Teacher Asks Students To Plan a Terrorist Attack

Tired of looking at an endless parade of dioramas, an Australian teacher had her class plan a terrorist attack that would "kill as many innocent Australians as possible." "The teacher, with every best intention, was attempting to have the students think through someone else's eyes about conflict. I think there are better ways to do that. ... This is not what we expect of professional educators," said Sharyn O'Neill, director-general of the state's Department of Education.

Comments

How do you anticipate weak points

[sheddd]

Without thinking like that?

Re:How do you anticipate weak points

[William Robinson]

How do you anticipate weak points without thinking like that?

Yeah Right.

So let's start asking students to come up with some new innovative concepts for 'how to steal laptops', 'how to make a kid blind so he could be used as begger', 'how to rape', 'how to murder somebody and dispose body in acid' and many more.

Seriously, anybody who is trying that on students is out of his mind.

Re:How do you anticipate weak points

[Urza9814]

What about teaching students to hack into computer systems? That's fairly common and fairly well accepted...and in those exercises it's not just a 'think of a way to do this', it's a 'here is a server, here is a PC, go do it'.

Re:How do you anticipate weak points

[Kell Bengal]

And you know what? We should have students thinking about exactly those kinds of things. They would gain more insight into what make some societies dysfunctional. Such instruction would come with discussion of the ethical implications of all those acts - as is the case with any social studies course. Certainly, by thinking about potential threats, what makes a threat credible and what can be done to reduce risks, students learn to cope with a world in which the TSA thinks binary explosives are dangerous but lets any fool take a laptop full of explosive batteries onto a plane.

Re:How do you anticipate weak points

[black3d]

Ah, my high school computer teacher didn't so much teach us how to break into computer systems, as much as challenge us to break into the school computer systems, and then disclose our methods. It was part of their ongoing security auditing and improvements.

It was a lot of fun. Starting with the library computers which had limited internet access and less-than-perfect policy controls. I remember using Netscape Navigator on one machine, to associate command.com as the default application for .wav files, then clicking through to a .wav file to get to a command prompt and wreak havoc. Years later we were breaking into the main school Unix network with ctrl-break's at susceptible points during the execution of scripts with elevated priveleges (which they rapidly fixed as a severe issue). Ahh great times. Alas, I was a mere hobbyist back then, and have trouble actually relating what I was dealing with at the time because I didn't really know... Fun times.

Re:How do you anticipate weak points

[cgenman]

"How do we secure this area from attack?" is not just a question of putting up standard safety procedures. It's about thinking how people would attack, and finding ways of stopping that. On a practical example "How would someone break into your house?" If you wander around it, find the weak points, and figure out how to do it, you can actually fix your security. "Oh, that second floor bathroom window that is always open is near a tree branch. The wood is rotting around this back door glass panel, and could be easily removed." That sort of thing. Even simple stuff, like "How would you attack someone on this street" can be quite useful. "Oh, there is a dark alley there, I'll walk in the street at that point. We need more lights at the park entrance. Let's keep people from parking at this spot, as it obscures the view of the corner."

If we don't get kids thinking realistically about how one could attack, they're never going to be able to anticipate and defend against real threats as adults. They'll just be standing around looking like fools when someone thinks to make bombs out of shoes, or drive a boat into the levees at New Orleans, etc. Or they'll live in fear of perceived dangers, which have little chance of turning into something real.

Re:How do you anticipate weak points

[niftydude]

Hell - if you are not allowed to think like that, then how do you even write the next season of 24?
The assignment would have covered such a large range of critical and creative thinking skills - it really seems to me like a good idea. I can't ever remember seeing a school project or assignment that would exercise such a large range of skills in one go.

And for the people who find thinking about it "extremely offensive" - all I can say is: harden up - terrorism in one form or another has existed throughout history, and it won't go away just because you choose to ignore it.

Re:How do you anticipate weak points

[txoof]

Not only does this kind of thinking teach preparedness, but it opens up discussions. This would be an amazing opportunity to talk about what terrorism is, why it happens and who is involved. Students that understand the whole package are less likely to lash out at minority groups and deal with future terrorism more sanely. That being said, As a teacher, I would definitely write a carefully worded curriculum plan and be ready to defend it. It wouldn't hurt to have the department head on my side either. People tend to freak out whenever teachers try something new...

Re:How do you anticipate weak points

[mjwx]

Without thinking like that?

Every armed force in the western world operates an OPFOR type organisation for just this purpose. Often using tactics, vehicles and equipment expected to be used by foreign aggressors (I.E. a lot of Ex-Soviet and old US equipment that got sold on). Sometimes up to the point where a foreign allied force is acting as OPFOR.

As an Australian, I dont see what is wrong here. Frankly we could use more of this kind of out of the box thinking in the glorified day care system that is education. But unfortunately the NIMBY's wont have a bar of it.

Re:How do you anticipate weak points

[Lumbre]

If we don't get kids thinking realistically about how one could attack, they're never going to be able to anticipate and defend against real threats as adults.

To me, this sounds like a professor asking students to hack a computer.

It's a learning process to learn the safeguards of what to do to provide computer security. There will always be a subset that use the knowledge maliciously.

There are also home-grown hackers (like there are home-schooled children), so I wouldn't blame the schools. I'd blame the person's character.

I think it's all right if the children (year 10 .. think high school) are mentally prepared for a hypothetical and critical thinking. We do, of course, offer violent video games to teens in the U.S. Don't think just because they are rated 'Teen' or 'Mature' they don't make it into the hands of younger children.

Re:How do you anticipate weak points

[Aeternitas827]

That being said, As a teacher, I would definitely write a carefully worded curriculum plan and be ready to defend it. It wouldn't hurt to have the department head on my side either.

That, to me, is essentially what this boils down to, is how the assignment was introduced to the class. The same goal here could have been achieved with a scenario along the lines of, 'You're in charge of a city (instead of a terrorist cell); where is it vulnerable, where would be most likely to be attacked if the goal is maximum casualties, (and add) what steps could be taken to mitigate such an event?'

The end result, that way, is almost the same; the students have to think critically, and ultimately would be charged with the same thing--think like an attacker--but with the exact opposite spin. Presented that way, there likely would have been some resistance, but continuing the assignment would be much more justifiable.

Re:How do you anticipate weak points

[_KiTA_]

No, it's more like let "the authorities" think about it.

The only thing that will come of able bodied, intelligent students thinking about flaws in the system is able bodied, intelligent students realizing that the system is flawed.

Which is bad, from the POV of someone who knows there are flaws, but keeps his/her job by making sure the general public is too stupid to realize / too fat to care.

Re:How do you anticipate weak points

[Kelbear]

That's a silly argument. A single student in the class turning into an attacker invalidates the educational process?

Shit, I'm sure some TV shows or movies have been used as a reason for violence, but I don't think we should ban TV or movies.

I definitely believe there is indeed an acceptable casualty rate for certain freedoms.

Look, even in middle-school, pre-911, without being asked. I had worked out that with enough savings, I could take a knife, stab random strangers and ride across America on an unstoppable pattern-less killing spree. This strategy still rings true in the age of terrorism. This doesn't happen because I'm not a batshit crazy murderer, not because anybody can stop me, or because I didn't think about it.

If the teacher was advocating terrorism, then there is a problem, but just trying to get kids to think and gain perspective is a worthwhile cause (Even if he probably could have accomplished it with a less inflammatory method).

Re:How do you anticipate weak points

[Anonymous Coward]

Did you even know that martial arts are exactly what you would say causing violence and social disorder?

Every martial arts students learns how to attack, but they are teached to not attack but to defend themselfs. If they do not know how to attack, they can not defend.

Example from Karate, it is only for defence, never for attack. You continue defend youself as long as the other can just stand. The idea is to use the attacker own force and actions against itself. It takes longer than do a counter-attack or attack directly but it is effective.
With Bruce Lee's "Intercepting Fist" (idea in Jeet Kune Do) the idea is what it says. Before enemy even attacks, you intercept the attack. All by knowing the ways of attacking.

The wrong way is to teach that the violance is answer for your problems. And that is as well about movies, they teach that violance is accepted answer for problems. And the fact really is that young peoples brains has not developed enough to understand so complex philosophies and the chicken-egg / action-re-action questions. They can not find out the purposes what is behind the story or what history books are not telling.

And even that there would come a ONE student who turns to be a person who wants violance and start planning and executing somethings, there is the rest of the class who know how to defend against him and think like him. Btw, terrorist is not a single person or group of persons. Only king/government can be a terrorist. The meaning what media now call "terrorists" is twisted version to hide the true actions of the government to have a control over own citizens.

Re:How do you anticipate weak points

[lxs]

You can't go looking through the eyes of THE EMEMY. Before you know it you will recognise the humanity in THE ENEMY and suddenly bombing his family and stealing his recources will start to feel wrong. Can't have that now can we?

Re:How do you anticipate weak points

[Hognoxious]

At some point you are overexposing a younger mind to violence and social disorder.

These are Australians, they're genetically predisposed towards those kind of things anyway.

Re:How do you anticipate weak points

[somersault]

First, I'm pretty sure a student who turns into an attacker doesn't need their teacher to tell them to think about how to attack.

Playing devil's advocate - this student may be too dumb to figure out a decent method of attack, and a much smarter kid or group of kids could provide him with a great plan.

Re:How do you anticipate weak points

[sourcerror]

Haven't you heard, Big Brother loves you?

Re:How do you anticipate weak points

[Jesus_666]

German students are exposed to violence and social disorder. German history class is 50% "German history between 1928 and 1945", under the premise that teaching the students about the inhumane cruelty of the Nazi regime will keep them from repeating these mistakes. There's some really gruesome stuff in there, especially when you get to the concentration camps. Mind you, this is not the same as showing them gory depictions of artillery shell victims. It's perfectly possible to teach someone about gruesome matters in school without sinking to the level of a B-movie.

Having gone through that, I not only know how to effectively gas people but also the basics of how to take over a poverty-stricken country and about the logistics of efficient genocide. Those are the side effects of having learned about the rise and fall of the Nazis - and the "how to take over a poor country" thing is in there explicitly so we can identify and potentially do something about people using similar tactics (and to prevent these tactics from becoming applicable in the first place).

Now, if the school teaches you how to build a bomb you know how to tell that someone is building a bomb and you can tell that not everything with wiring and batteries is an explosive device. You don't become more dangerous, usually, because at least all male teenagers I knew back when I was one were perfectly aware of how to construct a pipe bomb and many also knew how to improvise a somewhat functional fuel-air explosive using flour. We knew that because things going "boom" are naturally interesting to teenaged males and because it was trivial to find out how they work even back then. (And no, none of this was covered in school.) Granted, most girls probably wouldn't look into explosives on their own but I'd expect the deranged ones to do so.

Nowadays I wouldn't expect anyone with a serious intent to do harm to pick up his knowledge in school. Wikipedia can already tell you a lot and a Wikipedia session followed by half an hour of googling will give you everything you need to build an effective bomb. The schools are not imparting any new knowledge to those who already wish to kill someone.

Likewise, it's fairly easy to learn about effective bomb placement by reading/watching reports about terrorist attacks. Comments like "the terrorists did X wrong, otherwise the explosion would have been much more severe" aren't exactly rare. And given how a lot of amok runners spend quite a bit of time preparing for their run and tend to have a fascination with thiese things it's prefectly reasonable to assume that they will inform themselves about how to go about their business.


Unless American minds are extremely fragile, I'd say that teaching them about how terrorism works is unlikely to scar them. And teaching them about the methods of terrorism is unlikely to make them much more dangerous than they already are.

Re:How do you anticipate weak points

[Hognoxious]

If you had read TFA, the aim is to "kill as many innocent Australians as possible.",

Yes, as part of a hypothetical, theoretical scenario.

It would hardly be realistic in context if the aim was maximizing the number of yummy cakes eaten, would it?

Re:How do you anticipate weak points

[stonewallred]

When I was in the 7th grade, I was learning advanced infantry techniques, how to set an ambush, how to field improvise explosives and booby traps, and how to wreak havoc on supply chains and supply dumps. We also learned how to eat bugs, and survive with very minimal equipment and supplies. I kid you not, our instructor was named Sgt.Doom, and he was a Ranger with extensive time spent in Vietnam, along with other "unnamed" ugly places (his way of reference, not mine). He also taught us ways to silently kill or incapacitate sentries and other targets, how to carry weapons not concealed per se, but unobtrusively and other exotic tricks. Surprisingly, only a few of us students ended up in prison. Out of my class of 40 or so, only 8 of us ended up as wards of the state prison system. They ended up retiring him not long after I got out of school.

Re:How do you anticipate weak points

[thej1nx]

"It's about thinking why people would attack, and finding ways of stopping that."

There. Fixed it for you. You wouldn`t happen to be working for US foreign policy department by any chance, would you? Would explain a lot of things.

Re:How do you anticipate weak points

[stdarg]

why we don't see destruction on that scale regularly if it would be easy.

The rational answer is of course that terrorists aren't such a great threat as they're made out to be.

That's rational based on the assumptions of the assignment. The danger with teaching this lesson to children is that they may not see the flaws in the assignment itself, and the teacher didn't seem likely to point them out either. For instance, in reality, terrorist hopefuls don't have easy access to military grade chemical weapons. A big way domestic terrorists are caught is when they start networking with other terrorists to get supplies of advanced weapons (not homemade fertilizer bombs). It's probably also a huge barrier to entry. If everybody just automatically had WMDs, then you probably *would* see destruction on that scale regularly.

Another big flaw is that the assignment presumes motivation on the students' behalf. It doesn't ever ask, how would you *become* convinced that you need to make a terrorist attack to make a political statement. It just says, you *are* convinced, so how would you do it. Is that realistic?

The lesson learned after asking those questions is about how to fight terrorism. The answer isn't "don't worry about it" as you imply. It's "we need to watch people who seem motivated, such as religious extremists, before they take the first physical step to an attack" and "if we miss that, we need to catch them at the networking/supplying stage where they are most exposed" and "people like me probably won't be terrorists because we lack the motivation, and it's actually quite difficult to acquire that motivation without some obvious signs, so we need to watch 'others'."

Re:How do you anticipate weak points

[Minwee]

Surprisingly, only a few of us students ended up in prison. Out of my class of 40 or so, only 8 of us ended up as wards of the state prison system.

20% of your 7th grade class wound up in prison, and this was surprisingly low? Unless you were already in Juvie, I'll rather not see the rest of your school.

Re:How do you anticipate weak points

[Abstrackt]

Didn't britian found austrailia to get rid of it's terrorists?

Britain only claimed the eastern half, and not just terrorists ended up there.

Oh, right, I'm on Slashdot, what I meant to say was "whoosh".

Re:How do you anticipate weak points

[anegg]

Year 10 students would be about 16 years old, I believe. This is a fairly fluid time for many people in terms of morals and social consciousness.

Depending on the context in which such an assignment was issued, there could be a lot of value in it. Examining a potential threat by planning an attack yourself is an excellent way in which to uncover vulnerabilities, especially vulnerabilities that exist due to invalid assumptions. Its too bad we didn't do this prior to 9/11 when we might have realized that the assumption that hijackers wanted to survive the hijacking was no longer valid. This is something that adults should be doing, but also one in which students may have a more "fresh" and unassuming state of mind that could prove useful in uncovering those unwarranted assumptions.

However, having 16 year olds do this in a context that doesn't also examine why it wouldn't be right to make such an attack would be unacceptable to me. Its likely that the review would uncover lots of situations where causing mass mayhem is fairly easy, especially if the perpetrator/perpetrators doesn't/don't mind being caught. The fact that such attacks aren't made more often is probably related more to our basic social contracts than anything else. To cover this well with the age range in question would be difficult, and to fail to cover it well could possibly be disastrous, if only on a small scale (think Columbine).

I started off this response ready to argue against censorship and in favor of free thinking everywhere, but I find I must put some constraints on my thoughts. Interesting.

Re:How do you anticipate weak points

[GameboyRMH]

Wish I could have done that in place of gym class :D

By other "unnamed" ugly places, do you think Sgt. Doom might have meant Mars or Phobos? :P

Funny story, once when I was a little kid I climbed up some weird thing in a school gymnasium (it was like a box made of ladders with two sides missing). I guess nobody saw where I went until I was on top of it. I was looking way down at my teachers who were freaking out, I don't remember how tall it was but it felt like I was waaaaay up there. I was totally calm until my teachers started yelling at me. I just didn't see what the big deal was that everyone wanted me to come down so badly.

Re:How do you anticipate weak points

[vxice]

Actually not thinking about terrorism WILL make it go away. Hundreds fold more people have died on our freeway in the last year than from terrorism. The costs of the attempted attacks are low but extremely unlikely to succeed even marginally let alone spectacularly. We don't declare war on cars ban them from our roads and attack entirely unrelated devices in response to the holocaust brought about by the mechanical menace. We don't place severe restrictions on their movement that in the end do little to protect us. Our insistence on being scared shit less every time a shadow moves has hurt us more than the terrorists could hope for. We are hurting our selves with our insane behavior and belief that we can completely stamp out terrorism and anything that moves us towards that is good no matter how much it overall actually hurts us. Privacy, safety from the government, freedom of movement and religion are all friendly fire casualties. While the government can and has taped your phone line and records with out warrant, created laws that would through bureaucratic process loose your citizenship because the government says you might be a terrorist(without trial of course) hell your lawyer even has to ask permission from the government to argue with them the case that killing alleged terrorists is unconstitutional because they say you are a specially designated international terrorist. Quit scaring the children so they can sleep at night, the terrorists are out to get you but there are many well qualified people doing a good job trying to protect you but they keep quite about it so that you don't loose sleep about it and the terrorists don't get free airtime Fox might as well be a terrorist organization for its frequent mention of potential attacks everytime something happens. OMG was it terrorists we don't know more about the terrorist angle with us to discuss terror expert but if he were an actual terrorist we wouldn't sell them airtime... You are more likely to die from thousands of other much more easily prevented causes where no where near as much effort is being put.

Re:How do you anticipate weak points

[DavidTC]

Dumb people cannot do smart things, even if told in general terms how.

Look at that Times Square bombing idiot. Generally, that was a reasonable plan.

But, as he is a total moron, it didn't work at all. He didn't bother to find out exactly how to explode propane tanks, he locked his keys in the car, he waited far far too long to blow the thing up, the guy he bought from remembered him, etc.

Dumb people can do smart things if someone actually plans out every step, and they practice and drill, but that generally would not happen as part of a hypothetical.

so...

[santax]

What do they expect? I expect from teachers to be teaching the ability to learn. No matter how touchy this subject is for some people, this isn't something that should be punished. Hell, read the wikileaks of the CIA message today... They are doing the exact same thing!

Re:so...

[Fluffeh]

What do they expect? I expect from teachers to be teaching the ability to learn. No matter how touchy this subject is for some people, this isn't something that should be punished. Hell, read the wikileaks of the CIA message today... They are doing the exact same thing!

Yes, but the CIA pretend they don't do that sort of stuff. Given how stupid and paranoid most people are, I can see how they want to crucify the teacher. I wouldn't have an issue with that sort of lesson, but at the same time, it might not be overly appropriate. The teacher was a year 10 teacher (that means the students are around 15) and thinking about it, that allows kids to watch just about any movie or play any game released in Australia. I don't see how it is a gross stepping over a "maturity level" line in the sand.

Especially given some of the recent curriculum around how early Australians treated indigenous Aboriginals and the content taught there, this isn't out of line with expected maturity levels of our children. If they are old enough to be expected to understand that, I fail to see how an assignment like this is stepping over a line to ensure that they have actually understood their classes.

FTFA: "There is a difference between being a terrorist and learning about terrorism." - quote from Student in the class who got this assignment.
To me, that simply means that all her class work went in one ear and out the other. Total head buried in the sand mentality if you ask me.

FTFA: "Brian Deegan, whose son, Josh, was killed in the 2002 Bali bombings, said the reality of terror plots at home in Australia is exactly why students should learn about terrorism in school. He said the teacher could have been on to a good idea if the end result of her lesson was to extract feelings of regret and sympathy for the victims of their fictional massacre."
Couldn't agree more with this guy. It's good to see that at least some of us Aussies still have common sense and are able to get past all the media frenzy that anything to do with words like "terrorism" or "war on [insert topic]" seem to stir up.

Re:so...

[scotty.m]

Exactly. So? This is a nothing issue, parents should never have complained, media should never have published it. I do understand people want to protect their children from sensitive issues, but this real life. Terrorism is real - not learning about the issue will turn impressionable kids into naive adults.

Re:so...

[Kell Bengal]

FTFA: "There is a difference between being a terrorist and learning about terrorism." - quote from Student in the class who got this assignment. To me, that simply means that all her class work went in one ear and out the other. Total head buried in the sand mentality if you ask me.

Can you please explain why you feel this statement suggest the student hasn't grasped the substance of the lesson? It sounds to me like the student is quite correct: knowing about terrorism doesn't mean you're going to commit acts of terror anymore than knowing about WWII means you're going to invade Poland.

Re:so...

[wvmarle]

OP is quite right: student obviously missed most of the lesson.

Terrorism has a few faces that can be taught about, including why people commit these acts, how they are committed, what we can do to prevent such attacks (acting on both the how and why questions), and the result of attacks.

Seriously thinking about how they are committed (from the linked article: "The task included choosing the best time to attack and explaining their choice of victims") can give great insight ways to mitigate such attacks, and dealing with them if they occur. Coming up with a terrorist attack plan is doing just that, it makes one think about how an attack could be done. It makes you look at it from the other side.

I know it can be challenging for a 15yo to actually go deeper in matter than the face value of what the teacher produces. It's out of their comfort zones. And if this student thinks that learning about terrorism (which imho should include THINKING about it) makes you a terrorist, then indeed he missed the point entirely. Stepping into the mind of a terrorist is a very good way to think about the matter, and if that student thinks that merely thinking about terrorist attacks, how they were done, how they could be done, and why they are done, makes him a terrorist then this student himself might need some urgent counseling to stop his terrorist tendencies.

And about WW2: in my history lessons I have learned quite a bit about tactics used, particularly related to the invasion of The Netherlands (my home country). About how the Jews were deported and killed. Why this was done too. How the Dutch helped rounding up the Jews. it doesn't make me a crazy statesman like Hitler at all, on the contrary even. The same for such a lesson on terrorism: it won't make children into terrorists.

Re:so...

[TapeCutter]

It's good to see someone actually spoke to Brian Deegan, his story was being misused by the media to suggest he was angered and offended by the assignment.

Also that type of assignment is nothing new, especially in forensic science classes. When my daughter was attending HS in Oz (over a decade ago) she came home with an assignment to plot the perfect kidnapping/ransom crime. The teacher then selected several of these plots and the new class assignment was to use forensic methods to cath the fictional kidnapper. The upshot was that her teacher and I learnt that my daughter had a promising career as either a forensic scientist or a master criminal.

Most of her classmates also loved forensics, IMHO it's an entertaining and engaging way to teach science and critical thinking, which btw is the very thing that is lacking in the tabloid reporting of this story.

Re:so...

[zarzu]

"I was shocked and quite offended," she said. "I'm offended that it's Australia but I'm disgusted because it doesn't matter where it is, it's still not something you ask someone to do or think about. ... There is a difference between being a terrorist and learning about terrorism."

that is the original quote from the student. the problem is that she actually implies that thinking like a terrorist makes you a terrorist which is why this sentence is actually against the assignment. of course if this sentence were just standing there alone, any reasonable person would be thinking otherwise because clearly thinking like a terrorist does in no way make you one and this student did miss most of the lesson. just like everyone else who is outraged.

Re:so...

[zarzu]

only in the context of her answer. she is arguing against the assignment as you can clearly see (shocked, offended, blabla). the over and over quoted phrase from her point of view means that there is a difference between learning about terrorism (your teacher tells you what it's all about, why it happens, where it happened, etc) and being a terrorist (planning a terrorist attack). she equates the planning of a terrorist attack (thinking like a terrorist) with being a terrorist. now if you don't agree you're quite welcome to explain how she means with the last sentence, in context of her previous outrage of course.

It was a TRAP!!

[oldhack]

You stupid tiny anklebiters!

Ship the little shits over to GitMo.

Re:It was a TRAP!!

[MobileTatsu-NJG]

You stupid tiny anklebiters!

Ship the little shits over to GitMo.

One man's 'flamebait' is another man's 'brilliant satire'.

answers

[A3gis]

Heh, i can't help but bet half the answers went along the lines of: "take 4 hostages, put them in the upstairs office inside a warehouse, then wait at strategic points covering the roller door, back door, and ceiling air duct for Counter Terrorist forces."

Sounds like a good exercise

[johnhp]

If nothing else, it may make the children more aware of the possibilities regarding terrorism.

For best effect, they should do it a few times with different criteria. For example they could plan a scenario for ten men, and another for three. Or they could form plans about how to best disrupt commerce, or affect public opinion, etc.

Best of all would be for them to write origin and outcome stories for their scenarios that are based on real world conflicts. The students could get some interesting insight by taking a look at WHY a terrorist makes an attack, and by exploring the outcome.

Re:Sounds like a good exercise

[joocemann]

I would imagine it served to illustrate the truth about terrorism and the farce of what is claimed to be successes in the supposed 'war' against it. Most people either have a working knowledge, or immediate/easily-found access, to various approaches to the harm/killing of large numbers of people; they just don't know it until they try to think in that mode. I'm sure most people reading this article, or my post, may be inspired to also brainstorm --- and thus uncover the obvious: it is very easy to kill lots of people and terrorize.

I think the main barrier to terrorism isn't the ways by which it can happen, but rather the incapacity of most people to actually do it.

It's a shame that some groups of people are left with no other options (some cases), and other groups of people are deceived/manipulated by their faith (other cases), to use terrorism. But its also a shame to carry out multi-billion dollar war efforts against only a fraction of all terrorists, and then continue barking out faux success stories through accomplice and complicit media, as if they are in any way based in reality; the truth being that we've done almost nothing that will truly protect us and while having barely dented the numbers of those in that fraction, we have enraged easily influenced youth to replenish the ranks.

 

Re:Sounds like a good exercise

[joocemann]

The PLO/PLFF/etc have faced Israel in exactly that sense with Israel basically destroying palestinians in exchange. And yet some palestinians still foster enough hate to continue.

Scorched earth won't solve terrorism. Terrorism has little to do with any specific group, purpose, or culture. Terrorism is a means by which a small group or individual can garner attention and fear for some purpose.

The point being that 'some purpose' could be anything. DC Sniper. Red Brigades. IRA. Militant Islam.

Hell, the owner of LEGO could wipe out hundreds in some easily brainstormed plot --- like driving a large bus into a Linkin Park concert crowd at 120mph -- and then make an announcement that he wants us all to say we love his LEGOs.

Terror. Terror-ism.

And if you desire a world that has any sense of freedom, even far less than we enjoy now --- terrorism will not be defeated in any serious sense. Given the risks, such that I'd more likely die from a car accident, or eating meat, or food poisoning --- I say lets keep the freedom going and take basic precaution to known threats.

Re:Sounds like a good exercise

[LongearedBat]

Gorillas are quite peaceful. They like to eat leaves in misty mountains.
Guerrillas, on the other hand, are humans who fight in small skirmishes.

Also, I disagree.

You only win a war when you convince your enemy to stop fighting,
whether due to exhaustion, lack of ability, or lack of incentive.

The ultimate victory is not to wipe out your enemy. That’s usually very costly, extremely difficult and can earn you more enemies. (In fact, these are the very reasons why terrorist attacks are counter productive, in that they generate more animosity.)
The ultimate victory is to turn your enemy into your friend. That usually costs less, is still difficult, but you earn respect from everyone, and you gain a willing ally.

Having said that, finding a way to make peace can be very difficult. And that’s exactly why situations such as the current floods in northern Pakistan are so important politically, as they give an opportunity for people to show that they want to be friends. If the Taliban hinders foreign aid, then the people will more likely prefer to help friendly foreigners rather than disruptive Taliban, if they can.

Re:Sounds like a good exercise

[Anonymous Coward]

This reminds me of over a decade ago, when the "anthrax letters" were circulating through the post office addressed to congress critters.

At the time I was taking a network plus course at the local community college, and commented to the teacher that the terrorists were not actually trying to kill congress critters, or were woefully incompetent. When asked why I felt that way, I pointed out the following things:

1) Weapons grade anthrax is difficult to procure. VERY difficult to procure. Especially in the quantities that were being transmitted through the post mail service.
2) Everyone and his brother knows that congress critters do not answer their own mail.

Taken together, it would mean that the terrorists were savvy enough to either steal a shitpile of weapons grade anthrax from a government weapons facility ( a pretty awesome feat)-- or were savvy enough to culture it themselves without killing everyone in their cell (another awesome feat), but were somehow too stupid to plan an actually effective delivery technique. This does not follow. It is more likely that the actual intent was to cause national panic over a compromised postal system, or that the "attack" was a ruse designed to distract attention from some other issue, but the latter is fairly deep into the tinfoil hat domain.

I further added that if *I* had been the terrorist, I would have delivered the weapons grade anthrax directly to the house and senate in the following manner:

Hijack a fully loaded Krispy Kreme doughnut truck, and steal the driver's clothes and clipboard, then impersonate him.
Liberally spike all the powdered sugar doughnuts it (the truck) is carrying.
Drive up to the house and senate buildings, and "Deliver" a "Complimentary free sample" (on behalf of Krispy Kreme, in recognition of the work that they do for our country) to the congress and senate cloak rooms, complete with forged delivery confirmation paperwork. (bonus if you have hacked the delivery schedule database to confirm the delivery in advance. Afterall, this is a terror cell sophisticated enough to secretly heist weapons grade anthrax in the first place.)
Drive away, knowing you will have gotten a surprisingly large portion of both legislative bodies directly exposed to GI anthrax.

Needless to say, this line of thinking shocked my instructor sufficiently that she asked me to not talk about it any further, and completely dropped the subject.

Personally, I thought it was an excellent way to frame the current political situation, and evaluate what was happening around me at the time. The prevailing theories being circulated by the mainstream press did not seem to hold up well under critical review, and motive was, to my knowledge, never fully disclosed. To me, the fact that I could concoct a superior delivery plan on the spot than the one utilized by the terrorists was reason enough to doubt that attacking congress critters was the actual intention. If their plan was to sow seeds of disruption and intrigue, then their plan worked perfectly. The question then, is why they would go through all the trouble of procuring actual anthrax, just to cause a sensationalist media firestorm, when the mere suggestion of anthrax would have been equally sufficient, and also what they stood to gain from creating this media blitz in the first place.

Having more people think about that situation in the critical light that I did back then, would have instigated a more meaningful investigation by the mainstream press, and would have neutered much of the shock and awe value of the event in question, instead fostering useful, and rational inquiry.

Personally, I think this teacher is on the right track here.

Re:Sounds like a good exercise

[silentcoder]

Scorched earth worked to end the Guerilla phase of the anglo boer war.

The price was the slow death by disease and starvation of 27 000 women and children...

But that wasn't terrorism, it was guerilla tactics in a formally declared war used by the invaded nation as a defense against the invaders.

When you're dealing with actual terrorists - no it doesn't work. It worked because the Boers had lost a LOT but not everything - it worked because surrender meant saving the ones still alive.

If you try to leave guerillas with nothing "to fight for" what you actually do is leave them with "nothing to lose" - every civilian you kill in a country means 5 formerly moderate family members signing up at the nearest training camp.
In fact I think you'll find scorched earth policies is the best possible way to make a LOT more terrorists. When you make people feel that they are fighting a genuinely just war against a cruel and murderous nation - you remove all the moral blocks that stop people like you and me from using bombs to get our way. You remove the family ties that make us reconsider.
Most of us won't risk our families suffer for our believes. But when we've already lost them - avenging them can become all we still care about.

Scorched earth policies only work when you're fighting a properly declared war against a force using guerilla tactics against soldiers. It doesn't work against terrorist who target civilians as a matter of course.

Not to mention there is the whole Geneva convention and such you know...

It's easy to say scorched earth when you belong to a powerful nation. What if you were born in one of the smaller, oppressed nations - and some insane people in your country planted a bomb on the soil of a powerful one they have a grudge against ? Hell Timothy Mcveigh is your own piece of proof that terrorists targeting their own people is not unusual - rationality doesn't enter into it by definition.

So after Mad Mickey plants his bomb, the powerful nation comes and levels your city with misiles, shoots at your children in school busses, their misiles "accidently" hit your schools and hospitals and their soldiers push you around on the streets, rape your mother who was innocently imprisoned because she has alzheimers and walks with a cane and couldn't make it home before curfew because she got disoriented and lost.
You lose your job because their actions have destroyed your economy and the few family members you have left are struggling and starving and you remember that things were better before they show up.

Do you say "It's all Mad Micky's fault- let's find him and his cohorts and hand them over so it will end" ?
Or do you say "Mad Mickey was right all along - these bastards deserve to die for what they do, deserve to suffer as they made us suffer. As we suffer for the crimes of one, so they all should suffer for the crimes of a few of the soldiers. We don't have an army that can beat them in open combat, but we can plant bombs like Mad Mickey did, we can use suicide attacks to get in among them. They killed our women and children - we can kill theirs... we may not be able to win back our homeland, or win a war - but we can make them feel a little bit of the suffering they have made us feel."

Honestly ? Do you think you wouldn't choose the second option ? Even if you say so - you do realize that almost every person alive WOULD take it.

You're using scorched earth tactics NOW. All it does is make MORE enemies who have LESS to loose.

Re:Sounds like a good exercise

[blackest_k]

One of the first things declared in the constitution of the United States is all men are created equal and have freedom of religion.

By tearing away at these fundamental rights, you tear away at the foundation on which America is built.

Terrorists are not destroying America , misguided patriotic Americans are.

 

Terrorist lego

[Anonymous Coward]

Where can I acquire those terrorist legos? That just inspired me to get out my blackcats and m80s and recreate the twin tower scenerio, but now with a New York terrorist street battle.

Re:Terrorist lego

[Kell Bengal]

Brick Arms

You're welcome.

Wonderful idea

[toQDuj]

There should be no taboo on thinking thoughts.

Also, this will definitely get the attention of the class, as opposed to all the "nice thought" problems that are chucked their way.

Re:Wonderful idea

[sumdumass]

I don't think this is a taboo on thinking as much as it's a taboo on getting others to think something specific.

Children are a special part of society that do not carry the same rights and full blown adults. In most cases, children committing crimes aren't even charged with anything close to resembling the same punishment as adults. The reasoning for this is because the Child's mind is still developing and they are literally handicapped when compared to an adult. This reason is the basis in why children are restricted from entering into most contracts, why having sex with them is generally forbidden, why there is a certain age before being allowed to drink or drive or both, and so on.

Instructing children to create these scenarios is not a good idea as they aren't really capable of the context necessary to fully comprehend the results or the ramifications from the results. what makes it even more disturbing is that the parental supervision, be it from school, from home, or any other organization which maintains control over the child, is most likely not capable of ascertaining when this presents a problem that could carry over to a life threatening situation.

Pushing adaults to think about this is one thing, pushing children to do it is just a little different. I'm not saying they should never think about it, but when the assignment is a terrorist attack, and the real life consequences can be serious bodily harm including death, a great deal of caution needs to be taken into consideration too.

Re:Wonderful idea

[toQDuj]

I beg to differ with your point. I think this is an excellent exercise in figuring out the consequences of one's actions. Indeed, I think this was the purpose of the exercise. Planning a strategy from beginning to end, and predicting the outcome of certain events will surely reinforce the causality training. They will understand the ramifications of what they are planning, because that is the exercise.

Given that the kids were 15, as mentioned above, their sense of morality should already be quite well developed. Therefore I do not expect them to have any doubt in their minds as to what they are planning or thinking about is good or "evil". I actually think this forced thinking about such planning will enable them later on in life to make clearer distinctions between both. In other words, how do you know something is bad if you have not given it serious thought? Apart from the clearest examples (like killing as many innocents as possible), in many cases it is hard to see whether a certain plan has negative or positive consequences.

As for your last point, I think the distinction between adult and children is a little too black-and-white. As soon as you think of yourself as an "adult", you will stop learning from life because you think you (should) already know. That is why you learn when you are young, before you make preconceptions and assume your way into adulthood. I forgot who said it, but this is very applicable: "Stay young, stay foolish".

Finally, hindering thought on the matter will only make kids want to do it more. Supervised thought is better than hindering thought.

Re:Wonderful idea

[NeutronCowboy]

And magically, on their 18th birthday, children suddenly become endowed with the wisdom of adults, and the ability to properly process such thoughts.

Horseshit. You teach kids in a supervised environment, and discuss with them their trains of thought. Early. That is the only way that on their 18th birthday, they aren't as handicapped as they were at 17, 16 or even 12.

This teacher should be marked Troll

[Anonymous Coward]

"The teacher, with every best intention, was attempting to have the students think through someone else's eyes about conflict. I think there are better ways to do that. ... This is not what we expect of professional educators", said Sharyn O'Neill, director-general of the state's Department of Education.

Funny thing is, if I was a teacher, that is EXACTLY the type of assignment that I would give to students, because it will help them to THINK: analyze, empathize, question, ...

When I was in school I would often take the most controversial subject that I could think of, and something that I had strong opinions about, and take the opposite point of view and write an essay about it. It was an amazing learning process.

One of the reasons why I have never EVER considered getting into teaching is because I realized that schools aren't so much about learning as about teaching people to think like everybody else.

Re:This teacher should be marked Troll

[deniable]

Split them into two teams and have one try to defend against the threats, then have them swap. It would give a balanced view and require some thought. I'm sure the 'intelligence' ops around it would also prove interesting. "The terrorist cell was meeting behind the bike racks, so we infiltrated and bribed them for information with a couple of smokes."

Re:This teacher should be marked Troll

[SakuraDreams]

Funny thing is, if I was a teacher, that is EXACTLY the type of assignment that I would give to students, because it will help them to THINK: analyze, empathize, question, ...

Empathise with the guys planning to kill as many civilians as possible? They could look at the political reasons behind terrorism but to look at the planning of the tactical operation does not seem to add much but condone on some level the killing of innocent people.

Re:This teacher should be marked Troll

[stdarg]

It would also be interesting to not tell the students who is who. Just tell each one which team he is on. The teams have to find each other.

I'm tired of this...

[Superdarion]

Are we really that easily influenced? I mean, think-of-the-children-people are so affraid that if the kids watch a violent movie, play a violent videogame, listen to violent music and, in general, have any contact whatsoever with violent behavior, even if it's only in the theoretical level, they'll turn into killing machines who beat their wives and rape their children.

Does "thinking like the enemy" really make you the enemy? Are we really so easily modeled that we need to shield our children from being in contact with any type of non-optimal behavior (whatever that is) so that they can be molded into model citizens?

I know this is just anecdotal, but I have had contact with lots of violence, both in paper as in reality, and I have never been violent a single time in my life. I often think about terrorism as an empathy exercise and it doesn't mean I'm actually planning to do it.

Think like the enemy is a good way to empathize. The enemy is made of people, just like us, and just like us they have their issues and problems that drive them to terrorism. Is it really that terrible that a teacher is trying to teach the students about other cultures? Hell, try to think like a suicide bomber. That's a good empathy exercise.

Understanding terrorists might prove to be the only way to stop them.

Re:I'm tired of this...

[cduffy]

It was more or less a military exercise in how to kill people which is disturbing considering the targets were innocent civilians and the desired outcome was to force an entity entirely different to adopt some political line.

These are good reasons to think about such attacks; what vulnerabilities they would use, how to defend against them, the cost/benefit analysis of such defenses, and the like. How can we expect to be equipped to decide what constitutes a reasonable precaution or an effective security measure if hypotheticals are taboo?

An assignment to work out the logistics of running an attack, beyond being creativity-inducing in and of itself, is certainly going to raise the ethical and moral questions -- at least among any students with the slightest bit of introspection and curiosity.

Re:I'm tired of this...

[Trintech]

Think like the enemy is a good way to empathize. The enemy is made of people, just like us, and just like us they have their issues and problems that drive them to terrorism.

Thank you for bringing this up. Often, if you are able to actually empathize with the enemy, you realize that they are just a symptom of a bigger problem. As of late, our society has spent far too much time trying to treat symptoms (Root out and kill all terrorists) instead of tackling the real underlying problems (why they hate us in the first place).

Re:I'm tired of this...

[wvmarle]

In Dutch we always say "you have to speak the language of the enemy".

In a literal sense (during the war it helped many resistance fighters to speak German, and to speak it well, if only to understand what the enemy is saying to each other),and in a more figurative sense (knowing their tactics and way of doing).

What's wrong with that?

[Cosgrach]

Personally, I think that there is nothing wrong with this sort of assignment. In order to anticipate just such attacks, you must think like a terrorist. It may actually increase the safety of the people by getting them to raise their situational awareness. Nothing wrong with that. However, our wonderful government really dislikes the idea of people actually thinking for themselves, especially in this area. Just what do you think would happen if everyone suddenly realized that all the 'security' at the airport does not mean a damn and if everyone also realized that their civil rights have been stripped away and agencies like TSA and DHS really don't seem to have much in the way of limits... The best security on an airliner are the passengers - the likelyhood of another 9-11 type attack is less likely than finding a snowball in hell. Unless they figure out a way to gass all the passengers before making their move. Oh shit! I must be a terrorist!!! I'm fucked now.

Re:What's wrong with that?

[vux984]

EXACTLY!

The biggest epiphany one would get from this sort of exercise is just how pointless the security theatre is.

As soon as you run through an exercise like this, its impossible to reconcile it with there being a need for millimetre wave radar at airports... you can kill just as many people by detonating in the backed up line waiting to go past the damn machine as you can getting on a plane.

Or go to any of 1000 other venues where people gather... from a county fair to the line up to see a shopping mall Santa.

Re:What's wrong with that?

[pehrs]

An airplane can have hundreds of people on it. Suicide bombers with man portable bombs can take out tens of people, if lucky. Killing masses of people with people aware of suicide bombers can be pretty tough.

Yes and no. Sure, you can kill more people with the same amount of explosives if you bring down an airplane, but you forget that the attackers can change their tactics if they don't need to go through security, and large bags are common in an airport. Detonating two 50kg bags of explosives in a crowded airport can easily bring the death-toll into hundreds.

Terrorists are adaptive. Don't expect them to be stupid and play the game the way you want them to.

There's a Sun Tzu quote for that

[RichPowers]

"So it is said that if you know your enemies and know yourself, you can win a hundred battles without a single loss.
If you only know yourself, but not your opponent, you may win or may lose.
If you know neither yourself nor your enemy, you will always endanger yourself."

-Sun Tzu, The Art of War

I propose we ban the discussion and analysis of hypothetical terrorist attacks, military invasions, and network breaches because they're insensitive to victims of terrorism, veterans, and poor blokes like me who've had their medical records compromised.

Well, duh

[gman003]

First, you grab the BFG. Then, make a run for the enemy flag. Circle-strafe and rocket-jump when you need the elevation. It's that simple. You could probably gib the entire Pacific that way.

I mean, seriously, it's so obvious!

Promote this teacher!

[Lord Kano]

This is the kind of thing that teachers should be teaching. The world can be an ugly place. It's important to teach high school students what kind of things they'll experience in the real world.

Unfortunately, terrorism is the kind of thing that these young people might experience. Maybe if New York's public schools had done an exercise like this, fewer people would have died on 9-11.

"Class. If you're on 61st floor of a skyscraper and it and the building next to it are struck by passenger jets, do you 1) Stay at your desk and keep working. 2) Get out of the building and go home for the day."

I'm giving a lighthearted take on this, but I'm being completely serious. Thank God for teachers like this one.

LK

Re:Promote this teacher!

[shermo]

Really? Get some perspective. About 3000 americans were killed by terrorists in the past ten years. In that same period about 300,000 died from suicide, while about 350,000 died on the roads.

If you dedicate 2 hours to 'terrorism danger' in a school year, you should dedicate 3 months to suicide and traffic safety.

I'm not in anyway trying to belittle the emotional impact of 9-11, but in terms of "thing[s] that these young people might experience" you'd be better off putting your efforts elsewhere.

Re:Promote this teacher!

[justinlee37]

I think the parent had a good point that he expressed poorly.

Basically, while most of us will never experience a terrorist attack, we may experience a home invasion, carjacking, bank robbery, kidnapping, or any other number of hostile actions that are perpetrated against innocents all around the world every day.

Being able to ask yourself, "how would an assailant plan a crime against me?" is a useful skill as it will naturally lead one to think of ways that they could defend themselves against the crime.

Furthermore, this sort of project may inspire some students to pursue a career in counter-terrorism. Inspiring children is one of the primary goals of education. Most of us won't go on to be doctors or engineers either, but that doesn't mean we should start cutting our biology and physics programs.

Zombie Apocolypse

[hoggoth]

The teacher should have de-politicized it and asked the students to make plans for surviving an upcoming zombie apocalypse. As a side benefit many geeks would already have their plans worked out.

Government Idiots

[waltmarkers]

I couldn't disagree more vigorously with Ms. O'Neill, it's exactly what I expect of a professional educator. Mature thought is supposed to make us challenge our current assumptions, not change them, but at least think about them.

This teacher is making people think. And on a completely different note, this is standard practice in a security audit. Think like the bad guy.

Move along, the only story here is an administrator acting stupidly and hindering someone trying to practice their profession well.

Sun Tzu

[PinkyGigglebrain]

Over 2000 years ago said (in the translation on Wikiquote);

"It is said that if you know your enemies and know yourself, you will not be imperiled in a hundred battles;
if you do not know your enemies but do know yourself, you will win one and lose one;
if you do not know your enemies nor yourself, you will be imperiled in every single battle."

If you have not read it, "The Art of War" by Sun Tzu. His words are as applicable today as they were when they were written and are valid in all levels of conflict.

Another great thing about Sun Tzu, he also said "To subdue the enemy without fighting is the acme of skill.". Pity more of today's National leaders don't take that more to heart.

This thinking is needed to understand security

[gweihir]

It is therefore something that should be taught to every voter. This would prevent countless instances of fear-mongering, ineffective but costly security measures with negative impact on freedom, etc.

Obviously, understanding the enemy and what it can do is not something that is desirable from a political point of view. It would be far too easy to spot incompetence and hidden agendas (such as less freedom and giving a lot of money to the industry for very little in return) with this understanding.

On the other side, teaching this type of thinking does not make us less secure. Any good engineer and most good scientists can design, plan and execute devastating attacks. Practically none do, since these people also understand that terrorism is not an effective way to reach a goal and typically only serves the power-fantasies of the terrorists. This in turn means that the only effective protection from terrorism is not to make it hard to do (as it is not and cannot really be made so), but to make people understand its characteristics. Even less people would then consider terrorism as a way to "fight". The main problem is that understanding that, it becomes quite obvious that politics is either incompetent in this regard or has been lying shamelessly to us for about a decade now.

Site note: I also think that the political outrage at terrorism has nothing to do with civilian casualties and anything to do with politics regarding terrorism as competition.

Just to make this perfectly clear, I regard terrorism as ineffective, amoral and completely unacceptable. It is just that the other side (politics) has started to not look much better over the last few years.

I would like my son to do this assignment

[thewb005]

This sounded like an amazing assignment. When you choose a side in a debate for class, you are asked to think of every tactic the opposite side will try to use against you. I don't see how an assignment like this would be considered overly insensitive unless it was assigned out of the blue. If it was suggested in the class syllabus and had good justification as a learning experience, then I don't see why it should fly. Wouldn't it be one hell of a learning experience to have your student experience 24 hours in jail to learn about risk and consequence? Wouldn't it be just as valuable to write a report thinking like a terrorist? I think radical assignments like this impacts a student's learning more then any other ho-hum history report would. Wake up parents and look at the world. People spend their lives (and giving them freely) planning to commit terrorist acts. By sheltering our children from reality, they may end up believing everything they see on TV and not KNOW the real world.

Making a fuss for nothing

[2Bits]

In this society, it is not possible to learn something, or teach something, without other people making a fuss over it. In the previous few years, I was interviewing candidates for quite a few security engineer positions. We want to hire someone junior who has the potential, and we would train him/her to do the work.

So we asked the following question during the interview: We know that A is sending a very important email to B. Your job is to get your hand on that email, no matter what. Show me the different ways of getting that email.

We were trying to find out if the candidate could come up with a plan to solve the problem. If he/she could come up with an attack matrix, it would be even better. But our goal is to find out if the candidate could consider the problem from all angles.

The funny thing about this experience was that, one of the candidate who didn't get hired, reported the experience to the Public Safety Department (i.e. Police in China), saying that we are recruiting crackers, probably for some unspeakable purposes. We got a few visits (you know whom!), and I was to be specifically "interrogated".

Schneier's Movie-Plot Threat Contest

[swm]

It's been done.

Schneier on Security
A blog covering security and security technology.
April 1, 2006
Announcing: Movie-Plot Threat Contest

For a while now, I have been writing about our penchant for "movie-plot threats": terrorist fears based on very specific attack scenarios. Terrorists with crop dusters, terrorists exploding baby carriages in subways, terrorists filling school buses with explosives -- these are all movie-plot threats. They're good for scaring people, but it's just silly to build national security policy around them.

But if we're going to worry about unlikely attacks, why can't they be exciting and innovative ones? If Americans are going to be scared, shouldn't they be scared of things that are really scary? "Blowing up the Super Bowl" is a movie plot to be sure, but it's not a very good movie. Let's kick this up a notch.

It is in this spirit I announce the (possibly First) Movie-Plot Threat Contest. Entrants are invited to submit the most unlikely, yet still plausible, terrorist attack scenarios they can come up with.

Your goal: cause terror. Make the American people notice. Inflict lasting damage on the U.S. economy. Change the political landscape, or the culture. The more grandiose the goal, the better.

Assume an attacker profile on the order of 9/11: 20 to 30 unskilled people, and about $500,000 with which to buy skills, equipment, etc.

http://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2006/04/announcing_movi.html
http://www.schneier.com/blog/archives/2006/06/movieplot_threa_1.html

Re:Schneier's Movie-Plot Threat Contest

[Idarubicin]

You know, I was about to write a post mentioning Bruce Schneier's movie-plot contests.

One of the most important questions we ought to ask about this project is whether or not the teacher in question was actually prepared to address the implications of this sort of assignment, and particularly how this sort of thinking about painfully specific-but-scary plots distorts proper, rational security thinking. Schneier obviously gets it, but I'm not sure that the teacher here has nearly the same degree of clue. The assignment called specifically for a biological or chemical attack, despite such attacks representing a vanishingly small fraction of total terrorism attacks or deaths. Given that the project was to be evaluated based on the "students' ability to analyze information they had learned on terrorism and chemical and biological warfare and apply it to a real-life scenario", I fear that the assignment would have exactly the wrong effect on students' thinking.

The project is almost certainly a bad idea not because it 'teaches children to be terrorists' (or some similarly-worded alarmist tripe), but rather because it teaches children to unnecessarily fear terrorists. Imagining a class set of superficially-plausible worst-case scenarios involving deadly chemical and biological agents being used to "kill the MOST innocent civilians" in "an unsuspecting Australian community" then describing in detail "what effects the attack would have on a human body" seems tailor-made to promote irrational terror: visceral fear and revulsion, rather than rational thought and analysis.

There's always a special kid.

[SlurpingGreen]

I agree with the sentiment that the assignment is good for getting student brain activity going and for learning about critical thinking.

However, I've also worked with high school students and the opposing argument is not entirely without merit. There *are* those kids who don't understand sarcasm, don't follow even the most basic logical arguments and may not understand that discussing terrorism does not imply becoming a terrorist. Slashdot posters who breezed through high school should understand that many people barely passed (hell, many people fail).

And obviously, school administrators don't want to get the angry phone call from a parent "you're teaching my kid to be a terrorist!" so they have to say they don't support it even if they could care less.

Terrorists existed back then too...

[denzacar]

They were called resistance fighters, partisans and commandos back then.

There was recently even an American Oscar winning movie glorifying such terrorists.

Pussies

[garompeta]

I wonder what Spartans would have thought about this news. We are alarmed because of an hypothetical mind exercise for 15yrs old kids when 2500 years ago these kids would have been already married and battling in the field.
Spartan wives and mothers said their goodbyes by saying "with the shield or on the shield" which meant "come back victorious (holding the shield) or dead (on the shield)". These days we are becoming too soft and psychologically weaker. Really? We are overprotecting the kids from stress at all cost with these neurotic worrying over videogames, movies and creative teachers who break canons. Our society is full of mediocres and pussies, I am sick of it.

The Wave

[slonik]

It reminds me of a very insightful German movie "The Wave" (original German title "Die Welle") http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1063669/

A history teacher proposes to his students an experiment about dictatorship. See what comes out of it.

Re:The Wave

[xtracto]

Yeah but... on that movie the teacher goes very far away pushing his students.

And of course, the only thing you get from there is that if you pus a crazy lonely guy who needs psychological help, then he will can do terrible things.

That same guy (the character depicted in the movie) could have attempted on the life of a president just to impress some random actress (sounds familiar?).

empathy is not sympathy

[nten]

In the moment when I truly understand my enemy, understand him well enough to defeat him, then in that very moment I also love him.

        * Ender Wiggin

I disagree with Ender. I think you can understand someone very well and not even like them. You may comprehend their motives without agreeing with their choices.

I had a professor do somethin similar

[bsDaemon]

When I was in Uni my senior year, I had a "Sociological Problems" class. On the first day, doing introductions one of the questions we were asked was "if we were a terrorist, what would we attack in the US to try and strike fear into the most people?" The rationale was to see what we thought was most emblematic of the US and what we would be the most shocked and horrified to see attacked.

Everyone except for me said they'd attack either the Statue of Liberty, the Empire State Build, or the Lincoln Memorial. Mostly the Statue of Liberty.

I said I'd launch a coordinated car bomb attack at random points around Kansas City, probably on a Thursday morning. Of course, this caused everyone to freak out. But that just proved me point -- if everyone's expecting the Statue of Liberty to get hit, then no one is going to be surprised when it happens, unless they were there when it went down.

My answer was the only one that got an emotional response out of the class, because my target was the only one that would have had people believe "if it can happen there, it can happen anywhere!"

In Australia, it'd be the difference between the Sydney Opera House and some podunk burg in Tasmania.

If you don't really understand terrorists, how can you hope to defeat them, either militarily or rendering their tactics ineffective through rising above? You can't. Good for this teacher, of course most of the kids probably came up with the same, lame-ass plans that never would have actually terrorized anyone, just like my classmates did.