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Video Gamers Have Power Over Their Dreams
Ponca City, We love you writes "Live Science reports that researchers say playing video games before bedtime may give gamers an unusual level of awareness and control in their dreams, which could provide an edge when fighting nightmares or even mental trauma. 'If you're spending hours a day in a virtual reality, if nothing else it's practice,' says Jayne Gackenbach, a psychologist at Grant MacEwan University in Canada, who says that hardcore gamers represent the leading edge of immersion in virtual worlds that increasingly has come to define a large part of contemporary entertainment and communication. 'Gamers are used to controlling their game environments, so that can translate into dreams.' One intriguing theory holds that dreams are a sort of threat simulation where nightmares help organisms hone their skills in a protective environment, and ideally prepare organisms for a real-life situation. To test that theory, Gackenbach conducted a study using independent assessments that coded threat levels in after-dream reports and found that gamers experienced less or even reversed threat simulation (in which the dreamer became the threatening presence), with fewer aggression dreams overall. In other words, a scary nightmare scenario turned into something 'fun' for a gamer."
Have you ever had a dream that you were so sure was real? What if you were unable to wake from that dream? How would you know the difference between the dream world and the real world?
Other than testing the number of respawns.
DATABASE WOW WOW
Not all that surprising really. We rehearse coping with dangerous situations all the time (including public speaking ;-) ), so that when they actually happen we'll be better prepared to handle them.
FP.
The Internet's nature is peer to peer - 20050301_cs_profs.pdf
I learned to fly... it makes nightmares non-existent as I know i'm sleeping, and just "neo" away from whatever is bothering me... Pretty fun stuff - this will sound utterly retarded, but I once flew so fast and so far that I broke through space and met two odd green creatures who were looking down at the universe within a globe. I don't remember our conversation. Doh.
But the key is to become aware that you are dreaming, and that you *can* do anything... It eliminates nightmares.
Usually I just end up dreaming about whatever game I was playing. That's hardly "control."
There's no -1 for "I don't get it."
I don't know about games, but last night I did an in-dream Wikipedia search on a piece of botany I encountered in a dream. It was pretty freaking weird. Very realistic too, as the wikipedia entry was quite inaccurate.
... and then they built the supercollider.
OK, so this is going to be very corny in a karate kid / Bruce Lee "Enter the Dragon" sort of way, but my nightmares of running away from aggressors while my legs turned to molasses got much better after a few years of studying martial arts. They'd still catch up with me, but then I'd have some things to give to them in return and I'd wake up feeling good rather than miserable.
I probably don't play the right video games, but the dreams induced by L4D are mostly tedious rather than scary. Except when I spawn as the infected. Then I'm absolutely terrified.
As a teenager, I used to try controlling my dreams, and it actually sort of worked. I was sometimes able, in my dream, to realize it's a dream and decide about stuff happening in it, or decide waking up. I can't quite remember details now, but I do remember I was fascinated with all that was possible.
Video games didn't exist at the time.
I think this has nothing to do with video games, and everything to do with age and the mental ability and desire to experiment with stuff like that.
I admit that gaming and gaming themes have many times infiltrated my dreams. I remember a couple years ago I had an odd dream where there were zombies or something in them, and in the dream I was able to fight them off using powers similar to those of Paladins in games.
However, was I better prepared to handle this strange dream because of the influence of gaming, or did I dream about zombies in the first place because of games and horror films?
Secondly, if dreams are like scenarios that our brain plays out to practice dealing with threats, does that mean that those who immerse themselves in worlds of fantasy in science fiction entertainment (either in the form of television, movies, or games) to the point that they seep into their dreams end up training their brain to practice running through scenarios that are in reality a waste of the brain's time to consider?
Well... a waste up until the zombie apocalypse actually occurs, of course.
so this raises the question, what do electric sheep play?
Whatever they play, they play it baaadly.
... and then they built the supercollider.
How this differs from lucid dreaming?
Well, I'd predict that the first study suggested that people who frequently played video games were more likely to report lucid dreams, observer dreams where they viewed themselves from outside their bodies, and dream control that allowed people to actively influence or change their dream worlds – qualities suggestive of watching or controlling the action of a video-game character.
A second study tried to narrow down the uncertainties by examining dreams that participants experienced from the night before, and focused more on gamers. It found that lucid dreams were common, but that the gamers never had dream control over anything beyond their dream selves.
What's that you say? I just copied that from TFA? Well if you knew that was in TFA, why'd you ask?
TFA also mentions that the researcher in question was focused on lucid dreams until she saw her son kissing an NES box.
Dream world of the past:
Unicorns & Fairies
Dream world of the future (or Present):
Unlimited Minerals & Vespene Gas
Based on my experience dabbling with online FPS play, most of the gamers would sooner die that admit they 'felt threatened' by anything other than their Moms. And usually they will express such bravado while throwing in a few random epithets for good measure.
I wonder if the researchers had dream reports like 'Whatever dumbass. Only fags are afraid of dreams you noob. Don't be such a bitch you fag.'
I judt got a nre Kinesis keybiartf so please excusr ant egregiou typos.
Been a lucid dreamer ever since I started playing video games, around 20 years. It changes the nature of nightmares - when dreams are a story you're telling yourself, there's a certain point where you can just go "OK this is too far, it's my turn." The nature of nightmares then becomes indefinite fears, overcoming anxious situations gracefully (or not), and fear of the consequence of one's own actions, as these are fears one cannot just turn the tables on, even if one knows they are fake.
I find this alteration of nightmares is actually much better than the usual boogeyman/hunted dreams in adapting one for modern life. Facing anxiety is a much more important limitation than just getting hurt or hiding from a malicious force - desensitizing yourself to indefinite fears is much more adaptive than desensitizing yourself to monsters or gore.
Also, the expectation of 'fun' from exploration of the unknown is a much better expectation for modern things than it used to be. It really opens up one to learn more than a fear-based experience would be. It's part of why I love to see games being developed - the expansion of people's expectations, the expansion of experience in more people's minds. Books have offered a lot of that - but the exploration has always been new ideas exposed, as opposed to the true sense of open discovery.
Games aren't all good, of course, but I think this is a widely ignored benefit to the mindset that games allow to exist.
Ryan Fenton
Just because there are many quacks that get involved with the subject of lucid dreaming doesn't mean that the entire subject is without interest or merit.
"dreams are a sort of threat simulation where nightmares help organisms hone their skills"
When I was in college, I used to dream in c++. God damn segfaults got me every time.
As a gamer, I've discovered that not only can I control my dreams, but I've actually found several cheat codes that have allowed me to fulfill those dreams in real life. Example: I can cast fireballs from my fingertips in real life, so don't piss me off, ok?
Ob. Pet Peeve: (mis)characterizing all computer games with a rich video element as "videogames". Is WoW, for example, really a "video" game? Is the video the main point of playing the game, the thing that keeps people grinding away at for 30 hours a week or more, for years of their lives? I don't think so. The video component of the game isn't even close to being photorealistic, nor does it try to be...
Lucid dreaming is where you know its a dream, but in the case of the article, you still control yourself in the dream state without realizing its a dream till you wake up.
I remember reading a paper about this like last year, that said gamers are more likely to be lucid dreamers and I found it to be true, in my case. I played a LOT of video games during my teens, I'd say at least 5 hours a day, averaging about 40 hours a week. Once you get -REALLY- immersed in a game that you can turn off and shut down, it becomes easier to be a lucid dreamer. I haven't had it as much lately, since I stopped playing when I got job, but every month I get at least 2 or 3 fully lucid dreams, and in 99% of cases I can remember my dreams.
Let me describe how it usually goes down for me. You fall asleep. You either wake up in your room, or doing some trivial task you usually do, like laundry. Something slightly odd will happen, and happen either quicker than usual or slower than usual, like a spider scuttling across the floor, or someone walking into the room. This is the first signal, you don't have any real thoughts before this, but now you start remembering everything that happens very clearly. When it comes to a point where you are compelling to do something, perhaps your mother asks you to go to the store, and you leave, something VERY odd will happen. This will trigger the thought process of "This can't be right".
Now this can happen normally in any dream, and often times it does to me. Sometimes this will cause me to wake up, other times I will just have to continue with whats happening trying to figure it out. But the lucid part comes when you go "This can't be right, it must be a dream". Once you realize its a dream, a whole lot of doors open up. You feel like you have conscious thought to do whatever you want. I have trained myself that when I see that first signal, I will go and try something to see if I can trigger the "this isn't right" thought. For me, this involves walking some place, and if it takes 5 seconds to walk down the entire block, I know thats not right. If I flick the light switch numerous times but it doesn't flash properly, I know thats not right. Those kinds of things work for me, they get my mind to realize its a dream.
Now, once you get that power to do whatever you want in your dreams, the next step comes in FULL CONTROL of your dreams, which is very difficult to achieve. I have only ever had maybe 2 dozen fully controlled dreams, but I remember each one of them as though it happened yesterday. This is where its not that you have control of your actions, but you also have control of your surroundings. Times I would think "This is a dream, so why don't I just fly?" And I'd be able to fly. Times I'd be "There is a monster, this is clearly a nightmare. Well if I'm dreaming, give me a weapon", and turn a nightmare into a great experience.
Being a nerd, you can imagine where some of the fantasies led. The sad thing is, its the best I've ever had. I have had some very enjoyable endeavours in the real world, but nothing really relates to the pleasure of being able to do what you want to when you want to, without limitation or inhibition. You can do the things you'd be embarassed about without reconsideration. One day I had the thought of "I have already manifested anything I could ever want. What is to stop myself from manifesting the things I would hate or fear the most?" I was able to see deeper into my fears than ever before. Some things I discovered shocked me so much I didn't want to sleep anymore. Luckily that subsided.
If you want to learn to do this, its not as difficult as it might seem. Video games have been shown to help, or at least statistically. The other thing is a dream journal. Keep a journal by your bed. Every day when you wake up, and you remember a dream, write something down, jot it quickly if you're in a rush. But put it down before you forget. Then when you come home from work and you re-read it, you'll get a flurry of memories.
One thing I've n
I had something very much like this happen to me last night. Before going to sleep I had been playing World of Goo as well a dose of the latest Pokemon game (MANCHILD ALERT). I remember my dream last night had something to do with me blowing out the tires on my new car and basically making a wreck of the whole machine. What I ALSO remember is explicitly telling myself, mid-dream, that "Oh well, at least it's just a dream. But it sucks that I have to deal with this wreck until I wake up."
Direct causation? Not even close. But still it's an interesting idea that control over our "synthetic" virtual worlds might also translate, to a certain degree, over to our more "natural" virtual worlds.
"Live Science reports that researchers say that playing video games before bedtime may give gamers an unusual level of awareness and control in their dreams which could provide an edge when fighting nightmares or even mental trauma."
yeah... and it also provides the ability to get laid!! =D
Serious scientific research can be done on lucid dreaming and there might be something worth learning from it (e.g. how does it happen, why is it allowed to happen?) and just because it is tied to theology and other non-scientific aspects of the human experience is no reason to just toss it out as being uninteresting. Lucid dreaming is actually a phenomenon that we know happens, that we can record markers for in sleep laboratories, and that there is still a lot of interesting things that can be learned about it.
While video games are good at allowing people fight off nightmares, is there any correlation between playing video games just before bed and having nightmares? Also, makes you wonder, how does this state of awareness in the dream world affect your actual sleep. I would think it would make REM and a good night's rest more difficult to achieve. But of course that's just a thought.
You have to be smarter than the machine you're working with.
WTF does this have to do with atheism? I'm an atheist, and I've had lucid dreams. It's a phenomenon, not a religion. Charlatans encroach on any phenomenon, doesn't make it any less real. Just like spammers selling fake viagra doesn't mean that real viagra doesn't work.
... and then they built the supercollider.
You might want to run a search on the phrase "Association fallacy," Mr Science.
There's plenty of Grade-A bullshit surrounding the subject, that's for sure. But what has this article got to do with it? Nothing at all as far as I can see.
What is to stop myself from manifesting the things I would hate or fear the most?"
Don't you hate it when you manifest a giant squid that attacks your underwater habitat?
HELLO. MY NAME IS JERRY.
WTB [sig], PST!!!
Personally, I hope for Unicorns & Elf Girls every night--the unicorns for fast travel in style, and the elf girls for why the fuck else would I want elf girls!?
You can hold down the "B" button for continuous firing.
Lucid dreams though are fundamentally conscious dreams. All dreams involve some level of consciousness, or they would not register at all. Many though have very little consciousness. You are not in the dream making it more like a movie, or you are there but you are not really in control. Dreams go through a whole spectrum though through to basically full consciousness, where you are basically fully alert, you are able to think things through, etc. Any dream where you stopped and though things through would be one with a relatively high level of consciousness.
Now of course I am abusing the term consciousness here, because consciousness implies awareness of surroundings and awareness of self (at least to the maximum level self-awareness occurs in the species in question). In such a state, you are aware of yourself mentally, just like in real life, but as far as physical self-awareness you are only aware of your simulated self, and the same holds true for awareness of surroundings.
Technically such a state could be called "lucid dreaming", but you are correct that generally that term is used for dreams that have both lucidity [1] and awareness of being dreaming.
As for gamers though, while I will not dispute the end effect of having more conscious or even lucid dreams, I will dispute the explanation. Gamers don't have more control over the environment. Games often give the player relatively little control over the environment, and have only relatively course grained control over the character compared to the real world. You are not likely to be able to use your empty gun as a melee weapon, or perform many other improvised actions, such as ducking into a locker to hide from an assailant, or hundreds of other things that one might have a reason to try but the programmers never thought about, or decided was not worth implementing.
[1] Here I am using the original definition of lucidity meaning able to think clearly.
Stylish sheet to fix many problems in Slashdot's D3: https://gist.github.com/801524
"Just because there are many quacks that get involved with the subject of Teabaggers doesn't mean that the entire subject is without interest or merit."
You see how fucking stupid you sound right now?
I can play this game!
"Just because there are many quacks that get involved with the subject of String Theory doesn't mean that the entire subject is without interest or merit."
"Just because there are many quacks that get involved with the subject of Medicine doesn't mean that the entire subject is without interest or merit."
"Just because there are many quacks that get involved with the subject of Archeology doesn't mean that the entire subject is without interest or merit."
"Just because there are many quacks that get involved with the subject of Economics doesn't mean that the entire subject is without interest or merit."
"Just because there are many quacks that get involved with the subject of Space Travel doesn't mean that the entire subject is without interest or merit."
"I know together we'll make the possible totally impossible" - Homme
I participated in that study! I volunteered for an interview/question period. I was even co-interviewed with Jane by a reporter. That was about... must have been about 3 years ago, since it was after my first year at MacEwan, but before my placement. It's kind of mindblowing to me that she's now publishing results and moving to a new level with the study.
Canada: The US's more awesome sibling.
While I have been a lucid dreamer since age four, I never expected the depth I got out of it during my teen years.
I had a girl named Katie living inside my dreams. Generic cute-girl name aside, she was certainly unique, being rather unlike myself. My waking life was for working on my craft while my dream life was for play. And oh hell did we ever play.
The surprising thing was how authentic the simulation turned out to be.
Time dilation is a wonderful thing when you can make a half-hour REM cycle seem like a whole day, especially when able to manage more than one such event per waking life night. Go to sleep in a dream with Katie by my side, tag an NREM cycle and wake up in the next dream.
When I started gaming, we'd even fight in a DOOM type environment together. That was pure fun.
I look at it as a way I kept myself from succumbing to the same thing that nabbed a bunch of my peers who traded their dreams (in the ambition sense) for small desires, knocking girls up in the process and royally nuking their lives.
It also explains why I didn't lose my cherry until I was near 23.
Whether this "Katie" has any significance or not, that mind trick kept me from going mad during a really weird time in my life.
If she's the one waiting for me on the other side after this life, the real fun has yet to begin and it's entirely worth waiting for.
In a world of the blind, the one-eyed man is king--and the two-eyed man is a heretic.
Lucid dreaming is where you know its a dream, but in the case of the article, you still control yourself in the dream state without realizing its a dream till you wake up.
There's another kind?
3 hours of videogames before bed every night for 70% of my life must've altered my mind!
But the lucid part comes when you go "This can't be right, it must be a dream". Once you realize its a dream, a whole lot of doors open up.
None of my dreams have that level of realism. I can feel that I'm dreaming, right from the start. I've had some pretty strange dreams, including one where the doorbell rings, I get up, and get some computer parts delivered - but even then I was aware it was a dream.
I have only ever had maybe 2 dozen fully controlled dreams
Almost all of mine are like that. I have complete control over what I do and can do.
I remember when I was really young, I had a sick dream/nightmare, where I was in a jeep (third person perspective - weird) and a dinosaur was chasing us (?) trying to eat us. I had the exact same dream for several years, every time I had a really bad illness. This was before mainstream 3D games, so I doubt they had an impact. Then after I got heavily into videogames, I had that dream one final time. Rather than running from the dinosaur, I did a jedi leap towards it(kotor?), grabbed one of its arms, and tossed it over the horizon. (super mario 64?)
Haven't had it since.
Every once and a while I get an instructional dream. For example, I wanted to draw a 2D sprite for a game, but I have no artistic talent. I dreamed about drawing the exact pixel art I needed in a paint program, and was able to draw it for real when I awoke. There was also the CPU heatsink Purolator-delivery dream, in which I applied thermal paste for the first time. Handy.
My current theory is I must be communicating with my dormant artistic side and/or subconscious. I've got a few other observations supporting my theory, but I won't bore you with the details unless you're interested, as my post is already getting quite long.
I always like reading about other peoples lucid dreaming experiences. However, I would like to point something out. Everyone's experiences can be different, but in my experience, telling people they can't do something, or that it's difficult, rapidly becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy.
I know plenty of people who swear that you can't dream in colour, because they never have. And they were told they couldn't, when they were young. Same with all sorts of other dream related stuff, like seeing yourself in a mirror. Anyway, I'd like to point out that when you say "the next step comes in FULL CONTROL of your dreams, which is very difficult to achieve" I never found this to be true. For me, full control was instant and easy. It was like being on a holodeck.
It would be a shame if you were telling people that full control was difficult, and as a result, they found it as hard as you apparently did.