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Microsoft Reboots Two Classic PC Games

An anonymous reader writes "Ever since it launched the Xbox, Microsoft has had a fickle relationship with Windows as a gaming platform. On one hand PC gaming is a major driver of hardware and operating system sales, but on the other hand the PC is inherently less secure than the Xbox console, with piracy much more likely to impact sales of a PC title than a console one. Games for Windows Live has been an attempt to bring some of the success of Xbox Live to the PC, and while many games have shipped with support for Games for Windows Live, it hasn't exactly been a favorite of PC gamers. After all these half-hearted efforts, the last thing anyone expected was for Microsoft to announce new PC-only reboots of two classic game franchises, Flight Simulator and Age of Empires. But yesterday it did just that, announcing a massively multiplayer version of Age of Empires and a new Flight Simulator called Flight. The big question is whether Microsoft can make Games For Windows Live relevant in a market where Steam has taken hold, or if it's too late."

22 of 275 comments (clear)

  1. GFWL, no thanks by cbope · · Score: 4, Informative

    As long as it's attached to GFWL, no thanks. GFWL is such a piece of shit I will not have anything to do with games that require it. If you want me to buy your game, do not tie it to GFWL. It is unstable and a huge pain in the ass to deal with. MS should fire the management that came up with it; it does not in any way help Windows as a game platform.

    1. Re:GFWL, no thanks by EvilIdler · · Score: 4, Informative

      To pile up on the hatred: Live accounts will also occasionally expire. Accounts tied to purchases. Fuck MS.

    2. Re:GFWL, no thanks by naz404 · · Score: 3, Informative

      The new version of GFWL can run in offline mode which is a welcome change for those with flaky internet connections. That being said, it's still irritating and its only use is to record GFWL achievements in single player games.

    3. Re:GFWL, no thanks by realityimpaired · · Score: 2, Informative

      Blizzard at least gives you something in return for it... you can chat with friends playing other games. I don't have Starcraft II at all, but I regularly chat with friends playing that game from WoW.

    4. Re:GFWL, no thanks by petermgreen · · Score: 2, Informative

      I don't know what Bioware's up to, but I think Steam is different... since you're buying the game from them and getting it download-only
      IIRC half life 2 (and I think other valve games too) requires you to sign up to steam and activate and your copy through it (and IIRC the activation process involves a forced update to the latest version of the game) even if you bought your game as a boxed copy.

      --
      note: i'm known as plugwash most places but i screwd up registering that here somehow in the past and now can't register
    5. Re:GFWL, no thanks by El_Muerte_TDS · · Score: 2, Informative

      Bioware/EA also offers download only versions of the games. Steam games can also be bough as "normal" retail versions, but still require Steam. When you bought a retail Steam game (like: Just Cause 2, Borderlands, Mafia 2, Half Life 2, etc.) you will have to through the additional hassle to set up an account. For Steam games you also have to log in every time you want to play a game.

      GFWL does have an auto login feature. GFWL doesn't require logging in or being online, it depends on the games. Most GFWL games I played didn't require being online, or to register you product online. You just had to create a GFWL profile (which was only stored on your system). These games are: Gears of War, Fallout 3, Batman: Arkham Asylum. For Fallout 3 you can also get rid of GFWL completely, can be done by simply installing the patch directly from Bethesda.

      But yes, GFWL is quite an POS. It fails to log in often, or takes a long time, sometimes forgets the saved credentials. Installing patches through GFWL are a real PITA. Newer versions of GFWL broke older games, which then needed a patch, a patch you could only install from within the GFWL interface of the running game (chicked-egg, hurray).

    6. Re:GFWL, no thanks by fprintf · · Score: 3, Informative

      Your technical notion of troubleshooting is entirely much more complicated than the consumer/user version of troubleshooting. What you described as "choose a random item from a list" is exactly what MS and any other consumer company label as troubleshooting. Look in the back of many device manuals and you will see a section labeled "troubleshooting" where it gives a description of the problem and a list of things to do/try.

      --
      This post brought to you by your friendly neighborhood MBA.
    7. Re:GFWL, no thanks by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

      I think they fixed that years ago, it was due to the passport account expiring due to over a year of inactivity or similar.

    8. Re:GFWL, no thanks by wjousts · · Score: 2, Informative

      I don't know what Bioware's up to, but I think Steam is different... since you're buying the game from them and getting it download-only,

      Except when you buy the boxed game in the store....and still need a Steam account. That's why I'm not buying the more recent Total War games.

    9. Re:GFWL, no thanks by IndustrialComplex · · Score: 2, Informative

      "You are offline, loading the game anyway, 'cause we love you like that" screen.

      Yeah, glad that works for you.

      For me it's almost always. You are offline, something you did we didn't like so we are treating your game as online only, fuck you.

      And it ALWAYS happens when I'm waiting at the airport and just want to play a few offline, single player games.

      --
      Out of modpoints but really liked a post? 1BDkF6TtmmeZ3yqXbz9yhdYVqRYnwFoXDj
    10. Re:GFWL, no thanks by arth1 · · Score: 4, Informative

      Offline accounts is a nice idea, but the way GFWL has implemented it makes is worse than nothing.
      1: You still need to sign up for a Windows Live account and Microsoft Passport to activate it.
      2: If you save your progress in offline mode, and then log in to online mode, your save progress is unavailable. Even on the same machine.

      I did the big mistake of buying a collection of games on Steam that looked nice: Dirt, Dirt2, Fuel and Grid. Then I discovered that I could play but not save my progress without signing up for an account I didn't want. And would get interrupted every few minutes by a notice saying the servers could not be reached. It turns out that the service doesn't appear to work through NAT if instead of a cheap cone NAT home router, you have full symmetric NAT. In short, the games were a waste of money.

      It's getting ridiculous when in addition to the Steam DRM, you are subjected to Securom (or worse) AND have to enter a CD key to use online AND have to sign up for a Live account. The incentive to download a cracked copy has become rather large, and isn't caused by pirates, but by MBAs who don't seem to understand that making your paying customers jumping through hoops make it more likely that they'll go somewhere else for their fix.

    11. Re:GFWL, no thanks by wolrahnaes · · Score: 4, Informative

      I don't want to run into problems where "Oh crap, I must have started that game while on my sister's account or xbox, looks like all that playtime gets reset if I want to play it on MY account/xbox"

      1. There are no problems moving games between Xboxes.

      2. Saves are locked to their associated gamertag. This is designed to solve the "Oh crap, my brother/sister/parent/dog played on my console and erased my f*cking save!" problem. Just create yourself an XBL Silver gamertag, it takes seconds and is completely free, then all your stuff will be safely partitioned away. The 360 can use a USB drive to save, so even if you don't own a 360 at all you can just put your account and gamertag on any cheap USB drive to easily take it between friends houses.

      Or maybe that's not the problem, I don't know, because everything gets so freaking out of whack if you don't play the games exactly as you were 'supposed' to play them as defined by the service.

      What the fuck are you talking about? Log in to your account, play game any way you feel like.

      I also love how it used to be that if I bought something and hooked it up to my television that it was a household purchase. Now? Looks like I'd have to buy every item for each person in my family if they want to enjoy the same game that I have.

      And that hasn't changed at all. Purchases are tied both to the account and Xbox that they were bought with, so anyone playing on that Xbox can access the content regardless and that user can access it on any Xbox. It's very well implemented and there's an easy transfer tool to reassign the content to a different console in the event of a dead console or buying a new model.

      So no, you're totally wrong if you think you need to buy content once for each person. One console, one purchase, everyone can use it.

      --
      I used to get high on life, but I developed a tolerance. Now I need something stronger.
    12. Re:GFWL, no thanks by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Informative

      Hello, I'm a member of the Games for Windows - LIVE team. Thank you for your comments; I would like to correct some of the statements that you made regarding Offline accounts in GFWL:

      1. You can create an offline account without ever having to create a Microsoft Passport account or sign up for Windows Live, the option is in the GFWL Guide.
      2. This is not how it works. You can sign in with that account in an offline mode (when no internet is available), play your game, get achievements, save progress, and when you sign-in to LIVE (online mode) you are able to progress from where you left off.

      What you may be confusing is that there are 2 types of accounts:
      1. Offline Profile (Local Profile / Offline Only Profile)
      2. Online Profile (LIVE Enabled Profile / Xbox LIVE account)

      But, there are also 2 sign-in states for the Online account (which is where some confusion might come from), just like Xbox LIVE on the Xbox 360
      1. Signed-in Online (connected to LIVE through the internet and able to talk to the LIVE servers for multiplayer etc)
      2. Signed-in Offline (no internet connection is available, but you are still using your profile and can get access to your Downloaded Content, game saves, and achievements).

      You cannot continue progress from an Offline Only Profile and then continue with an Online Profile as they are 2 different accounts. You absolutely can continue progress from an offline to an online state with your LIVE Enabled Profile.

  2. Wow i must be tired by Adambomb · · Score: 3, Informative

    Am I insane or is the woman superimposed on the right hand side of the [weirdly purely flash] Flight site topless with propellers for nipples?

    or both?

    --
    Ice Cream has no bones.
    1. Re:Wow i must be tired by IndustrialComplex · · Score: 2, Informative

      Have they tried increasing the system DPI (Control Panel > Display > Settings > Advanced > General > Display > DPI setting)?

      It works, except when it doesn't, and when it doesn't you have the option of messing with your resolution, or tweaking each program individually (when they don't support it)

      Then you end up with a frankenstein of system settings some of which seem to apply, and then Oh my looks like this program started paying attention to the DPI and is now all wonky.

      It's just easier to use a lower resolution even though adjusting the DPI is the 'correct' way to do it.

      --
      Out of modpoints but really liked a post? 1BDkF6TtmmeZ3yqXbz9yhdYVqRYnwFoXDj
  3. Re:What about Hearts, Freecell and Minesweeper? by dingen · · Score: 4, Informative

    Actually Minesweeper has been part of Windows since it was released in 1990's "Microsoft Entertainment Pack" and Hearts was included in 1992's Windows for Workgroups 3.1 as a demonstration of the "for Workgroups" part of the name.

    So that's 20 years for Minesweeper and 18 years for Hearts. I don't know when Freecell was first released. It was part of win32s, but I can't find out when the first version of that thing shipped.

    --
    Pretty good is actually pretty bad.
  4. Games for Windows by Sockatume · · Score: 5, Informative

    My understanding, based on an editorial in Edge earlier this year, is that GfW just plain flat-out doesn't work. Not in the sense that its limited user base makes for poor multiplayer or that it has insufficient publisher for its downloadable games service, but in the sense that it does not reliably allow you to download games or play online.

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    No kidding!!! What do you say at this point?
  5. Re:AOE MMO by lowlymarine · · Score: 3, Informative
    Wikipedia, apparently:

    A massively multiplayer online game (also called MMO) is a multiplayer video game which is capable of supporting hundreds or thousands of players simultaneously. By necessity, they are played on the Internet, and feature at least one persistent world.

  6. Re:What about Hearts, Freecell and Minesweeper? by Kjella · · Score: 2, Informative

    So that's 20 years for Minesweeper and 18 years for Hearts. I don't know when Freecell was first released. It was part of win32s, but I can't find out when the first version of that thing shipped.

    A little bit of digging shows it was later included in the Entertainment Pack 2 which was released in 1991 according to Microsoft's support lifecycle pages. It could not have been earlier than 1990 since that's when Windows 3.0 came out so 19-20 years old. Since it missed EP1, probably 19. And I can't really believe I bothered to go looking.

    --
    Live today, because you never know what tomorrow brings
  7. Re:AOE MMO by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Informative

    From what I've read, your capital city continues to grow while you're offline. Though unlike games like Travian, you can't be attacked, or otherwise penalised, while offline. So yes, it's persistent.

  8. Re:Games for Windows Live by CronoCloud · · Score: 2, Informative

    The Playstation had 640MB of storage, but you could load like 2MB into RAM at a time... smaller levels, less detail, load time, etc.

    Which is why some PSone games loaded level data on the fly, as needed, as intended. Compare the Spyro games to Mario 64. Some PS2 games do the same thing, ever play EQOA, you'll never see a load screen past boot up unless you directly TP somewhere. You could walk/swim from Fayspires to the Kappa fortress on Odus and never see a single load screen.

  9. Not according to the trailer by dreamchaser · · Score: 2, Informative

    According to the trailer it is persistent.