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Paper-Thin Batteries Provide Bendable Power

SkinnyGuy writes "New carbon nanotube-based technology could literally allow companies to paint layers of electricity-holding lithium-ion on standard pieces of paper. The possibilities are endless." You can also read the actual paper.

102 comments

  1. Energy Density by chill · · Score: 2, Informative

    For the electrical geeks, the energy density is 108 mWh/g. Anyone want to compare that to a standard AA rechargeable?

    --
    Learning HOW to think is more important than learning WHAT to think.
    1. Re:Energy Density by danbert8 · · Score: 5, Informative

      From wikipedia: The specific energy for NiMH material is approximately 70 Wh/kg (250 kJ/kg), compared to 40-60 Wh/kg for the more common nickel-cadmium, or 100-160 Wh/kg for Li-ion.

      This looks like it would be comparable to Li-ion and an improvement over NiMH and NiCd.

      --
      Yes it's an anecdote! Were you expecting original research in a Slashdot comment?
    2. Re:Energy Density by Thanshin · · Score: 1

      The information would probably be much more useful per square centimetre rather than per gram.

    3. Re:Energy Density by Jurily · · Score: 2, Insightful

      More importantly, will it fry my gonads if it bends too much in my pocket?

    4. Re:Energy Density by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      108 mWh/g

    5. Re:Energy Density by somersault · · Score: 1, Flamebait

      This looks like it would be comparable to Li-ion

      Really? I never would have guessed from the summary saying "paint layers of electricity-holding lithium-ion"..

      Will try to tone down the sarcasm for the rest of the day, honest.

      --
      which is totally what she said
    6. Re:Energy Density by sakdoctor · · Score: 5, Informative

      1 Wh/kg = 1 mWh/g

    7. Re:Energy Density by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      108 mWh/g

    8. Re:Energy Density by ryanleary · · Score: 3, Informative

      Researchers at Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute produced "paper batteries" on nanocomposite paper with an energy density of about 13Wh/kg back in 2007. You can see the paper here.

    9. Re:Energy Density by Thanshin · · Score: 1

      This looks like it would be comparable to Li-ion

      Only if it's a really, really flat and electrically charged, probably for having been hit by a lightning, lion.

    10. Re:Energy Density by danbert8 · · Score: 2, Informative

      The point is, he asked for energy density compared to AA batteries, and I was making the point that they didn't lose any energy density by making it paper thin. I guess looking back over it, it doesn't read that way. Oh well.

      --
      Yes it's an anecdote! Were you expecting original research in a Slashdot comment?
    11. Re:Energy Density by mea37 · · Score: 1

      "I guess looking back over it, it doesn't read that way."

      No, it does. GP is just a jerk.

    12. Re:Energy Density by trum4n · · Score: 1

      the bad news is ratings on vaporware are useless. as an electric car builder, i see the hot new battery tech talked about and then just poof, its gone. when its in my hand, ill care.

    13. Re:Energy Density by Saishuuheiki · · Score: 1

      Be careful with the direct comparison:
      Without paying to read the actual paper, it's tough to say if the energy density there is for the thin sheet that acts as the battery, or for the entire sheet of paper.

      Plus there's issues of packaging and scaling that lower the density you get out of a battery which hasn't been applied to the thin-sheet. Not to mention it doesn't really mention energy-density vs actual volume of the battery
      (It's nice if it's light, but can be limited if you need the volume of a soda-can for the power of a AA battery)

    14. Re:Energy Density by bigrockpeltr · · Score: 1

      why was this modded down?

      --
      $ unzip, strip, touch, finger, grep, mount, fsck, more, yes,fsck,fsck,fsck,umount, sleep
    15. Re:Energy Density by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Dunno lol

    16. Re:Energy Density by IndustrialComplex · · Score: 5, Funny

      Only if it's a really, really flat and electrically charged, probably for having been hit by a lightning, lion.

      Or a zoo lion run over by a Tesla roadster. Now THAT would be an interesting headline.

      "Coulomb Car Careens and Crashes Cat Cage. Collision Causes Concussion, Catatonic Kitty Carries Charge. Cops Consult Caretakers and Consider Charging Car Caretaker as Careless."

      --
      Out of modpoints but really liked a post? 1BDkF6TtmmeZ3yqXbz9yhdYVqRYnwFoXDj
    17. Re:Energy Density by Moryath · · Score: 2, Funny

      The possibilities are endless.

      What are the possibilities if we fold it into a mobius strip? ;)

    18. Re:Energy Density by somersault · · Score: 1

      Sorry if I find the sentence "li-ion is comparable to li-ion" slightly redundant.

      --
      which is totally what she said
    19. Re:Energy Density by somersault · · Score: 1

      Yeah I suppose it was the OP asking a silly question rather than you giving a silly answer.

      Since the energy density is the same I'd be more interested in how much flexibility you can retain when you layer this stuff up - or if layering it would cause overheating issues, etc.

      --
      which is totally what she said
    20. Re:Energy Density by SilverEyes · · Score: 1

      Mod parent up !

      --
      Interesting.
    21. Re:Energy Density by mea37 · · Score: 1

      Ok, you're not "just a jerk", you're a persistent jerk.

      Put the comment in context, jerk. The "equivalent to Li-ion" comment was a correct answer to a specific question. (And no, the question wasn't stupid either. It would be unsurprising if this type of adaptation had significantly changed properties like energy density. Essentially someone asked if it did and someone else answered that it didn't, only you don't like the way they phrased it.)

      But sure, if you isolate the answer and ignore why it was given you can pretend that it was a stupid thing to say. You probably have a future in political punditry. (And in case you failed to pick it up from the context, that wasn't a compliment.)

    22. Re:Energy Density by somersault · · Score: 1

      Persistent yes.. interested in politics.. not so much. Are you having a bad day or something? You seem very angry.

      --
      which is totally what she said
    23. Re:Energy Density by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Funny

      One-sided.

    24. Re:Energy Density by treeves · · Score: 1

      But in context, he meant "paper-thin Li-ion is comparable to AA-form Li-ion" which *is* informative. And it was not hard to tell that that was what he meant, so it seems like you're being deliberately difficult.

      --
      ...the future crusty old bastards are already drinking the Kool-Aid.
    25. Re:Energy Density by dragoneye1589 · · Score: 2, Funny

      Combustion

  2. as if they didn't explode easily enough by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    all items containing this product will be banned from commercial flights.

    1. Re:as if they didn't explode easily enough by Teun · · Score: 1
      Possibly.

      And in jurisdictions where waste segregation and recycling is taken seriously we'll now have to dispose of this paper as chemical waste.

      --
      "The likes of Facebook and WhatsApp are free to those whose privacy is of zero value."
  3. worst linking job ever by slshwtw · · Score: 5, Informative

    You can also read the actual paper.

    What kind of a protocol is hhttp and what kind of a URL is pubsacsorgdoifull101021nn1018158?

    Actual link

    1. Re:worst linking job ever by danbert8 · · Score: 5, Funny

      It's much faster than just Hyper, it's Hyper Hyper, which is like regular Hyper except on ADHD. Ooh, look at that blinky ad!

      --
      Yes it's an anecdote! Were you expecting original research in a Slashdot comment?
    2. Re:worst linking job ever by Jurily · · Score: 4, Funny

      What kind of a protocol is hhttp and what kind of a URL is pubsacsorgdoifull101021nn1018158?

      It's the new RTFA-test. You're the only one who passed.

    3. Re:worst linking job ever by Shrike82 · · Score: 1

      What kind of a protocol is hhttp

      Well according to this page of Internet Protocols it's identical to regular HTTP. Good to know that typing errors are documented as standards.

      --
      You can advertise in this sig from as little as £99.99 a month!
    4. Re:worst linking job ever by danbert8 · · Score: 1

      Just wait until they standardize HHTTPP, for people who use the internet and press their keys too long.

      --
      Yes it's an anecdote! Were you expecting original research in a Slashdot comment?
    5. Re:worst linking job ever by drinkypoo · · Score: 1

      Hilariously given the prior story, acs.org refuses to cough up content unless you let them set cookies on your computer, for no reason whatsoever.

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    6. Re:worst linking job ever by boarder8925 · · Score: 1

      Sure it's Hyper-Hyper, but can it go Ludicrous Speed?

    7. Re:worst linking job ever by Java+Pimp · · Score: 1

      which is like regular Hyper except on ADHD...

      No, that would be plaid...

      --
      Ascalante: Your bride is over 3,000 years old.
      Kull: She told me she was 19!
    8. Re:worst linking job ever by slshwtw · · Score: 1

      By the way it appears that if you directly access the full paper, you may get a message that "Your current credentials do not allow retrieval of the full text."

      To solve this problem try using this redirect link (which is the one found in TFA).

    9. Re:worst linking job ever by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      hope they remember to slow down first

    10. Re:worst linking job ever by Shrike82 · · Score: 1

      Shouldn't that be HHTTTTPP? Or are we being silly now? Also I can't read two consecutive letter P's without snickering in my head. God I love being so childish.

      --
      You can advertise in this sig from as little as £99.99 a month!
    11. Re:worst linking job ever by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It's a botched Digital Object Identifier (http://www.doi.org/faq.html). The doi for this paper is actually 10.1021/nn1018158. The idea is that the paper will always be accessible via this doi even if original url changes. For example, the url might change if the journal re-organises its website or the paper may even be moved to a completely different website (e.g. if the journal changes publisher or goes out of business and its publications are archived elsewhere).

      From the doi faq:
      "A DOI name is an implementation of URI (Uniform Resource Identifier, sometimes called Universal Resource Identifier, IETF RFC 2396). It uses the Handle System® for resolution of the identifier, and the indecs framework for metadata description. The syntax of the DOI name is specified by a NISO standard, (ANSI/NISO Z39.84). "

      You can download a doi and hdl handler for Firefox (https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/10820/). Alternatively you can use the resolver at http://dx.doi.org, either by using the web form or by appending the doi after a forward slash (e.g. http://dx.doi.org/10.1021/nn1018158 for this paper).

    12. Re:worst linking job ever by __aagmrb7289 · · Score: 2, Informative

      http://pubs.acs.org/doi/abs/10.1021/nn1018158 That's the corrected link, I believe.

    13. Re:worst linking job ever by leromarinvit · · Score: 1

      Actual link

      I tried to read the paper, but it tried to charge me first. Wasn't it supposed to be the other way round?

      --
      Proud member of the Ferengi Socialist Party.
    14. Re:worst linking job ever by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You can also read the actual paper.

      What kind of a protocol is hhttp and what kind of a URL is pubsacsorgdoifull101021nn1018158?

      It's Adriano Celentano's new URL format Prisencolinensinainciusol.

  4. Paper-thin spying devices. by Thanshin · · Score: 1

    I wonder if the spying technology that doesn't reach the public, if there is such thing, has already reached a size that makes it impossible to find by non-electronic means. I wonder if such deviced didn't exist until the paper-thin batteries were invented.

    1. Re:Paper-thin spying devices. by Joebert · · Score: 1

      German cockroaches. I know, you'd never suspect them right ?

      --
      Wanna fight ? Bend over, stick your head up your ass, and fight for air.
    2. Re:Paper-thin spying devices. by drinkypoo · · Score: 1

      I wonder if the spying technology that doesn't reach the public, if there is such thing, has already reached a size that makes it impossible to find by non-electronic means.

      Since you can use RFID for spying (with a directional antenna to power and receive data from it) the answer is yes.

      I wonder if such deviced didn't exist until the paper-thin batteries were invented.

      since you can power electronics remotely with RF, the answer is no.

      --
      "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    3. Re:Paper-thin spying devices. by damien_kane · · Score: 1

      German cockroaches. I know, you'd never suspect them right ?

      I'm pretty sure that's because specifically the German variety of cockroach was not originally naturally occurring. They were genetically modified from normal cockroaches by the Spanish Inquisition to look and act very similar to garden-variety cockroaches, except with malicious intent.

  5. Puns (sorry) by PsyciatricHelp · · Score: 3, Funny

    I read the paper and it was Shockingly Powerful.

    1. Re:Puns (sorry) by Anne_Nonymous · · Score: 2, Funny

      So you got a charge out of it?

    2. Re:Puns (sorry) by PsyciatricHelp · · Score: 1

      I did. It was a fairly Positive experience.

    3. Re:Puns (sorry) by somersault · · Score: 1

      All I got was a stream of negativity.

      --
      which is totally what she said
    4. Re:Puns (sorry) by damien_kane · · Score: 1

      Get with the times, my good man.
      Bottle up all of that negativity and send it to the positive people. They're much more accepting of it than we are.

    5. Re:Puns (sorry) by erroneus · · Score: 4, Funny

      I clicked on the link and found that there was no charge. After I read the paper, I found it to be both positive and negative. I found the subject matter to be current and energetic. It was both powerful and enlightning. You seem to be applying some resistance to this where I think you should be looking to reduce your impedance. Of course your position on the matter can help determine your polarity.

      Well, thank god it's Faraday...

    6. Re:Puns (sorry) by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Bzzzzt! Wrong!

    7. Re:Puns (sorry) by Slicebo · · Score: 1

      Did you click on the ohm page and read the actual paper? Shocking!

    8. Re:Puns (sorry) by MiniMike · · Score: 1

      Not trying to put a different spin on it, but I thought it was a bit thin. I could see just where they were standing on the issues, but couldn't quite tell where they were going or when they would get there.

    9. Re:Puns (sorry) by O-Deka-K · · Score: 1

      Yes! The headline was:

      "Man Struck By Lightning Arrested, Charged With Battery"

  6. The energy crisis finally solved by hAckz0r · · Score: 0, Offtopic

    Just add this stuff to the Red Ink Supply in Washington DC, and nobody will ever need another battery, ever again. Power from paper. With each session of Congress our economy will become *stronger*, and we will no longer have to rely on foreign oil for even our transportation purposes. All new Congressional Energy Bills passed can now pay for themselves! Problem averted. But, lets just hope that spontaneous combustion of recycled paper doesn't start causing any new problems. </sarcasm>

  7. The possiblilities are endless... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    When you paint it on Andrex toilet paper. Goes on and on and on (or is that Duracell?).

  8. It's like sci-fi ... by Spectre · · Score: 2, Funny

    "... embed it in a carbon nanotube matrix, and it really is that simple ..."

    I swear, what are carbon nanotubes NOT good for?

    --
    "Flame away, I wear asbestos underwear"
    1. Re:It's like sci-fi ... by RivenAleem · · Score: 1

      Electrical insulation?

    2. Re:It's like sci-fi ... by AlecC · · Score: 1

      You. They are carcinogenic.

      --
      Consciousness is an illusion caused by an excess of self consciousness.
    3. Re:It's like sci-fi ... by tsalmark · · Score: 1

      carbon nanotubes: the new Snake Oil,

    4. Re:It's like sci-fi ... by geekoid · · Score: 1

      With the exception people are actually making things out of it. Light as air sheets, artificial muscle, bullet proof vests that don't hurt when hit, and so on.

      Snake Oil could never do anything.

      --
      The Kruger Dunning explains most post on /. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
    5. Re:It's like sci-fi ... by Overzeetop · · Score: 2, Funny

      Carbon nanotubes - the new Asbestos!

      --
      Is it just my observation, or are there way too many stupid people in the world?
    6. Re:It's like sci-fi ... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      links to actual products?

      We need a new word, like "vaporware," but for hypothetical products that will be made possible by carbon nanotubes.

    7. Re:It's like sci-fi ... by huckamania · · Score: 1

      tI deruc ym aixelsid!

    8. Re:It's like sci-fi ... by stdarg · · Score: 1

      That's when you reverse the polarity of the tubes.

  9. a better direction for battery development by slshwtw · · Score: 1

    I want a battery that I can recharge by holding either end and shuffling my socks on the carpet.

    1. Re:a better direction for battery development by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Some of us have hardwood floors, you insensitive clod!

  10. Maitre D: And finally, monsieur... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Maitre D: Oh sir... it's only *wafer* thin.

  11. Am I the only one... by CowFu · · Score: 1

    That Instantly went to "how will this advance the sex-toy market" instantly before thinking of good practical or scientific uses?

    1. Re:Am I the only one... by ae1294 · · Score: 1

      This is slashdot what the hell do you think....

  12. Apple by TheSpoom · · Score: 1

    Apple Tech: "You don't understand, sir, you can't replace the battery because the iPod is the battery!"

    --
    It's better to vote for what you want and not get it than to vote for what you don't want and get it.
    - E. Debs
  13. Makes sense now. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Funny

    So that's what Gambit actually used in his playing cards!

  14. Refinement from last year, reported by Gizmag? by Anti+Cheat · · Score: 1

    Perhaps I'm wrong, but I seem to remember a Slashdot thread last year on this. What I am clear on is that this is the same scientist and the same material shown over at Gizmag Dec/2009.
    http://www.gizmag.com/paper-battery-nanotechnology/13537/
    This appears to be more of a refinement of the discovery and methods first reported by Dr. Yi Cui and team. Now the question is. When will we finally see products? Another year?

  15. I propose a new rule by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Anyone who uses "The possibilities are endless" in a Slashdot summary shall slapped repeatedly with a fresh Salmon.

    1. Re:I propose a new rule by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Anyone who uses "The possibilities are endless" in a Slashdot summary shall slapped repeatedly with a fresh Salmon.

      Is that a genetically modified Salmon or the traditional non-modified version?

  16. No New Battery Technology -- Ever by Wingsy · · Score: 1

    I'm convinced that we're pretty much forever stuck with the battery technology we have today. Of all the hype I've heard over the years of some great new battery technology, nothing of any major consequence has ever panned out. I didn't even read the article, cause I'll only believe it when I see it.

    --
    If I didn't have absolutely NOTHING to do, I wouldn't be here.
    1. Re:No New Battery Technology -- Ever by mattack2 · · Score: 1

      We didn't always have Ni-Cd, then NiMH, then Li-On batteries.

  17. What About by SnarfQuest · · Score: 1, Interesting

    What about toxic effects on children? Right now we are dealing with lead paint and asbestos in our homes. What kind of problems will we see with kids eating this kind of paint/paper? If you don't think they would eat this, just look at how many of them still get pennys stuck up their noses. Eating paper is no big deal for them.

    --
    Who would win this election: Andrew Weiner vs Andrew Weiner's weiner.
    1. Re:What About by HTH+NE1 · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Presumably the first shock from trying to eat the electrically charged paint would get them to stop. Or at least the third attempt.

      --
      Oh, say does that Star-Spangled Banner entwine / The myrtle of Venus with Bacchus's vine?
  18. I say to this.... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    YAFC

    Yet Another Flying Car

  19. Sharks by KiwiCanuck · · Score: 1

    Sweet! Now I have the much needed power supply for the lasers. Time to break out the duct tape.

  20. Practical advantages? by CCarrot · · Score: 1

    My imagination machine must be broken today, but I'm having a hard time seeing what this would be good for? Is it more useful to have the battery spread all over the place than it is to have it nicely tucked away in a protected compartment, easy to access, detach and replace (unless you're an iPiddle user)?

    The only thing I could really see this being useful for is in cases where concentrated battery weight throws off balance or maneuverability for moving equipment, like electric cars or bicycles, and even then, this isn't saying you'd need less weight in batteries, you could just distribute the battery weight load more evenly.

    Orr...actual digital 'paper', that records pen (stylus) strokes on a piezoelectric surface to an embedded memory card for later uploading. This could be made to look much more like a standard piece of paper than today's attempts, just a bit thicker, like writing on parchment or leather. Of course, you'd have to depend on additional advances in display thinning technology for user feedback. And there would still be an unbalanced weight load on the device due to the memory storage requirement. And it's not like you can fold it in half and stick it in your pocket (bendable, not necessarily foldable).

    Any other actual usage ideas where this would provide a practical advantage over current technology?

    --
    "I love animals! Some are cute, others are tasty, what's not to like?" - Betsy Schroeder, Jeopardy contestant
    1. Re:Practical advantages? by Issarlk · · Score: 1

      The obvious advantage is that you can pile up lots of sheets of paper. We could make little compact devices filled with this paper to power our equipments.

    2. Re:Practical advantages? by CCarrot · · Score: 1

      True...but would that really be more efficient than using stacks of traditional batteries? The energy density is not greater, remember.

      Perhaps one could 'wrap' the battery around the device, although I still fail to see how this could be a benefit...?

      --
      "I love animals! Some are cute, others are tasty, what's not to like?" - Betsy Schroeder, Jeopardy contestant
  21. Your mom! by guybrush3pwood · · Score: 1

    I came up with a "your mom" joke, but I think I better keep it to myself...

    --
    Perhaps I'm trolling, perhaps I'm not.
  22. Coming soon - the trackable by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    As this gets better, combine it with induction charging - and you have the ability to track almost any form of paper - or more importantly, the paper could track itself.

    Imagine a world where your currency of choice was charged inductively (as merchants would required to have the coil in their registers or something) and every transaction was tracked, recorded, taxed, and monitored.

    Each bill testifying of its validity. Bills not charged are no longer currency.

    Now, your wealth, private transactions, and every dynamic of your life could live in a database. No more hiding cash in cans in the back yard or under the mattress.

    You need to own gold - and not just on paper. But that won't matter - as it won't be a valid currency and as soon as you're issued cash for it- you're back on the grid.

    Only barter will be below the radar?

    I'm going to invest in tin foil, myself. :)

  23. As Endless As? by b4upoo · · Score: 1

    The delivery dates on these types of products is about as endless as the possibilities. And for once it is just not the net that ballyhoos these new inventions. Popular Science has reported on endless breakthroughs through many decades as have other magazines. Yet the number of these ideas that actually make it into production in any reasonable amount of time is next to none at all. Printing batteries on flexible paper sounds great. But give us thirty years and batteries might be a thing of the past. If it isn't some fancy kind of capacitor it will be some other newly thought of technology that hits the streets.
                  I predicted the same thing with Linux. I'm a Linux fan and daily user. But I remarked on many occasions that the battle between Linux and Windows was irrelevant as somewhere a new OS would crop up that might sweep the field. It might be Chrome. It may be something yet to be discussed. But changes are occurring and not only are they occurring faster but the steps of increase are getting greater as well. Batteries have shown distinct limits as have Windows products. Expect sweeping changes.

  24. Printed Battery and Printed Solar Cell? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Interesting

    Combine this with a printed solar cell... that could be interesting:

    http://www.renewableenergyworld.com/rea/news/article/2008/07/next-generation-dye-sensitive-organic-pv-part-1-53133

  25. the ACTUAL paper? by stinky+wizzleteats · · Score: 1

    That seems kind of dangerous.

  26. Cool beans by hesaigo999ca · · Score: 1

    how about on the side of your car, and then also add some solar paint ....the combo of the 2 turns your car into a self generating self contained energy construct, and the fact you do not need a bulky battery you coudl also just do without a bulky heavy one sitting
    in there, you could end up getting more miles for the gallon (or what is it for electric cars, kilojoules???)