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Democrats Pan Google-Verizon Net Neutrality Proposal

GovTechGuy writes "Four House Democrats wrote to the Federal Communications Commission, urging them to write strict net neutrality rules and reject the framework put forward by Google and Verizon. The lawmakers, including Rep. Anna Eshoo, who represents the district containing Google HQ, said the Google-Verizon proposal increases the pressure on the FCC to come up with actual net neutrality rules, and characterize the deal as harmful to consumers and beneficial for the corporations. In particular, the letter took issue with two pieces of the Verizon-Google proposal: exemptions for managed services and wireless services from strict net-neutrality rules."

20 of 156 comments (clear)

  1. About time. by JavaBasedOS · · Score: 3, Insightful

    They're finally realizing that you can't let corporations have their way with the internet? Hopefully, this leads to a reversal that grants the FCC the proper powers to uphold these rules should they actually make the climb.

    1. Re:About time. by Ironhandx · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Am I too jaded or did anyone else have the reaction to the parents comment that it should read more along the lines of:

      "They're finally realizing that they can't let corporations that aren't paying them off for it have their way with the internet?"

      That(to me) is the most likely reason for them not submitting their own plan. Whoever is paying the bills at their getaway condo in the bahamas is asking them for a stop gap while they come up with their own plan.

      Oh, will you look at that... theres a tin foil hat on my head... maybe I'm just paranoid.

    2. Re:About time. by unity · · Score: 4, Funny

      It seems to me the corporations have been doing a darn good job with it for awhile now. I don't have much in the way of complaints. But what the hell, I can't see how adding government regulations and control could hurt things. I mean, everybody I know loves the FCC. /s

    3. Re:About time. by wonkavader · · Score: 4, Insightful

      You're saying basically "Because this sounds like an intelligent reaction by politicians, it has to be fake. It simply must be a maneuver, rather than a real response. An actual response would be stupid. Intelligence is always a lie. Progress is always a lie."

      No, that's not paranoia, any more than thinking the sun will come up tomorrow is paranoia.

    4. Re:About time. by Microlith · · Score: 3, Interesting

      It seems to me the corporations have been doing a darn good job with it for awhile now.

      They -seemed- to be doing a good job, despite stonewalling and slowly rolling out service that is generally two steps behind most of the rest of the world even in the highest density regions of the states.

      And now that they only see money these days, manipulating and destroying the openness that the internet offered for the sake of their other business interests (which are in direct conflict) only serves them. They'd happily follow a Cable/Satellite tiered access system if not for the utter shit they'd catch.

      Personally, much like phone systems all internet services should be marked as Tier II common carriers and forced to ignore the content of their customers communications.

    5. Re:About time. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Interesting

      > Last I checked, most consumer-level cable connections such as what most have with comcast explicitly forbid running a "server" on the line in the contract.

      That would be one of the first things to be prohibited by any regulation worthy of the name "net neutrality".

      The customer pays the ISP to transfer packets. Whether those packets belong to a connection initiated by the client or by another system is none of the ISP's goddamn business.

      A net neutrality law should specify which parts of the IP header the ISP is permitted to examine and for what purposes. Examining any other part of the packet (e.g. TCP/UDP ports, TCP flags, etc) should be considered an illegal wiretap.

      The fundamental principle of the internet is that routers only know two protocols: IP and ICMP. Anything and everything beyond that is just "payload", meaningful only to the endpoints.

  2. Lots of empty talk by Zelgadiss · · Score: 4, Insightful

    From the way I see it, if these politicians actually had the will to put their foot down on net neutrality then Google wouldn't even have to compromise and cut deals.

    But what do I know.

  3. Back in my day... by RightSaidFred99 · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I remember back in my day we fought tooth and nail to keep the government _away_ from controlling the Internet. Now apparently it's fashionable to want them controlling it, but only for "good" purposes. I'm sure they'll keep their hands off except to ensure the evil corporations don't screw the noble consumer over, though. Government's pretty good at that kind of thing. Incorruptible and efficient beyond reproach, that's what the government is.

    1. Re:Back in my day... by dgatwood · · Score: 5, Insightful

      No, back in the day we fought so that nobody would control the Internet. Initially, corporations didn't have enough power to screw things up, so the only people we had to keep from abusing their power was the government. Now, they do, so we have to convince somebody more powerful (the government) to step in and keep them in check. It's about balancing one bad guy against another so that the harm cancels out....

      --

      Check out my sci-fi/humor trilogy at PatriotsBooks.

    2. Re:Back in my day... by AK+Marc · · Score: 4, Informative

      Keep them in check from what, exactly?

      To keep the cable companies from blocking/throttling Netflix to boost PPV revenue. To keep the telcos from blocking/throttling VoIP to boost LD revenue. There are suspicions that some have tried similar things, and Comcast committed a man-in-the-middle attack against its customers to damage a particular protocol used heavily for movies that are on PPV. But Terry Childs gets 4 years in jail for a delay in handing over passwords, while an actual DoS attack that violates a number of state and federal laws done maliciously and deliberately goes unpunished.

      Net neutrality is absurd and its proponents largely resort to fearmongering to sell it.

      If they weren't intending to harm their customers in an underhanded manner to boost their own services, then they wouldn't be fighting it so hard. So I don't trust those against it. "We'd never do that" when they've already done it doesn't strike me as a good argument.

      Now we have this new generation of Government Can Do, idealistic youngsters who think the government can protect our precious Internet without stomping all over it. Riiiight.

      The government isn't going to "control" anything they don't already control. The Internet was built by the government and then opened up. It was pushed to what it is now by the government. Al Gore did invent the Internet as we know it by opening up the networks and getting the government out of the way. The government hasn't tried to directly control it (other than the parts they didn't yet get rid of) and isn't trying to with this either. It's nothing more than when they told AT&T that they couldn't require only AT&T hardware on the phone network. That wasn't government control of the phone network, but a restriction on the company that runs it in order to benefit the people. And that's what Net Neutrality is. A restriction on the corporations that have a profit motive to harm their customers to where Net Neutrality benefits anyone that doesn't own an ISP (and doesn't affect honorable ISPs).

    3. Re:Back in my day... by poliscipirate · · Score: 3, Informative

      Do you not understand the idea that normally diverse interests can align on a particular issue? We get the idea that some corporations support net neutrality and some oppose it, but to imply that supporters are being led around all glassy-eyed and used purely for the ends of these corporations is a little simplistic. On this particular issue, supporters agree with some powerful corporations. On others, not so much.

      Is everyone who doesn't agree with you a useful idiot?

    4. Re:Back in my day... by sqrt(2) · · Score: 3, Informative

      You are the closest I've come to repopulating my foes list since I cleared it a few years ago. I'm actually more concerned that adherents to the suicide pact of libertarianism still shock me when I come here.

      --
      If you build it, nerds will come. Soylentnews.org
    5. Re:Back in my day... by betterunixthanunix · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Here we go again.

      Net neutrality is not government control of the Internet. It is government regulation of ISPs, in the form of a mandate that they continue to provide neutral access to the Internet. It is an assurance the free and open Internet remains free and open. That is all. Stop spreading the FUD.

      --
      Palm trees and 8
  4. You know what by Flyerman · · Score: 5, Insightful

    The lack of neutrality for managed services is going to put an increased burden on IT companies. It will increase the costs where cloud services are already being proven to NOT lower costs.

    The fact of the matter is that True Net Neutrality is beneficial to every company EXCEPT ISPs. ISPs being a set than includes broadband, T1, DSL and any provider as well as the increasing role mobile providers take. Basically a set of companies that receive quite a bit in government money ALREADY to fund construction of network infrastructure.

    1. Re:You know what by sjames · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Net neutrality doesn't mean no traffic engineering at all, it just means that such engineering cannot be based on who did or didn't pay the double dipping fee.

      Fundamentally, anything but net neutrality is fraud. Customers pay their ISP for a connection to the internet. The ISP is obligated to carry their traffic in exchange for the monthly fee. Charging another party to actually honor that commitment is fraud. It's the same reason UPS can't come to you and say "Amazon shipped a package to you. If you want to make sure *AHEM* nothing causes it to end up in Siberia, you could choose to pay us $5.00 in addition to what Amazon paid."

      As for your analogy, show me a packet that can explode in the cable causing death and destruction all around it and I'll consider it.

      Network neutrality says the minimum wage guy has just as much right to use the tunnel as the carload of trustfund babies.

  5. Re:Translation of the translation by Moridin42 · · Score: 4, Insightful

    It isn't wrong. They wrote a fucking letter that says we don't like what Verizon and Google have proposed. It doesn't have any proposal of what the FCC policy should be. Just that Google and Verizon's shouldn't be adopted.

    The closest they get is saying what concepts should be central in the policy that is adopted.

    Since this is slashdot, we can make this a car analogy. Google and Verizon have designed and built a vehicle. They have presented it and it could be sent to the manufacturing line. These democrats have said "don't build it!" and instead are proposing that the factory make cars that have 4 tires, a steering wheel, some seats, and an engine. 4 cylinder? *shrug!* Comfy seats? Eh, if you like.

    It would be one thing for a private organization to protest the Google/Verizon proposal. But these people are in the practice of legislation. If they object, why haven't they and their staff managed to come up with a proposal of their own? Its only been, you know, years.

    --
    I don't expect morality, equality, consistency, or justice from the law. I expect only legality.
  6. The best reason for net neutrality... by dpilot · · Score: 5, Insightful

    ...doesn't exist yet.

    When the internet first started...
    There was no "cloud".
    There was no streaming video.
    There was no bittorrent.
    There were no VPNs, no work-at-home over the net.
    There wasn't even a web - though that came fairly quickly.

    The internet was conceived as an open-ended transport mechanism, with no plans or constraints as to the data being transported, though there were some thoughts about QOS, recognizing that some data had to get there quickly, some reliably, some not particularly either.

    Commercial deployments of anything, not just the internet, generally aren't open-ended. They tend to plan things, up-front, and put just as much thought into billing as they do into the rest of the job. (Ever see how much cell phone plumbing is dedicated to billing, as opposed to merely shuttling customers' data?)

    The best reason for net neutrality is something we haven't done yet, something no company has planned for, and very likely something that would be hindered by default, because it doesn't fit into current plans. (Or can you say, "disruption not desired!"?)

    --
    The living have better things to do than to continue hating the dead.
    1. Re:The best reason for net neutrality... by DaDeacon · · Score: 5, Informative

      I haven't logged in or posted on slash dot in almost two years and your post my very well be the most honest and real argument for true net neutrality. I have worked for big telco and other "real" players in the ISP and networking biz and let me tell you the money is not in the crops but it's in the farm. Bandwidth really isn't an issue it's getting us to pay more to play more, as more people use the net and less people use PBX / phones and what not the telcos just want you to keep paying them $65 a month one way or anther. Cable companies are now in this game as well they have lost monthly reoccurring monies to home dish systems at a rate that no one saw coming. The internet is cash cow everyone wants to milk.

  7. Managed services are a good idea, if... by KonoWatakushi · · Score: 4, Interesting

    Managed services are a good idea, if they are run on top of a neutral network. As long as that physical network is developed by an unbiased entity and resold fairly with no oversubscription, ISPs should be free to carve out as much bandwidth as they can pay for. As demand increases, regardless of content, investment in additional capacity will follow.

    The problem with the existing situation is that as long as the ISPs own the underlying physical network, the "manages services" aren't running on top of the Internet, but rather the Internet is transformed into a "managed service". There is no incentive whatsoever for the ISPs to invest in additional capacity beyond what they require for their own services, so investment in the Internet is dead, and its value for future innovation is lost.

  8. Re:Wait... by careysub · · Score: 3, Insightful

    If you let them, they'll take away a few more of those pesky freedoms or yours, and then have the gall to send you a non-contestable tax bill for their trouble. Wait, so you are arguing that I should have the freedom to have throttled Internet but not the freedom to have the ability to choose unfiltered open Internet? What freedom do I lose when the government-created monopolies are prevented from abusing their monopolies to screw their customers?

    You do not understand the insights of the modern (anti-conservative) right wing and their Tea Party intellectual shock troops. Government is always evil in everything it does and private corporations never do wrong. This revelation frees you from needing to study such boring and old fashioned things as "facts" or "evidence" or to engage in elitist "rational thought".

    --
    Starships were meant to fly, Hands up and touch the sky - Nicky Minaj