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Arizona Considers Selling Capitol Buildings

Things are so bad in Arizona that legislators are considering selling the House and Senate buildings where they've met and worked for more than 50 years. Dozens of other state properties may also be sold. The plan is to sell the properties and then lease them back over several years before assuming ownership again. "We've mortgaged the legislative halls," said an exasperated state Rep. Steve Yarbrough, a Chandler Republican. "That just tells you how extraordinary the times are. To me, it's something we're going to have to do no matter how much we find it undesirable." I bet they could get a great price on the Grand Canyon.

9 of 301 comments (clear)

  1. tax cut fundamentalists by Uberbah · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Low taxes can have high costs.

    1. Re:tax cut fundamentalists by wjousts · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Don't be silly. Why would patriots think their country is worth paying for?

    2. Re:tax cut fundamentalists by MSTCrow5429 · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Patriots love their country. Those corrupted by power and lucre love government.

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    3. Re:tax cut fundamentalists by Waffle+Iron · · Score: 3, Insightful

      The state doubled its budget in 9 years... why?

      Arizona's population went up by about 27% in that timeframe, and inflation increased by about 25%. That brings us to 158% of 2000 without any changes in gov't spending relative to income.

      So in constant dollars per person, their spending only went up 25%. That's not out of line with other governments.

      Why does government spending always seem to go up in general? Mostly because increasing technology levels. This has many effects which I won't go into here, but one big one is people live longer. (And Arizona is full of old people living longer.)

      At any rate, the governments' fraction of the total economies have been going up for centuries, and will continue to go up no matter how bitter that makes you. Individuals' absolute wealth has continued to increase regardless of the smaller fraction of overall activity they retain. That's the way it is; we don't live in an agrarian society any more. Deal with it.

  2. Arizona is worse than California by religious+freak · · Score: 5, Insightful

    On a per capita basis, Arizona is worse off than California. The cause is due to a confluence of factors, including not saving enough for the bad times, taxes being too low or spending being too high, having such a growth oriented economy, etc.

    But there are two items which I am CONVINCED are major factors as well.
    1) Term limits: They suck. I used to support them, but I was wrong. Term limits result in a legislature that doesn't know WTF it's doing at any time. There is no institutional memory, and once someone understands the complex process of creating and passing legislation - they get the boot. Additionally, because no one exactly knows their jobs, term limits result in a weak branch of government, so the executive tends to dominate. This is not what our respective state constitutions intended. I wish people would put two and two together on this.

    2) Illegal alien "crackdown" and employer sanctions: AZ is suffering a major real estate crisis. The crisis is for reasons obvious to anyone, but a contributing factor for our crappy economy and crappy real estate was the crack down on illegal aliens. Folks don't realize that these people rent and spend here too (often times without the societal expense us "real people" tend to cause society). When you have sweeps, a lack of employment and a general sense of animosity towards those who (in my view) are major contributors to society, they move one state over (they're not moving back to Mexico). I wish people would understand this point too.

    Certainly, the overall economic factors play a very large role, but AZ has gotten itself in a big mess all by itself...

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    1. Re:Arizona is worse than California by wjousts · · Score: 3, Insightful

      1) Term limits: They suck. I used to support them, but I was wrong. Term limits result in a legislature that doesn't know WTF it's doing at any time. There is no institutional memory, and once someone understands the complex process of creating and passing legislation - they get the boot. Additionally, because no one exactly knows their jobs, term limits result in a weak branch of government, so the executive tends to dominate. This is not what our respective state constitutions intended. I wish people would put two and two together on this.

      Not only that, but they pretty much guarantee that whoever is in government now, is planning for their career after government. They really have no choice with term limits.

  3. Re:You're stupid! by abigor · · Score: 4, Insightful

    So I take it you've analysed Arizona's budget and know for a fact that excessive government spending is a problem? I'd be interested in hearing your analysis of precisely what should be cut.

  4. How does this even work? by Volda · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Im confused here... If they sell the buildings then lease them from the new owners do they not have to pay rent? Then in a few years when the economy is better wont they have to buy it back for more then they sold it for? Real estate generally increases in value not decreases. It would make the whole deal a loss for the state then wouldnt it? I see no way that this would help out with their yearly budget except for the year they sell it. After that its only going to be a net loss.

    It seems to me this sounds like a bs accounting scheme. Kinda similiar how a few states say its cheaper to keep a murderer in prison for life then it is to execute him within a few years. Its looks great in the short term but in the long run it costs much more.

    It just sounds really stupid to me. I can understand trying to get some money to make ends meet but this whole deal makes me scratch my head.

  5. Re:You're stupid! by A_linux_covert · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Then riddle me this, from the New Deal until Reagan and the tax cutters at all costs, we were the envy of most of the world. I know you are going to hit back with the stagflation of the '70's, but that was more a product of the oil shock and paying for Vietnam. Until Reagan screwed up CA's higher ed, college was free and most of the country was headed down the same road. I live in CA, what we are experiencing now is a direct result of prop 13. If it were repealed tomorrow, a year from now we would be ok, not great but ok. The other half of the equation is the insane trade policies we(the upper class) have forced upon most of the world that is eating we (the middle and lower classes) alive. A protectionist trade policy was put into place by Hamilton and it worked for over 200 years. A progressive tax system forces a more egalitarian society to arise. It also tends to encourage reinvestment in the company, rather than exorbitant CEO salaries. Why pay someone $50 million when 49 of it is going to be taxed at %90, better to put it back into the company. Everything the Right wing GOP has done to this country has been nothing but deleterious to it. I arrive at this conclusion by simply looking at history. I remember when this country was full of hope and a chance to have a better life than your forebears. Now I fear for my grandchildren, at best they will be wage slaves to some faceless corporation.