Slashdot Mirror
Attacked By Anonymous, HBGary Pulls Out of RSA
itwbennett writes "HBGary Federal cancelled a talk the company's CEO Aaron Barr was planning to give at the BSides San Francisco conference on his investigation of WikiLeaks. 'I was receiving death threats,' Barr said in an interview Tuesday. 'There was lots of talk that was being made of in the Anonymous IRC channels of harassing us at our booth and sending people to heckle [HBGary speakers at the conference].' The company has also decided to pull its booth from the RSA Conference floor after it was vandalized on Sunday, said Jim Butterworth, HBGary's vice president of services. 'We... came back the next morning and it was very apparent that the group responsible for the activities in the news had decided to make another statement,' he said."
Nice tidbit.
So a "security company" is afraid of a sign?
I'd sooner place my bets they're in the Long Con to paint "Anonymous" (there can be only one, right?) as a Threat. Then everyone in power profits when draconian measures come along.
My first Journal Entry ever, in 8 years! http://slashdot.org/journal/365947/aphelion-scifi-fantasy-horror-poetry-webzine
For supposed 'security experts' they do seem pretty weak.
Also I suspect this might well be a publicity stunt to get more attention.
It's an all-out war between the forces of good and evil that has never stopped and will never stop.
Wait, is that part of the Green Lantern Corps creed or something from the Thundercats?
I could take stuff like this more seriously if people didn't have such cartoonish perceptions of what "good" and "evil" actually mean, and stopped trying to pretend they are some sort of freedom fighters when all they are is vandals and bullies who get off on what they are doing
If *real* fascists ever took control in this country, most of these people would shit themselves on a continuous basis before the secret police killed them, their families, their pets, burned down their houses and killed a few others standing around just to send a message.
If *real* fascists ever took control in this country, most of these people would shit themselves on a continuous basis before the secret police killed them, their families, their pets, burned down their houses and killed a few others standing around just to send a message.
Which is why attempting to foil incremental steps in that direction, before they reach fruition, is sort of a good idea, no?
Protesting is one thing but wanton destruction of property is another. Death threats are well over the top.
These are not things responsible protests groups do in a situation like this. Next time, keep it to rhetoric and, if you are willing to be !Anonymous, picketing in person.
Knowledge is how to play a game, intelligence is how to win, wisdom is knowing what game to play.
Anonymous is just the first of many future darknets that will be nearly impossible to destroy. You might take out a ringleader or two, but 4 others would stand up to take their place if they felt that it was unjust. And in the end, it's death by a thousand harmless cuts, or in this case, 1,000 users that don't like something running the their Ion cannons under central control. In this case, this dude is using social networking like facebook to figure out who are hackers. I doubt they have many connections to other hackers on facebook or twitter. It's most likely random unrelated acquaintances, so I think the guy's research is flawed anyway.
The best example of what one of these organized systems could do is a story by Bruce Sterling called Maneki Neko. It is what happens when people get organized but maintain some level of anonymity. We are not to this level yet, but I suspect it right around the corner. It will do strictly good at first, but eventually it will ruin someone's life. Just as Anonymous has ruined some people's lives, they've done a little good for some, like a great birthday. It doesn't justify the destruction, but it's bored kids on the internet, so what are you going to do?
The news media will make a big deal about future 'attacks', but some will be harmless kids having fun. But if you start to push that everyone involved in these groups must be destroyed, those people who are marginally involved will suddenly get VERY involved in your destruction. So be careful.
Gonzo Granzeau
"Nothing the god of biomechanics wouldn't let you into heaven for.." -Roy Batty
Anonymous good?
Is making death threats because you do not like someone is going to say at a conference good? Is heckling and yelling them down good? Funny but I have seen those actions in old news reels from the 30s and from old news stories from the 60s. The folks using those tactics where the ones in the brown shirts and the white sheets.
I don't think MLK or Gandhi ever made any death threats to people or hecked them when they presented papers at conferences. I could be wrong but I am pretty sure about that.
Since when is when someone says something you do agree with you make death threats been a sign of being good?
Anonymous is a gang of bullies. People often see bullies and thugs as heroes if they themselves do not ones being bullied. There are people that think the KKK are a bunch of brave freedom fighters.
Anonymous is no differn't right down to hiding their faces. And their fans do not like they people they are abusing.
Anonymous are those peoples brave Knights in white sheets.
See my blog http://ilovecookes.blogspot.com/ for light hearted technical information.
Anonymous is trying to suppress information using death threats. That makes them no better than many governments and worse than the U.S. government.
I wonder what people would say if members of Anonymous were on the receiving end of death threats. Some how I bet it would be "Look! They are evil fascists!1!!!1!". Well, as soon as Anonymous used death threats, they became an oppressive, authoritarian group using terroristic tactics.
HBGary is not in the business of preventing or withstanding attacks. They're the guys who will investigate events after the fact, compiling nice piles of evidence to hand over to the FBI/police/whomever.
The sign on the booth is a threat. Note that "vandalized" was ITworld's chosen word. The message is clear: "Anonymous is here, and has the same utter lack of respect in real life as online." Given that there were many threats ranging from harassing the booth staff to heckling the speakers, and even up to death, the sign potentially serves as a last warning: Let Anonymous ravage whatever they want, or die.
It makes sense for HBGary to step out of the line of fire, just in case somebody's crazy enough to act on those death threats. Death is not their business. I expect that the sign is being checked for fingerprints, the conference attendee list is being subpoenaed, and security cameras are being reviewed.
I'd also expect that HBGary will use this incident to paint Anonymous as a group of people who constitute a real threat. They stalk and harass a target organization for as long as they're interested, with expenses and lost income costs rising daily. This dedication is as much a problem to Anonymous as to their targets, and HBGary is now playing a great game: they're trolling the trolls. With every public move HBGary makes, Anonymous is drawn into acting. That's another 4chan post, another analysis, another page in HBGary's final report on Anonymous, and another customer impressed by the company's thorough attention to detail.
You do not have a moral or legal right to do absolutely anything you want.
If *real* fascists ever took control in this country, most of these people would shit themselves on a continuous basis before the secret police killed them, their families, their pets, burned down their houses and killed a few others standing around just to send a message.
Which is why attempting to foil incremental steps in that direction, before they reach fruition, is sort of a good idea, no?
Yes, but there is the whole "boy who cried wolf" aspect to constantly calling everything you don't like "fascism." Not everything presages the immanent collapse of American civilization. And the AC has a good point about people's cartoonish perception of good and evil.
- None can love freedom heartily, but good men; the rest love not freedom, but license. -- John Milton
So Anonymous is kind of like Earth First folks. Loosely organized, with sociopathic tendencies.
Except instead of burning down construction sites and SUVs, they crash websites and break into systems.
They both apparently make death threats.
When Fascism comes to America, it will call itself Anti-Fascism, and tell you to give up your guns.
I can't comment on what kind of snobs HBGary folks are, but the actions of Anonymous seem quite hypocritical to me in general. So "Anonymous" fights for wikileaks, which is expressly set up for the purpose of sharing secrets and revealing things. Then I read about how someone tried to expose who various members of Anonymous were, after which Anonymous got all upset and attacked him for doing the very things that wikileaks does, which they work to support. Seems like they value secrecy above everything else, kind of like the people that feel the most threatened by wikileaks. Ironic.
Yup, this is definitely the work of hardcore terrorists. Time to extraordinarily rendition them and ship them to Git'mo.
Two of my imaginary friends reproduced once
I'm going to go out on a limb and say that putting a "large paper poster" on their booth doesn't really count as "vandalism".
"Our two-party system is like a bowl of shit looking at itself in a mirror." - Lewis Black
What happened when Assange started releasing diplomatic cables? Oh, that's right: he received public death threats from US officials. What happens when an individual starts complaining about a corporation, or about scientology? Oh, that's right: they get bullied by a team of lawyers that cost more per hour than the individual makes in a month.
I don't support making death threats or using baser harassment to get a point across, but the only thing newsworthy about the tactics of Anonymous is that now it's regular citizens making the threats and engaging in bullying tactics instead of governments and corporations. If governments and corporations only respect the law when they aren't the ones in power anymore, fuck'em.
You are still in Fox mode, trying to see the conspiracy behind events because your mind cannot grasp that shit just happens.
Anonymous has no organization, it cannot by its very nature. Some people who HAVE grouped together have used the name for themselves BUT by that they have seized to become Anonymous.
Is it really that hard to grasp? Just because you know the identity of ONE A. Nonymous author doesn't mean that every other book written under that name is linked to it in anyway. Anonymous, the concept to give a mystic to the random actions of people that sometimes seem to work together and groups calling themselves anonymous are NOT the same thing.
MMO Quests are like orgasms:
You may solo them, I prefer them in a group.
Thats because the America Revolution wasn't "domestic terrorism".
From 1770 to 1776 the colonies had public conventions, meetings and publicly complained about their problems with the United Kingdom's rule. The colonies in today's Canada, Barbados, Bahamas and Florida (Florida wasn't part of the US until 1819, and not a state till 1845) were told and invited to send delegates.
While the colonies were complaining the United Kingdom kept turning up the heat by passing more laws and taxes designed to piss off the colonies.
It wasn't a bunch of men sitting around in a basement deciding what building to blow up, it turned into a civil war in North America and spawned European wars between the powers there.
HBGary is not in the business of preventing or withstanding attacks. They're the guys who will investigate events after the fact, compiling nice piles of evidence to hand over to the FBI/police/whomever.
Did you not read the leaked emails? All the slides about pre-emptive attacks, infiltration, planting of fraudulent documents, etc. Interesting use of the word 'nice' to try and paint HBGary as one of the 'good' guys instead of a company planning criminal acts.
The sign on the booth is a threat. Note that "vandalized" was ITworld's chosen word. The message is clear: "Anonymous is here, and has the same utter lack of respect in real life as online." Given that there were many threats ranging from harassing the booth staff to heckling the speakers, and even up to death, the sign potentially serves as a last warning: Let Anonymous ravage whatever they want, or die.
Ok now we know you are astro-turfing for a snake oil security company. Some kid drops a note on a stand with the standard Anon catch-phrase, known by all apart from yourself, and you try and hype up some massive imaginary drama. Pathetic.
It makes sense for HBGary to step out of the line of fire, just in case somebody's crazy enough to act on those death threats. Death is not their business.
Or maybe they've been busted, and have the decency to leave out of shame?
I expect that the sign is being checked for fingerprints, the conference attendee list is being subpoenaed, and security cameras are being reviewed.
Again the melo-drama. I am sure the whole attendee list is quaking.
I'd also expect that HBGary will use this incident to paint Anonymous as a group of people who constitute a real threat
Did you miss the Anon arrests that have already happened?
They stalk and harass a target organization for as long as they're interested, with expenses and lost income costs rising daily.
Do you even read Slashdot? Try doing a search for 'scientology'
This dedication is as much a problem to Anonymous as to their targets, and HBGary is now playing a great game: they're trolling the trolls. With every public move HBGary makes, Anonymous is drawn into acting. That's another 4chan post, another analysis, another page in HBGary's final report on Anonymous, and another customer impressed by the company's thorough attention to detail.
No, HBGary are screwed.
Phillip.
Property for sale in Nice, France
Why is this ridiculous sort of mob justice tolerated ? We've all been in the playground, we've all seen mob justice in action, and we all know what WILL happen. So why do these people get any support whatsoever ?
Are we truly such hypocrites ? Insist on rights, when it's about us ... And then demand and defend swift illegal and criminal action against anyone we don't like ? Is that what is meant by "internet protest" ? Because if it is, frankly, it must be squashed with any amount of violence necessary.
I can't say I'd participate, but I can certainly understand the frustration of seeing an incompetent government security firm in action. Think about the last 12 years for more than a second, and the word 'security'... well, a shiver runs down my spine. The *immediate* surrender of the country's principles and well-being following the bombings in 2001 while dissenters are booed from the spotlight and ostracized. All the things done in the name of security that made us less secure, all (all!) of the money spent on endless, fruitless military operations and grandma groping. Like many /.ers it troubles me deeply, and I see the country breathe a cheeto-stench sigh of disinterest while all but a handful of legislators jerk off on their bases while doing nothing to manage the cancerous meme of security uber alles, all out of cowardice and greed.
Maybe some people think mob justice is the closest they'll ever get to the real thing.
Huh. Guess I'm a little more pissed off than I thought... I'm going to go get some coff... eh, decaf.
"All these years believing you're the signified monkey, only to find out you're just a big hunk of nobody cares."
You're right. It's terrorism!!!!!11
Dear Slashdot: next time you want to mess with the site, add a rich-text editor for comments.