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Steorn's "Free Energy" Jury Comes Back To Bite Them
chiark writes "Remember Steorn? Free energy for all, coming soon, and a gauntleted slap in the face to the physics establishment: 'come be our jury, and prove us right or wrong.' Well, 2 years later, the jury's verdict is in, and it's not the validation Steorn was hoping for: 'Twenty-two independent scientists and engineers were selected by Steorn to form this jury. It has for the past two years examined evidence presented by the company. The unanimous verdict of the Jury is that Steorn's attempts to demonstrate the claim have not shown the production of energy. The jury is therefore ceasing work.' Steorn had the choice to either accept this and move on, or attempt to rebut. Guess which approach they took?"
I just can't believe that anyone wasted 2 fucking years of their life trying to "disprove" it.
CheShA: Manchester Breakcore / Drill and Bass Yes I'm a s
And I bought a DeLorean in preparation just for this... Thanks a lot, Steorn. Bah!
they accepted the results gracefully and in the future all their ideas will comply with the laws of physics, just like every other crank out there~
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
So, after failing to provide enough evidence, a jury decides the company cannot prove their claims. In the press release, the company claims to still move forward? Sheesh....
In other related questions, what's going on with the Markus Zahn guy? Everything I can pull up about him and his invention comes to an abrupt stop in the 2 months following shortly after that story.
import system.cool.Sig;
Or Geniuses?
Just because I can hook a shark from a boat, I do no offer to wrestle it in the water.
The solution to their problem is to form a lobbying group to get Congress to reform the Laws of Physics. Those laws have been around for centuries and are clearly woefully outdated. Sure, at first the so-called "Laws" of Thermodynamics were a good idea, but now they're just holding us back.
I am willing to prove it as well.
But only for the next five minutes.
You will not be allowed to look inside the box, ONLY to measure the energy going in and out. You're not allowed to touch the machine and it must be in a completely dark room. You must pay all expenses for travel and lodging yourself. You must address me as "esteemed scienctist sir" at all times.
A-ha, and there the time is up. I see none of you felt brave enough to try to disprove my claims. I am the winner. I'll be sure to quote this in my journal.
The fact that people take these free energy claims seriously is the prime example of how scientifically illiterate people are, and it's a real problem. It's what allows things like alt-meds to gain a foothold, UFO abduction proponents to have a voice, and free energy claims to waste everybody's time.
Even somebody like myself with no scientific background whatsoever can understand basic scientific principles like thermodynamics. It's called scientific literacy, it's like regular literacy except you replace regular words with science words.
And that was the last Terry Fox run I ever participated in.
And will any of the investors be gullible enough to invest additional money for the company's plans to commercialize it?
"In this house, we obey the laws of thermodynamics!" -- Homer Simpson
I've abandoned my search for truth; now I'm just looking for some useful delusions.
Knowing the basics allows you to avoid pseudo-science without effort.
Once you master physics, you see the world for what it really is. Everything turns to green code, and you can tear apart charlatans with a wave of your graphic calculator.
Perpetual motion is actually a fundamental property of the universe, though we usually call it inertia: a body will not stop moving, unless somebody moves it. Therefore, linear perpetual motion is the norm, with change of velocity depending on an outside force.
To make it even more interesting: non-linear perpetual motion is actually also present in all molecules, at any given temperature, even at 0 Kelvin. Quantum chemistry shows that vibrational motion in a molecule changes by energetic quanta, where at least half a quantum is always present in a vibrational degree of motion (so-called zero-point energy). Hence, the atoms in a molecule are always in motion, even at 0 K, and the motion is non-linear. In first approximation, especially for diatomic molecules, it can be described as an oscillation with a parabolic energy profile, for multi-dimentional molecules one usually gets ergodic movement that is a bit more complex to describe, and is usually considered chaotic where only the statistical properties are relevant.
But no free energy, of course.
Look, I admit that their claims sound unlikely, but you can't just dismiss all claims out of hand because "they break the laws of physics". The fact is that they break the current laws of physics.
Hell, there could be all sorts of unlikely explanations that don't even break the current laws of physics (like perhaps some mass is being converted into energy)
Real Science means conducting experiments and taking measurements. The 'laws' of physics are only as good as the experiments and measurements taken.
The fact is that the experiments have been conducted, and it appears that it doesn't work. It doesn't mean that the Jury are 'idiots' for trying to test it - it means that they are scientists.
Sig (appended to the end of comments you post, 120 chars)
Don't do that ** self-censoring shit. It makes you look like a retard.
Orbo is based upon time variant magnetic interactions, i.e. magnetic interactions whose efficiency varies as a function of transaction timeframes.
It is this variation of energy exchanged as a function of transaction time frame that lies at the heart of Orbo technology, and its ability to contravene the principle of the conservation of energy. Why? Conservation of energy requires that the total energy exchanged using interactions are invariant in time. This principle of time invariance is enshrined in Noetherâ(TM)s Theorem.
The time variant nature of Orbo interactions can be engineered using two basic techniques. The first technique utilizes a method of controlling the response time of magnetic materials to make them time variant. This is achieved by controlling the MH position of materials during permanent magnetic interactions.
The second technique decouples the Counter Electromotive Force (CEMF) from torque for electromagnet interactions. This decoupling of CEMF allows time variant magnetic interactions in electromagnetic systems.
I may as well get out my cheque book, I'm convinced.
I'd note that we get free energy all the time. We get more energy out of a gallon of gasoline than was put into making it. We get far more power from a pound of fuel in a nuclear reactor than we put into mining the uranium, refining it and turning it into nuclear fuel. Neither of those violates the first or second laws of thermodynamics. That's because those laws apply to closed systems, and we're not in a closed system. In the case of gasoline, the sun put energy into the system from outside. In the case of uranium, the supernova that created the uranium atoms put the energy into creating them. So it's entirely possible to have a source of energy that's simply tapping something outside our normal view of the system. Such a source would appear to be providing free energy.
OTOH, Steorn seems to have failed the acid test: producing results. It'd've been much more convincing if they could've just dropped a unit down on the bench and told their jury "Here it is, here's how to turn it on and off, here's where the power comes out. Have fun with it.". A working prototype trumps all theoretical arguments, and Steorn couldn't produce a working prototype. Until they can, I'm inclined to believe they're either mistaken or running a scam.
Working as a design engineer and FEA analyst at a small mechanical design shop gives me the chance to work with on a lot of different projects.
:-)
One day, my boss comes in and tells me to look over a design this old guy from Florida has for a power generating machine.
This guy wasn't taking the "violates the laws of thermodynamics" line, so I had to spend some time to model up his design (a large drum that rotated, with small pistons that would drive up and down in relation to the surface of the drum, driving a crankshaft). He couldn't get it that this was essentially an overly complex gear, except with way more inefficiencies.
He tried to use the "if you roll a wine bottle with a string attached to the circumference, you can lift a load". He just couldn't accept that this was an example of transfer of work. Sigh.
What finally got him to calm down was that even if the drum could produce positive energy, it would immediately be gobbled up by the inefficiencies of the drive motor, gearing, and generator.
Best part of it was that I still got paid!
Arguing with an engineer is like wrestling a pig in the mud. After a while, you realize the engineer enjoys it.
Lisa, in this house, we obey the Laws of Thermodynamics!
Fascism starts when the efficiency of the government becomes more important than the rights of the people.
In the short story "Waldo," one of the main themes were "magical" energy generating devices called "DeKalbs." SPOILER: Ended up that they were actually sucking energy from an alternate universe. At any rate, I'm not inclined to dismiss it outright just because it can't be explained. However, I agree with a previous comment that they need to produce a working prototype in order for it to be taken seriously.
Religions really have the best take on this business method: claim the reward/product/proof will come after you're dead!
If he explores all forms and substances Straight homeward to their symbol-essences; He shall not die.
We have this in Finland too. Called "Utele", and obviously they're collecting money from investors. http://www.utele.org/utele/?page=6000002&l=1
If I invented a free energy machine, here is what I would do.
1. Create a "Solar Panel Farm" on my Property. The panels would be cheap panels of glass spray painted silver on one side. In an obscure shed would be the "AC/DC converter for the cells" which in actuality would be chock full of my amazing magnetic free energy engine thingies. I would produce about 2x as much energy as I would if the solar cells were actually real. :) Have another shed with "batteries" to supply the grid at night, in reality, they are filled with more of my machines and used batteries that don;t work with GNDN (goes nowhere, does nothing) wiring.
2. Sell the energy to the electric company and take the money to buy more land and build more "fake solar farms or fake windmills" more nondescript sheds built housing my free energy devices.
3. Keep repeating my process of making "fake" solar energy farms and maybe some real ones that produce more electricity that they should, (wink wink), selling electricity till I have built up a war chest enough to buy a region power company. Take several coal powered plants and fill them with my machines and only burn enough coal to make a diffuse small amount of smoke so no suspicions are raised. Lower my electricity rates as well for the consumers cause I don't have to buy so much coal to make power. Start selling power to other companies and take them over in the same way.
4. Once I have over 52% of total electricity in the country being produced by my free energy devices I would then open a chain of plants that would extract CO2 from the air, break sea water down and make hydrocarbons the hard way, sure it would be energy intensive, but what do i care, I gots free energy! Disguise them as refineries and buy a token amount of crude from domestic producers, make about 20x the amount of hydrocarbons for the amount of crude processed. Sell the produced oil to China and Russia first and then to the US, take over the oil companies the same way I did for the electric companies. Build enough infrastructure to crush the middle east and OPEC financially.
5. When the whole world is dependent on my free energy, then come clean about how I did it and how I made free energy and laugh my ass off from my personal moon base which is powered by my free energy machine.
Tsukasa: All I really want, is to be left alone...
Steorn's extraordinary claims are outside of the realm of known physics, many others have made similar claims (Galileo, Newton, Einstein, etc). The difference is proof...
Steorn needs to provide substantial proof to the world that their claims are legitimate, that the known laws of physics need revision.
Proof would open up enormous possibilities for research and development, now that we know what to look for, and how to test it (think airplanes, transistors, etc).
But Steorn has failed to provide any basic proof of any of their extraordinary claims. The scientists have not disproven anything, they have just shown that Steorn can not back up their extraordinary claims when tested properly.
The scientists go back to work.
Steorn goes back to "we fixed the little problem, it really works now, send us money, you can trust us..."
I say we find a way to steal energy from another universe, this free energy would be awesome! What could possibly go wrong with increasing the amount of energy in our universe, other than turning an open or flat universe into a closed universe.....
Enjoy the big crunch, all our fault, at least we could enjoy the Omega point while it lasts....
Tsukasa: All I really want, is to be left alone...
Why do the electrons keep going round and round perpetually? They should run out of energy at some point shouldn't they? They supposedly have mass, but I believe this is more a logical construct than a reality...
Just ask to see the company's quarterly electricity bill. If it's greater than 0.00EUR (0.00GBP/0.00USD) walk away.
AT&ROFLMAO