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Officials Use Google Earth To Find Unlicensed Pools
Officials in Riverhead, New York are using Google Earth to root out the owners of unlicensed pools. So far they've found 250 illegal pools and collected $75,000 in fines and fees. Of course not everyone thinks that a city should be spending time looking at aerial pictures of backyards. from the article: "Lillie Coney, associate director of the Electronic Privacy Information Center in Washington, DC, said Google Earth was promoted as an aid to curious travelers but has become a tool for cash-hungry local governments. 'The technology is going so far ahead of what people think is possible, and there is too little discussion about community norms,' she said."
A few years ago I was in a speeding ticket dispute (that I eventually won) where the traffic court was using Google Maps' Satellite View in order to count the number of mailboxes along the road to determine the number of houses on the road, and therefore to determine if the area was "densely populated" and therefore qualified for a lower unposted speed limit.
They're not that expensive though. Comparably, government employees typically have salaries a good bit below that in the private sector. The benefits (health insurance for example) and retirement plans are much better though. We've still got lifetime pension plans after 28 years where I'm at.
If you dedicated 1 person to this, my bet is they'll probably be bringing in more in recouped fees than they cost annually. Not to mention that like all things government, you have to have some level of enforcement, even if it costs a bit more than you recoup, because if you DIDN'T enforce the rules at all, then many more people would not pay.
It's like property tax seizure sales. If you owe enough back taxes on property, we'll seize it and sell it. We do this with all real property and mobile homes. Sometimes we get older mobile homes that we seize but they won't even sell (people generally don't want a 15+ year mobile home for any price), so they end up sitting and rotting or getting hauled off to the dump if someone else buys the land that they sit on. It's a bit odd to think that we seized a home due to failure to pay taxes just to destroy it or throw it away, but that's the current law, and if it's not enforced then even the people with higher valued properties won't follow it either.
"People who think they know everything are very annoying to those of us who do."-Mark Twain
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Yes, you generally have to get a permit from the city in order to put in a pool. This isn't anything new nor is it some obscure thing. It's a pretty typical part of city zoning ordinances.
A common myth that public sector employees believe so that they don't feel bad about agitating for automatic raises.
That MSPaint-created graph on some random Blogspot page is just so incredibly well-cited.
First off I am not a fan of Governmental regulation. I had and issue with a my township and a portable pool. The fact is that you have no expectation of privacy in you own back yard as far as aircraft are concerned. The basic rule of thumb is that anything viewable with out special equipment is considered public and a plane is not considered "special equipment". I think the licensing that they are talking about is actually the building permit with inspection documentation. Swimming pools are considered by the courts as "attractive hazards" That is why cities, towns, townships, states all require certain types of fencing, gates, locks, etc. It is also and insurance issue. See what happens when you add a pool and notify your home owners insurance company.
They are doing it already in Argentina for years now... Checking for illegal pools and buildings through Google Maps and airborne photos...
"The Supreme Court has also ruled that there is no objectively reasonable expectation of privacy (and thus no search) when officers hovering in a helicopter 400 feet above a suspect's house conduct surveillance."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Florida_v._Riley
You might think you have a "right to privacy from the air", but you don't. It's terrifying how the citizens of this country seem to don't know what the hell their rights are.
There are definitely restrictions related to Government use of Google Earth or Google Maps. The restrictions appear to be an effect of the agreements the Government has related to use of the Tele Atlas Licensed map information.
Google Earth EULA
Legal notices including restrictions related to Government end-users
What's next, having to apply for a license to own a fscking charcoal grill on your own patio?
I believe California tried to require a permit recently.
Who would win this election: Andrew Weiner vs Andrew Weiner's weiner.
most locales the property taxes are a share of the budget. the more improvements on your property the larger your share. a lot of the valuations i've seen will divide it among land value and improvement value. the land value is the dirt and is low. anything you build goes into the improvement value and increases your share of taxes
If you want a pool, you get an inspector, they ensure there's no rogue wiring or geographic problems,
On a slight tangent, sometimes a proper permit/inspection can prevent a tragedy.
a pool is not a rich mans toy... they aren't *that* expensive, there are many houses well within the $100-200K range around me that have pools.
As far as pool maintenance, that has nothing to do with permits. Once it's in the books, it's not on some HP Openview in the city office while they're monitoring your pool water quality. The way that works is if the neighbor feels their yard being inundated with mosquitoes they contact the city. They come out, and fine the person if they find the water has not been maintained, then they make sure a shock treatment is applied to the water to neutralize lifeforms and to bring the water back into a stable range.
I know this because I have studied it when buying a house when I owned one, and also my neighbor decided not to maintain a pool and mosquitoes were hitting my yard, hard. A phone call and a week later, everything was back to normal.
-- This space for lease, low setup fee, inquire within!
It's called zoning and planning, but what it is, is malignant interference with your liberties.
If it's your land, and what you do there does not physically affect anything beyond your land's boundaries (chemical, fire, high level sound waves, overhangs, undermining, water flow... the obvious things) then I really can't see the government having any role at all. Of course, I'm one of those crackpots that think land ownership should be meaningful, and that if you want to control something, you should have to own it first. Radical, I know.
I've fallen off your lawn, and I can't get up.
seems like the kind of thing only an idiot would do.
You seem to be under the assumption that no idiots are involved in planning and building these things.
To be fair, outside of planned developments, real world considerations often lead to piss-poor comprimises. For example, I don't have gas on my street, but I'm pretty sure the next street over has it. If I wanted it, the utility company would either have to dig up a bunch of pavement, or reach an agreement with my neighbor to run a line through his property, preferably near the edge.
I prefer rogues to imbeciles because they sometimes take a rest.
your property is yours ONLY because there is a society that defends it
It could also be argued that society is there ONLY because of its ability to defend my rights. Society (and land ownership, or HOAs for that matter) are artificial constructs brought about to support the free exercise of natural rights.
I prefer rogues to imbeciles because they sometimes take a rest.
That graph is so neat and clean; no citations mucking up the look of it. Nice work!
I don't really see how any form of pool malfunction could possibly damage a neighbor's property,
Pools without gates tend to kill small children. Also pools without double drains tend to suck the innards out of people. Those are two things are usually required and checked as a part of the permit process.
Truth is, you are just another liberal sado masochist
Truth is you're just a self centered prick who does get the point of civilization.
I don't always use unix-like operating systems; but when I do, I prefer FreeBSD.
You sir are and idiot completely lacking in imagination. An improperly designed pool could easily destroy a house. However, outside of a massively poor design, the standard issue is having a properly designed fence to keep young children from falling in and dying. (Yes, this is actually a common problem.)
PS: As a fireman what the standard procedure is for a fire at a pool supply store. It's far more nasty than you might think.
That graphic is misleading.
The thousands of minimum wage and below( waitresses and bartenders ect...) workers lower the private sector avg. But their are no comparable job in the public sector.
Yes in the public sector, you can make more money for doing less work. But the fact remains, If you want to make REAL money, you work in the private sector.
Other states (like mine - CA) require double drains for all private pools too. My pool (built in 1978) doesn't have one in the main pool but it does in the spa. The suction in the main area of my pool is relatively low due to the distance from the pump, so it doesn't pose a danger, but the spa which is very close to the pump would be extremely dangerous without the double drain. Regardless, if I ever do any construction on the pool I will be required to retrofit the main pool's drain.
I don't always use unix-like operating systems; but when I do, I prefer FreeBSD.
Do you really think that your land is really your land? Try not paying your property taxes and watch for the results. It's called "real estate" not because it's "real property" but because "real" comes the Spanish "royal" estate...loosely updated..it's the state's estate. Yes you "own" it, and you can do what you want with it...within reason. You undercut your own argument by mentioning water flow. Pools do leak, pools do need to be drained..water has to go SOMEWHERE...most likely to an estuary or your neighbor's backyard(s).
Here is a better documented and very recent analysis. They found that Federal employees tended to earn more than private industry (though not in some areas, including one pertinent to slashdot - Computer Support Specialist); however state and local employees (which is who is looking for swimming pools) are paid less than private industry on average.
Child falls into pool, drowns. Worse yet -- child playing in pool, pool drain unsafe, disembowels child by sucking out colon through anus -- not funny, happened in my home town recently, the girl died a couple of days later.
Are towns on a money grab? Probably.
Is it true that there is "too little discussion about community norms" ...? Of course not -- go surf blogs, tweet some tweets -- this world is not lacking for discussion.
-kgj
Overhead flights are also used by mosquito abatement districts is to spot "green" pools. When we moved into our house, the pool was a swamp, complete with water bugs and who knows what else living in it. About three weeks later, we got a visit from the mosquito abatement man to inspect our swamp. I had gotten the pool from greenish-black to turquoise by the time. He congratulated me on my progress (he had seen the pool before we moved in) and we never saw him again.
I don't always use unix-like operating systems; but when I do, I prefer FreeBSD.
People are required to get permits.
The didn't get permits.
They got caught.
Not so much of a money grab. More like equal enforcement.
Plus city infrastructure needs to be able to support it. Backflow device water quality, and so on. They want to be sure it was engineered correctly so you don't kill your neighbors.
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
Yes, sue them, that bring you dead spouse back to life.
Let me know how you feel when they poison a whole neighborhood, killing the young and elderly because they didn't install a proper backflow device.
If ti was just about someone who flooded my house, you might have a point. It's not.
Here is a clue, how about we ensure the meet some minimum standard to minimize the risk to people outside the persons property? Naw, lets just sue them until the dead are back.
I know, maybe I'll build a coal fired plant and then make you wade through years of people work and legal cases until you can make me shut it off?
twit.
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
Your understanding of the history of the English Empire, its fall, and its current geopolitical importance, is extremely flawed.