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Unique ID In India Causes 'Fear of the Beast'
bhagwad writes "India's attempts to tag everyone with an ID number has run into a roadblock is some Christian villages. Apparently the villagers fear they will be associated with the devil since according to the Bible, everyone having the 'mark of the beast' will go to hell. These people are not afraid of punishment. They relish this opportunity to prove their faith because the Bible also proclaims that they will be persecuted."
Everybody knows those grocery store "loyalty cards" are the real Mark of the Beast!
I've always wondered: If you have more than one "loyalty card", does that make you a traitor or just a whore?
I believe I am well educated with some extensive study in Eschatology.
The Mark of the Beast is interesting and whether you are Premillennial or Amillennial you can find issues with the Mark of the Beast.
I, personally, am mostly indifferent. Mostly.
Here's where the concern is and will continue to be: buying and selling goods. I must make a living. I must pay my taxes. I'm okay with this. What happens when I won't accept an ID chip in my hand or cell phone?
As a citizen I am no longer "free". I pay my taxes but I can't buy or sell without these shackles?
Once a government is able to completely restrict the buying and selling, the means in which I survive, they have become oppressive and abusive. They must be overthrown.
If you think it doesn't matter or this is an unimportant step then we can Godwin this discussion.
And no, I'm not afraid. I won't bow down to another god or man. If the next President says we must bow down to him or his god(s) I will refuse.
Personally I think Christians (practicing their faith in "loving others") are the best kind of citizen one can have. They follow the just laws, they pay taxes and help their fellow men.
I had a sysadmin who refused to chmod files to 666 because it was the number of the beast. We didn't have the permission-letter version of the command back then.
Bruce Perens.
Agreed, but it is noteworthy that for once religious paranoia, and especially that LSD-induced last part of the bible, has a good effect on the world See "Jesus Camp" for plenty of examples of it being much more annoying and dangerous.
The dirty, filthy secret is of course that they are right. But the educated buffoons who make up the majority of Slashdot's readership will just use this as an opportunity to pummel anyone they consider "ignorant" in comparison to themselves. Let's get it out of the way, shall we? They're ignorant. Stupid. Illiterate. Backwards. Primitive believes in invisible Sky Daddy Fairy Unicorn. Ahh... there we go.
Now for the seriousness - replacing names with numbers is just one of the many tools governments across the world use to dehumanize their populations. Nothing is more dangerous to a government than free people who consider themselves sovereign entities and treat the edicts of their government with contempt. The government wants to impress you, show off for you, convince you they have all the power and you have none. It is illegal in this country the United States to have a baby and not immediately report that birth. Is it because they care so much about your child and want to make sure it's taken care of? All evidence says no, of course they don't give a damn. They just want to make sure they know who and where this new person is so they can subject them to a lifetime of oppression. From public schooling to mandatory health insurance purchasing to jury duty, the government needs to know you exist so they can make you submit.
These villagers might not be right in their exact theology, but that makes no difference. They correctly recognize that enumerating human beings as if they were any other commodity is a tool of dehumanization that makes life less valuable in the eyes of the paper pushers who decide whether to bomb you or to build you a bridge. It's a tool for treating the human soul as a cost-benefit calculation, as just another thing to be thrown away when it's no longer usefully working.
But of course, they're ignorant and stupid and you are so much infinitely smarter and wiser. That's why you've allowed yourselves to be treated like cattle and sheepherded into any pen the government conceives for you. Keep your protests in a Free Speech Zone and when the government decides to shut down the internet you will have to find someplace else to parade your intellectual superiority.
When a true genius appears, you can know him by this sign: that all the dunces are in a confederacy against him.
That's why years ago I started using loyalty cards with other people. By my count now we have probably a hundred different people on one card alone.
Other than the supposed savings (they're are an illusion just like you pointed out) you maybe get some savings on Gas. However, there are usually 1 or 2 places in a 100 mile radius that you can get the gas from. So you waste all the time driving there, wear and tear on the vehicle, just to save a few cents on gas that usually does not offset what you lost getting there. Unless you live less than 5 miles away from the super special gas station you can cash in your rewards on, it is just stupid.
In some stores you don't even need your loyalty card either. Enough people complain that they won't purchase the items unless they get the "discount" price that cashiers will just give you a new card on the spot or swipe a card they have with them. I have seen that a lot.
Personally, I enjoy my method a heck of a lot more. The original information on the account is bogus and the demographic information they glean from it must be hilarious.
I see your point. Really, I do, but I must say that I see a distinction here, in most of the posts I've read. I will stand up for anyone's right to believe as they choose, no matter how silly I may consider those beliefs to be. I will furthermore defend those believers' right to live by their beliefs... right up to point where their actions have an undesirable impact on others. Failing to take part in the census counts as such an action. At that point, the believers become instantly deserving of all the derision that can be heaped upon them because now their silly and irrational superstitions actually matter. It is the right, nay, the duty of rational persons to point this out, loudly and repeatedly, for as long as it takes for all of us to finally fucking get it.
Yes, I always love seeing my favorite items under a "loyalty card" discount.
Monday: normal price $2.
Tuesday: normal price $5, "ONLY $2.50 with your LOYALTY CARD! WOW!!!! YOU SAVE TWO DOLLARS AND FIFTY CENTS!!! AREN'T YOU THE SMARTEST HUMAN SINCE EINSTEIN!!!!!"
Wednesday: normal price $2.
"This post contains words, known to the State of California to cause thought. Wash brain thoroughly after reading."
Interesting. Can you explain further? I looked up the first paragraph and it's this:
"Revelation 1:1 The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John:"
It doesn't say anything about using symbolic language. Also not in subsequent paragraphs.
Secondly, you are confusing Hell with Sheol, the place where all the souls of the dead go. However amusing the idea may be, the Bible most definitely does not claim that Jesus went to Hell.
Thirdly, your claim that the mark is not a physical mark is easily refuted by Rev. 13:16, which even mentions the *location* of this mark.
"Revelation 13:16 And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads:"
see a Text Widget
The Bible predicts that people will be intolerant of Christians. It also predicts that the 'mark of the beast' will come about, no matter what we do to try to stop it. If the 'mark of the beast' becomes a reality, the Bible will be proven correct.
Some Bibles say 'signify' others more plainly say 'in signs'. Look up the word 'signify' and you will see what he meant:
Main Entry: signified
Function: noun
: a concept or meaning as distinguished from the sign through which it is communicated
So the mark represents what a person does (the hand) and what a person thinks (the forehead).
In the original Greek and Hebrew Hell=Sheol=Hades=Gehenna=Tartarus. They all mean 'grave' not 'place where God tortures people for eternity'.
I judt got a nre Kinesis keybiartf so please excusr ant egregiou typos.
I caught this quote from the first post:
"Always good to see uneducated crazies are all over the world.
Yes, uneducated, but not in the way you are thinking of.
Christians are persecuted all over the world. In India, there are some fanatical groups of Hindus and Muslims that are especially violent towards Christians, with murders and burning whole villages not uncommon. Lesser persecution occurs all over the world, however, and is to be expected. In fact, this is probably not exclusive to Christians, though some religions tend to suffer less. I suspect because they fight back. Christians are not called to do so, but to love their persecutors and put their faith in God. Seeking persecution is not necessary - it will seek you as a Christian.
I'm currently studying Revelation, and have been getting very different insights into the imagery and visions depicted there. The 'mark of the Beast' need not be a literal mark, but it could be just as apparent. If, as a Christian, you spend your time watching celebrity news shows and, as Don Imus says, 'revelling in the agony of others', you are participating in the less-Christian aspects of our culture. This is more the domain of the Beast (Satan) than it is of God. You are marked by this. If you spend your time talking about things of the world, you are marked as one more interested in the world. Am I guilty of this? Yup. We can change, though.
The quote about 'buying or selling' is indeed, however, looking more literal than figurative. This is more interesting. But of course, if you wish to buy or sell that which is being offered by the prevailing culture, well, yes, avoiding the mark of the Beast will distance you from that culture. In TFA, it seems India is instituting the UID system to better identify individuals. I think, as a Christian, I could tolerate having a UID as a means to entirely acceptable ends, ie property ownership.
I think these Mizoramans are misguided, but they are also under constant threat. Who knows.
Hopefully some of the pastors I know of in India will reach out to them and give them some useful insights. You have to fight the real fight, not be distracted by the enemy.
ps- I do not advocate Christians isolating themselves from the world. We are called to be in the world, but not of it. If you don't understand this, try to evaluate your investment in current events. Are you tossed to and fro by the latest political debate, or do you take it as an event, and keep your focus on the issues and real progress?
deleting the extra space after periods so i can stay relevant, yeah.
You can without a doubt easily prove that the world is older than 4,000 years, yet there are many Christians that will tell you otherwise.
This should be good. How do you intend to prove that the world actually is older than 4,000 years (shouldn't that be 6,000?), as opposed to simply appearing older? The appearance of age is inevitable, and proves nothing. These Christians are not claiming that the world came about by natural causes within the last few thousand years, you know. There is no way to disprove creation ex nihilo, whether it be four billion years ago, four millennia, or four minutes.
That, of course, is the whole problem—once you start believing in things which cannot be disproved you've pretty much given up on any lingering pretense of rationality. Fortunately, tolerance doesn't mean you have to internalize other people's beliefs; it just means that you won't reject someone as a person simply because you disagree with them. It is perfectly possible to tolerate religious individuals without accepting the truth of their worldviews or endorsing their actions.
"The state is that great fiction by which everyone tries to live at the expense of everyone else." - Bastiat
The gays aren't knocking at my door, telling my children that they are going to burn in hell forever.
Okay, define how this is intolerant. Are they killing your kids if they do not convert? You always have the option of shutting the door if you don't like it.
They aren't shooting abortion doctors.
How many abortion doctors have been shot by self-described Christians? Less than a dozen (which I would say is still too much). And true Christians condemn these acts (that whole Sixth Commandment and all).
They aren't launching suicide attacks on my neighborhood.
Ah, now you're talking about Muslims, which is a totally different religious group. Fundamentalist Muslims will try to blow you up. Fundamentalist Christians just pray for your soul and witness to you.
They aren't polluting science with their fictional delusions.
To turn this around, aren't you being a little intolerant in the way you're presenting their beliefs?
When the theists abandon their irrational bigotry, grow up and stop trying to control their neighbors, they'll be worthy of tolerance.
That also doesn't sound very tolerant.
--Chag
You realize that your statements have put you far outside of both historical Christianity and the dominant Christian denominations in this country, right? Speaking of just my corner of the US, I do a lot of business with Christians and Christian churches(I am the only PC repair-person who makes house calls), and thus I am privy to a lot of private information, such as emails. They also have some irrational desire to open up and tell me about their beliefs while I'm removing yet another round of malware(I don't have a scarlet A tattooed on my forehead, so they assume I'm some brand of Christian, too). Aside from a couple of elderly pastors from California and a family of unobservant Lutherans(note that both examples are not native to this area), I haven't met a single practicing Christian or a single denomination that didn't preach Creationism, anti-homosexual bigotry, weird end of the world AntiChrist beliefs or forms of Christian Triumphalism(sometimes intermixed with militant militia beliefs). Or some bizarre mish-mash of all of the above. And these irrational beliefs are quite vocally the basis for their votes.
I encourage you to attend some midwest political meetings and canvas them for religious beliefs. It will open your eyes to what your fellow theists believe and are trying to push onto the rest of the population.
All that is necessary for the triumph of good is that evil men do nothing.
Uh there have been many married gay people. Married to the "opposite" sex.
;)
If legal perks are what you want from marriage, just find a suitable partners and there you go.
The lesbians could marry the gay guys (consummation optional). Then they could have their gay affairs with permission from their "spouses". So far they aren't convicting the heterosexuals for adultery.
If the legal perks aren't important, isn't this marriage stuff considered "old fashioned" and anachronistic by all the "modern thinking" bunch?
I always wondered what society would be like if people didn't experience fear.
I'm not talking ignorant of danger, rather immune the unreasoning response to imagined threats.
the preceding comment is my own and in no way reflects the opinion of the Joint Chiefs of Staff
And what, in your expert opinion, was the context of the similar commands to offer someone your cloak as well if they demanded your tunic or to carry bags two miles if they demanded you carry them one?
Ok, I’ll just tell you.
A tunic was a lightweight, loose garment; a cloak was heavier. In Jewish law & tradition, you were permitted to take someone’s tunic as security for a debt. You could not, however, take their cloak and keep it beyond nightfall as it would be cold and they would need it. (This was based on rabbinical interpretation of Deut. 24:12-13.)
Similarly under Roman law the occupying soldiers could recruit any non-citizen of Rome and demand that the person carry their bags. However this was limited to a distance of only one mile, after which the person was free to go; they could not legally demand two miles from the person.
Now how do those situations jive with your claim that turning the other cheek was a taunt?
Alexander Peter Kristopeit bought his basement from his mommy for one dollar.
Well, to be fair: given that the Bible is a collection of translations of translations, etc... pretty much everything is a "version".
My point here is that if the meaning of a single ambiguous word in the whole translation chain can change the entire meaning of one of the most important sections of the Bible, then how seriously can we take the Bible in the first place?
If it's a guide to something, then to what exactly? Our pre-conceived notions perhaps? Then the Bible is nothing more than an enabler for the intellectually lazy.
Unfortunately, the so-called "Christians" seem to prefer persecuting the messenger... typical of false wannabee Christians.
I think we're in general agreement though :-)
see a Text Widget