Slashdot Mirror
Universe Has 100x More Entropy Than We Thought
eldavojohn writes "Previous estimates are now thought to skimp on the entropy of the observable universe. The researchers contend that super-massive black holes are the largest contributor of entropy. Since they contribute two orders of magnitude more than previously thought, the total of all the observable universe is correspondingly higher. The paper highlights (in gruesome detail) new issues that arise with these new calculations — like estimating us a little bit closer to heat death (moving entropy totals from 10^102 to 10^104 out of a maximum of 10^122)."
I meant that the CURRENT age of the universe is finite. And any point in the future, the age will be finite (although it will be arbitrarily old the more arbitrarily further in the future you pick).
You misunderstood my comment.
One of the main ideas (before the Big Bang theory was proposed) used to be that the universe had always existed. So, in that context, the second law (and the Big Bang theory) sides with the creationists, who propose that the universe currently has a finite age.
If you really want to change a creationist's mind, you must first convince them that modern, mainstream science is sometimes on their side, and then they stop fighting and you have an ally for science, instead of a foe. Science is agnostic (because it deals with the natural, not with any kind of potential "supernatural"), yet atheists make enemies of science when they pit science against religion (which is more important than rational thought to very many people--they will defend it at all costs).
If atheists really care about advancing science in the public's view, they will stop picking fights with everyone's grandmother and start just advocating science (and letting science stand for itself).
But so many Atheists don't really care about science any more than the Creationists do. Yes, I'm about to draw a -1 Troll, but here's the facts.
Back in the 1940s - 50s, when the Big Bang/Steady State controversy was at its peak, a sizeable number of organised Atheists came down squarely on the side of the Steady State. Scientists and Philosophers, people with the international reputation of Sir Bertrand Russell (for just one example), all insisted that science would prove the Steady State. They made public statements that the Steady State proved there was no need for any God, and that the Big Bang wasn't science, it was religion trying to sneak God in by the back door.
At least a dozen people who were as significant to the Atheist movement of their time as Richard Dawkins is today or Carl Sagan was before his death, picked one side in a scientific debate over the other for philosophical reasons, and turned out to be wrong. Even twenty years after the Big Bang won out in most circles, almost none of them could bring themselves to admit it had.* Many of them acted with obvious bad character, for example making promises that if it turned out the universe did have a definite time of origin, they would resign from being local chairman of an Atheist society and embrace religion, and then denying they ever said such things once the Big bang won in general scientific circles (and several of these made the statements on radio or in their own books, so the record is actually pretty easy to check).
*Fred Hoyle comes to mind as a partial exception. He actually coined the phrase "Big Bang" as an insult to the 'other side's' position, and has tended to support odd theories that might do away with the Big Bang standard model ever since, but at least he has admitted that he had created a straw man attack with the name.
Who is John Cabal?
....to prove that it has a finite age....
If you BELIEVE in the Big Bang, you must logically also believe that the universe has a finite age. Nobody knows what was before the Big Bang. Matter-energy, space-time all came into being together. I BELIEVE that the eternal God Jehovah created the universe out of nothing. He formulated the laws under which it would evolve. Even though the details are very sketchy, there is one refrain in the creation account in the Bible. It says repeatedly that God said "it was very good".
In my estimation, a universe with entropy, that is where things get old, die and wear out is definitely not "very good". The Bible does not go into detail, but does tell us that evil entered into God's very good universe and has messed it up. That's why, in the Bible, God promises to create a new heaven and new earth, a new eternal universe, wherein there will be no more evil.
God has a very simple, universally applicable test to determine who will join him in this new perfect creation. It is found in the most quoted verse of the Bible: John 3:16.
All theory is gray