

Android uses Linux, but isn't Linux (no standard libraries, for example).

Android uses Java, but it isn't standard Java nor is it compatible with most Java apps.

Android is open source, except for certain fiddly-bits they keep private.

This is not the competition for Windows we've been looking for.

Re:That's great, but...

[Thumper_SVX]

But Qualcomm's Gobi chipset purportedly supports EV-DO and HSPA in a single chipset, thus it's at least technically possible that they have done exactly as they say. It even includes GPS... so long as you have room for all the antennae (dead space behind the screen for example) then it should be a non-issue to make it into a truly "multi-radio" machine.

Hmm... wonder if Apple's been talking to Qualcomm for the next gen iPhone... ;)