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Feds Ask IT Execs To Throw Away Cellphones After Visiting China
sholto writes "US intelligence agencies are advising top US IT executives to weigh their laptops before and after visiting China as one of many precautions against corporate espionage. Symantec Chief Technology Officer Mark Bregman said he was also advised to buy a new cellphone for each visit and to throw it away after leaving. Bregman said he kept a separate MacBook Air for use in China, which he re-images on returning, but claimed he didn't subscribe to the strictest policies. 'Bregman said the US was also concerned about its companies employing Chinese coders, particularly in security.'"
The same outsources plants that produce the goods just do a second run at night to produce grey market versions. Microsoft found this out after finding perfect counterfeit copies of their software that were only distinguished by having serial numbers that were never activated in their database, the plants that were producing packaging and holograms for their official packing were making exact duplicates for the counterfeiters.
There are 4 boxes to use in the defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, ammo. Use in that order. Starting now.
How about using phones and notebooks manufactured in China? Is that ok or do we have to assume they are bugged-at-factory? Are the US starting to move their production lines back to home?
Also that he doesn't let his IT department near his laptop. Thats a level of distrust that, as an IT guy, drives me absolutely bonkers.
I'm just curious. Isn't it a bit of a coincidence that this warning comes out when there is a growing trade dispute with China happening now? We have been using China as our factory an major offshoring partner for quite a few years and now there are warnings.
It's NOT me! It's the meds! I'm on 1000mg of Fukitol.
(The following discussion is based on real experiences and is not meant to profile people, but to state facts.)
This is really ridiculous. If the Chinese want to steal our technology, all they have to do is to contact several of the thousands of Chinese nationals who are working in the US until they find someone who needs money or other help for their family back in China.
One company I worked for had a Chinese national who was not allowed to work on part of a project because it was protected technology. The same person could have dropped the entire project onto their iPod and carried it out the door, but did not.
The ethics problem is represented by an experience I had while at an American research university. A Chinese faculty member met with the Chinese students in order to tell them in America, cheating and other ethical breaches are not considered a good way to get ahead. This suggested certain cultural differences which should not be used to discriminate, but need to be recognized because of the risks involved.
-Todd
Omne ignotum pro magnifico.
Since in the US they'll take your phone and laptop, MP3 player and any other good stuff and demand to see your company documents if they think there's something nice in there.
PS the US has used Echelon to get Boeing a european contract by finding out the figure they had to bit under to get the contract.
This didn't require a cell phone either, so throwing away your cellphone isn't necessary there either.
So much nicer being spied on by the US government. You don't have to buy new kit all the time, just accept the espionage.
how much does data weigh? I'm sure the 1's are heavier than the 0's....
In the punchcard / papertape era, it was obviously the other way around, 0s are heavier, 1s (punched out) are lighter.
"Science flies us to the moon. Religion flies us into buildings." - Victor Stenger
In a word? YES.
It would require actual competence to detect a piece of hardware that essentially did nothing until activated and simply sat on a motherboard. Do you know if there are extremely detailed inspections done on every piece of circuitry brought into country X from country Y? I know for a fact that in a certain very large defense company I worked for lots of "surprises" were found on a regular basis. Typically things like parts that were different from the specs, insects, and on occasion completely incorrect assemblies.
The funny part was these nearly all made it past QA and into the finished products, only to be discovered when something failed.
So based on that, I'd say that *if* someone were choosing to do something like this, it would be fairly easy to sneak it past the level of moron that would typically be doing these inspections.
Tinfoil hats aside - the real trick is getting the data back off again. It's trivial to convince a cell phone (for example) to record conversations while appearing off. The trick is to get to the data without anyone noticing, while you're in a foreign (possibly hostile) nation. I'd think someone would notice if a cell phone was constantly 'phoning home'.
Doing this with a laptop would also be trivial, but I would hope that the firewall filter would catch outbound connections to unusual sites?
An operating system should be like a light switch... simple, effective, easy to use, and designed for everyone.
Data may be weightless, but how about hardware key logging devices?
That reminds me of a Cold War story I heard once upon a time. The CIA worked with a Xerox technician to secretly install a camera inside the machine(s) at the Soviet embassy. They got away with it for a long time because those old machines were so complicated that only a handful of people knew how they really worked.
This is just the modern day equivalent. If your hardware is out of your sight even for a few moments it should be treated as though it was compromised. If it's worked on by someone that you don't trust implicitly then it should be treated as though it was compromised.
I want peace on earth and goodwill toward man.
We are the United States Government! We don't do that sort of thing.
To be fair China is still a Command economy that let's "Capitalism" play because it's a useful way to get people to work harder.. they are a long way from the idea of "Free Markets". This is where it's not a "round" world.. The Chinese government has their eye on the 50 year game and is more than willing to tie up all of a natural resource... and throw people in jail when the "free market" price goes up.
While the US punishes "intervention" by state banks in places like Japan and Korea for making sure their chip makers don't go under, China is stacking the deck on a NATIONAL level for resources... setting prices that corporations are allowed to SELL to China for.. and nobody is really stopping them. Just last week China "decided" they weren't going to be exporting any more rare earth metals (needed for high power magnets in electronics) They just issued a directive it wasn't allowed to be exported anymore....for any price. Back in 2007 one of the things that knocked US auto makers on their butts was China using scrap US steel instead of imported ore. It nearly doubled the price of scrap here (ironically bought with trade surplus dollars no less!) and made it even harder to complete with Asian companies... it was the straw that caused a good deal of the auto maker meltdown earlier this year. China manipulates their currency by not allowing dollars to be converted into Chinese money except for specific state-sponsored investments, and they don't allow US companies to take their Chinese profits OUT of the country either. It sets up a situation where they pile up money in US banks to buy US resources... but US companies can't pull their capital profits OUT of China...
China is playing the long game, highly protectionist and stacking the deck with our own money and resources against us. It's economic "war" played at the highest level and the US government has no grasp that the "invisible hand' won't save them.
An airplane builder had its proprietary metal reverse engineered by asian companies. They did a great job with security, so couldn't figure out how the metals got sampled. People can't just go scrape parts off a military airplane, especially when it's not built yet.
They gave tours and you couldn't take pictures, but you could see planes being built.
Turns out asians were using very soft-soled shoes. So while looking up and pointing, they pressed their feet down on metal filings, and when they drove away they had samples in their shoes, to be analyzed later.
Sneaky bastards work in corporate espionage.
It is. There was a story a few months ago about the Department of Defense using router hardware sent to them with onboard hacks.
I swear to God...I swear to God! That is NOT how you treat your human!
I submitted a story here about a year or so ago about Maxtor hard drives with compromised firmware that were made in China. It never got picked up. Go figure.