Toyota Black Box Data Is More Closed Than Others'

wjr writes "Many cars these days contain black boxes that record information (speed, accelerator position, etc) and can preserve information in the case of an accident. Ford and Chrysler say that they use 'open systems' so anyone can read out the data; General Motors has licensed Bosch to produce a device capable of reading its cars' black boxes. On the other hand, Toyota has only a single laptop in the US capable of reading its cars' black boxes, and generally won't allow the data to be read without a court order. Honda seems to have a similar policy. This is emerging as an issue in the investigation into unintended acceleration."

Comments

Re:A challenge...

[binarylarry]

Toyota's systems have over a 100 million lines of code: http://news.discovery.com/tech/toyota-recall-software-code.html

Not exactly a trivial app to just run strings on.

It could be that Toyota is just being responsible

[OrwellianLurker]

Toyota ... generally won't allow the data to be read without a court order.

All it takes is a court order. So essentially the only thing slowing the investigations would be an unwilling Federal government.

Re:Let's nip this Toyota bashing in the bud

[Lehk228]

those failing tires? were made by bridgestone/firestone, a japanese company.

and the pinto?

However, a 1991 law review paper by Gary Schwartz[17] claimed the case against the Pinto was less clear-cut than commonly supposed. The number who died in Pinto rear-impact fires, according to Schwartz, was well below the hundreds cited in contemporary news reports and closer to the twenty-seven recorded by a limited National Highway Traffic Safety Administration database. Given the Pinto's production figures (over 2 million built), this was not substantially worse than typical for the time. Schwartz argued that the car was no more fire-prone than other cars of the time, that its fatality rates were lower than comparably sized imported automobiles, and that the supposed "smoking gun" document that plaintiffs claimed showed Ford's callousness in designing the Pinto was actually a document based on National Highway Traffic Safety Administration regulations about the value of a human life rather than a document containing an assessment of Ford's potential tort liability.

Re:Japanese Grammer Nazi

[93 Escort Wagon]

Not meaning to pick on the Japanese Grammar Nazi in particular, but - I can't believe we've gotten this far into the story without anyone picking up on the fact that the company president's name is TOYODA not TOYOTA (yeah I realize it's not really spelled using our alphabet). For the car company name they intentionally changed the name slightly because the T-ish symbol was considered luckier than the D-ish one.

So frankly, calling him "Toyota-san" or -dono or whatever would probably be considered a bit rude.

"voluntary" == gun to head

[Anonymous Coward]

Hah. In most cases "voluntary" means doing something with a gun to your head.
Want insurance (which you're required to have)? Better "voluntarily" open up that black box data.
Want to not be arrested? Better "voluntarily" open up that black box data.
Want to get your emissions checked? Better "voluntarily" open up that black box data.
Want to get a license for that car? Better "voluntarily" open up that black box data and let us connect it to an auto-ticketing device.

And so on....

The problem is a lot of "voluntary" things quickly become non-voluntary (i.e. forcibly waived) if you are to get standard services.

Re:I knew that and is MAIN reason I bought Toyota

[IgnoramusMaximus]

Interesting stuff. Is there a website that details what cars have what in terms of chips and such?

Just google "T.R.E.A.D. act" and "RFID".

Here is an example of what you will find (its an article in a business rag extolling a manufacturers "success" in embedding the RFID chips and their "readiness" to help others to be complaint with the act - for a fee of course).

Ostensibly the act is intended to prevent accidents related to tires, but once you have unique RFID chips in tires that are all federally registered (which is required by the act) an inexpensive reader can be used (and or placed) anywhere by any government agency, for pretty much any purpose. Take into account recent government encroachments on freedom and privacy across the board, realize that the databases under government control can easily cross-correlate the TREAD manufacturer registry with VIN number registry and ownership records ... and it does not take multiple readings of 1984 to figure out where this is going.