Anti-Piracy Windows 7 Update Phones Home Quarterly

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Anti-Piracy Windows 7 Update Phones Home Quarterly

Posted by kdawson on Thursday February 11, 2010 @05:54AM from the who-owns-your-computer dept.

Lauren Weinstein sends in news of a major and disturbing Microsoft anti-piracy initiative called Windows Activation Technologies, or WAT. Here is Microsoft's blog post giving their perspective on what WAT is for. From Lauren's blog: "The release of Windows 7 'Update for Microsoft Windows (KB71033)' will change the current activation and anti-piracy behavior of Windows 7 by triggering automatic 'phone home' operations over the Internet to Microsoft servers, typically for now at intervals of around 90 days. ... These automatic queries will repeatedly — apparently for as long as Windows is installed — validate your Windows 7 system against Microsoft's latest database of pirated system signatures (currently including more than 70 activation exploits known to Microsoft). If your system matches — again even if up to that time (which could be months or even years since you obtained the system) it had been declared to be genuine — then your system will be 'downgraded' to 'non-genuine' status until you take steps to obtain what Microsoft considers to be an authentic, validated, Windows 7 license. ... KB971033... is scheduled to deploy to the manual downloading 'Genuine Microsoft Software' site on February 16, and start pushing out automatically through the Windows Update environment on February 23. ... [F]or Microsoft to assert that they have the right to treat ordinary PC-using consumers in this manner — declaring their systems to be non-genuine and downgrading them at any time — is rather staggering." Update: 02/12 02:08 GMT by KD : Corrected the Microsoft Knowledge Base number to include a leading 9 that had been omitted in the pre-announcement, per L. Weinstein.

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False Positives? by N3tRunner · 2010-02-11 05:54 · Score: 5, Insightful

I wonder how many false positives this will generate? The thing is, for every person who pirates Windows 7, there is a fairly decent chance that they will be doing so with an activation code which a genuine user may have purchased. I wonder if MS has figured out some way to deal with this issue? I wouldn't bet on it.
1. Re:False Positives? by DeadPixels · 2010-02-11 05:57 · Score: 5, Insightful
  
  I wonder if MS has figured out some way to deal with this issue? I wouldn't bet on it.
  Why should they, at least from their point of view? Corporate thinking here is just "well, maybe we'll get a few false positives, but gee, we'll have stopped those pirates!" They don't give a damn about catching innocents by mistake if it doesn't impact their bottom line. And it won't, because the average user is just going to phone tech support and deal with the grief and hassle, because they don't see any other option.
2. Re:False Positives? by calmofthestorm · 2010-02-11 06:25 · Score: 3, Insightful
  
  I think it's more an extortion on the law-abiding clueless to get people to pay yet again for the same software, thus moving toward the renter model MS has been after for years.
  As if the windows tax wasn't bad enough. Windows 7 could be nothing more than a picture of Hitler with flashing eyes and still sell millions of copies hitchhiking on new PCs.
  
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  93rd rule of Slashdot: No matter how obvious my sarcasm is, my comment will be taken seriously by someone.
3. Re:False Positives? by Targon · 2010-02-11 06:54 · Score: 5, Insightful
  
  A big problem isn't from those who intentionally pirate, but from those who place an illegal copy of the operating system on the computers of other people. It is amazing how many customers have had "someone come fix their computer" and that person used a Windows XP Pro CD with key to "fix" the problem. Then they turn off automatic updates. The moment the customer does an update of the OS, the key used flags the OS as not being genuine.
  One thing that I feel is needed when dealing with this sort of thing is for the OS to be the same, with the key used just being used to enable or disable features. In this way, you can "downgrade" from an Ultimate or Pro version to Home if you have this sort of thing happen to you. The so-called experts who put illegal copies of software on computers are the ones who need to go away, because they cause more trouble than they solve.
4. Re:False Positives? by hot+soldering+iron · 2010-02-11 07:24 · Score: 5, Insightful
  
  ***Warning: Linux Advocate*** ***Warning: Linux Advocate***
  Sorry I'm late to the party. One of us should have been in the first 3 posts.
  Users DO have an option. My wife and teenagers use Linux at home all the time (only my wife is semi-"tech savvy"). Admittedly, they do have a resident "expert" to provide support and lessons, and fix the hard stuff (drivers, etc..). But they love not being bothered by malware, not needing anti-virus software, and the systems just work. In fact, my wifes' wifi card works fine under Ubuntu, but we couldn't get the drivers to work under XP. I'm setting them up with virtual machines soon, to run optimized images of XP for their games, and whatever else they want, in a secure sandbox.
  Yes, not all printers, video cards, or wifi cards are supported by all flavors. But apparently, that's the case with Windows, too. We just purchased a NAT, wifi router, and network color laser printer that all work fine with Win and Linux (the router and NAT came loaded with embedded Linux from the manufacturers). No special research involved. "Computer" doesn't have to mean "owned by Microsoft", and you don't have to worry about "drive-by" malware, or getting hijacked by cracked warez (sure, I believe your kids downloaded Visual Studio).
  You don't have to get bent over by your OS distributor. But you will as long as you let them.
  
  --
  When you want something built, come see me. If you want correct grammar and spelling, get a F*ing liberal arts student.
Now with Continuous Auditing! (aka surveillance) by Statecraftsman · 2010-02-11 05:56 · Score: 3, Insightful

WAT? WATTF!

Like serial numbers, product keys, and activation before, automatic auditing like WGA is proving not to be as effective as Microsoft would like... this is surveillance plain and simple. Looks like I'm going to need to update my article on problems with non-free software... (Free Software or: How I Learned...).
Son of WGA by tepples · 2010-02-11 05:57 · Score: 4, Insightful

I wonder how many false positives this will generate?
Probably no more than Windows XP, whose "Windows Genuine Advantage" module has the same behavior.
1. Re:Son of WGA by poetmatt · 2010-02-11 06:09 · Score: 5, Insightful
  
  it's a lot less trivial for folks who never bought it (and thus pirated) by just disabling this WAT. Nice to know MS is treating their paying customers almost as well as it treats the ones that don't pay.
2. Re:Son of WGA by Ephemeriis · 2010-02-11 06:27 · Score: 3, Insightful
  
  it's a lot less trivial for folks who never bought it (and thus pirated) by just disabling this WAT. Nice to know MS is treating their paying customers almost as well as it treats the ones that don't pay.
  Yup.
  Once again, the assorted DRM measures only affect paying customers.
  Anyone who is actually pirating the software has already cracked or bypassed the activation process in some way. They'll probably never have to deal with this WAT stuff.
  And some poor soul who actually purchased a legitimate copy of Windows (either retail, or with an OEM box) is going to get their software de-authorized because of a false positive.
  
  --
  "Work is the curse of the drinking classes." -Oscar Wilde
3. Re:Son of WGA by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-11 06:31 · Score: 5, Insightful
  
  In my book, any piece of software which requires getting on the phone is defective by design. You may not mind the ridiculous waste of time and effort which is calling tech support, but I sure as hell do.
4. Re:Son of WGA by smartin · 2010-02-11 06:32 · Score: 4, Insightful
  
  Yes awefully kind of them to let you use the software that you bought and paid for.
  
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  The difference between Canada and the USA is that in Canada healthcare is a right and gun ownership is a privilege.
5. Re:Son of WGA by nine-times · 2010-02-11 06:49 · Score: 5, Insightful
  
  Yeah, because it seems perfectly reasonable for my OS to require me to call the developer periodically in order to remain functional. I'm shocked the contractor who built my house doesn't periodically change the keys to the front door so that I can validate every 6 months that I do, in fact, still own the house. Or that my car doesn't connect electronically every few months to make sure I still have the manufacturer's permission to drive it.
  Why would anyone have a problem with this sort of thing? As long as any malfunction can probably be fixed with a phonecall, I don't see how anything could possibly go wrong.
6. Re:Son of WGA by nine-times · 2010-02-11 07:20 · Score: 4, Insightful
  
  Has anyone ever thought that people in business might want to make sure that the copies of Windows they have on their machines are valid and thus would want to install this patch to ensure it.
  No. I've honestly never thought that.
  I am one of these "people in business" and I personally wouldn't trust this tool for that purpose. Microsoft could do an awful lot to make my software auditing easier, but this isn't one of them.
  If this was Microsoft's intention, then they should have included a license manager in their server software that allowed me to control my level of enforcement without reporting back to Microsoft. The fact that they force you to report back to them demonstrates that their intention is not to help users or businesses.
7. Re:Son of WGA by nine-times · 2010-02-11 07:28 · Score: 5, Insightful
  
  Don't run Win7.
  I don't.
  Totally honest and dead serious: I run an IT department. I've tested Windows 7 and Windows Vista. I would considering buying upgrades to Windows 7 (I even put space in my budget for it) if not for all their "activation" and anti-piracy nonsense. For now I'm sticking with the volume licensing version of Windows XP and avoiding WGA as much as I can, while looking to OSX and Linux as possible upgrade routes *largely to avoid activation*.
  I don't pirate software, but I view any activation scheme as potentially dangerous, generally inconvenient, completely unnecessary, and even insulting.
8. Re:Son of WGA by butalearner · 2010-02-11 07:41 · Score: 4, Insightful
  
  As Microsoft keeps tightening up on people, I really have to wonder why anyone still puts up with it.
  I've always felt it was a kind of technological Stockholm Syndrome, or perhaps it should be called Redmond Syndrome.
  There are reasons to continue being Microsoft victims, of course, such as all those content providers whom Microsoft pays handsomely to ensure their products only work or only work reliably on Windows. And they provide their own proprietary development tools for everything - some of which are the best in the business, don't get me wrong - so that more and more new software (and more and more developers) only works on Windows. Other than that, people just stay because Windows is familiar. So people happily accept their abuse - indeed, they defend it - in return for these things. I'm sure people will jump in with anecdotes about "trying" Linux and failing miserably, but the counter-anecdotes are just as numerous. The only conclusion you can draw is that people accept the abuse because they don't know any better.
  And if that's not just like Stockholm Syndrome, I don't know what is.
9. Re:Son of WGA by Darinbob · 2010-02-11 08:00 · Score: 4, Insightful
  
  Well, if they can't get the pirates to pay, at least they'll get the honest consumers to pay twice.
10. Re:Son of WGA by pwizard2 · 2010-02-11 08:18 · Score: 5, Insightful
  
  Not to mention that it's trivial to get your machine re-authorized over the phone if you actually did buy your copy of the OS and end up being a false positive.
  
  And you see nothing inherently wrong with the concept that you have to call Microsoft and essentially beg them to reactivate a product you already bought and paid for? If your Windows 7 can be deactivated and essentially blacklisted on Microsoft's whim, what exactly did you purchase? Do you actually own a copy or are you just renting it? Phone reactivation may not be a long drawn-out process, but I still oppose it on principle. It's not my problem that Microsoft is supposedly losing money on piracy, so why should I be inconvenienced in the slightest by it?
  
  Not to mention that I would consider any program that phones home without my concept to be malware, even if Microsoft wrote it.
  
  --
  "It is a denial of justice not to stretch out a helping hand to the fallen; that is the common right of humanity."
11. Re:Son of WGA by drooling-dog · 2010-02-11 08:45 · Score: 3, Insightful
  
  Microsoft reauthorized my OEM copy of Vista Home Premium twice when I moved the install to a new system, in spite of the license saying they don't allow that. Awfully kind of them, I thought.
  Good lord. You had to ask permission from Microsoft to upgrade your own rig, and you think they're just swell because they gave it to you.
  If only there was an OS that you could install on whatever you wanted, whenever you wanted, without asking permission or paying a fistful of money each time. Oh, and free too. Well, that could never happen...
12. Re:Son of WGA by Comboman · 2010-02-11 09:08 · Score: 5, Insightful
  
  Apple is *notorious* about controlling your experience with their hardware and software yet their OS updates have no restrictions, no serial numbers, no registration. It's the honor system that you don't share the DVD with all your friends.
  That's because Apple is a hardware company; they don't care if you copy the OS since you need a nice shiny MacBook to run it on and they are the only ones who sell them.
  
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13. Re:Son of WGA by TheRealGrogan · 2010-02-11 10:58 · Score: 4, Insightful
  
  No, stuff like that isn't that important as computers with obsolete buses are likely incapable of running Vista or Windows 7 anyway.
  But what about all the perfectly good sound cards that had to go in the trash because they don't play ball with Microsoft's DRM? I recently tracked down some hacked drivers so a customer could use his first generation Sound Blaster Live card in Vista. Guess what? With mere changes to the .inf files the card works perfectly.
  What about perfectly good 10/100 network adapters that will never work in Vista or Windows 7 because Microsoft didn't think it was necessary to port drivers?
  What about analog game ports? Some people still have those and they are unsupported. I have a perfectly good Microsoft Sidewinder Joystick and guess who doesn't support it anymore? It actually works perfectly in Linux... too bad I don't have anything I'd want to use it for anymore.
  How about perfectly good USB scanners? So what if they are 5 years old? I got my parents a new computer the other day. Their HP ScanJet 2200c doesn't work in Windows 7 at all (XP is the last supported OS according to HP). I plugged it in thinking that had to be some kind of mistake but nope, it doesn't work. It's just a PlusTek scanner rebranded. There are zillions of scanners from different vendors based on Plustek. Plug that thing into a Linux computer and udev rules will detect it and with the help of HAL and friends, the appropriate SANE backend will be invoked and it just works.
  I'm sorry, but Linux and Linux distros' inclusion of various userspace driver subsystems trump Windows for hardware support any day. The fact that new hardware is only supported in Windows out of the box with third party drivers is the fault of the vendors, not the Linux community and does not praise Windows in any way.
Just going to annoy legit customers by Alcimedes · 2010-02-11 06:01 · Score: 4, Insightful

I have a machine, purchased by my employer that has to be validated against the key server at the office.
The machine however is at my house. The only way to make it validate is to ensure that I'm connected to the VPN when it attempts to find its key.
Does this mean once a quarter (if I have this update) my machine will downgrade itself, make me hop on the VPN, revalidate etc.?
That's just damn annoying. I'll probably end up cracking my legit install to stop this stupid behavior. When the cracked version of your software is less obnoxious than the legitimate version you have a problem.
Not news by El+Gigante+de+Justic · 2010-02-11 06:01 · Score: 5, Insightful

I don't see how this is in any way news or shocking. WAT = rebranded WGA.
The only major question I would have, is if it's only calling back every 90 days, how many false positives will it get from people doing major hardware upgrades over that three month span. (I'm assuming it compares the system specs with the license key as WGA did to determine if it was actually the same computer or not)
And at least they just downgrade you - they could instead just shut your system down for a suspected license violation and prevent any log-ins.
Hoooly crap... by TheDarkener · 2010-02-11 06:01 · Score: 5, Insightful

Ok, conspiracy theorist point of view here, apologies... but... I mean, they can basically disable/cripple anyone's computer for any reason without notice.
Think of what governments would like to do with this little feature, during wartimes, etc...
Do you really trust Microsoft that much? Do you really want them to have that much control over your computer at any point in time? Your ability to communicate online?
Come on, this is really getting ridiculous.

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1. Re:Hoooly crap... by Bobfrankly1 · 2010-02-11 06:46 · Score: 4, Insightful
  
  Which is why instead of upgrading my trail version of Windows 7 I'm switching to Ubuntu 9.10.
  From everything I read on Slashdot, Ubuntu IS the windows 7 upgrade.
Can it be avoided? by Killer+Orca · 2010-02-11 06:01 · Score: 4, Insightful

You could manage to avoid WGA by unchecking the checkbox when it asked to install via update, then making sure it didn't mention un-selected updates. I wonder if judicious users can keep an eye out for this and do the same?
Re:Giving up on the server market, eh? by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-11 06:03 · Score: 3, Insightful

Someone who needs application software for which there is no reasonable Linux/Unix equivalent. Such software includes mid-range accounting systems and point of sale systems.
Bah by T+Murphy · 2010-02-11 06:03 · Score: 5, Insightful

Windows would be so much better without Microsoft.

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1. Re:Bah by twidarkling · 2010-02-11 06:14 · Score: 5, Insightful
  
  No, it's really fucking not. Linux is fine for what it is, but what it is not is Windows sans MS.
  
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Re:So what do they do by Attila+Dimedici · 2010-02-11 06:09 · Score: 3, Insightful

Steps like these need to be taken because, well, people pretty much can not be trusted to do the right thing without the fear of a reprisal looming over their head.
The problem with steps like these is that they will mostly cause problems for people who tried to do the right thing by buying Windows 7 legitimately but now Microsoft identifies it as a pirate key (either because they got it from a shady character who was selling illegal copies with some pirated key, or because the legitmate key they got has since been pirated--or at least identified as pirated). People who knowingly are using a pirated copy will either have developed a work around that avoids this problem, or will be expecting this to come up and have a plan in place to deal with it.

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Re:Now with Continuous Auditing! (aka surveillance by Jeng · 2010-02-11 06:11 · Score: 4, Insightful

Funny how this is happening right after Microsoft won that lawsuit regarding WGA.

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Re:Statecraftsman's free software article by poetmatt · 2010-02-11 06:11 · Score: 3, Insightful

clearly you don't understand - it has nothing to do with "proprietary doing better" and everything to do with DirextX (and it's focus on all gaming) being owned 100% by Microsoft.
When does DirectX release new versions? Shortly after when wine cracks the full functionality of the existing DirectX.
I'm tired of paying money to rent software by Anonymous Coward · 2010-02-11 06:17 · Score: 5, Insightful

Essentially we don't buy anything anymore. Everyone out there seems to have control of my computer but me. Yes I can spend the time and disable some of the functions but it's constant cold war of disabling the latest functions only to get hit with the next round. I want to use software not fight OSs. Also I'm tired of fighting software licensing, period. I'm not from the camp that wants free software I pay for every piece, except I do love some open source like Open Office. The point is why do I constantly have to deal updates? My bloody HP Printer driver constantly demands to be updated. I'm not stupid and I know they aren't releasing updates that fast. Many of pay thousands of dollars just for our desk top let alone software and yet everyone insists they should have control of our machines at all times. 10, 15, 20 years ago this was not the case. 15 years ago due to corruption issues I used to reinstall my OS and all software once a month. The machine ran better and the software crashed less. It took me a couple of hours and gave me a fresh machine each time. These days I live in terror of redoing a machine. I have a lot of software and at best we're talking days and generally it's weeks before I can get all the licenses squared away again. It's reached the point where I dread buying a new machine.
Re:Statecraftsman's free software article by The+MAZZTer · 2010-02-11 06:20 · Score: 4, Insightful

Video gaming on Linux has come a long way thanks to Wine. I tried TF2 a few versions ago and was surprised how well it ran and how free it was of any graphical glitches. Only thing it was missing was DX9 support. The performance was almost as good as under XP.
Re:Statecraftsman's free software article by mystikkman · 2010-02-11 06:22 · Score: 5, Insightful

I am sorry but there are many other reasons. Linux audio is a pain for game developers. The tools are lacking. OpenGL standards developers sided with CAD companies thereby screwing over game developers. I know I'll be downmodded for saying things that are meant to be brushed under the carpet on Slashdot but I don't care about karma.
Re:Riiiiight! by calmofthestorm · 2010-02-11 06:29 · Score: 3, Insightful

It nags the non computer-elite into picking up your tab, and hating your for it.

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Re:Giving up on the server market, eh? by Ephemeriis · 2010-02-11 06:38 · Score: 4, Insightful

Who in their right mind would use Windows on a server any more?
Folks who've spent their entire lives working on a Windows GUI and can't imagine a computer without a Start menu or a C: drive.
We're a Microsoft shop... That's generally what we sell and install, including servers. Myself, I don't much care what we run. I'm familiar with various flavors of *nix and support them as well. My boss, on the other hand, can't deal with anything non-Windows.
You should have seen his face the first time he sat down in front of a machine running XenServer. He had no freaking clue what to do with it. He kept shaking the mouse around and looking puzzled.

--
"Work is the curse of the drinking classes." -Oscar Wilde
Re:Note to self.... by Nimey · 2010-02-11 06:40 · Score: 4, Insightful

You'll be skipping the service packs, then.

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Re:Well that pretty much settles it for me. by Jaysyn · 2010-02-11 06:43 · Score: 3, Insightful

Three words: False Positive Lottery. As a legit customer who has already been stung by WGA during a hardware upgrade, I don't want to even think of it being an every 3 month thing.

--
There is a war going on for your mind.
Re:WAT is Voluntary and Doesn't Impact OS Usage by tomtomtom · 2010-02-11 06:53 · Score: 5, Insightful

I would really pick you up on your point (1) - I'm assuming this will be like Windows XP's "WGA Notification" patch which is also "voluntary".
In that you can avoid installing it, IF you (i) don't use Automatic Updates; and (ii) remember to click "custom updates", then find it in the huge list of patches that comes up on a fresh install, then realize what it is, then deselect it, then click the box saying "no I really don't want this, don't ever show it to me again".
Oh, and if you do have the bad luck to happen to accidentally install it, you can only uninstall this patch with a third-party crack.
All in all, I'd say this patch is less "voluntary" than a lot of malware trojans are.
Re:WAT is Voluntary and Doesn't Impact OS Usage by VTBlue · 2010-02-11 07:02 · Score: 3, Insightful

This is not true. Go to parts of the world where system builders sell illegal copies of Windows along with their computers and you will see that normal non-technical people wouldn't know the difference. Microsoft doesn't go after individual pirates. Microsoft anti-piracy goes after those that profit from the reselling of pirated Windows.
Re:wow by VTBlue · 2010-02-11 08:02 · Score: 5, Insightful

Microsoft circa 2010 is very misunderstood on Slashdot. I also had my doubts before being assimilated by the collective.
Microsoft is fundamentally a different company now than in the 90s. We have to be due to competition, compliance, and regulation.
History is very important, but holding grudges only impedes progress. Even Linus Torvalds has said, "Microsoft hatred is a DISEASE."
End of life by Bert64 · 2010-02-11 08:11 · Score: 4, Insightful

What happens when MS stop supporting windows 7 and turn the activation servers off?
Does that mean it will become useless 90 days afterwards?
What about for machines which aren't networked, or are on isolated networks which can't or aren't allowed to access the internet?
If they provide a corporate version which doesn't need to phone home, then pirates will simply pirate that instead, just like they did with the corporate versions of xp that didn't need activation.

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