Slashdot Mirror


Microsoft Kills Support For XP SP2

Trailrunner7 writes "Microsoft's announcement this week that it is preparing to end support for machines running Windows XP SP2 not only represents a challenge for the thousands of businesses still running SP2, but also is the end of an era for both Microsoft and its customers. It wasn't until 2004 that the final release of XP SP2 hit the streets, but when it did, it represented a huge step forward in security for Windows users. It wasn't necessarily the feature set that mattered as much as the fact that the protections were enabled by default and taken out of the users' hands."

52 of 315 comments (clear)

  1. So what? by SanityInAnarchy · · Score: 5, Insightful

    What's wrong with SP3?

    --
    Don't thank God, thank a doctor!
    1. Re:So what? by Andorin · · Score: 4, Informative

      Way back when I had XP SP2, installing SP3 borked my machine. Had to do a System Restore.

      Just sayin'.

      --
      That Anonymous Coward guy is pretty annoying. Can we have the government censor him or something?
    2. Re:So what? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Nothing wrong with SP3. Just another "security columnist" trying to make headlines by exaggerating a minor event. Title of his article? "End of Support for XP SP2 is End of an Era", give me a break.

    3. Re:So what? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      It has WGA in it.

      But the "A" stands for "advantage", dude!

    4. Re:So what? by Mashiki · · Score: 4, Interesting

      MS never released it for XP64, this kinda leaves XP64 w/sp2 users going wtf.

      --
      Om, nomnomnom...
    5. Re:So what? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Funny

      Way back when I had XP SP1, installing SP2 borked *my* machine. Had to do a full reinstall.

      Just sayin'.

    6. Re:So what? by spidercoz · · Score: 3, Funny

      all 3 of them

      --
      "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it." - Evelyn Beatrice Hall, re Voltaire
    7. Re:So what? by BitZtream · · Score: 5, Funny

      Anyone using XP 64bit has pretty much been doing that since the day they installed the OS anyway.

      --
      Persistent Volume manager for Kubernetes - https://github.com/dwimsey/openshift-pvmanager
    8. Re:So what? by Ephemeriis · · Score: 2, Insightful

      What's wrong with SP3?

      At my previous job they were still using a piece of software that did not like SP3 - only ran happily on SP2 and older systems.

      This wasn't a problem at the time because Microsoft still supported SP2 installs.

      --
      "Work is the curse of the drinking classes." -Oscar Wilde
    9. Re:So what? by Backward+Z · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I had the same problem going from XP SP1 to SP2.

      Later, I tried installing SP3 clean to the same machine. It blue screened every time during the progress bar part of the install sequence.

    10. Re:So what? by westlake · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Way back when I had XP SP2, installing SP3 borked my machine. Had to do a System Restore.

      The plural of anecdote is not data. How many upgrades to SP3 were successful on the first attempt?

    11. Re:So what? by sakdoctor · · Score: 5, Funny

      Way back when I had 2k, installing XP borked my machine. So I switched to Linux.

      Just sayin'.

    12. Re:So what? by Ralish · · Score: 2, Informative

      That's because XP x64 isn't actually XP (NT 5.1), it's Windows Server 2003 (NT 5.2). That is, it's really only XP in name as it is built off the Windows Server 2003 codebase. It has all the server functionality of its counterparts removed as well as some minor functionality present in XP but absent from the server releases included. Consequently, they share the same service packs and updates, with the latest service pack for Windows Server 2003 being SP2. Unless of course, you meant the original "XP" Itanium release, which really is built off of XP, but support for that was discontinued a long time ago.

    13. Re:So what? by Mister+Whirly · · Score: 2, Insightful

      And this is different from any other operating systems how exactly?

      --
      "But this one goes to 11!"
    14. Re:So what? by mollog · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Microsoft has no incentive to support older operating systems, especially the really good versions of older operating systems. Indeed, they have every reason to be careless about 'updates' to those older operating system and ignore problems caused by those 'updates' because their policy is to recommend their newest product. Obviously, the policy of recommending customers buy their newest product to fix problems with their previous product is a profitable policy.

      The reason that this article is newsworthy is because so many corporate customers balked at the Vista upgrade cycle. XP was known to work better with fewer resource requirements. Many of the PC's built that were claimed to be 'Vista Ready' (TM) were dogs with Vista but were perfectly usable with XP. Imagine, an 'upgrade' to a line of operating systems that performs worse than its predecessor. So, corporate customers demanded, en masse, that Microsoft continue to offer XP as an alternative to Vista.

      For the first time in my memory Microsoft blinked, and extended its support of the XP revision despite the obvious disadvantage to its profits. Its customers had learned to put their foot down and refuse Microsoft's self-serving upgrade recommendations.

      To my mind, XP is the most stable release of an operating system since MS-DOS 5. Everybody hailed it as uncharacteristically stable and usable.

      --
      Best regards.
    15. Re:So what? by Hijacked+Public · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I'd do that, but my XP disc is stamped "DO NOT MAKE ILLEGAL COPIES OF THIS DISC" and I haven't yet finished reading USC Title 17 to determine whether your recommendation would be illegal.

      --
      "Sacrifice for the good of The State" - The State
    16. Re:So what? by prograde · · Score: 2, Informative

      That only counts as one bad experience. It sucks, to be sure, but it's anecdotal. I've done dozens of SP2 --> SP3 transitions, and zero machines got borked.

    17. Re:So what? by enjerth · · Score: 4, Funny

      Everyone said I was daft to install Windows 3.1 (before WFW 3.11) on a 286, but I installed it anyways.

      At first, it borked my machine. So I did a reinstall which burned down and then borked my machine. The third install burned down, fell over and then borked my machine... but the fourth one stayed up!

      And that's what you'll get, lad.

    18. Re:So what? by Mister+Whirly · · Score: 2, Insightful

      And so you think it is up to Microsoft to continue support for SP2 because you use some third-party software they have nothing to do with?? I think your beef should be with the software company not making their software work with the current patch to the operating system, and not vice-versa.

      --
      "But this one goes to 11!"
    19. Re:So what? by Shakrai · · Score: 3, Informative

      I'd do that, but my XP disc is stamped "DO NOT MAKE ILLEGAL COPIES OF THIS DISC" and I haven't yet finished reading USC Title 17 to determine whether your recommendation would be illegal.

      I know you are going for sarcasm, but Microsoft actually tells you how to do this. Also, it says "illegal copies", Microsoft has never much cared if you make copies for your own personal use. Hell, they don't even distribute media by default for their bulk licensed products. You have to download them or pay extra for the media.

      --
      I want peace on earth and goodwill toward man.
      We are the United States Government! We don't do that sort of thing.
    20. Re:So what? by pjfontillas · · Score: 5, Funny

      Way back when I had a typewriter, installing IBMDOS borked my machine. I couldn't figure out how to use the floppy disk. I put it in just like paper, right? The disk just jammed and I had to trash everything. I should have given up then.

      --
      Life. Is. Good.
    21. Re:So what? by ImprovOmega · · Score: 3, Informative

      XP64 SP2 is the same as Windows Server 2003 SP2. When there's an SP3 for Server 2003 there'll be an SP3 for XP-64. Further, any updates for Server 2003 SP2 x64 edition will patch directly into XP-64, so in actuality you'll probably have support for that long after XP-32 is dead and buried. Microsoft's support for Server OS's far outlasts their support for consumer OS's (generally).

    22. Re:So what? by Ephemeriis · · Score: 2, Interesting

      And so you think it is up to Microsoft to continue support for SP2 because you use some third-party software they have nothing to do with??

      When did I say that?

      The original question was "What's wrong with SP3?" I indicated one example where SP3 would be a problem.

      I think your beef should be with the software company not making their software work with the current patch to the operating system, and not vice-versa.

      I never claimed to have a beef with anyone.

      I certainly don't have a beef with anyone about this particular piece of software, as I no longer work there. For all I know they may no longer use that software.

      And if I was going to have a beef with anyone, it would be with my former boss. He was too cheap to buy the new version of the software, which was why it didn't work with anything newer than SP2.

      --
      "Work is the curse of the drinking classes." -Oscar Wilde
    23. Re:So what? by Ephemeriis · · Score: 2, Interesting

      People always say that, but never explain "how it's a mess".

      XP x64 never seemed to be a real mainstream product. You never really saw Microsoft advertise it much... Nobody really advertised support for it...

      Some of the software I had to support would not run on XP x64. It would run fine on XP x86... It would run fine on 2003 x64... But it was not happy on XP x64. I don't know why that would be, since it was basically 2003 x64 repackaged... But some of the software wasn't happy with it.

      Then we had some vendors who flat-out refused to support their software on XP x64. It would run OK... But if we hit a bug and they heard we were running XP x64, they'd tell us to re-install with a supported OS.

      Drivers were another issue. I had a hell of a time tracking down drivers for some devices. Generally speaking, you had to use 2003 drivers. Which wasn't necessarily obvious since the OS said XP, not 2003. But sometimes the 2003 drivers wouldn't work either.

      The only thing (generically speaking) that it seems to lack vs. Vista as far as an Actual Problem, is direct support for various AHCI drivers

      The big benefit I personally saw with Vista wasn't some kind of technological change - it was simply the fact that Vista x64 was a mainstream product. You would see the x64 version advertised prominently along-side the x86 version. Hardware and software both would advertise support for the x64 version. Vendors stopped running away when you mentioned you were running x64.

      This currently being written from XP x64, I've never seen what all of the fuss is about.

      I guess I'm glad it's working for you.

      I personally gave up on XP x64 on my home computer when I had trouble finding working video drivers.

      That was a couple years ago... So maybe the problems I experienced no longer exist. Maybe it would be a piece of cake to run XP x64 these days. But I don't really have a reason to anymore.

      --
      "Work is the curse of the drinking classes." -Oscar Wilde
    24. Re:So what? by Mister+Whirly · · Score: 2, Funny

      Wee, wee, wee all the way home.

      --
      "But this one goes to 11!"
    25. Re:So what? by Gr8Apes · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Everybody hailed it as uncharacteristically stable and usable.

      Er, no. They treated pretty much the same way they did Vista.

      IIRC, they lampooned it for its cartoonish look, and the fact that it was slower than Win98 and Win 2K, depending on where you were coming from. Win 2K was probably the "best" of the NT versions, solid and trim compared to all of its predecessors and descendants. And while XP was eventually accepted, Vista never will be, as Win 7 is now out (Vista SP2 really, renamed because "Vista" had such a bad rap)

      --
      The cesspool just got a check and balance.
    26. Re:So what? by drsmithy · · Score: 2, Informative

      IIRC, they lampooned it for its cartoonish look, and the fact that it was slower than Win98 and Win 2K, depending on where you were coming from.

      Yes. Just like Vista.

      Win 2K was probably the "best" of the NT versions, solid and trim compared to all of its predecessors and descendants.

      Compared to NT4, Windows 2000 was "bloated" and slow - the former needing a 33Mhz 486 with 16Mb RAM and the latter a 133Mhz+ Pentium (~8x more) with 64MB RAM (4x more).

      Vista never will be, as Win 7 is now out (Vista SP2 really, renamed because "Vista" had such a bad rap)

      Windows 7 is as much "Vista SP2" as Windows XP was "Windows 2000 SP1". Certainly the changes weren't as large as Vista (probably the single biggest update to NT since its release), but definitely more than just a service pack.

    27. Re:So what? by drsmithy · · Score: 2, Insightful

      You are correct sir. Windows 2000 == NT 5.0 while XP == 5.1 -(basically 2000 with bugfixes). Likewise Vista == 6.0 and Seven == 6.1, the bugfixed and memory-optimized version of Vista.

      A .1 release is not a Service Pack.

      Don't be duped. Remember this is the company that tried to trick people with "Windows Mohave" which was really just vista.

      Er, right. An anti-FUD experiment is "trying to trick people" ?

      Well, this is Slashdot I suppose...

    28. Re:So what? by ajlisows · · Score: 2, Insightful

      XP SP2 did seem stable, but now when I compare it to Windows 7, it was really buggy. I've been using Windows 7 since the Beta and the only time I had problems was early on with a Toshiba laptop running the 64-bit version. Toshiba eventually released a BIOS update that allegedly would solve that problem...but I had gotten rid of that laptop by that point. I did try running Vista for awhile but had all sorts of issues with it.

      Compared to others around here I am not that big of a Linux fan. Don't get me wrong, I do really like Linux but I am not as vested in it as others. Back when I was using XP (SP2 and SP3) I probably was using Linux 60% of the time and XP 40% of the time. Since I became acclimated to Windows 7, I've probably shifted to 25% Linux/75% Windows (Mind you I work at a place that is almost exclusively Microsoft so that has a big impact on what OS I want to use when.) Windows 7 is responsive, sleep mode works properly, the interface is nice, it hardly ever crashes, and it doesn't have to be rebooted all the time. Right now the Windows 7 machine I am on has an uptime of 39 days. Yes, that is pretty standard for Linux but in my experience...not for XP.

      I truly believe that Microsoft's newest offering is its most stable since the DOS days.

    29. Re:So what? by zmollusc · · Score: 4, Funny

      Back when I was using Vista, I .. Oh, wait, this is the wrong end of the thread.

      --
      They whose government reduces their essential liberties for temporary security, receive neither liberty nor security.
    30. Re:So what? by drsmithy · · Score: 2, Informative

      Then XP came along, and didn't really add anything of substance to 2k, mostly just fluff.

      This is false.

  2. Too late, Redmond by Dystopian+Rebel · · Score: 5, Funny

    I ended support for Microsoft products a few years ago.

    --
    Rich And Stupid is not so bad as Working For Rich And Stupid.
  3. Re:"Kills" by Beelzebud · · Score: 4, Funny

    MS bludgeons XPSP2 to death like a small defenseless kitten.

  4. Re:XPSP2? by spidercoz · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I know you tried to make the OP look foolish but is it really that hard to write Microsoft Windows XP Service Pack 2?

    --
    "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it." - Evelyn Beatrice Hall, re Voltaire
  5. Re:"Kills" by spidercoz · · Score: 2, Funny

    "assassinates" would be better

    --
    "I disapprove of what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it." - Evelyn Beatrice Hall, re Voltaire
  6. Re:"Kills" by LoverOfJoy · · Score: 2, Funny

    Why not say "Murders"? Or is that a little too over the top for /.?

    I prefer decapitates.

  7. News? by toleraen · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Microsoft has had their end of life policy available on the web for ages now. Sp2 has been well known to be going EOL. If this threw any sysadmins off-guard...then wow.

    The only reason I can see sticking with SP2 is that SP3 hasn't gotten an EAL rating.

    1. Re:News? by MobyDisk · · Score: 3, Informative

      FYI: EAL ratings I had never heard of this before.

  8. Cost effectiveness by copponex · · Score: 2, Interesting

    I bought my copy of XP in 2002 for $150. My cost per day is down to about 5 cents, and since it's only a VM now, there's no compelling reason to upgrade to 7. All of the apps work just fine.

    I used to wonder why all of these huge businesses were still on Windows NT in the early naughties. It's because it worked, and the smartest CIOs know the real truth about IT: if it ain't broke, don't try to fix it. There will be unforeseen costs and bugs, and if there's not a "killer app" you're gaining for some competitive edge, you're just wasting time and money.

  9. So, does that make it Abandonware, Legal to Crack? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Interesting

    "..the Library of Congress yesterday approved six exemptions to US copyright. The one most pertinent to gamers is that, for archival purposes, copy protection on software no longer being sold or supported by its copyright holder can be cracked.."

    - http://www.joystiq.com/2006/11/23/us-copyright-office-grants-abandonware-rights/

    if not, why not? Seriously, interested..

  10. Re:Typical MS forcing their customers to be slaves by mister_playboy · · Score: 2, Insightful

    The developers of this software simply aren't ready on their end and there is no reason why a company should HAVE to upgrade just because MS wants more money or compliance (read slavery) from their customers.

    If you don't like the rules of Microsoft's game, then don't run their software. Other options exist.

    --
    Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law ::: Love is the law, love under will
  11. Re:Typical MS forcing their customers to be slaves by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Maybe they should contact the company that supports their multi-million dollar financial software to get off their asses and fix their software.

    Microsoft, for all their faults, maintains their OS API quite well. You do not see this sort of API stability from almost any other vendor. API that worked in Windows 95 still works, more or less.

  12. Re:Rediculous by Dog-Cow · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Ford Motor is still running SP2.

  13. Oh, Noes! by lbalbalba · · Score: 2, Funny

    Next thing you know, they'll be dropping support for my MSDOS systems too!

  14. Re:"Kills" by interval1066 · · Score: 2, Insightful

    "MS bludgeons XPSP2 to death like a small defenseless kitten."

    If you mean "...a small defenseless ZOMBIE kitten that refuses to finally die." I would tend to agree.

    --
    Python: 'And then suddenly you have a language which says "we're all stuck with whatever the whiniest coder wants".'
  15. Not a Bad Idea by Kozar_The_Malignant · · Score: 2, Funny

    >Microsoft Kills Support

    I've often thought that death was the appropriate punishment for MS Support. I'm glad that they took care of it for us.

    --
    Some mornings it's hardly worth chewing through the restraints to get out of bed.
  16. Re:Typical MS forcing their customers to be slaves by Quirkz · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Seconded, more or less. There is no excuse for a business-critical app to not be compatible with SP3 at this point. Hell, there's no reason for it to not be compatible with Vista at this point. Those developers knew the end was coming, just like the rest of us.

  17. Options by sharkey · · Score: 2, Funny

    We can still call the Psychic Hotline, though, right?

    --

    --
    "Outlook not so good." That magic 8-ball knows everything! I'll ask about Exchange Server next.
  18. Re:XP did NOT replace 2000 by Kalriath · · Score: 3, Informative

    The successor to Windows 2000 Professional was Windows XP. Not Windows Server 2003.

    Millenium was also a consolidation release, designed to make the consumer line look more like the business line so they could merge them. There are three tracks:

    3.x -> 95 -> 98 -> Me -> (Line ends. Continue from XP below)
    NT 4 Workstation -> 2000 Professional -> XP -> Vista -> 7
    NT 3.51 -> NT 4 Server -> 2000 Server -> 2003 -> 2008 -> 2008R2

    --
    For a site about things like basic rights, Slashdot users sure do like to censor "dissent".
  19. Re:So, does that make it Abandonware, Legal to Cra by Khyber · · Score: 2, Interesting

    That would depend upon where you were purchasing it from and whether or not the shop informed you of such at the time of purchase, I'd think. There is some degree of culpability that lies upon the retailer of a product.

    --
    Still waiting on Serviscope_minor to wake up to fucking reality and realize that Jessica Price isn't going to fuck him.
  20. Re:Wow, Slashdot has changed a little. by harryjohnston · · Score: 3, Informative

    Be aware that the end-of-support for SP2 isn't actually news. The date has been known ever since SP3 was released.

  21. Re:Typical MS forcing their customers to be slaves by mr_da3m0n · · Score: 2, Informative

    You do not see this sort of API stability from almost any other vendor. API that worked in Windows 95 still works, more or less.

    Solaris has always done great in this regard. Sun in fact has maintained binary compatibility up to Solaris 10, the current production release. It's even a guarantee.