Hydraulic Analog Computer From 1949
mbone writes "In the New York Times, there is an interesting story about a hydraulic analog computer from 1949 used to model the feedback loops in the economy. According to the article, 'copies of the 'Moniac,' as it became known in the United States, were built and sold to Harvard, Cambridge, Oxford, Ford Motor Company and the Central Bank of Guatemala, among others.' There is a cool video of the computer in operation at Cambridge University. I remember that the Instrumentation Lab at MIT still had an analog computer in its computer center in the mid-1970s. Even then, it seemed archaic, and now this form of computation is largely forgotten. With 14 machines built, it must have been one of the more successful analog computers — a supercomputer of its day. Of course, you have to wonder if it could have been used to predict our current economic difficulties."
Some explosives factories still use hydraulics, steam or vacuum for process control. Although it tends to be digital now, with valves used as flip-flops.
Excuse me, but please get off my Pennisetum Clandestinum, eh!
There is a serious flaw in thinking that computers can accurately model macroeconomics, or predict systematic collapses, any better than commonsense and basic logic can. It is a given that if you massively inflate the monetary supply, you will create a false sense of wealth and a false understanding of risk, and people will malinvest in sectors that they otherwise would have spent far less resources on, or none at all. This is an unsustainable artificially created bubble, and all bubbles burst. Many people saw this coming years, even decades ago, and didn't have supercomputers. People understood this scenario centuries ago, before computers even existed. Using computers as a crutch to make up for a lack of understanding of basic economics is an aggravating factor in the current scenario, not the solution.
Slashdot: Playing Favorites Since 1997
It might have been more successful if they had used beer instead of water...
Wow! Great article about it in Wikipedia. Loved the picture that showed the two faucets on the side.
If "disco" means "I learn" in Latin, does "discothèque" mean "I learn technology"?
No, you don't have to wonder that. The current economic difficulties were easily predicted by many.
The problem was that the people with any kind of ability to stop the conditions that led to the current situation were those who profited most from those conditions. Not a good recipe for prevention.
"Trolls they were, but filled with the evil will of their master: a fell race..." -- J.R.R. Tolkien on Olog-hai
I just finished with Terry Pratchett's "Making Money". I think I'm having a flashback now.
In college I built a divide-by-eight counter in pneumatics. One reciprocating cylinder was the "clock" signal, the rest was a bunch of pneumatic shuttle valves. Problems arose because I kept needing to increase the air pressure to move some of the switches because they were spring-loaded. The air hoses started to pop off their fasteners so it took a lot longer to get the assembly working that I had anticipated (talk about blowing a circuit). It did manage to get me an exemption from the rest of the labs though.
If lots of people are extracting money from the system and not contributing real wealth, then there will be problems. Money has complicated dynamics, but its not magic. People who make a living shuffling numbers around in spreadsheets are providing a useful service that makes the system more efficient. But only up to a point. Few people believe greed is a vice anymore, hence certain results follow.
Hydraulic computers are used in some military aircraft because they are very reliable and can withstand EMP.
All ideas^H^H^H^H^Hprocesses in this post are Patent Pending. (as well as the process of patenting all postings)
"Johnny, there's another damn memory leak! Bring the bucket!"
Probably not, but Byron Dorgon Predicted this trouble in 1995 when teh derivatives markets starte to get noticed and again in 1998 when the "securities modernization act" was passed, deregulating the banks, insurance companies and investments firms.
... the Internet truly would be a series of tubes.
Also, little known fact: Gordon Moore's father was a mechanical engineer who predicted that the size of hydraulic valves would shrink 50% every 18 months.
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In class I built a half-adder and a full-adder and could do 2 bit addition with it. subtraction too if I interpret input and output as 2s complement numbers. I ran out of parts in my kit to make it bigger. but with enough parts you could do pretty much anything, as long as you don't mind the slowness and noise and possibly a tremendous amount of power.
hydraulics have the advantage that you can apply a great deal of force through them precisely. which is useful when you have many layers of "logic gates" that you have to drive by pushing a fluid through some tubes. with pneumatics I could have quickly ran into an issue if I made a ripple counter for example where the amount of pressure necessary to switch the furthest most element might exceed the abilities of my pump.
“Common sense is not so common.” — Voltaire
1998, you mean. There was a reason they had all those banking rules developed over centuries, You can't just wipe them out with a stroke of a pen, and expect no consequences.
Brett
Which gave rise to one of the oldest computer jokes: "If it doesn't work, piss on it."
I'm a Programmer. That's one level above Software Engineer and one level below Engineer.
This was water cooled before water cooling was cool
*DrugCheese rants*
In the early 80's the USN had over 30 analog computers driving various submarine simulators. Heck, each of the original '41 SSBN's had an analog computer driving the hovering system. Then there was the 100+ analog installations of the CONALOG system.
Etc... Etc...
And this is why you should always read the author's note at the end, where he mentions all of the things that he based inventions in the book on. You also get fun things like, in the end of Nation, an explanation of thinking, followed by 'do try this at home'
I am TheRaven on Soylent News
Shows that our economy is down the drain.
You'll actually see TP give due acknowledgement to the Phillips Economic computer, Moniac, at the front of the book.
As a result of reading Making Money, I tracked down the prototype, which is in the foyer of the school of management at Leeds University in the UK, and now have the job of rebuilding Phillips very first machine.
Steve
What about The Great Brass Brain? An analogue computer for computing tide tables that when replaced by a CDC 6600 super (for its time) computer, the 6600 couldn't perform all of the tricks (i.e. pause at each low/high tide moment or produce a continuous) graph of the machine it replaced? There's some great, mostly lost, history out there.
"It's the height of ridiculousness to say for those 9 lines you get hundreds of millions."
Could predict todays our current economic difficulties and spend 18 minutes playing with the abacus.
The Annotated Pratchett File has also interesting resources to help grasp to more obscure jokes.
"Sufficiently advanced satire is indistinguishable from reality." - [Tips: 1DrYakQDKCQ6y52z6QbnkxHXAocMZJE61o ]
Seems to me that this could be replaced today with an Excel spreadsheet - and no I'm not being facetious.
"It's the height of ridiculousness to say for those 9 lines you get hundreds of millions."
I once had a wonderful, yet frustrating, toy whose name I can't remember any longer that was kind of a hydraulic Erector Set. It came with battery-powered pumps, clear plastic tubing, splitting/combining Y and T connectors, valves, tanks, items that filled and then tipped out, a board and supports to arrange everything, and even coloring tablets (messy) to allow blending different streams -- just add water. The frustration came from the poor level of construction that resulted in it not being all that durable and the pumps not seeming to work as long or as well as I felt they should. And when you used it you pretty much ended up with water, and staining colors when you added them, in a mess all around. Even so it was one of the great fun toys (along with Lincoln Logs, Tinker Toys, Erector Sets, and Flexigons) that I would happily play with now if I could find them again. No, we weren't a Leggo family.
"It's the height of ridiculousness to say for those 9 lines you get hundreds of millions."
now i truly understand a buffer overflow, and the implications of a memory leak are clear.
I saw one of these in operation at the Venice Biennale in 2003. It was really remarkable to watch, but then I was thinking of it as more of an art project pointing out the absurd nature of economic forecasting than a serious research tool.
If these did run teh internetz, then the Internet really WOULD be a series of tubes! :D
The Christian Right is Neither (Christian nor right). See: Matthew 23, Matthew 25, Ezekiel 16:48-50
Often, digital computing is clumsy, awkward, and overly precise.
A good example of this is in Aviation. Pilots are still trained to use the E6B Flight computer which is really a glorified slide rule.
When you are estimating fuel consumption, and figure you'll probably use about 11.5 GPH for 3 1/3 hours, it's not important to know any more accuracy than perhaps to a gallon or so, since reality will always be a bit different than your calculations, anyway. You don't need to be exactly precise on your degrees of heading, and when you are computing weight & balance, it's stupid to calculate your moment to the 4th decimal place.
Knowing how to use an E6B, you can get calculations in a second or two with a single hand that are "good enough" - and that's important when you're flying an airplane in turbulence while trying to stay on top of busy ATC calls in a heavily trafficked area. You can't even enter the first of 3 or 4 digits into a digital calculator in that time, and you'd have to use two hands. (Frequently, when flying, your hands are both occupied and you're steering with just your feet)
Digital isn't always better.
I have no problem with your religion until you decide it's reason to deprive others of the truth.
I work with and service a lot of hydraulic machines. Generations of them, in fact. The pilot valves and such really haven't changed much in 50 years, as they are a simple device - but the CONTROLLERS are simply awesome. We use mostly David Bradley stuff, but there are plenty of Japanese, Chinese, and Korean valves and controllers in the plant. Amazing how accurate they can be when remotely controlled by a computer. Hydraulically powered computer can be sent 30 feet away from you, and come back, kiss your forehead, or a baby's cheek, and sent out again. It will repeat ad nauseum, and NEVER strike you hard.
Air? I would never trust air powered mechanisms to touch a baby, and simple electric motors can scare me too. Don't even dream of doing it with some kind of gasoline powered machine. Hydraulics are more reliable than anything I can think of.
"Windows is like the faint smell of piss in a subway: it's there, and there's nothing you can do about it." - Charlie Br
There is a cool video of the computer in operation at Cambridge University.
No, there really isn't. The video consists of 3 minutes and 38 seconds of a guy explaining how he's not an economist and doesn't really understand this stuff, and clearing his throat an awful lot. Meanwhile, he proceeds to explain how he's shut off or removed most of the parts of the machine, and intends to only demonstrate a little bit of it. Just as he's about to begin the demonstration, the video ends.
I'm a fan of Fluidics, which can create analog or digital devices based on fluid flow.
See this powerpoint for a great history of fluidics.
I took an (electrical) analog computing course in the mid-70s. Best (only?) way to solve differential equations in real time till clock speeds caught up. LIke music on vinyl vs. 1KHz sampling. Optical ain't dead - how about a 2D FFT at the speed of light?
Featuring an Economic Model inspired by MONIAC:
http://sydneypadua.com/2dgoggles/lovelace-and-babbage-vs-the-economy/
You are not a brain: http://books.google.com/books?id=2oV61CeDx-YC
There's a whole series in the Crunchly cartoons by Guy L. Steele, such as this one where he buys a hydraulic computer of sorts...
Qu'on me donne six lignes écrites de la main du plus honnête homme, j'y trouverai de quoi le faire pendre.
'cool video' is really a misnomer - the guy doesn't explain anything and nothing happens. 3:28 of my life i will never get back.
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