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Electric Company Wants Monthly Fee For Solar Users
7-Vodka writes
"Xcel Energy customers who have their own solar panels are worried about a new fee being proposed by the company. A monthly fee to pay for transmission and distribution of energy would be charged to customers who have solar panels, irrespective of their energy use for the month. An Xcel Energy spokesman said the fee is to ensure that regular customers don't subsidize the 'connectivity fees' for the solar panel customers who don't pay when they generate as much as they use. When pressed, the spokesman admitted that nobody actually pays a 'connectivity fee,' yet they wanted to prevent the mooching from occurring in the future (presumably when they hit everyone with such a fee). He also called the absence of a connectivity fee for solar customers a 'double subsidy' because many solar customers receive rebates to install the panels."
Because I'm not really getting what the hell they mean about how solar panel users are mooching by NOT using the grid's energy. Maybe there's something electrical and complicated going on that I, as a mere mortal, don't understand that some kind EE can explain to me.
Right now all I'm hearing is "Damn them, how dare those freeloaders not buy things from us!"
A bullet may have your name on it but splash damage is addressed "To whom it may concern."
What about the monopoly Xcel has to distribute electricity. That's one hell of a subsidy. Oh, what about the free right of ways across the solar panel owner's property. Maybe the home owners should be permitted to charge for allowing a utility pole on their lawn.
Solar panels produce their highest output when demand is highest, namely on sunny summer days when everyone has their air conditioning cranked up. That's VERY expensive power. Keeping the power company from needing to fire up their peak power generators (versus relying on base load) and helping to prevent brownouts is worth serious $$$. Solar panel output is lowest when cheap base load power is plentiful. In management-speak this is called "synergy".
The PHB's at Xcel Energy need a whack with a cluestick. Nickel and diming people who are giving you expensive peak power for the price of base load is petty at best.
If they want to charge a connection fee then so be it. The gas company and other utilities often charge those so there's a track record of that and I doubt you'll be able to fight the lawyers and politicians they own without a lot of trouble.
The money you would spend to fight them could be better used to move yourself off the grid so you don't have to pay them. Anything. Ever.
But that's a lifestyle change too so I doubt enough people in the US are going to be motivated enough to do that.
Note - I live in the US and am reducing my usage until I can find a way to get off the grid. You can do it even in a suburban home if you plan well enough.
"Bah!" - Dogbert
It's called a line connection fee. EVERYONE already pays this. There is no reason that solar CONTRIBUTORS should have to be charged to help the power companies, if anything excel should have to pay them. Think about it, power, they dont have to maintain, service, or otherwise pay to implement, comes into their grid magically.
These guys just want to remain a near monopoly on power generation, so they want to create barriers of entry. People who propose stuff like this should be flogged, or worse.
Troll, Troll, go away and flame again some other day
I can agree with this logic. I do wonder when they will start charging a "feed your extra power back into the grid" fee will begin and any number of other fees that might arise out of this.
-- Who is the bigger fool? The fool or the fool who follows him? --
But they're already charging that fee.
The FAQ for xcel's own solar rebate program is here, read question 3.
There are some solar users with battery banks large enough to ride all the way through a typical night, but very few solar users with enough battery to last through a week of storms. In this case the power company's infrastructure is acting as insurance, and a fee like this is the price for that insurance.
In your analogy, please don't forget that you'd also be obligated to buy my leftover groceries. However, since you don't know how much I might send back, you have to pay to mail me a big box every week, which I may or may not return.
Ok, so you prevent your system from giving back extra during sunny days ( which is the right thing to do.. ) how would they ever know you can generate your own power? ( hey, we go on vacation a lot so we shut everything off )
Also, if i'm giving back back to the grid on good days, they are in effect getting free power to distribute elsewhere so they shouldn't bitch about it.
---- Booth was a patriot ----
Power companies (generally) don't make a ton of profit, they're regulated to keep costs down.
This may be pedantic, but they are regulated to keep _prices_ down. As a monopoly, unregulated they could charge any price. Ideally regulation would be customer centric. But in reality, tariffs tend to be based on cost plus formulas. Which is what makes the lack of innovation by electric and telephone companies ludicrous. They were content to sit on their wasteful practices rather than innovate and become more efficient. The Telcos learned the hard way when cellular and cable companies joined the party. Alternative energy production could teach electricity providers some of the same lessons.
Another day, another update to a Google android app.
Let's consider the value of the pollution externalities that the power companies benefit from every day, balance that against the cost of hooking wires to my house, and we'll call it even.
It's a really good deal for the power company.
To explain further, an externality is an economic term that refers to a cost or an impact on someone not directly involved. When a power company pollutes with a coal plant, there are many people who are impacted by the pollution, even though they are not involved in either the generation or the consumption of the electricity causing the pollution.
A homeowner bears more than his fair share of the cost of pollution, and a factory which uses far more electricity bears much less than its fair share.
Clean air is worth something. It has a value. And when that clean air is destroyed, the value is uncompensated. That's an externality.
So if the electric company wants to charge me for the house hookup, then I would like to start charging the electric company for the value of the clean air I no longer have access to.
Fair's fair.
Fascism trolls keeping me up every night. When I starts a preachin', he HITS ME WITH HIS REICH!