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Prison Bans D&D For Mimicking Gang Structure
Trepidity writes "In a case that has been winding its way through the courts for a while now, a Wisconsin prison banned inmates from playing Dungeons & Dragons, using the justification that 'one player is denoted the Dungeon Master... [who] is tasked with giving directions to other players... [which] mimics the organization of a gang.' The prison also cited some sparse evidence that a handful of non-inmate D&D players once committed some crimes that allegedly were related to their D&D playing. On Monday the 7th Circuit Court of Appeals upheld the regulation (PDF) against challenges from inmates. The court appeared skeptical of the ban, sarcastically referring to it as the 'war on D&D,' but upheld it nonetheless as having a 'rational basis.' Law professor Ilya Somin suggests that the court may have had no choice, given how deferential rational-basis review usually is."
I don't think it's against the law to play D&D, rather that it's legal for the prison to ban it if they can make a plausible case.
So it's a stupid rule that just happens to be upheld by a fairly reasonable law.
'one player is denoted the Dungeon Master... [who] is tasked with giving directions to other players... [which] mimics the organization of a gang.'
Clearly, no-one involved in the case has ever played a decent game of D&D. But why bother with facts when prejudice and hysteria will suffice ?
For the 0.0001% of Slashdotters who've never played, a good "dungeon master" (just like a good computer game programmer) creates an interactive environment for players to explore.
What the players decide to do from there is what can make the game an interesting vehicle for self-discovery and excercising one's imagination and problem-solving abilities.
It no more mimics the structure of a gang than someone attending a lecture or watching a play.
As the article noted, lots of games might come under their "mimics gang structure" argument:
TCP: Why the Internet is full of SYN.
With the exception that once the game ends and you return to your cell, the reality of your situation is inescapable.
You may have thought that you'd escaped for a few hours, but you didn't escape at all, and that taste of imagined freedom turns to ash.
Th cruelest prisons always have a window to the open sky...
You don't sound elitist, you sound sadly unaware of the very basics of human psychology.
Do you realize that the most severe punishment in any United States prison is solitary confinement? The human need for socialization is the very foundation of Sociology, Psychology, Political Science, Anthropology and many other schools. This is not opinion or conjecture, it is a basic assumption of most of the soft sciences and there have been many experiments that have shown the extreme adverse effects of solitary confinement.
Do yourself a favor and read Discipline and Punish. You'll start to understand that the prison system is not in fact as old as civilization but a very new, very disturbing invention.
The stated goals of prisons are to rehabilitate, they are called "correctional facilities". You cannot rehabilitate humans if you treat them like animals. All this ruling, and many like it, achieve is: a further sense of marginalization among the inmates, further reducing the chance of rehabilitation, a loss of a very positive venue for personal expression and imagination which could greatly aid in resocialization, more institutionalized, life long criminals. Our current system does not work nor is it meant to. Prisons are big business, and just like everything else, they are run by big business.
There is a DM someone who sets the rules of the game and make sure everyone plays with in the imaginary boundaries. The DM is an authority figure and the players must acquesce to his/her rules. This is basically a model for prison life and some would say life as a "good citizen".
If the rules are in dispute you negotiate and resolve the issue before moving on. Negotation is definitely something you want to teach to violent offenders since they may not have had any 1st hand experience with it.
Basic mathematics and reading. Playing a game and being good at it requires one to learn the rules of the game. You want to find that numbers advantage? the DM isn't going to hand it to you on a silver platter. Many small gamers learn to read so they can figure out what to do next or what the screen is telling them and the same can apply in a prison setting with low literacy rates and math skills.
Abstract problem solving skills. Ok this makes the criminal more dangerous but it could be a skill set that could be used for good and finding a respectable job. (yes I know about job aps and disclosure of arrests/prison time)
As some one said before socializing with others as well as team work to accomplish goals together.
open source sub sim. I might start coding again for this. http://dangerdeep.sourceforge.net/contribute/
"..anything more than educational reading and meditation in a prison seems like it's a reward not a right."
Right on! I want people coming out of prison extremely bitter and angry that the last few to several to many months to years of their lives were joyless and unrewarding. I want them walking around free society having no fresh recollection of what it meant to feel happy or satisfied. I want them to be suddenly forced to interact with functioning members of society immediately after they have been denied any forms of entertainment or amusement in an otherwise hellish living situation.
How could there possibly be a downside to this?
Personally, I just think the Warden doesn't want them having FUN.
And when you get down to brass tacks, it is a fucking PRISON.
When I looked at this from that perspective, it makes quite a lot of sense. Prison isn't supposed to be fun, folks.
"Hey! I never have to work again, my room and board are provided for me and I get to play D&D all fucking day!" This is most old-school gamers wet dream. The only thing missing is Mom cleaning up the basement for you once a month.
C'mon folks. We have to make it a deterrent, not something to look forward to. The only reason this is fucked up is because they don't just come out and state it that way. Instead, they rationalize and tie this shit up in a courtroom. They could have just said "No fucking games" and been done with it.
And playing D&D while your incarcerated isn't going to make the whole experience enjoyable. Do you really think anyone might of been sat there thinking "Man, now that I can play D&D in prison I'm not sufficiently put off trying to rob this bank?".
There is no one specific reason for putting people in prison, although generally people see it as being for protection of others and punishment of criminals (some would add to discourage other criminals). Personally I think protecting others is the most important of these reasons, and if letting the inmates play D&D in anyway improves the generally negative prison enviroment Ive got no issue with it.
Heh... So, instead of playing D&D they will just shank other inmates in their free time. I'm betting this isnt about security, or gangs, or any of that shit in reality. It's about the warden being a poostabbing griefer. Well, I hope they knife him to death when the riots come.
Not to get off topic, but it should be clarified that this is what *some* Christian fundamentalists believe. I would be categorized as a Christian fundamentalist, and I would categorize Jack Chick as a conspiracy theorist lunatic fringe nutjob Christian fundamentalist. There are a number of things in his tracts (aside from the weird stuff) that he presents as Biblical that aren't in the Bible (no matter how liberal/conservative your reading of it.
Take it to the limit, everybody to the limit, come on, everybody fhqwhgads.
I'm shocked by how many people in this discussion seem to think that prison inmates are subhumans who don't deserve any rights and should be driven to suicide.
How does that help? The only thing you'd ensure would be that those who do make it out have a justified hatred towards society and will definitely commit more and worse crimes. And, of course, everyone who does commit a crime would have a strong incentive to kill all witnesses as prison would be designed to crush the inmates' soul and capital punishment wouldn't offer much of an additional threat.
And all of these observations are besides the fact that the very statement that inmates don't deserve to be called human is a sign of complete moral bankruptcy and nothing short of appalling.
USE HOT GRITS WITH STATUE OF NATALIE PORTMAN (NAKED AND PETRIFIED)
When I looked at this from that perspective, it makes quite a lot of sense. Prison isn't supposed to be fun, folks.
"Hey! I never have to work again, my room and board are provided for me and I get to play D&D all fucking day!" This is most old-school gamers wet dream. The only thing missing is Mom cleaning up the basement for you once a month.
I know I shouldn't feed the trolls, but this is ridiculous.
So...having 99% of you civil rights taken from you is not punishment enough?
So...becoming institutionalized to the point that many cannot function in society for any amount of time is not punishment enough?
So...not being able to see you friends and family except for in extremely controlled circumstances is not punishment enough?
So...becoming stigmatized by society to the point that it is extremely difficult to get a decent job, get a decent apartment, or to some extent have any interaction with the public without being pre-judged is not punishment enough?
So...getting beaten and or raped on a regular basis is not punishment enough?
So...eating prison food isn't punishment enough?
So...being forced to spend large amounts of time surrounded by sociopaths isn't punishment enough?
I could go on and on...
One of these days I'm going to cut you into little pieces. - PF
Prison is also supposed to rehabilitate.
And even if you think this is nonsense: Prison should under no circumstances produce better criminals.
As someone who was a long-time AD&D player who also worked for a time in a maximum security/close custody prison facility, my perspective may be a bit different from other who have replied here. In the prison environment, there are strict rules regarding fraternization among the incarcerated (prisoners/inmates). Often, there are limits on the number who may gather at one time, rules regarding proximity to others, and rules regarding communications. Inmates might not be allowed to carry stacks of personal papers or items from room to room. Any time inmates gather, it is suspect. Any time they are talking in hushed tones, it is suspect. Any time they are passing notes, it is suspect. Any talk of weapons or violoent actions puts the guards/officers at a heightened state of alert. Anything that might be viewed as gang-like behavior is suspect. Anything that could be viewed as cover for gang behavior is suspect.
Now, if you have been an AD&D player (or a player of any number of other RPG games), think about the dynamics of game play. Games often include more than two or three people. Players often carry a stack of papers (e.g., maps, character sheets, game manuals) to and from game sessions. The group might get loud, but some members of the group might have a secret side conversation with another player or the DM. Notes might need to be passed (e.g., "I want to pickpocket the baron", "I want to move into the shadows behind the paladin"). Table conversation will include various weapons and tactics. Althought talk of some medieval weapons could easily be discerned as fantasy (e.g., "I'll run him through with my halberd"), others could easily match a contemporary context (e.g., "I'll knife the guard while you try to get his keys"). Most groups with which I've played held the DM in high regard; it was as if the DM had his own cult following or at least a lot of resepect. That behavior, to the untrained observer, would appear to mimic some gang behavior. Prison guards have no way of knowing if such a behavior is just a game, overt gang activity, or a game being used to hide gang activity. To strive for safety and control, they must err toward interpreting events as the worst possible scenario.
If you are an RPG player, think through things that were said around your game table, and try to imagine hearing them as a prison guard or corrections officer. How might you interpret them?
People who really got into their game playing often would talk about the game anywhere and everywhere. Can you imagine a guard in a lunchroom overhearing AD&D players discussing a plan to escape the tower by feigning illness before attacking the guards when they come to investigate? Can you imagine players discussing plans to dig an (in-game) escape tunnel while having recreation time in the yard? The game could easily be used as a veil to allow the player to communicate real escape plans out in the open while the rest of the facility thinks they are just a bunch of RPG geeks. I can't say I fully agree with the decision to bar AD&D, but I can say that I understand the reasoning behind the decision.
I use irony whenever I can, but my shirts are still wrinkled...
Allowing prisoners to play games doesn't controbute to either of those goals. However, you still need to take into account the fact that most people in prison will be leaving again. If you take away all sources of fun for years, how do you think that will affect their psyche? Many people, including myself, believe that one of the major problems with the American justice system is that its focus is primarily on punishment instead of rehabilitation.
I agree with you on principle, but I'd like to make one side point - prison rape is not intended as part of the punishment/rehabilitation program, and is a huge PROBLEM, one that modern U.S. culture in particular insists on treating as a joke.
It's not funny - people don't deserve to be raped, regardless of their crimes; and given that the worst offenders tend to be the ones most prone to violent, impulsive behavior, it's usually the less violent inmates that bear the brunt of it.
With an attitude like that, good luck ever getting into prison.
"Believe me!" -- Donald Trump
...if you recognize that you've become a fundamentalist, wouldn't you want to do everything possible to quit being a fundamentalist?
Christian Fundamentalism is basically "Let's strip off all of the ritual, tradition, cruft, and bloat that's crept into Christianity over the past 2000 years, and get back to what was preached and practiced back in the First Century". It's like clearing a machine of all the spyware and unused programs to get back to a pristine state. Why would you NOT want to do that? A lot of what gets labelled Fundamentalist isn't. It's whack-jobbery.
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