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Opera Closes China Loophole; Reinstates Censorship
ObsessiveMathsFreak writes "Coming hot on the heels of Microsoft's censoring of Chinese search results, browser-maker Opera has become the latest company to joyfully contribute to prosperous growth of the Great Firewall of China. For speed and convenience, the mobile phone-based 'Opera Mini' browser receives formatted web pages via Opera's own line of proxy servers. These unfiltered proxies gave Opera's Chinese users rare unfettered access to the wider web. However, this loophole has now been closed, with Chinese users now being directed to 'upgrade' to 'Opera Mini China,' which closes this loophole, returning them to the bosom of party censorship, and Opera to the favor of the Chinese Government. Truly; 'To Get Rich Is Glorious.'"
Unfortunately there is no better browser for my needs. Still, good that this makes the news. Name and shame, but in the end it won't change a thing. The market in China is not something many companies will want to lose out on. And as long as we're still buying nike's or other clothes made by them little kids there, we better look in the mirror first.
welcomes our new Chinese overlords
SJW: Someone who has run out of real oppression, and has to fake it.
Option 1: Refuse then, get blocked meaning you make no money and china gets no uncensored news
Option A:Comply keep making money and china gets no uncensored news.
IranAir Flight 655 never forget!
buxom ??? What word do you think they were aiming for?
The closest related word that would make any sense there is "bosom".
It is unfortunate that companies in this situation are caving to the requests of a government that has different ideals about the freedom of information than we do, but honestly, do you expect anything different? These companies aren't in the business of battling China on their political ideology. They are out to sell a web browser and maximize the NPV of the company. This is what a business and a free market is all about. To do anything different would be a strategic move that while it could be argued might benefit Chinese citizens, it is much less likely to benefit Opera. Furthermore, if they did fight China on this one, I think it would be naive to think that they did it for any other reason that as a calculated risk to gain marketshare and ultimately profit. So don't act surprised when stuff like this happens. The sooner people realize what businesses are and aren't, the sooner they will understand the forces shaping the world in which we live.
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There are way bigger, monstrous sized companies who does serve to China's interests. Who did the "great firewall" to begin with? Which hardware does it run on? Can you imagine the data bandwidth, processing power required to do such "out of Internet nature" thing?
What about gigantic game companies who abides their "1 hour only" rules? What about once hippie run company shipping their "edition" for China?
Opera is like a grocery store run by family compared to those companies which are gigantic. They got bigger but they are still small. Their main income is from mobile&electronics and I don't think any mobile company on this planet dares to confront China. Their shareholders would really punish them so bad that Opera ASA as we all know would cease to exist.
This is true; but less useful than it sounds.
Sometimes, censorship(especially of the more or less extreme "news blackouts and gunmen occupying the radio stations" flavor, or Iran's SMS being down for service at a convenient time) is in fact about stopping the flow of information among motivated people. This is very hard to do perfectly; but can often be done well enough to dampen some particular event.
Day to day, though, censorship is less about dissuading the truly motivated(though, if it can make them easy to detect and harass, that is a plus) and more about preventing the casual from becoming motivated. In most cases, people aren't just born motivated, they become motivated based on experiences or information. If you can control the information available to casual browsers, you can substantially modify the risk of having to deal with motivated adversaries later.
Every time the Great Firewall comes up, somebody always mentions one or more of its numerous technical weaknesses. Those are largely beside the point. If the system is good enough to ensure that casual users receive only a steady stream of ideologically comfortable information, the system will ensure that it never faces more than a limited number of sophisticated and adversarial users.
It would be quite stupid, you know, unless they had morals and principals.
I disagree. The Chinese know that they're being blocked and if their current browser all of a sudden doesn't show things that they're used to seeing, i.e. Facebook, they will know who is the cause. And that takes yet another small chunk out of the Chinese government's stranglehold.
We need to think long term, here. And long term changes are the ones that stay.
It's NOT me! It's the meds! I'm on 1000mg of Fukitol.
... or not. I mean, restricting some content on the web isn't nearly as bad as invading other countries, killing its civilians by the hundreds of thousands and setting up puppet governments, and yet nobody here is calling for boycotts against American companies that support all of this (which is all of them, or at least those that pay taxes).
the mind is like a muscle: work it out, challenge it with ideas hostile to your own, and you only wind up with a stronger mind and stronger ideas
i understand that the technocrats think they are protecting the chinese citizen from foreign interference and degenerate thoughts, but for whatever perceived good is being done by a policy of censorship, the much larger real negative effect is to turn chinese citizens into cotton heads full of nothing but empty thoughts, placid lies. the truth is always ugly and disharmonious. that's what makes placid lies so much more attractive
for a mind where the serene lie is more valuable than the rude truth, inward thinking reigns. this is the same inward thinking, away from the wider world, building a wall against the outside world, literal and figurative, that led to the rot of the old chinese dynasties, and left china weak and ripe for exploit by foreign powers. the shame of this history drives so much of modern chinese infuriated pride: never again will china be defiled by foreign powers. the literal and figurative rapes of japanese imperialism, the british opium wars to force heroin on its citizens: this led to china's rebellions and eventual modernization
however, in the policies of the technocrats of beijing today, we see the same seeds of the same thinking of the old brittle bureaucratic mandarins that led to china's previous downfall. sheep are very harmonious, docile, placid creatures. they're also dumb. dear china: why do you choose placid lies over ugly truths? the harmonious still pool is beautiful, but weak. the raging river is ugly and dirty, but strong
the chinese government are turning their citizens into housepets. this is not a strong nation, this is a weak one, populated by simpletons who could have been strong minds, but the chinese govermnet made sure they were empty weak minds, by censoring anything that would challenge the dominant monoculture. yes, legions of robots can turn out lots of cheap goods, but you would think that you would like a china full of strong and wise chinese, not slaves. and yet the chinese government clearly values their citizens only as slaves, unable to think on their own, with censorship policies that mean chinese minds are never exercised
the chinese government does not respect its own citizens. the chinese government's censorship policies is recreating the conditions that led to china's historical rot, and the chinese government's policies will mean china will be weak again, and dominated and exploited again
that is why, in the name of respecting the chinese people, i do not respect the legitimacy of the chinese government. the chinese government does not respect its own people. the chinese government has an agenda which serves only its own flawed priorities, and do not serve its people
intellectual property law is philosophically incoherent. it is your moral duty to ignore it or sabotage it
My own opinion is, corporations have no business aiding and abetting censorship. I've thought pretty well of Opera, until now. This is the sort of whoring that helps to give Microsoft THEIR bad name. It irritates me when any of them goes this route. Somewhere in China sits an asshole just like me, except for the color of his skin, and the government is just waiting for him to slip up, giving them a reason to "reeducate" him. The corporate whores are more than happy to sell him out....
"Windows is like the faint smell of piss in a subway: it's there, and there's nothing you can do about it." - Charlie Br
How is having no Google at all better than having a censored Google? This is different from profiting from child labor or whatever, imho. Google is useful for the people, and you can be sure China won't stop censoring just because their people can't access Google.
Dilbert RSS feed
During the Cold War, the most effective way of breaking through to the people behind the Iron Curtain was to keep our doors open (ahem, CUBA!) and allow them free access to the 'west'. Eventually, it snowballed, fences and walls came down. The so-called "People's Army" turned their guns from the people to the government, in some cases, or were just dropped, and the people tore down the blockades.
Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it everywhere, diagnosing it incorrectly and applying the wrong fix.
It's been this way for much longer than 100 years. Censorship is, and always has been, a way of life for the Chinese. It is not a problem and it is in fact supported by many of Chinese people. The mindset is completely different from that of Americans/English.
For example, many secrets are kept within Chinese families. You NEVER talk about something that can make your family lose face, no matter if it's true or not. I have a lifetime of firsthand experience with the "do" and "do nots" because half of my family is Chinese. Family pride at almost any cost is something that is drilled in from a very early age. This same ideal reaches out to the government as well.
And even if pulling completely out of China had been an option, it would have been a bad one. Don't you get it? Fewer services means less and easier work for the government when censoring. The more services, the more difficult for the government to keep track of everything, and the greater the chances of workarounds being open.
As long as Opera keeps working in China there may be ways to work around the censorship (and there are). Opera pulling out wouldn't help at all!
It's extremely short-sighted of you to assume that you know best, and that it's fine to sacrifice Opera's employees in China. It's extremely short-sighted not to see the benefit in more services meaning more potential cracks in the firewall.
Also, will you stop using all Google services, if you actually do stop using Opera?
Why the hell did you feel it necessary to repeat a rumour no fewer than eight times to prove your point?
1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8
Slow down, cowboy. Even if it’s true, nobody wants to read it over and over.
Alexander Peter Kristopeit bought his basement from his mommy for one dollar.
All of ye are thinking of it wrong. Instead of thinking 'Opera sucks', think 'Well China was going to ban Opera from their country, which would leave the Chinese left with nothing but Internet Explorer Hell. At least now they can use an alternative. Opera China is still better than virus-friendly Explorer.'
Well at least that's how I think.
"I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it." - historian Evelyn Beatrice Hall
There doesn't seem to be any connection here. There are plenty of individuals who operate under the same algorithm. In fact, it's often those individuals who form corporations in the first place!