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Getting Beyond the Helldesk
An anonymous reader writes "I've been working as a helpdesk monkey for over a year in a small-medium sized law firm of around 200 users and I don't know if my patience and sanity can last much longer. I'd like to remain in IT, but in less of a front-line role where I can actually get some work done without being interrupted every five minutes by a jamming printer or frozen instance of Outlook. There isn't really any room for progression at my current employer, and with the weak job market it seems I can only move sideways into another support role. I've been considering a full-time Masters degree in a specialized Computer Science area such as databases or Web development, but I don't know if the financial cost and the loss of a year's income and experience can justify it. Do any Slashdotters who have made it beyond the helpdesk have any knowledge or wisdom to impart? Is formal education a good avenue, or would I better off moving back home, getting a mindless but low-stress job, and teaching myself technologies in my free time?"
If you really want to stay in IT and don't want to learn a programming language learn a UNIX. Even half way decent UNIX admins are few and far between, I know a number of companies hiring.
Just download a BSD, Linux distro or Open Solaris and use that for your desktop at home. Tinker, read and study and you can get a job out of helpdesk.
Hate to break it to you but you won't necessarily get away from distractions and you may not entirely move away from support. Every job I've ever worked in included distractions and some amount of support work.
I currently work as a software developer but I also work to troubleshoot the existing systems, and I do take second tier customer calls (so less problems, but usually harder ones). I even work shifts and do on-call support. My job's a good one - prestigeous, reasonable pay so I'm not complaining.
That's not to say I would rather be on a help desk, or that you shouldn't try to better yourself. Just make sure your expectations are realistic.
These posts express my own personal views, not those of my employer
http://news.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=08/04/30/1823242
http://developers.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=08/07/01/173205
http://ask.slashdot.org/askslashdot/08/12/01/0145255.shtml
http://it.slashdot.org/story/09/06/09/2028202/How-Do-IT-Guys-Get-Respect-and-Not-Become-BOFHs?art_pos=2
http://news.slashdot.org/story/09/05/11/0126212/Go-For-a-Masters-Or-Not?art_pos=14
This. Spend your spare time at home learning new marketable skills. Don't be a zealot with regards to open-source vs Windows or whatever, look at what businesses are using and learn to fix it. By all means, get skilled in Linux/Unix/whatever, just be aware of the potential market for the skills you're learning.
Be a zealot as far as new software/application development goes if you think you can support it, but don't exclude Windows skills simply because "Windows sucks"; you're cutting yourself out of a huge share of the market.
I started out in helldesk at an ISP, see sig below for what I'm currently doing...
I run: Windows, OS X, Linux, FreeBSD. Just because you have a hammer, doesn't mean everything is a nail.
Stay with it , its the people who who are longest in the job that become managers.
Hell, that's good enough reason to quit! Manager of a help desk means you have to take the calls of the screamers who escalate themselves above the first line monkeys, and you take the blame every time you're short staffed because Joe and Jane didn't show up 'cause they're hung-over again.
John
I've had many technical support jobs, helping employees and friends and family. I ended up in your position and didn't know how much longer I could handle it. What I did is got my B.S. in computer science at a good school and now my full time job is working for myself doing web development. You will not go wrong learning databases and web development and if you get good at it you will be able to work anywhere, anytime, and basically for whoever you want. Also, we all know that web applications and "cloud computing" is the new face of the Internet and still in its infant stages and has plenty of room to grow. Having your degree in computer science can land you other types of jobs doing productive work (even if you decide you don't like web development) and you get a great sense of accomplishment for the type of work you choose to do (possibilities are pretty much limitless). Hope this helps.
It is difficult to get out of the help desk at any organization. One person I know immediately shifted to night shift so he could take on line courses. Once he got his CCNA he moved into another role. But if you are on during prime shift and not motivated to train up in another area on your own. You will be there until your job is moved off shore or you quit.
It depends on where you're thinking of getting a degree from. If you can get into a good program, it can help you jump the fence from "IT" over to "software development," where the grass is greener and the pagers quieter. (This is not to say that software development is never frustrating or never involves dealing with idiots, but from your complaints it definitely seems like something you'd enjoy more.)
Staying home and learning technologies is great, and may even be more helpful on the job than what you'd learn in that Master's program, but it definitely isn't as helpful on your resume. Go get a degree, bust your ass to get good grades, and then start applying to software/technology companies where you'll be helping to provide a product or service rather than helping other people provide one.
You can also get pinned down by URGENT FIX THIS issues to the point that you can't make substantial upgrades to improve the overall situation. For example, so busy removing viruses you can't deploy more effective means to fight them in general.
93rd rule of Slashdot: No matter how obvious my sarcasm is, my comment will be taken seriously by someone.
Wow, you know what, I totally agree. You can ignore my large post elsewhere here about learning on your own. I agree, run. I double-agree, run to plumbing.
sorry once you're past 25, they want nothing to do with you. undergrad at 25+ is a lonely and tiresome route. even stuff like group projects is tough because 18yos still think of themselves as kids and don't want to work with an 'adult'. maybe just getting certs is a better idea.
I answered the phones and staffed the front desk at the student help desk when I was in college. It was the best paid student job on campus - $10 per hour your first semester, and a lot of the time you weren't busy and could surf the net or do your homework. There were a few other Computer Science majors there with me, and we got to help out all levels of student, faculty, and staff with their problems. What I took away from that job is not that I dislike working in the service industry, but rather, that there were certain universal truths about end users that I couldn't learn about anywhere else.
The help desk is your opportunity to study the areas where computers and human interactions break down. Learning computer skills in some high level language like Java or C# while working at the help desk is a way to advance your career. Start out with a book, but have goals in mind. Computer Science education is all about leading you to the water. Buy or borrow a few good books, classic computer science texts, etc. Work through the examples and do the exercises when you're not on the phones.
Most importantly, design some UI on paper (I like graph paper for this because you draw a lot of boxes in designing UI). Figure out what you *want* the program to do when you click the buttons. Then use a free program like ant or Visual C# Express and build the UI. Take apart the generated code. Look at it. Study it. Solve a problem that is interesting to you. Do it for fun. If you don't enjoy making programs, then Computer Science is simply not for you. There are plenty of people in CS departments who are very smart and study very hard, but their heart is just not in it. You can tell because they stop writing software when the day is done.
If you want to practice on Linux and you have Windows, you can download Microsoft Virtual PC 2007 (free) or VMWare player (also free) and install Ubuntu on a virtual drive. Put that virtual drive on a USB key chain or iPod, and you have a mobile development platform that you can take home. The internet is full of human knowledge on the subject of Computer Science and other computer topics. A degree from a reputable college or university is not necessarily a requirement.
But you need to prove to most engineering firms that you have what it takes, and the best paying jobs ($75K+ benefits) usually require solid interviewing and development demonstrations with someone who has 5 to 25 years of development experience and typically a Bachelors or advanced degree in Computer Science, Computer Engineering, Math, Physics, or something equally challenging. A degree won't get you in the door though. We see tons of people straight out of college with their Sc.B. degree who can't solve a problem involving a linked list, binary search on an array, binary search tree, hash table, dealing with memory management, and many other problems you need to be able to solve on your own as an engineer.
I started writing code sometime around the age of 6 in the early 80's because I wanted to make a game. I ended up discovering that game writing is interesting, but what I love to write are tools that interact with pixels and musical notes. Software engineering can be grueling work. In my best weeks, I write hundreds of lines of code. In my worst weeks, I spend long hours debugging and poking and proding and pulling out all the tricks, but get no closer to solving a bug which eventually is found to be something trivial in another part of the code. Highs are higher than in technical support, but lows are awfully low, too.
I'm having a hard time understanding how someone with a CS or Software Engineering degree could end up in your position though. (Maybe I'm ignorant...)
I will give you the answer; the companies that hire BSc graduates in "IT" tend to be call centers and help desk type companies. In the 1990s you could go straight out of college and land an 80K per year job. These days you are lucky to land a help desk job. Of course the more successful people will have embellished their experiences on their resumes and with their references. The smart people often end up programming in their parents basement.
I'd like to point out the programming route. Compared to the mild torture of IT work I've seen described in this and other threads, I, and many others, find programming extremely fulfilling. Specifically, I'm talking about large-scale development where performance and code quality matters and you can take pride in your work. I think it was best described by Frederick Brooks (of Mythical Man Month fame) in his "The Joys of the Craft": http://momjian.us/main/favorites/doc/programming.html. I might add it also pays well and I've found that companies are *always* looking for good programmers.
As for specific advice: go to school so you can really learn your algorithms and data structures, not little soundbites from message boards and copies of Torvald's posts. If you want to do low-ish level programming (which I highly recommend because, with most students graduating knowing little more than Java and Scheme, C/C++ and knowledge of how things work is a jewel), take a compiler class where you implement source to assembly for a toy language and an OS class that makes you write bits of a toy OS; understanding how these two things work and not feeling like they are deep magic is critical. Thirdly, take a computer architecture class so you know why some things are fast and some things are slow. And lastly, for goodness sakes, if you want to be a programmer, program all the frakkin' time so that eventually the syntax melts away and programming is like walking.
Cheers on taking action to improve your situation!
Submitter here. I current hold a upper-second class (the next step down from a first class, don't know how American colleges grade their awards) honours BSc in Comp Sci from a reasonably well-respected UK university. So I meet the criteria for most Computer Science Masters courses that I have come across.
Regarding your confusion of my current position, when I first graduated I was unsure if I was suitable for any kind of development role, which I suppose is the avenue taken by a large proportion of Comp Sci graduates. I was good enough at programming to pass the modules, but I never really programmed for pleasure or got involved beyond what was required of me academically. I know that makes me a blasphemer and a poser on here!
I worked in unrelated fields for a couple of years, which wasn't terrible as I paid off a lot of debt, especially at the beginning while living with the parents. My current job is my first 'proper' IT role, and considering my initial circumstances it seemed like quite a good first rung of the ladder. However, I have felt for quite a while that I both wanted to leave my current area of residence as well as thinking that this job is not right for me. It just feels like the right time to start planning a clean break, and soon, especially with the new academic year creeping up.
I have enough money saved up to live and study for a whole year, so the finance side of a Masters is not the major hurdle if the qualification would be worthwhile. I quite like the idea of going back to academia and taking it seriously this time, no more skipping lectures due to hangovers and doing it half-assed like my Bachelors. Working with colleagues that are involved with data management and web development as part of their own roles, and finding it quite interesting from where I stand, I have been looking at Masters programmes that specialise in these areas, rather than just do another year of general Comp Sci. There aren't that many programmes in these areas so my options are limited but still out there.
Mother, do you think they'll like this sig?
The bottom line is that companies will hire without education, but they will not hire without experience (even someone with education). If you do run into a company that is requiring a degree (specifically). Then the problem is that they do not understand the job well enough to hire someone into it. It is your job at that point to sell yourself to them, show them why they were wrong in requiring a degree by explaining your experience, and also that this experience cannot be taught in school. I have found that most people understand that experience is far more important than education (after all keg-stands and beer bongs bring very little value to a company - unless of course your company sells kegs and beer bongs). Fact is that there is no job on this planet that is not attainable school or not, you just need to be able to convince the other guy that you can do it better than anyone with an attendance sheet from a University.
If you are truly motivated and it is time for a move, hit your resume hard (biggest recommendation here is to cut out the fluff - all of it), start shopping for jobs, and start showing up for interviews (a lower paying job in this economy will pay dividends if you get some experience).
-matt
$diff terrorists hippies
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$rm -rf *terrorists *hippies
Oh. You're in the _UK_. Learn Linux: my professional colleague in London is having to beat off recruiters, even in this economy, and they keep trying to hire him for work in Scotland and Geneva as well. The support and systems administration roles available to a someone who can work in a mixed Linux/Windows, or Linux/Windows/Mac environment, are very active as companies try to stretch their finances for new servers and services.
School is great for your resume: but so is experience with fields that are growing and likely to remain in demand.
I wish I could have this mindset--I really do. But I can't. The inefficiency drives me crazy. Despite the job security issue, I have done things like teach a lot of my clients (the smarter ones who aren't likely to make things worse) how to fix little issues on their own. They may not have to call me as often, but they also can get their jobs done a lot more smoothly, and they like/respect me for that.
10 FILL MUG WITH COFFEE
20 DRINK COFFEE
30 GOTO 10
Fact is that there is no job on this planet that is not attainable school or not, you just need to be able to convince the other guy that you can do it better than anyone with an attendance sheet from a University.
That sounds good in theory, but many organizations have job descriptions standards set by Human Resources, not the hiring manager. If the job description states that a degree is required, you'll never even get an interview in that case.
This is coming from someone with 12 years of IT consulting experience, and is finally finishing their degree in September.
I was good enough at programming to pass the modules, but I never really programmed for pleasure or got involved beyond what was required of me academically. I know that makes me a blasphemer and a poser on here!
Programming is as much to Computer Science as telescopes are to Astronomy.
In most companies, they just ask a headhunter to find someone to become manager.
Depends. If you can sell yourself as management material, without seeming like a threat to your boss, he might recommend you as a successor.
Anyway, i was in the exact situation you are now, and i got out by never giving up on going to job interviews, not necessarily to directly get a job, but to test out what strategies in "marketing" yourself work best. . . .
That's how in 4 years time i doubled my salary and am now at the same level as someone who has his masters degree. Just be sure to keep on trying, and keep reading up on everything you're interested in.
I did something similarly. Started out third shift as/400 operator/helldesk and now I am a senior developer in a .NET shop. It was a windy road, but thanks to the breadth of my experience I know can pick up a new language, database, OS, etc very quickly.
--- Justin Dearing http://www.justaprogrammer.net/ We're just programmers.