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PA School Spied On Students Via School-Issued Laptop Webcams
jargon82 writes "A Pennsylvania high school is using laptops they issued to students to spy on them in homes and outside of school. According to a class action filling the webcams and microphones in these laptops could be remotely activated by school officials, and have been used in this role. One student was accused of 'improper behavior in his home' and the school provided a photo taken via his laptop as proof."
Solves all problems. At least the ones that WD-40 can't.
Karma fed to this user will be promptly burnt. Be warned; be wary.
And accuse school officials of pedophilia. This will be fun...
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WTF is "improper behavior in the home", and why does the school seem to think that it's their business?
School officials tend to think themselves as above the law / the law way too many times in my personal experience, not surprised that some decided they would also be the police in these kids homes.
I hope they lose this suit. Hard.
"We need to get over this notion, that, for Apple to win... Microsoft must lose." - Steve Jobs, 1997
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No shit. Not that I advocate underage people doing anything, but all it takes is one girl changing clothes in her room with the laptop turned on, and then they have a stack of federal charges.
I'm pretty sure there are some federal charges that can be associated with that anyways.
Serious? Seriousness is well above my pay grade.
If I were one of those students and under-aged (18), I'd claim that they were guilty of producing child pornography because I had been naked in front of my laptop.
Hell, I'd go as far as to tell them that I have masturbated in front of it.
Fuck them and whomever came up with that idea, that includes IT personnel, school administrators, PTA and whoever else have have even a superficial finger in this and haven't said 'no'.
One of the most disturbing things in this story is that the school deemed "inappropriate behavior" of the student. I have read the legal briefs and a number of other sources and have not been able to determine what this is. What on earth could a school say about MY child that would be considered inappropriate behaviour? Drinking? No, sorry, covered by privacy rights. The only thing I can think of would be inappropriate use of school equipment. The inappropriateness of anything in the home would be determined by the parent.
This is why you don't want "free" computers from the government, you want the government to NOT take that money away from you to begin with so you can buy your own computer...
It's shocking, given the general lack of tech competence by school bureaucrat types that they did this and thought they could get away with it. And why aren't there criminal charges? This isn't any different than them putting cameras (potentially) in the bathrooms of minors for the purposes of procuring child pornography.
This goes far beyond stupid school administrators, this is a blatant case of GOVERNMENT actors out of control, willfully violating the Constitution (and scores of other laws) and they need to be punished. Not just fired, everyone responsible for this need to spend some quality time in a "pound me in the ass" prison.
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First, there's no way that you can take illegally obtained "evidence" and punish the student for it. It goes against the 4th amendment, and is unethical on so many levels. I strongly doubt that this case will go too far in court.
Second, why the hell do they need to spy on students anyway? It's good that they're giving the students laptops, but what they do at home (regardless of all the stupid shit they do) is none of the school's business, nor is it in their jurisdiction. I could make a rant about how parents need to step it up and take better care of their kids, but I'll just sum it up: schools should stay out of parental territories. It's bad for the student, and it's bad for the school.
Whoever was running this, either the school IT admins or even the higher school administration should be at least suspended pending further review.
What exactly is "improper behavior in the home", and who would believe it was appropriate for a school to accuse the kid of it?
In a society where we are now so ready to trade privacy and other personal liberties for the (often empty) promise of security, it is no surprise at all that this or that government entity should feel no compunction at this gross affront to the privacy of their students and their families. And let's be clear, someone had to have had second thoughts about this, and still they went ahead with this staggeringly stupid plan.
I hope that not only do the tools responsible for this have their asses handed to them in civil court, I sincerely hope that those asses are then tossed into prison for what has to be a long list of criminal statutes that have been violated.
To me, the whole idea that a school could possibly accuse a student of "inappropriate behavior in the home" is worse than the web cams. Seriously, WTF? This is taking the whole "school as babysitter" thing a bit to far.
Socialism: a lie told by totalitarians and believed by fools.
Someone should go to jail for this.
Child porn charges should be raised, of course. Further, the cameras/mics could be used to spy on anyone in the house, including adults who are not in any way, shape, or form under the guardianship of the school. So any argument about guardianship is moot.
Sadly, no one will go to jail for this. Some administrator will be told not to do it again, and the school board will be fined, and that will be the end of it. At least, that is all that happened when a school nurse (not a cop) forced a child to strip and wiggle (without probable cause, for that matter).
I don't understand how a society that is so obsessed with protecting the children that it tries children as adults for crimes that wouldn't have been crimes if the children were adults can turn around and let adults off scott-free when they directly break the law to the detriment of children.
Irrationality really frustrates me. And scares me, too.
I absolutely DARE some school official to try this with my kids. I don't play the stupid game where they think they have even an ounce of authority over what my child does after stepping off the bus. In fact, if they punished my son for anything he did at home, I'll buy him ice cream for every day he's suspended and encourage him to make noise about it and resist in a smug, non-violent way as well as writing every official, politician and journalist I can find in a 100 mile radius. And then, I'll just be getting started. I'm not afraid of DSS either. I even *gasp* spank my kids.
The problem is sticking up for yourself and actually exercising your rights gets you branded as a radical, a criminal or a terrorist. This needs to end. I'm willing to live a harder life to live it with my liberty, pride and self-respect intact and I have. I've lost jobs, promotions, etc solely on sticking to values and principals and refusing to do the wrong thing. It's cost me.....dearly in some cases but at least I can honestly say that I'm free. There used to be a lot of people like this.
The school's job is to pour a bit of knowledge in his head. Teaching morality and values is the parent's job. They need to stay the hell off of my turf and stop overstepping their bounds. Period. What my son's personality is like, his habits, etc is none of their business outside that building.
You are sadly dissillusioned (or just young and ignorant, or incredibly stupid). Anarchy always leads to monarchy; with anarchy, the strong (meaning rich and powerful) can do anything they want to the weak. Anarchy means I can shoot you in the back without provocation and without fear of reprisal. I can get an armed mob and enslave you. I can rape your mother, sister, girlfriend, and two year old daughter before torturing them to death. No law.
"Anarchy is the REAL democracy and freedom" is the dumbest statement I've heard all week. What grade are you in, kid?
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Doesn't matter if the child is male or female ... naked + underage = trouble for whoever made/possesses the image. Of course, there are problems with the puritanical, nanny-state mindset of the zealots who use those laws to jail teens who take pictures of their own bodies, but its use seems strikingly apropos here, given the voyeuristic nature of the complaint.
What I want to know is
a) Who thought it would be a good idea to allow remote control of the camera and mic? Sounds like it would require school administrator and systems administrator knowledge and cooperation.
b) Who thought it would be a good idea to actually use and review the video streams? Having the theoretical ability is one thing, but to actually make use of it is worse.
c) With regard to the student who was spoken to about their "innappropriate behavior", what directed the school's attention to the laptop in question? With all the laptops potentially involved, the sheer numbers make it impossible for a school's admin staff to monitor them all.
d) When was the student's "inappropriate behavior" monitored? Was it after school hours, at home? Was it during school hours? What was the conduct in question?
e) IF YOU ARE A SCHOOL OFFICIAL PEEKING AT KIDS' PRIVATE MOMENTS, HOW MUCH OF A FREAKIN' BONEHEAD DO YOU HAVE TO BE TO CONFRONT THEM WITH EVIDENCE OBTAINED BY SUCH QUESTIONABLE MEANS?
I hereby sentence the offending individuals to take whatever Civics/US Government 101 class is mandatory for all students in their school. Anyone with less than an A final grade will be shot. Anyone who gets an A will be forced to write the complete Bill of Rights 10,000 times, before being forever exiled to the set of Big Brother.
I prefer rogues to imbeciles because they sometimes take a rest.
As much as I'd like to see several people go to prison over this, I feel bad for the local taxpayers and their kids who will have to go to a school $50 million in the red..
This really warrants criminal charges against the school officials who are behind this, not just a civil action. The FBI and local law enforcement should be reading those officials Miranda.
>if any inappropriate sexual behavior is observed, included but not limited to self-abuse
Masturbation is not self-abuse.
>and teachers, who act as guardians
While the children are at school, not when said children are at home.
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You mean the taxpayers in that school district are fuuuuucked.
But I sure hope anyone who had a hand in it is canned.
That said... the laptops were provided by the school. Just like my employer, I'm sure the school made it clear that use of the laptops would be monitored, non-official use is verboten, etc. Turning the webcams on definitely crossed the line in terms of monitoring, IMO. What if some kid was doing their homework in their underwear, or naked? That's using the laptop for sanctioned purposes.
"Trolls they were, but filled with the evil will of their master: a fell race..." -- J.R.R. Tolkien on Olog-hai
Actually I would say that somebody should be up on criminal charges. How do they know that my wife or daughter are not changing in that room when they decide to spy. How do I know that they are not recording nude pictures of my children?
Your right that a class action law case will only help the lawyers. I want to see people go to jail for this.
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What really discourages me about all of this, is teaching the students to expect and accept this kind of treatment. I realize they are minors and often (necessarily) children's rights are limited or curbed to facilitate time to learn and understand consequences for exercising those rights.
As I watched my younger brother go through high school I was shocked to hear how the students were given no right to privacy in their lockers or personal vehicles, were under constant surveillance and could be patted down or searched at any time the school felt it wanted to (without parental consent or notification, and without any sort of probable cause requirements). The kids just accepted this and thought it was the way things worked... everywhere. No one told them that this was only possible because of the school setting; no one told them that when they became adults in the real world this sort of treatment from authorities was illegal and a violation of their rights. I don't like what we are teaching our kids, in the name of 'protecting' the kids. I'm afraid the level of scrutiny and personal rights violations that we are subjecting them to is desensitizing them to how wrong it is.
We wonder why citizens seem to just accept the erosion of their personal liberties, but what should we expect when we've been teaching them to just accept it since they were kids.
They clearly DID record it. They used a picture of the child in the case engaging in "improper behavior in the home" then confirmed to the child's father that this is true. I'm horrified by this and want to know why the heck there aren't also criminal charges filed against every staff member who knew of this without alerting the public.
What an incredibly terrifying thing this must be to each family in that district who has had such a laptop in their home. Aside from basic states of undress they may have caught kids in there's the likelihood of actually having captured sex acts, whether adults or children. This is just insane! It's not just stored, either. Clearly someone actually reviews these recordings!
This is all aside from what exactly a school is thinking for disciplining children for something that happens int he home. As a father myself I'd be furious if such a thing happened to my child. Sure, some things can impact schools but this takes it to an entirely new level.
Un-fucking-believable.
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And the school will produce their Acceptable Computer Use Policy where all of the above is authorized by the parent or other legal guardian of each student, and transferring the responsibility of any illegal acts upon the student or upon their parent or other legal guardian (including prevention of anyone being in the presence of the laptop in any state of partial or complete undress or engaging in any form of sexual or excretory activity, real or pantomimed, in the presence of the laptop).
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Let's assume for a minute that the complaint is correct and that the school was remotely monitoring some set of students. (This might not be correct. Did the snapshot come from some public source like FaceBook?).
If it were my daughter's computer, I would not be talking about a class-action suit with a civil attorney. I would be sitting down at police HQ and the district attorney's office pursuing criminal charges against the individuals involved. They would need to face the felony charges that their behavior warranted. Once that was rolling, I would go after the individuals (not the district) for civil damages.
Why give a pass to the deep pockets? Simply because I don't want to have to look my neighbors in the face when a fractional point increase in their property taxes is required to pay a civil settlement that made me wealthy. I have no problems bankrupting the people who authorized and deployed the tech.
The lawsuit alleges the cameras captured images of Harriton High School students and their families as they undressed and in other compromising situations.
Emphasis added. I know there's a lot of strong emotions going around on this subject, but lets try to keep it reasonable shall we?
The emphasis was unnecessary. I even used the word "allegedly" in my introduction to that quote. What exactly was unreasonable about my post?
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Personally, I think the individuals involved with this policy should be charged with attempting to acquire child pornography. After all, the laptops in question could easily have been in the child's room where they would absolutely have a reasonable expectation of privacy. It's no different than if the teacher/administrator had drilled a peephole in that child's room and had anytime access to watch them change their clothes.
Also, if I were a parent, I would be unbelievably angry if school faculty came bursting into my home uninvited. This is no different.
School faculty only has a right to deal with a student's behavior when they are on school grounds or attending school functions.
Personally, I hope criminal charges are filed against the school administration that did this.
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