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PA Appeals Court Weighs Punishment For Students' Online Parodies

Posted by timothy on from the at-least-the-judges-aren't-ciavarella-or-conahan dept.

crimeandpunishment writes "Is it a student's right to free speech or a school's right to discipline? A US Appeals Court in Pennsylvania heard arguments Thursday on a case that could have far-reaching implications. The issue involves the suspension of two students, from two different Pennsylvania school districts, for web postings they made on their home computers. The students posted parody profiles on MySpace that mocked their principals. The American Civil Liberties Union argued on behalf of the students."

11 of 319 comments (clear)

  1. Accusations of pedophilia?!?! by AnonymousClown · · Score: 5, Insightful

    She used her principal's photograph and described him as a pedophile and mentioned a sex act. The girl later apologized, took down the page and was suspended for 10 days.

    OK, it's one thing to parody, it's another to accuse someone of a crime that will ruin them for the rest of their life. I think those kids shouldn't be suspended for parodies but when they are using actual images and making false accusations along with them, that's another matter. That fake profile could have gotten that principle murdered. There are many vigilantes out there who would love to knock off a child molester. Then there's the whole social stigma and ruining his life.

    Those kids went way too far - they went beyond parody.

    --
    RIP America

    July 4, 1776 - September 11, 2001

    1. Re:Accusations of pedophilia?!?! by morari · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Maybe. But even then, the principal should have screamed "libel!" and let the police/courts handle that. Instead the student was suspended, despite nothing ever being done at the school itself. This is really just another case of school system trying to overstep their boundaries. It would happen every single day if people don't keep them in check.

      --
      "He who can destroy a thing, controls a thing." --Paul Atreides, Dune
    2. Re:Accusations of pedophilia?!?! by dkleinsc · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Did they engage in defamation? Yes. Is defamation legitimate grounds for suspension? No. If the principal believes he is slandered, he can as a private individual sue the students for slandering (although in this context, a reasonable argument could be made that he's a public figure, which makes this much harder). What he can't do is take official action against the students.

      For comparison's sake, let's say that a newspaper ran a front-page article (completely falsely) saying that a prominent politician's wife was a drunk and stating that the politician in question is bigoted against a minority group. While said politician could give a speech denouncing the paper, and could sue them for defamation, what he can't do is have the publisher of said paper arrested. (And for those old enough to remember the 1972 presidential campaign, you'll notice this isn't a hypothetical.)

      --
      I am officially gone from /. Long live http://www.soylentnews.com/
    3. Re:Accusations of pedophilia?!?! by kevinNCSU · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Presented with the option of leaping to the courts and costing the family money to defend themselves and the option of having the kid stay home from school a couple days to learn their lesson on what's acceptable and what's not I'd say they made the right choice.

      She's not just attacking the principal as a person, she's attacking him and his ability to do his job, and disrupting the ability of other kid's in that school to learn. Telling everyone a school is run by a pedophile has far reaching implications and is generally disruptive to the learning environment. Just like a kid cussing at a teacher during class, the school seems to me well within their rights to tell her to stay home for a couple days till she's ready to act responsibly. In fact, that seems like a much lighter sentence then the legal avenue.

    4. Re:Accusations of pedophilia?!?! by Lythrdskynrd · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Did they engage in defamation? Yes. Is defamation legitimate grounds for suspension? No.

      That is untrue. It is absolutely grounds for suspension. I was a high school teacher for five years and dealing with discipline amongst the students is paramount. As a teacher you've got to stand in front of 30 (ish) teenagers and teach. Many of them don't want to be there, some of them have decided that they hate you personally over some personal slight from six months ago (ie: telling them they must complete their assignment rather than playing flash games, or it seems an issue with uniform as in the article). If one student sits back and tells you to go fuck yourself and is seen to suffers no consequence then that behavior spreads. Inside or outside of school is irrelevant (though is it the case that the speech that is accessible in school is speech in school?) How often do you read stories with headlines like "Student behavior out of control", "Teachers ineffective"... the fact is that there are good parents and bad parents. Leaving discipline choices up to the good parents is fine, leaving discipline choices up to bad parents is disaster. Better just to treat all students equally. One set of rules, consequences for actions. Let them adjust themselves to society and not the inverse. At the end of the day, the punishment of suspension is about teaching them right from wrong, and a page calling your teacher a pedophile is wrong.

    5. Re:Accusations of pedophilia?!?! by morgan_greywolf · · Score: 5, Insightful

      IANAL, but if I remember correctly intentionally misrepresenting someone as something that is patently false is libel or slander depending on how it is done. This is a criminal offense

      No. Defamation, which slander are libel are forms of, is generally not a criminal offense in the United States; it's a tort. There is no criminal defamation at the federal level, although 17 states do have criminal defamation statutes, though they seem to be rarely enforced and are generally considered a misdemeanor.

      --
      My blog
    6. Re:Accusations of pedophilia?!?! by Beyond_GoodandEvil · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Inside or outside of school is irrelevant
      Wrong. Your power as a teacher ends at the school, unless you want to be held liable for all the actions of the children you've ever taught?Because that sword cuts both ways.

      --
      I laughed at the weak who considered themselves good because they lacked claws.
  2. There is a difference... by joel.neely · · Score: 5, Insightful

    ...between humor and malicious behavior. We don't excuse a schoolyard bully if he claims, "I was just having fun." Neither should we ignore malicious false statements merely because someone claims, "I was just doing a parody."

    Accusations against teachers and principles of sexual misconduct against their students are typically taken very seriously (with good reason). So how is a student who makes such statements, apparently in retaliation for being disciplined at school, that different from a student who retaliates by pulling a fire alarm?

  3. Simple by characterZer0 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    If something happens on school grounds or using school equipment, the school can discipline.

    If something happens off school grounds and not using school equipment that is damaging or may be illegal, involve the criminal justice system or sue.

    Why is this so hard?

    side note: Homeschooling parents are looking pretty smart, aren't they?

    --
    Go green: turn off your refrigerator.
  4. Re:Not the school's problem by schon · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Ask yourself something - assuming the student is guilty of the act - what's better for the student and their family:

    1. Being suspended for a few days and learning that actions have consequences.

    2. Being taken to court, possibly having criminal charges pressed against you, bankrupting your family due to legal expenses and the judgement against you, and learning that actions have consequences.

    Sounds like the school did what was best for the student, and is now being punished for it.

  5. But did the school have a right to suspend them??? by Bourdain · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Those kids went way too far - they went beyond parody.

    I completely agree with that is clearly beyond parody, but the real question is "Can schools punish students for web posts?" not "Can people be punished for [inflammatory] libel?".

    In a sense, these kids got off easy. They could have had real legal consequences as opposed to a school suspension.