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For New Zealanders, No More Phones As Sat-Nav Devices

rixth writes "From the 1st of November, it will be illegal to use cell phones while driving in New Zealand. Today, the Government clarified that you can't use your mobile phone as a navigational device, even if it is mounted on the dash board."

32 of 364 comments (clear)

  1. Hands-free is allowed by Walking+The+Walk · · Score: 3, Informative

    Not sure what all the fuss is about, as you will be allowed to use your mobile phone via a hands-free kit. So as long as your phone does navigation over the hands-free, it's fine to use.

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    1. Re:Hands-free is allowed by Walking+The+Walk · · Score: 3, Informative

      Lots of the hands-free kits respond to voice commands. That's the point - otherwise how would you dial, answer, etc? I assume they would do the same for navigation. I'm sure there's a voice-driven navigation app for the iPhone. (If you know for sure there isn't, let me know, I'll invest in a local team to build one. Sure to be a money maker.)

      --
      A recursive sig
      Can impart wisdom and truth
      Call proc signature()
    2. Re:Hands-free is allowed by dunkelfalke · · Score: 5, Insightful

      As you should do it in all cases - park your car, enter the destination, wait for the route calculation, go on driving.

      --
      "It's such a fine line between stupid and clever" -- David St. Hubbins, Spinal Tap
    3. Re:Hands-free is allowed by MichaelSmith · · Score: 4, Funny

      As you should do it in all cases hire a Mexican to enter the destination while driving.

      Fixed

      Thats going to be expensive in NZ. How about somebody from Norfolk Island?

    4. Re:Hands-free is allowed by slim · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Holding a phone to your ear not only ties up a hand, but also probably means you're having a conversation.

      A sat nav, on the other hand, is designed so that you don't have to touch it once it's set up. Its voice instructions are designed so you don't usually have to even look at it. If you do have to look at it, it's designed so that a glance is sufficient.

      What's more, many people's alternative to a sat nav is to refer to a paper map while driving. That's obviously more of a distraction.

      BTW - Studies have shown that having a phone conversation is more distracting than having a conversation with a passenger. Something to do with passengers knowing when to give you space to concentrate on a road hazard. Do your own Googling.

    5. Re:Hands-free is allowed by rolfwind · · Score: 4, Insightful

      A sat nav, on the other hand, is designed so that you don't have to touch it once it's set up. Its voice instructions are designed so you don't usually have to even look at it. If you do have to look at it, it's designed so that a glance is sufficient.

      What's more, many people's alternative to a sat nav is to refer to a paper map while driving.

      Not only that, but you can concentrate on the road instead of the highway signs looking where you are going, as well as not having to squint for the random road sign, or when you are close to your destination, looking at house numbers. Less miles driven due to being lost as well, as well as a lot less anxiety in a new place - I would say sat navigation makes the road safer overall.

    6. Re:Hands-free is allowed by IBBoard · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I would say sat navigation makes the road safer overall.

      Except for the idiots who a) take it too literally and ignore road signs the satnav doesn't know about (like some one-way systems that aren't on its maps, or junctions that aren't really there, or U-turns that you could take but probably shouldn't), b) just enter a destination and get lost because it isn't accurate enough or it picked the wrong one, c) decide that the best time to fiddle with the route is while still driving or d) leave all of their indicating and moving to the last minute rather than having planned ahead even vaguely.

    7. Re:Hands-free is allowed by Lumpy · · Score: 5, Insightful

      I was told people who have a driver's licence are qualified to operate a car.

      you were lied to. People with a license simply passed a very easy and incredibly rudimentary testing. They are not skilled enough to safely drive a car, they are not educated in collision avoidance or defensive driving.

      At least here in the USA, it's that way. Honestly, around here a baked potato can get a drivers license.

      --
      Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
    8. Re:Hands-free is allowed by dunkelfalke · · Score: 4, Funny

      I understand a german drivers license is expensive and incredibly comprehensive... anyone know for sure?

      I do. You've got that word "incredibly" before the wrong adjective, but otherwise the description is correct.

      --
      "It's such a fine line between stupid and clever" -- David St. Hubbins, Spinal Tap
    9. Re:Hands-free is allowed by kuldan · · Score: 5, Informative

      I understand a german drivers license is expensive and incredibly comprehensive... anyone know for sure?

      Yeah, I can. To get your Drivers License in Germany, you have to attend to around 15 - 20 Hours of theoretical classes, take a written test on them, have around 25 - 30 hours of guided driving until your driving instructor deems you fit for driving, and then have to take an approximately hour-long driving test (including: city driving, highway driving, interstate driving, parking, vehicle safety) with a state-provided inspector additional to your driving instructor - and if you don't pass, you have to take a few driving lessons and try again. (each try - including the mandatory lessions - comes you at around 300 - 400 $ extra).. expect to pay around $2.500 - $3.000 for your german license if you are an average learner.

    10. Re:Hands-free is allowed by commodore64_love · · Score: 4, Informative

      Hands-free phones should be banned as well.

      The American Automobile Association (AAA) has shown via study that the mere act of using or talking into a cellphone is a distraction & reduces response times below that of drunk drivers. People don't like to hear that, but those are the results.

      --
      "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it." - historian Evelyn Beatrice Hall
    11. Re:Hands-free is allowed by PitaBred · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Passengers should be banned, too. That increases reaction time. Hell, anything you do other than keenly staring ahead and in your mirrors reduces reaction time.

      Driving is dangerous. We already have laws that ban dangerous and distracted driving... if someone is being dangerous, pull them over. Do we not have video cameras for evidence?

      Banning everything someone might do piecemeal is asinine. Stupid people will find a way to do stupid things without explicitly breaking the law.

      BTW, those cell-phone studies were almost certainly done with people right at the legal limit for "drunk" driving. Makes you think about how stupidly low those limits are, eh? MADD is a prohibitionist organization.

    12. Re:Hands-free is allowed by Runaway1956 · · Score: 3, Informative

      I wasn't aware of the AAA's study. More, I have problems with the AAA - they have given bad advice in the past. But, this study validates what the AAA says on the subject, with a lot more credibility:

      http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov/portal/site/nhtsa/template.MAXIMIZE/menuitem.416f74e8613992381601031046108a0c/?javax.portlet.tpst=4427b997caacf504a8bdba101891ef9a_ws_MX&javax.portlet.prp_4427b997caacf504a8bdba101891ef9a_viewID=detail_view&itemID=d01bab6383f62010VgnVCM1000002c567798RCRD

      Wow! It looks like I searched out one of the longest addresses on the web, huh? Try these http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/32035670/ns/technology_and_science-wireless/

      http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090924/ap_on_go_ca_st_pe/us_commercial_drivers_cell_phones

      People who claim that they drive safely while using a phone probably think they also drive safely with .2% blood alcohol content.

      --
      "Windows is like the faint smell of piss in a subway: it's there, and there's nothing you can do about it." - Charlie Br
    13. Re:Hands-free is allowed by MindlessAutomata · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Yes, but people with passengers in the car WITH them actually recovers a bit from risk from what you would see with cell phones, as apparently passengers, during a tricky driving moment or such, know when to shut up or may even alert the driver to dangers in the road. The studies on this have already accounted for that factor.

      Dispute the facts all you want, but driving and talking on a cell phone depletes attentional resources considerably.

  2. Bad decision? Is it? by tonycheese · · Score: 3, Interesting

    At first glance I thought this was a terrible decision. Clearly, the government just rushed a response to whether it would be illegal to use cell phones as navigational devices. But actually, it might make sense. The article says you can still use your phone to make phone calls, just nothing else. It gave an example of someone rear-ending another car while using a cell phone in a cradle as a navigational device. A cell phone usually would have a much smaller screen than a regular GPS device, since it is designed as a cell phone and not as a GPS system. This might lead to longer times spent glancing at the screen and higher chances of accidents happening.

    1. Re:Bad decision? Is it? by RMH101 · · Score: 5, Insightful

      No, it's a dumb decison. Take the most popular smartphone - the iPhone. I have one running Tomtom Navigator, and I also have a standalone Tomtom 720. They're pretty much identical: approximately the same size screen, no hardware buttons - just touchscreen, with the same interface. Why should they be treated differently? My old WinMo handsets running Tomtom were much the same: same interface, same operation.

    2. Re:Bad decision? Is it? by MichaelSmith · · Score: 4, Interesting

      A similar law is on the way in Victoria, Australia. I believe the reasoning is that they want to totally ban people hand operating phones while driving. Using the phone as a GPS gives drivers a way around the law. The Government is trying to close this loophole.

    3. Re:Bad decision? Is it? by RMH101 · · Score: 5, Insightful

      There are already (I'm in the UK) laws against driving without due care and attention. They passed a law to specifically cover sending text messages, and generally touching your phone at all (i.e. a bluetooth headset is OK, but hand-dialling isn't) which you can kind of understand, but what's next? Passing a law making it illegal to eat an apple whilst driving? To tune your car radio?
      The point is there are a large number of activities that are a Bad Idea whilst driving, including talking to passengers. You don't need a law for each and every one.

  3. from TFA... by stimpleton · · Score: 4, Insightful

    " 2 degrees chief executive Eric Hertz admitted rear-ending another vehicle at an intersection in Auckland a few weeks ago while glancing at directions on his iPhone, which was mounted on a hands-free kit in his car. Under the new law, that would be illegal"

    If the law takes that tact then It makes me wonder how children being taken to school rates on the distract-o-meter.

    As little johnny stabs his sister with a blunt pencil, I would presume it to be less so than an iPhone on the dashboard.

    But yes, it would be political suicide to go near that hot potato.

    --

    In post Patriot Act America, the library books scan you.
    1. Re:from TFA... by TheTurtlesMoves · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Because my quality of life is seriously impeded by the inability to use a cell phone while driving, *without* a hands free set. Oh the humanity.

      Next thing you know they will impose speed limits, minimum mechanical requirements for cars and, God save us all from the freedom hating governments, require drivers are certified to drive by passing a standardized test.

      Sometimes you "freedom" people come across as real dicks.

      --
      The Grey Goo disaster happened 3 billion years ago. This rock is covered in self replicating machines!
    2. Re:from TFA... by Totenglocke · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Sometimes you "freedom" people come across as real dicks.

      Maybe, but you freedom hating people always come across as dicks.

      --
      "The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." ~Thomas Jefferson
  4. Re:What's the deal with all these features? by wjh31 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    you can, only its going to cost you $30 instead of $300.

  5. it's getting fixed by dodocaptain · · Score: 5, Informative

    Slashdot is a bit behind the times - Steven Joyce, Minister of Transport in NZ has instructed officials to fix this oversight in the law.

    http://www.iphonewzealand.co.nz/2009/all/breaking-common-sense-prevails-law-is-to-be-amended/

    1. Re:it's getting fixed by retech · · Score: 5, Funny

      It's not technically behind. NZ is a day ahead (more or less). So it's already happened here, we're just waiting for the rest of the world to catch up. By the time you read this, it will already be tomorrow in NZ and we'll have moved onto something just as bizarre and misunderstood by lawmakers.

      BTW, the for those of you in the past the numbers were 11, 19, 27, 32, 41, 47 (39). Enjoy your new winnings!

  6. As a Kiwi...This sucks. by ThePeices · · Score: 3, Informative

    As a New Zealander I cant say that I am very happy with this decision. I think that an exemption must be made for hands free kits for these phones/satnavs. The rest of the new law was banning talking on a cellphone or txting while driving a vehicle, is commendable, but common sense needs to bear with laws like these.

    This law needs amendment.

  7. This is whatcha call job security... by macraig · · Score: 3, Insightful

    ... when you're a company that makes dedicated car navigation devices. Ain't it great when the guv'ment creates a captive audience for what you happen to be selling? All the auto insurance CEOs jizzed all over themselves the day that California mandated auto insurance but then didn't provide any. The same thing happened twice again when California also mandated helmets for motorcycles and bicycles, but then didn't provide any and didn't even use the state's collective buying power to negotiate a good deal for all the state citizens. Of course they should have done at least that much for auto insurance, too (and they kinda did, very belatedly).

    Let's see if New Zealand screws up just as bad or surprise everybody and do it right. If you're gonna require something by law - or effectively do the same thing by banning something else - you'd damned well better keep a lid on the profiteering that is sure to ensue.

  8. Re:It doesn't just stop at electronics - eg food by Tony+Hoyle · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Legally that's correct - you must have both hands on the wheel otherwise legally you're not in control of the car. I presume there are exceptions for changing gear..

    In this case the key phrase is "she negotiated a left turn with an apple in her right hand". She wasn't just driving - she was trying to turn with one hand on the wheel. The was then issued a fixed penalty notice for what would normally be considered a minor breach of the law - she refused that remedy, demanding a court appearence - hence the cost to defend the case.

  9. can't get there from here by muckracer · · Score: 4, Funny

    > "The Road User Amendment Rule 2009 means drivers will not be able to look at
    > a navigation aid on a mobile phone when driving, even if it is mounted on
    > the dashboard.

    I'd go a step further and require all windows to be painted black so that
    drivers may not look at the mountains or ogle at cute women they pass...

  10. They're all illegal! by countach · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Most of the "dedicated' GPS units on the market actually have bluetooth which technically turns them into proxy mobile phones. So aren't they really saying that almost all GPS units are now illegal?

    So you can make calls on a mobile (in a cradle) while driving, and use a GPS while driving, but you can't use a phone in a cradle as a GPS????

  11. Cross-continental accidents by aclarke · · Score: 4, Funny

    So, GP. It's pretty clear that if you hold your phone to your ear while driving in Australia, you could cause a death or injury in the United States.

    If that's not a reason to abstain, I don't know what is.

  12. Probably protecting Navman by LinuxLuver · · Score: 4, Interesting

    This interpretation of the new law is probably intended to protect the Navman GPS devices designed and (formerly) made in New Zealand. Senior government Minister, Murray McCully, is the MP for the electorate where navman is located (East Coast Bays). Other government ministers (Dr. Wayne Mapp - North Shore and Jonathan Coleman - Northcote) are also from the same area. The Prime Minister, John Key, is MP for Helensville.....right next door to East Coast Bays. Yes, this law is dumb.....But the current government knows few limits to dumb when the public interest gets in the way of filling the pockets of their cronies and donors: 1. gutting rail to favour the trucking lobby. 2. Hobbling commuter train growth to favour the bus operators. 3. Delaying the ETS application to their farmer base.....forcing all OTHER taxpayers to subsidise their national Party voting farmers. I could go on all day. This government is a crony feeding frenzy.

    --
    Only boring people are ever bored.
  13. Rigged Tests by Totenglocke · · Score: 3, Informative

    I've read up on many (not all, so I can't say for ALL) of those tests and they all have one flaw to rig the test to show that cell phones are "bad" - they do NOT let the driver say "hang on" or put the phone down for any reason. I rarely talk on my phone while I'm driving because I have a manual and it's just too annoying. However, when I do if I get to a tricky bit of road I say "Hang on" and drop the phone in my lap or in few cases where someone cut me off and I had to hit the brakes and swerve, I simply dropped the phone and it landed wherever.

    It's not hard to shut up and / or drop the phone when you need to really concentrate on the road. The tests are going out to prove that cell phones are bad (not sure WHY they want that conclusion) and they rig them to show what they want.

    --
    "The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." ~Thomas Jefferson