BlackBerry Tablet Confirmed, Supports Flash

HouseMuzik writes "Betanews' Tim Conneally reports that sources close to RIM have confirmed the existence of a BlackBerry Tablet device, with a ship date by the end of the year. Previous reporting on the device was confirmed by the source, including a 7" screen and a 1GHz processor. The source added that the device would support Flash, and would include a hardware-based Flash accelerator. Betanews' reporting seems to confirm an earlier report that quoted Rodman & Renshaw analyst Ashok Kumar as saying the BlackBerry Tablet indeed existed."

Comments

Memo from Jobs to Balsilie

[eldavojohn]

July 12, 2010
From: Steve Jobs
To: Jim Balsillie

Jim,

Hey, buddy, sorry about getting my piece of the pie in the mobile phone market from under your feet but daddy's gotta eat. Right? Really though, I've been meaning to send you over some complementary hookers and blow but you know how things get busy what with the release of my new baby.

Speaking of which, it's called the iPad--maybe you've heard of it? I don't know, seems the other CEOs spend half the time with their heads up their asses so you coulda missed it.

Anyway, I wanted to take this time to send you a message, loud and clear:

It's okay. You can release a tablet device now.

I know, I know, you're probably pitching a tent under your desk as you read this. This has been tried -- what -- like fifty times before? And everybody's failed. But now your sugar daddy has warmed up the masses and anybody can stick their meat in. Even you! Of course you gotta hit below my price point when you offer them your aborted fetus of a tablet but come on let's be happy about this.

I mean, there's the three mil that have already bought the iPad--you know the people whose time is worth more than watching a goddamn blackberry shit itself. And there's everyone else (your customers).

And now that I've said it's "okay", it's "okay" to own a tablet. Did you see how that worked? Let me spell it out for you. Before it wasn't okay. Companies couldn't sell it, people couldn't buy it. And then Steve Titty Fucking Jobs showed up and said it was okay. Suddenly three million people have iPads. That's how it works. On July 12, 2010 your stock shares will jump a little bit because I told you it was okay to turn a profit.

Now someone else gets the dregs, offer up a knockoff and cash out. The Courier fell flat on the pavement like a bead of sweat sliding off of Steve Ballmer's bald head so I guess that comes down to you. But really, when is the last time that guy did anything right?

And you know what? After the iPhone took any non-corporate user you might have had maybe you deserve this. Maybe you are good enough to have Apple's sloppy seconds this time around.

Consider us even. I bet you're upset right now and that's because you're just reading this memo wrong. Don't read it that way.

Steve Jobs

Re:Memo from Jobs to Balsilie

[mdwh2]

Which is indeed what Jobs and some people here no doubt believe, but remember it's not true. Tablets were around before the Islate or whatever they called it, and they're still not mainstream after Apple's tablet. No doubt they will become more popular in time, but this is a gradual change due to increased technology (hence things like touchscreens, prices falling, cheaper mobile Internet connections), and there is no reason to single out Apple as a sole cause.

What has happened is that we now have vast amounts of media hype over Apple's tablet. But this happened before it was even released - or even officially announced in fact. So had nothing to do with any success it did or didn't have (and indeed, the causative link would be the other way round - vast amounts of media hype leads to better sales, not vice versa).

If we're going to credit anyone with popularising tablets, thank the media. But it's still very rare for me to see anyone with a tablet (and when I have, it wasn't from Apple).

Apple entered the phone market after most other companies - so they had to wait until other companies told them it was okay to release a phone now...

(RIM still have higher market share in phones than Apple, don't they? Although they're still small compared to companies like Nokia, Samsung, Motorola).

Re:Memo from Jobs to Balsilie

[shutdown -p now]

If we're going to credit anyone with popularising tablets, thank the media.

No, thank Apple for putting themselves into a position such that the media will create hype over any new Apple product release. Which is entirely Apple's doing.

But it's still very rare for me to see anyone with a tablet (and when I have, it wasn't from Apple).

I don't know where you're looking, but my anecdotal experience does not support this. For one thing, where none of my friends and acquaintances had any kind of tablet before, a few have iPad now (not all are happy about it, but that's another story). For another, I still see a lot of people around several stands with iPads in the local Best Buy - so much so that they sometimes have to queue up because there aren't enough for everyone.

Kick Apple for being closed - fair enough; but denying that iPad is already a huge success in market terms is just delusional.

Re:Memo from Jobs to Balsilie

[mjwx]

Which is indeed what Jobs and some people here no doubt believe, but remember it's not true. Tablets were around before the Islate or whatever they called it, and they're still not mainstream after Apple's tablet.

Indeed. This is why I compare the Ipad to the Apple Lisa. In the end it's a product that is less useful and more expensive then previous products. If tablets become popular it will end up being the same story the Ipad will be forced out by cheaper, more competitive tablets from other manufacturers much the same as the Lisa was ignored in favour of the cheaper and more ubiquitous IBM PC's of the 80's.

Of course the fanboys will talk up how nothing can match the Ipad's supreme interface or some such, but remember that Apple fanboys of the 80's talked up protected memory. The Ipad will either be another tablet that goes nowhere or be overtaken by US$2-300 tablets.

Guarunteed way for success

[Pojut]

Make ANY tablet able to function as a Wacom or Cintiq, including the pressure sensitivity. You will lock in the Internet Comic business almost instantly.

There are other things required in order to be a true mainstream hit (which the iPad is, admittedly, fairly close to fulfilling), but creating a niche product that has been requested by pretty much everyone in the industry would certainly be a smart move.

Re:Guarunteed way for success

[guruevi]

You mean like the Axiotron Modbook? It's a really nice device designed by Woz. I considered getting one myself but it's a bit expensive.

Re:Guarunteed way for success

[gstoddart]

Make ANY tablet able to function as a Wacom or Cintiq, including the pressure sensitivity. You will lock in the Internet Comic business almost instantly.

Ummm ... is the Internet Comic business sufficiently large as to cause any large corporation to factor it into its demographics when designing a mass-appeal product?

It sounds a little like "left handed goat herders who program in scheme".

but creating a niche product that has been requested by pretty much everyone in the industry would certainly be a smart move

RIM doesn't want a 'niche product'. They want something as many people as possible will buy. The internet comics crowd? Maybe not so much.

Re:Guarunteed way for success

[ahankinson]

Wait.... the iPad isn't a mainstream hit? It sure looks like it is from here...

Re:Guarunteed way for success

[WillAdams]

They're available, and expensive, and not selling that well:

http://www.motioncomputing.com/products/tablet_pc_J35.asp

http://www.axiotron.com/index.php?id=home

And until recently the battery life wasn't that great either (technology is finally catching up to the early promise) --- I still have to use 9-cell extended life batteries in my Fujitsu Stylistic ST-4121 (and unfortunately Fujitsu has discontinued their ST-6012)

William
(who has been using pen computers w/ Wacom styluses since the NCR-3125)

Re:Guarunteed way for success

[macs4all]

You mean like the Axiotron Modbook? It's a really nice device designed by Woz. I considered getting one myself but it's a bit expensive.

It IS nice; but it wasn't DESIGNED by Woz. He is involved with the company; but pretty much only as a PR booster.

And it is insanely expensive.

Re:Guarunteed way for success

[webdog314]

I would agree with you, but not so specifically. Any pressure-sensitive tablet capable of running Photoshop would be an instant winner in the art community, especially if it were priced around that of the iPad. The trend into digital illustration is huge, and not just in the comic industry, but frankly, working on a split screen/tablet format sucks. It's certainly doable (as I can personally attest) but it's a FAR cry from working directly on a medium.

The problem with this is that it's self defeating. The moment you bring ANY form of input device (other than your fingers, which most of us always have with us) back to the tablet, it completely changes the user experience to the point that the device risks falling back out of the "tablet" definition altogether. Would the "stylus" be required for input? It is on any Wacom device.

While such a device is a pipe-dream for artists (and has been for a LONG time), I seriously doubt the public wants to give up the versatility of finger gestures in favor of a pen, even a pressure-sensitive one.

Re:Guarunteed way for success

[ColdWetDog]

And doesn't work well. The digitizer is 'grafted on' as opposed to 'designed in' and it shows. The company is about to go bankrupt. Most of the software support to make the thing usable has been done by a couple of users, not the company.

It's just like most of the Windows tablets - a hack job that's close to being useful (and indeed useful enough in edge cases) but never given enough engineering love to get the hardware and software to work together. I'm quite sure it will go the way of those tablet PCs: production will cease, the several thousand people who have fallen in love with them will band together and complain endlessly in some remote corner of the Internet and try to scarf old ones off of eBay.

Re:Guarunteed way for success

[ari_j]

While I agree that there are very few internet comics actually finding success, I wonder if it's anything like the guitarist market. For every one guitarist who is making enough money from it to call a part of the guitar industry, there are 20,000 people who want to buy the same guitar, amp, effects, cables, strings, picks, hats, and condoms as the hero is using. That's a large part of what drives the guitar-related product market. The same applies to hip-hop artists in their mothers' basements doing whatever it takes to get ahold of an MPC, a couple of good turntables, a good condenser microphone, and a recording console of some sort. High school kids' parents spend untold fortunes on whatever top-end basketball shoes are hot on the market that year.

Does the same phenomenon occur with internet comics? Are there enough wannabes to drive the market for these features in a tablet computer?

Flash, that big a deal?

[El Neepo]

Does Flash support really make or break the deal when buying a smartphone or a tablet? Do people really double think that iPhone/iPad purchase just because of Flash? Does anyone even on Slashdot go Android just because of Flash?

Maybe I'm biased as I have an iPad but lacking Flash is a minor annoyance at best. If I switched to some other OS for a tablet or smartphone, Flash support is way at the bottom of the list of features I would switch for.

Personally, I think Flash needs to just die as it's only used for games and annoying ads.

Also, I really don't see why Flash should be in the headline. Unless BlackBerry is really targetting the Farmville segment of users.

Re:Flash, that big a deal?

[gaspyy]

It's actually important for me.
From Google Analytics and Yahoo Finance to a game I play daily I rely on Flash. I actually like flash. I also like to be able to write my own flash app and to be able to install it on a device.

I seriously considered buying an iPad, but I decided against it due to lack of flash and MKV support (I understand there is a player albeit very buggy).

Re:Flash, that big a deal?

[netsavior]

My wife's netbook broke a few weeks before iPad launched and she was looking at getting one then: Wait, what? Hulu doesn't work on iPad, then what the heck is it for? Never mind, I'll just get another netbook. Sure I know that they have Hulu plus now, but for my wife who is more technical than some, but by no means a Slashgeek... Flash was a dealbreaker.

Re:Flash, that big a deal?

[AHuxley]

Flash would let you use a web cam for real.
The ability to broadcast from any location on any network to a world wide audience with a few clicks seems 'flash easy' at this time.
Apple is still trying to get beyond wifi and device lockin with its open FaceTime camera efforts.
Sure html5 is fast, pretty and new but easy UVC web cam support is still a ?

Re:Flash, that big a deal?

[Steve S]

Although I program in and use Flash daily, actual flash support was not a dealbreaker when I chose to get an android phone. It was important, sure, but not a dealbreaker. The dealbreaker was WHY flash isn't supported on apple products. It's clearly not a technical limitation since it can be installed on a jailbroken ipad and works well even through a compatibility layer http://www.engadget.com/2010/07/07/how-to-install-flash-on-your-jailbroken-ipad-for-real/. It's entirely political. I don't want to be told what I'm allowed to install or not. My devices are MY devices.

Re:Flash, that big a deal?

[El Neepo]

It's actually important for me.
From Google Analytics and Yahoo Finance

Thank you for informing me of legitimate Flash uses. Those and Hulu, that someone else mentioned, are good uses of Flash.

However, I do still think that the lack of Flash support isn't a way to shoot yourself in the foot. Apple obviously didn't support it. I'm just wondering if any other companies will follow suit because of whatever reason or do they really believe Flash is a must-have.

Re:Flash, that big a deal?

[PPalmgren]

Flash sways iPhone/iPad purchases because people beleive they should be able to think for themselves. The "think different" line is definitely no longer accurate.

You never know what they're going to decide for you next.

Re:Flash, that big a deal?

[Anonymous Coward]

"Does Flash support really make or break the deal when buying a smartphone or a tablet?"

I don't own an ipad because it lacks Flash. The primary reason I wanted a tablet was because I wanted a home viewer for legitimate streaming sites, many which are Flash based and encrypt the video data. Having a general purpose browser that worked well without restrictions would be a benefit. The ipad doesn't match either of these because it lacks Flash. Adobe is partly to blame, since they don' t have a clear Flash spec, but Apple is, to me, being the worse player, since they've restricted other programs and content from the app store.

There are other issues with the ipad, such as not being 16:9, or high enough resolution to adequate handle letterboxing in a 4:3 ratio, but they aren't deal breakers. Not being able to use common sites the way I want them, without a custom app released by that site, is annoying.

"Also, I really don't see why Flash should be in the headline"

Then you don' t use Flash, and are happy not using Flash. Not everyone is like you. Many people want Flash. As such, the company that puts out a decent device with Flash may win over that population of buyers who are interested in owning a tablet which supports Flash.

This is why Android 2.2, which supports 10.1, is to most people the tablet they may be waiting for, if device makers can put out a decent hardware package.

Maybe, I'm guessing, you're not a regular /. reader then either, as you don't seem to know you own an Apple product that has been lambasted for months for being closed, restricted, crippled, and lacking development tools, Flash often being cited as an example in all these cases.

Steve Jobs wrote an open letter criticizing Flash, and even belittled Adobe that they were late in getting Flash to mobile devices and having them worked well.

Then of course, Adobe released Flash 10.1 in final candidate for supposedly the upcoming Android release, and has been releasing decent Flash updates like 10.1 for most general purpose computing, and as a result, in my mind, become the second company to show in the past few months that Steve Jobs's way of thinking is backwards and old.

Jobs says AT&T is great and has great plans.

AT&T screws users with revamped plans.

Jobs talks about how great the iphone is, which runs pretty much the same OS as the ipad in its current gen. Tech folks point out Android devices have been making huge gains into that market.

It's the Macintosh and Windows debate all over again. Jobs hasn't grown up. Except this time, it's not MS with the general platform, it's Google, and Google is far superior to MS when it comes to putting out more open, clear products (even though it'll stay in beta for years).

Re:Flash, that big a deal?

[masmullin]

flash delivered the streaming world cup games. flash delivers lots of interviews from some of my favourite sites. flash delivers a HELL of a lot of content that I miss on my iPad. I can live without it... but I dont particularly want to.

Re:Flash, that big a deal?

[MistrBlank]

"Thank you for informing me of legitimate Flash uses. Those and Hulu, that someone else mentioned, are uses of Flash."

The use of "Good" is subjective. I happen to think it's a waste in Hulu Why do we not have flv support as a plain codec? Why is it still only usable in flash based players?

And you can't tell me those sites couldn't code their sites to work with Ajax or retool them for HTML5 (you know, an actual defined standard).

Re:Flash, that big a deal?

[tlhIngan]

To be fair, the version of Flash that people are installing on their iPads is a hacked version of the Flash Player 10.1 for Android that was just barely released a couple weeks ago. It still has a lot of issues with Flash that requires hover actions, and playing back video at a decent framerate. Most of the complaints I've seen are that it is impossible to scrub video because the controls are too tiny to actually tap on with a finger.

Personally, I don't blame Apple for not including it with the iPad - It wasn't even available when the iPad was released, and it doesn't have the user experience Apple products are known for - trying to watch Flash video that is so small you can't even click on the play or pause button is going to be an exercise in frustration for anyone.

Once Adobe fixes these bugs, I have a feeling we might see something change from Apple, and they may include it with a future release of iOS or Safari.

More fundamentally, only the iPad meets the requirements for Flash. Adobe's Flash Player for Android requires a minimum 1GHz processor. Only the iPad has it (the iPhone 4 is rumored to be a 600-800MHz processor). Not a problem for Android since all the good ones all have 1GHz processors (pretty much out of necessity to get a really nice and smooth running phone). But Apple's not ramping up the CPU speed (they don't need to - even the 3GS with its 600MHz CPU is really speedy).

Jobs' next challenge for Adobe would be to get Flash running "great" on an iPhone 4 or something, which would be about 20% slower than the Android phones it already runs on, or this Blackberry device.

(And Jobs could easily force Adobe's hand by requiring third-party platforms support new features by new OS release date. App store apps using said platform will be removed until updated runtimes are available. Thus, native developers have advantages in having apps ready all the time, while those reliant on 3rd party platforms get locked out until the platform is updated. And everyone saves face, except Adobe has to work harder in getting their Flash updates in time with iOS updates...).

Re:Flash, that big a deal?

[cbhacking]

Your "minimum 1GHz processor" argument is complete bullshit. The N800 had a 400 MHz processor (ARM-based, like iToPhoPad) and could run full Flash 9 just fine (it came with the device). This was three years ago, in the relatively early days of the iPhone, which actually had a more powerful CPU IIRC. Yes, hover was tricky, and yes, it used battery life more quickly, but it *worked* just fine.

There is not, and never was, a legitimate technical reason for lack of Flash on Apple's mobiles. Linux and OS X aren't identical, of course, but but don't try to tell me that Nokia could get Adobe to port Flash to Linux on ARM but Apple couldn't get them to port it to OS X on ARM. Even if that ever was the case, you can be damn sure Adobe would have been willing to do it in the intervening years, seeing Apple's sales numbers (the N800 and N810 were better devices from a nerd's technical perspective, but didn't have the mass-market appeal).

I hope the software doesn't suck

[ari_j]

I currently have a BlackBerry, and the operating system is horrid. I regularly have to pull the battery because the device's media processor gets tied up by software malfunctions, preventing ringtones from being played. The browser currently crashes entirely when viewing any Wikipedia page. Even sending a text message can take up to 90 seconds from the time I hit send and the time the device is usable again, apparently due to some ridiculously bad programming on the part of whoever wrote the message display software.

I am currently thinking about getting an iPad to replace my personal laptop entirely, probably after a few more first adopter issues get sorted out and I am convinced that I can carry on my normal workflow with it, browsing web pages and being able very quickly to switch to read and reply to instant messages and e-mails (which will most likely be in another browser window until a better Gmail app with threading becomes available), etc. I have an iPod Touch and believe that there is actual potential for the iPad to effectively replace my personal laptop. I also have a BlackBerry and I can't imagine a larger version of it being even the least bit useful.

Re:I hope the software doesn't suck

[DigiShaman]

I've got a Curve 8330 myself. Even though it has the latest OS (v4.5.0.175), it will still reboot on its own. Quite annoying. And yes, the processor is slow. I wish I hadn't updated Opera Mini. It's so damn slow, the mouse cursor skips all over the place. I will be dumping it for a Droid soon.

A Blackberry tablet?

[shikaisi]

That would be a fruit lozenge then?

Trackpad

[Zaffle]

Of course, in the tradition of blackberry, the device will be a tablet with a keyboard, and won't have a touch screen. Fortunately they will instead use the new trackpad, instead of the trackball. Blackberry don't have a good record with touchscreen... In fact, its pretty atrocious. People forget, the touchscreen is what makes a device. This is why iPhone, iPad, etc are so popular, Apple have nailed the touchscreen. (btw - in case anyone accuses me of otherwise - Avid blackberry user, hate the iPhone, love the blackberry, but I call it like it is - Apple ownz touchscreens).

Re:Trackpad

[Zerth]

Funny, you'd think a blackberry user would remember the bb storm. All screen, no keyboard and it distinguishes hovering from clicking.

Not that I'm saying the bb storm touchscreen was particularly good, but at least it let you interact with the web as if you had a mouse. Now if only it didn't freeze up every other week.

Underwhelmed?

[Hadlock]

I really like my Blackberry. As a phone. It's nigh indestructible, and the OS is ideal for the itsy bitsy 2.5" screen. I can even buy aftermarket replacement parts for it (trackball). However the smartphone industry has advanced by leaps and bounds in the last year. As much as I am satisfied with my BlackBerry, I know it's so far behind the curve now that even their new OS 5 can't save them now. My next phone will for sure be an Android device, maybe an iPhone. Even the new "Windows Phone 7" isn't completely distasteful. Do you really want to buy a consumer device tablet running an outdated OS designed for enterprise users? On an oversized tablet device? There's so many better options out there, starting with the Apple iPad, various Chrome/Android products in the works, and HP has a WebOS tablet in the works. But something running the Blackberry OS in this day and age simply looks....antiquated. RIM may never catch up in the smartphone OS race at this point; I think the BB Storm is proof of that. And with the Motorola Charm on the horizon... well, we come to bury RIM, not praise their outdated OS.

Re:Underwhelmed?

[moosesocks]

running an outdated OS designed for enterprise users?

Enterprise user here. Apart from the exchange support and BES (which is admittedly quite nifty and unique), I certainly wouldn't argue that Blackberry's OS fits our needs to a T. In fact, we're routinely frustrated by almost all aspects of it.

I've said this many times, but it bears repeating -- The first phone manufacturer who can make a product that functions as a drop-in replacement for BES will capture the enterprise smartphone market. It's ripe for the picking.

A tablet...from blackberry?

[grasshoppa]

That's two strikes, I'm waiting for the third.

It's not that blackberry can't make an OS...it's just that their OS isn't one I want to use for recreational purposes. Corporate email? Ok, they've got that locked up, I'll grant them that. But usable might be a bit of a stretch.

And a tablet? It's a niche market, at best. Sure, because apple released a tablet everyone's nipples are hard for one, but honestly it's a flash in the pan. What app will really drive people to a device with no keyboard, or any physical input method whatsoever? Portable media player is about all I've got here.

Re:Apple In 3rd Place And Losing Marketshare

[morgan_greywolf]

In addition, Jobs isn't worried about BlackBerry, either. Jobs has been shown to be visibly upset about Google and the explosive growth of the 2nd place Android.

get a Wacom Cintiq

[WillAdams]

They've been available for years now --- but they're expensive enough that most people won't buy them:

http://www.amazon.com/Wacom-Cintiq-12WX-12-Inch-Display/dp/B00115OFJK/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1279042099&sr=8-1

List price $1,199.99 --- on sale ``just'' $947.54 at the moment.

William