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Authors' Amazon Awareness

Geoffrey.landis writes "Many book lovers were surprised this week when Amazon.com removed books from the publisher Macmillan from the shelves (later restored), including such popular imprints as St. Martin's, Henry Holt, and the science fiction publisher Tor. But readers shouldn't have been surprised, according to the Author's Guild. The Author's Guild lists a history of earlier instances where Amazon stopped listing a publisher's books in order to pressure them to accept terms, dating back to early in 2008, when Amazon removed the 'buy' buttons for works from the British publisher Bloomsbury, representing such authors as William Boyd, Khaled Hosseini, and J.K. Rowling. In response, the Author's Guild has set up a service called Who Moved My Buy Button to alert authors when their books are removed from Amazon's lists." Amazon's actions have generated ill-will on the parts of many authors, who — being authors — are only too happy to explain their viewpoints at length. Two such examples are Tobias Buckell's breakdown of why Amazon isn't the righteous defender of low-prices they claim to be and Charlie Stross's round-up of the situation.

17 of 174 comments (clear)

  1. So what? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Amazon is one party in a two party negotiation. If they don't like the terms of the negotiation, they don't have to accept them. Are they supposed to sell books no matter what the terms are? This is a lot of hot air about nothing. It's simple, really. If authors don't like their publisher, if publishers don't like Amazon - they can go elsewhere.

    1. Re:So what? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Putting aside the fact that Amazon is the 800lb gorilla in bookselling business who currently controls 80-90% of eBook market, the problem has arisen due to Amazon's insistence that authors should submit to restrictive contractual terms in order to be allowed into the Kindle store -- i.e. making the book exclusive to Amazon, negotiating a special low price, and worst yet, making Amazon the publisher.

      Prior to the iPad's announcement Amazon's terms for ebooks were 70/30. That's 70% going to Amazon. It's nothing short of a robbery.

      I'm sorry to say this, but it is a very sleazy company.

    2. Re:So what? by Geoffrey.landis · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Amazon is one party in a two party negotiation. If they don't like the terms of the negotiation, they don't have to accept them...

      You're missing the point. Amazon didn't merely say "we don't like your terms, so we won't sell your e-books." What they did was say "We don't like your terms on one item, e-books, so unless you accept our terms on that we won't sell anything else of yours, either, no hardcover or paperback, sales, not just electronic."

      They were trying to use their market dominance in one area to allow them to dictate prices in another area. And not for the first time.

      This why monopoly is bad.

      --
      http://www.geoffreylandis.com
    3. Re:So what? by geekmux · · Score: 5, Insightful

      ...Prior to the iPad's announcement Amazon's terms for ebooks were 70/30. That's 70% going to Amazon. It's nothing short of a robbery.

      I'm sorry to say this, but it is a very sleazy company.

      That's the one good thing about competition. It tends to force change on monopolistic pricing and "sleazy" agreements. Of course, in the case of Apple(iTunes) and Amazon(Kindle), we're talking about two 800-pound Gorillas going at it. Should be a good fight.

    4. Re:So what? by MaJeStu · · Score: 5, Interesting

      Except that Amazon has nothing even near a monopoly on books, whether electronic, paper, or audio. There are many other online vendors that would jump at the chance to have a major product line Amazon doesn't.

      Regardless, Amazon is absolutely right to negotiate with the price-gouging publishers any way they see fit, using any leverage they can. The publishers are trying to use their exclusive rights to the books; why shouldn't Amazon use their exclusive rights to their store? They are not harming the market, or keeping anything from being sold.

      --
      The best mixed martial arts training in Boston - www.redlinefightsports.com
    5. Re:So what? by Geoffrey.landis · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Except that Amazon has nothing even near a monopoly on books, whether electronic, paper, or audio.

      Except this is clearly not true. Think about it. After Amazon says "we don't like your price on e-books and so we won't sell them," what is their motiviation to not to sell Macmillan paper books; an unrelated product? What do they gain from this?

      Up until they disagreed with e-book pricing, they had no problem with Macmillan products, so it's clearly not a case of them not liking their prices on paper books. So what exactly do they gain by what appears, on the surface, to be an economically unjustified decision? If the market were indeed completely fungible, as you suggest, this would only reduce their sales volume. It would put no pressure on Macmillan, since their customers would just buy from somebody else.

      The only reason that they would attempt to muscle Macmillan into accepting their pricing terms on e-books by refusing to sell paper books would be if they do have some degree of monopoly power (or, at least, they think that they have power). You say "negotiate using any leverage they can," but there simply isn't any leverage there unless they are market dominant.

      Here's a rule of thumb you might consider: When a company uses market dominance to set pricing terms, it pretty much never is a good thing for the consumer. Even if it looks good on the surface.

      --
      http://www.geoffreylandis.com
  2. Kill the DRM by millennial · · Score: 4, Insightful

    This is another reason I loathe DRM. Amazon is apparently the sole distributor of the authorized electronic version of these books. They apparently have unquestionable control over whether or not they'll even be available for purchase, and they can revoke ownership of the books remotely without people even noticing (viz the 1984 kerfuffle).

    When I buy something, I want to own it. I don't want to license it at the whim of a service that dictates what I can do with it. That's just ridiculous.

    --
    I am scientifically inaccurate.
    1. Re:Kill the DRM by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      There's an idea: enforce the calling of things by their proper name. i.e. making it illegal to use a "BUY NOW" button in these cases and force them to use a "LICENSE NOW" button instead. False advertising and all that jazz?

  3. It's all about the money by wheelema · · Score: 4, Interesting

    And to think that I helped Mary Ann North become rich paying $.75 per paperback. Of all the parties beating their breasts in outrage over this issue the only ones I have any sympathy for are the authors and the readers.

  4. Uh... everyone seems focused on amazon but... by Ekuryua · · Score: 5, Insightful

    I checked the prices of ebooks, and as far as I am concerned, I am finding those prices outrageous.
    I do respect the right of authors to make some money, but when an ebook is twice as expensive as a cheap paperback version, there's something highly wrong.
    All of that makes me think they actually are trying to kill the ebook market, where "they" means publishers. Amazon of course is not clean either, and they obviously have been taking advantage of their public policy to look like saviors, that they are not.

    tldr: ebooks are way too expensive. Anything above 3-4$ for an old book or 4-8$ for a novelty is just plain insane. It's not like they require a lot of infrastructure. Oh and of course the author should still get most of the money in that grand scheme. But I doubt it's the case.

  5. Re:Free Market? by timeOday · · Score: 4, Insightful

    ...If Amazon can dictate terms to book publishers in this fashion...

    Actually the whole premise of the article is a fraud anyways, since amazon already caved to McMillan, which will now set the price of e-books on amazon.com, and already sharply raised amazon's previous pricing. So tell me, who is dictating terms here?

  6. 30% for an author wouldn't be a bad deal by transporter_ii · · Score: 5, Informative

    Do some research. There are authors out there that made way less than 30% of sales, while the publisher took a big chunk. I was just reading a published author that has had over eight books published. On some of them, he got .50 cents per book. On others, he got a flat rate and no royalty fees at all.

    If an author dumped their publisher, went with Amazon, and happened to sell a lot of books, 30% wouldn't be a bad deal, in my opinion.

    See the above statement. Who do you think are stirring the pot here? Authors or Publishers?

    Yes, there is very much an RIAA type of situation here, where the publisher often does promotion and advertising, but a big name could write a book and go straight to Amazon with it.

    Now they could get their own servers, marketing team, etc, and go it on their own. How much time and money do you think all of that will cost?

    Amazon isn't spotless in the situation, DRM and all, but a lot of publishers treat their authors like the RIAA treats its artists.

    --
    Doctors destroy health, lawyers destroy justice, universities destroy knowledge, religion destroys spirituality
  7. Re:Amazon sucks anyway. by homer_s · · Score: 4, Informative

    Great idea: go to a BOOKSTORE and buy a copy. Even better? Get one at a locally owned shop. Book-buying is better in person: browsing shelves, reading through a few pages, checking out your favorite section, then finding that rare gem that you'd have never seen on Amazon anyway.

    Why? I value my time and I like to spend it doing other things. Amazon makes it incredibly easy for me to purchase the books I want, new or used. In fact, I have a few books that I could not have found if not for amazon.com.

    I see amazon, like any other store, as my agent who aggregates the buying power of consumers to negotiate a price from manufacturers/publishers. I applaud whatever they do to get prices down for me. Authors' rights? That's for them to defend, not me.

  8. Comment removed by account_deleted · · Score: 5, Informative

    Comment removed based on user account deletion

  9. Re:Free Market? by TubeSteak · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Almost all monopolies are the result of government intervention. The anti-trust laws were written to break up monopolies that had been created by government intervention in the market. Some of the classic examples of "essential" monopoly were created by the government. When electricity and telephone service first came on the scene most cities had many competitors selling either. The government stepped in and decided to make both of these regulated monopolies.

    [Citation Needed] because I don't think you have any clue what you're talking about.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ma_Bell#Formation_under_Bell_patent
    The telephone (and telegraph) markets were consolidated by Bell Telephone/AT&T.

    Following a government antitrust suit in 1913, AT&T agreed to the Kingsbury Commitment in which AT&T would sell their $30 million in Western Union stock, allow competitors to interconnect with their system, and not acquire other independent companies

    AT&T did everything but that last bit. They kept buying up telephone/telegraph companies until the government came back again in 1934 and set AT&T up as a regulated monopoly.

    I'm not sure why the "all monopolies are the result of government intervention" meme lives on.
    During the hey-day of laissez faire economics, "classic" monopolies sprouted up left and right.
    The government didn't create railroad and boat shipping monopolies.
    The government didn't create the oil production/refining/distribution monopoly .
    The government didn't create the monopoly in the telecom market.
    I realize that facts are inconvenient to your ideology, but they won't go away.

    In case that was all too long:
    AT&T built up a monopoly in spite of the government's attempt to prevent it and before the government officially sanctioned them as one.

    --
    [Fuck Beta]
    o0t!
  10. "cheap" $9.99 books? by Sloppy · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Stross writes:

    They lied by falsely positioning themselves as the defenders of cheap $9.99 ebooks

    I'm so confused. Here I am with a paperback that says $7.99 on its back. An ebook costs a fraction of that to manufacture and the paperback's price also includes all the amortized costs (like paying the author!) in its price, so how the fuck is $9.99 "cheap"?

    --
    As copyright owner of this comment, I authorize everyone to defeat any technological measure which limits access to it.
  11. Re:Better than competition: No publishers. by winwar · · Score: 4, Interesting

    "Why have publishers?"

    Because the authors want them. They provide useful services.

    You might want to read some of the links in the article. They contain information about where all the money goes and why authors use publishers.