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Apple Blames 'External Forces' For Exploding iPhones
Shome writes "Apple has stated that there is no evidence that recent iPhone explosions reported by users are connected to overheating of batteries.
It may be stated that French consumer affairs authorities have started their own investigation on the reported explosions, some of which have caused minor injuries to the users, and are studying the phone's safety features.
The Inquirer runs a piece that blames Apple for blaming its customers. 'This mysterious force is not God, or a rival religion, nor does it require any metaphysics to understand. An "external force" is just Apple's term for the black shirted people who believe that everything that Apple makes is wonderful. It is what other companies call their "customers," writes Nick Farrell.'"
check out the Macrumors forums. people bought iMacs a few years ago and LCD's started to go after the warranty expired. The Genius's called the customers crazy. Only reason Apple payed out money with the nvidia chipsets is because they got the money from nvidia.
there was a hard drive clicking issue with current MBP's and 7200rpm drives, including freeze ups. people took them to Apple stores and were told it was a feature.
..because Apple doesnt have a track record for selling devices that explode. They certainly didn't recall 1.8 million iBook and POwerBook batteries in 2006. Definately not.
"His name was James Damore."
I think it's simpler than that, they literally mean "a force has been applied to the device from outside causing it to fail", i.e. it was dropped or struck.
No kidding!!! What do you say at this point?
There's an app for that! Seriously though, lithium polymer batteries *can't* explode since they have no metal canister to hold the outgassing pressure. They simply 'vent with flame'.
That's actually what their press release says. From a quote of the statement in the BBC:
"The iPhones with broken glass that we have analysed to date show that in all cases the glass cracked due to an external force that was applied to the iPhone."
Of course, it is more fun to blame the Eveel Apple and accuse them of being disingenuous, than to actually read what they said.
-dZ.
Carol vs. Ghost
I know little about these specific explosions, but modern high-density batteries pack a heckuva lotta energy into a tiny package. If mechanical damage causes an electrical cell-short, you can expect that energy release to be pretty dramatic. If not an explosion, certainly a rapid heat discharge. That's tough to design around unless you just make the thing bigger and heavier to withstand the pressures exerted by the worst-case ass-press.
He's getting rather old, but he's a good mouse.
Sure, it may be "external forces" like accidently dropped phones, high- or low humidities or temperatures, or what-not, but if the iPhone explosion rate is higher than competitive phones, you have to ask yourself why iPhones are so fragile.
Come on Apple, find the cause and unless it's customers deliberately abusing their phones, fix it.
Let's see - single digit reports, all in one country; hardly enough data to determine anything, other than a few screens broke in France. No evidences of "explosions" Apple should certainly look into it, but at this point it's hard to tell what is wrong or who's fault it is. Until Apple gets the phones, pulls them apart and see's what happened everyone, including Apple, is guessing.
If it is an iPhone problem, I wonder why the issue is so localized; I'd expect a design flaw to show up more often and more evenly spread over a production run.
Personally, my experience with Apple addressing issues that point to design flaws is good - I've had 2 MB's keyboards replaced, free of charge with 1 day turnaround, due to cracking issues. One was way out of warranty, yet they fixed it for free.
I'm a consultant - I convert gibberish into cash-flow.
Yes, I recall reading a warning about this in (I think) the literature that came with my 360.
Most publishers will replace damaged discs for a fee. I think the going rate these days is about $20.
Have you see the pics? These phones have severely cracked screens, but 90% of the glass is still there... This is not exactly an "explosion" though the imact in a few cases caused the LiIon battery pack to outgas or "pop"
In every case reviewed thus far however, "external pressure" clearly indicated the force was a twisting or bending, or an impact on the glass itself pushing in. The glass is not boken outwards, so any glass discharged from the device, per the evidence presented, was likely shot up from the impact with ground, or a couple of kids were wrestling over the device and bent it in such a was to send glass shards outward.
NO evidence of the battery, or the glass itself, being a fault has been shown in any of these cases. Though little is public information, Apple has libberously documented each suspected case for a device returned to them for examination, and it;s consistant evidence.
There is no contest in life for which the unprepared have the advantage.
Don't cry little boy. Just because Apple have some bad apples in their sold inventory, you don't have to take it so personally. As for information, you must have missed the recent 800 page report details this very issue - yes 800 pages of real paper!
I can't tell if you're being sarcastic or trolling, but I'll bite:
I've been sitting my ass on mobiles for 10 years. That's all my phones except my first brick of a Sony, that couldn't fit in my backpocket.
Out of all the perverted treatment I subjected my phones to, the only one that got hurt was an Ericsson T28: its screen got cracked when I slipped on ice and landed on my ass. That's my full weight landing on a thin glass+electronics+thin metal/plastic shell, and the phone was still working but the LCD was barely readable.
Compare that to 2 out of 6 iPhone owners I know -- they got their screens cracked: one vibrated itself off a table, and the other one got dropped on concrete. I know I've dropped my phones many-a-times from varying heights, and none got hurt. Probably because other manufacturers build their devices for real-world use, and test them as such: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zES6byXbOaE -- jump to about 6:00 and witness the bending test, aka ass-sitting-on-cellphone-test.
Does Apple test the iThingies like that? Do they bake them to unbearable temperatures? Probably not, because this looks like a design flaw easily uncovered with a bit of prodding/bending/overheating.
I'm glad all my laptops use NiMH, since it's been around quite a big longer (almost 20 years) and the bugs have been removed. I'm sure Lithium batteries will be a great product to own... circa 2020.
Naaaaaah. The main thing that limits the short circuit current of a battery is it's internal resistance. And different battery families have considerably different resistances. Check out the mighty wikipedia:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Internal_resistance
The lower the internal resistance, the higher the overall battery efficiency, especially at high currents, but the more dangerous a short circuit is.
So, as alot of automotive mechanics and UPS repairmen know, short out a lead acid cell, and you get a "glowing crowbar/screwdriver of doom".
As the R/C airplane guys know, short out a NiCad and it'll pop, quite violently. My father had a RC plane pack pepper a styrofoam ceiling with foil fragments in the 80s during fast charging (no one hurt, no serious property damage, but that was the end of that pack...)
wikipedia's mostly made up numbers show a lithium has about 1/2 the internal resistance of a NiMH. So, that would be twice the short circuit current. Thanks to P=I2R that would be four times the heat output. Lithiums have a much higher energy density, meaning the lithium either has more energy to convert into heat, or that its an equal amount of heat in a smaller volume.
I'd conservatively estimate a shorted Lithium will inherently make a bang thats about ten times bigger than the bang from a shorted NiMH. Plus or minus engineering design effects, like corroded emergency vents in a NiMH, flamability and boiling points of the different electrolytes, etc. This would make a highly entertaining mythbusters episode.
"Science flies us to the moon. Religion flies us into buildings." - Victor Stenger
I'm pretty sure they don't. Not in the US, and probably not anywhere else. Computers and phones are regulated by the CPSC (and the FCC); cars are regulated by the NHTSA. Totally different set of laws, regulations, and responsibilities.
Whether the cost is $0.6 or $600 - the point is that it was his mistake, and so he pays the price.
Disagree. Major manufacturer design failure. The game publisher and retailer knew what they were getting into when they decided to sell it. They should eat the cost of a very poor design.
It's not the manufacturer's fault that he moved it while it was spinning - something common sense would say not to do.
My car CD/MP3 player has not scratched a disk in approx 8 years of driving over potholes.
My ancient sony disk-man CD player has never scratched a CD while in motion. Skipped while playing, yes, but no damage.
Apparently rotating a standard size optical disc without grinding it like a car disk brake rotor has been a solved problem, industry wide, for at least a decade, unless you're microsoft.
"Science flies us to the moon. Religion flies us into buildings." - Victor Stenger
if a manufacturer can not design a cell phone to withstand normal use by normal people, they should not be the business of manufacturing cell phones.
That seems to be something Motorola has got right. My wife and both have Razr2 V9 phones, and I have always been a bit suspicious of their shininess.
However, a couple of weeks ago, my wife managed to drop her phone in the path of a tractor I was driving. Sure, the glass splintered due to the "external force" as one would expect. But apart from that (and a few scratches), the device is still perfectly functional. Call that an endorsement if you will, but I don't believe the iPhone would stand up to the same treatment.
the point is that it was his mistake, and so he pays the price.
There's only one problem with that assertion. Microsoft specifically said playing games or DVDs with the system in a vertical position was ok. Scratched discs were a well known problem.
Comment removed based on user account deletion
Yup, you didn't read the Apple manual and SAFETY WARNINGS page that came with your device, did you?
I did...
It was fairly clear.... Never expose device to more than 130 degrees F, never use for extended periods in hot sun, never submerge in water, take caution not to drop on hard ground or from a hight above 6 feet (g-force shock alone, not just blunt trauma, can cause LiIon cells to short and overheat during rapid discharge), never leave on in a closed bag, purse, pocket, or insulated sleve.
All these things were indicated as possible cause of fire or dangerous battery outgassing possibly including explosion.
Every device with a LiIon battery included these warnings. Most people ignore them completely.
There is no contest in life for which the unprepared have the advantage.
Here is a video of exploding Li-Po battery http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z3o_2mwRPdw
- Raynet --> .
Again, it is a matter of engineering. Consumers mistreat their devices. The more portable the device is, the more people mistreat it. A cell phone is extremely portable, and if you designing a cell phone, you should design it to withstand the conditions that people subject other cell phones to: pockets, bags/briefcases/backpacks, dropping, hot environments, vibrations, dust, moisture, etc. No, it does not need ludicrous tolerances; it does not need to operate underwater or inside a volcano, but if it stops working because it was stored in a pocket on a 95 degree day, it is a poorly designed phone.
Palm trees and 8
No boom there... just an emphatic poof...and this is absolute worse case purposely pushing way more current into the battery then intended. Given enough current I could make a potato explode.
AND DID YOU NOTICE in every instance the Li-Po battery swells to at least twice its normal volume before Flameout a pretty obvious warning sign. Of course you don't see the same experiment with other battery types as the people that tried it are still picking bit of battery out of the flesh.