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Making Wireless, Not Ethernet, the Heart of the Network

GMGruman writes "As mobile devices enter the workplace and latch on to Wi-Fi networks — along with devices such as HVAC sensors and videoconferencing that most people don't even realize use Wi-Fi — the typical wireless LAN is unable to cope. What needs to happen, argues Aberdeen Group's Andrew Borg, is a rethink of the wireless LAN not as a casual adjunct to the wired LAN (the typical mentality when they were first set up) but as the corporate LAN itself."

53 of 346 comments (clear)

  1. The number of devices is not most relevant by drinkypoo · · Score: 2, Interesting

    [...]as mobile devices gain strong adoption in businesses, it's not unusual for there to be as many -- or more -- devices connecting to your network via Wi-Fi as are plugged into an Ethernet jack.

    So what? What is relevant is what those devices are doing. Anyone who needs to pull boatloads of data needs to sit the hell down, and at that point, you can serve them with a wire.

    --
    "You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
    1. Re:The number of devices is not most relevant by Albanach · · Score: 4, Insightful

      So what? What is relevant is what those devices are doing. Anyone who needs to pull boatloads of data needs to sit the hell down, and at that point, you can serve them with a wire.

      And where, exactly, do you suggest I plug in my iPad? The MacBook Air requires a separately purchased dongle to connect to a wired LAN.

      Your solution assumes that a majority of devices continue to be developed with an ethernet port. As we move towards thinner, lighter laptops, I doubt Apple will stand alone in manufacturing devices that no longer have an easy way to connect to a wired network.

    2. Re:The number of devices is not most relevant by Huntr · · Score: 2

      Anyone who needs to pull boatloads of data needs to sit the hell down

      Sure, in May 2011. The idea is that, moving forward, let's not have to sit down. Let's be able to pull, process and use that boatloads of data on the go.

    3. Re:The number of devices is not most relevant by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Funny

      I can tell you where to shove your iPad

    4. Re:The number of devices is not most relevant by dfghjk · · Score: 5, Insightful

      You are using an iPad on a corporate LAN and accessing "boatloads of data"? Haha.

      Some people have real work to do.

    5. Re:The number of devices is not most relevant by hawkbat05 · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Perhaps then it's time to refine the overly large rj45 plug into something that will accommodate smaller form factors. Call it Ethernet micro. Most of the connector is wasted plastic anyway.

    6. Re:The number of devices is not most relevant by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2

      Because of the laws of physics: shared collision medium, higher latency, etc.

    7. Re:The number of devices is not most relevant by mcavic · · Score: 2

      What are you doing using your personally-owned equipment on the corporate network?

      See, that attitude (which as an administrator I agree with) goes completely against the concept of wireless.

    8. Re:The number of devices is not most relevant by hedwards · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Precisely, which is why you'd get that response. If the company wanted you to use an iPad for your job they would either provide it or provide resources with which IT would support it. It's really clear that under typical circumstances that they won't provide the support unless they provide the equipment.

      Plus, self entitled assholes like you make it a lot more difficult for the rest of us to get our work done.

    9. Re:The number of devices is not most relevant by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Unlike most kinds of wires (e.g. USB), it's very common for people to want to make their own Ethernet cables. Part of the reason people are often staying with CAT 5e instead of CAT 6 is that it's easier to deal with. Any change would have to keep them easy to pull and crimp. Plus, if you make a new system, you're going to have to replace all the tools associated with it. Every IT pro is going to need to buy new crimpers and testers.

      All that to fix a system that ain't broken.

      Now I wouldn't mind seeing a new cable that's better, but I'm afraid in this case it might be impractical.

    10. Re:The number of devices is not most relevant by Anthony+Mouse · · Score: 4, Interesting

      People are apparently having trouble understanding that there is a finite amount of spectrum allocated to wireless and you have to share it between all the devices in range. At some point all the bandwidth is used up, and if you want more, you need wires.

    11. Re:The number of devices is not most relevant by Charcharodon · · Score: 4, Interesting
      An iPad is not a real device, it's a toy. Besides exactly how much "data" do you need to send it?......... oh wait you are talking about watching movies/video at work not actually doing "work" because anything else doesn't actually take up that much bandwidth for more than a minute or two.

      The only thing thin devices like iPads may be usefull for someday is running remotely software on a hardwired server or a desktop and then streaming it to it.

    12. Re:The number of devices is not most relevant by Comen · · Score: 2

      I do not think it was trolling, if you are doing some serious work, get off your iPad.
      I have a iPad myself, and like many have stated before, its a device used to watch media and browse, you can stream video just fine at WIFI speeds, not sure what else you want to do here, if you really want a good connection plug a wire in.
      Wireless will never top a wired connection, you have to much interference, and retransmissions just at layer 1, its nice and all, but if you can plug in... do!
      I had a buddy recently buy a PC from Best Buy and paid the Geek Squad to hook his new PC up witha new wireless router, the router sat only a few feet on his desk, and still they hooked his PC up using the wireless connection, I changed that for him right way, why would you do that?
      Is the original poster asking for us to make wireless as good as wired? because thats not going to happen.

    13. Re:The number of devices is not most relevant by DarkOx · · Score: 4, Interesting

      I work in IT security at my company. If an end user acted the they way you are acting I'd report it and you'd probably be pretty severely reprimanded for your attitude and if you failed to change it afterward you'd be fired. Yes IT does need to *make it work* if its actually *work*, the fact that'd you would *like* to use your iWhatever may or may not be work. If you have a good reason come talk to us, most security departments would try to find a solution.

      Expecting IT (Security especially) to just get out of the way or have a no request is to unreasonable attitude is just wrong, and I think you will find your UPPER management realizes that. Maybe you are not at a public company that might change things a bit too, but trust me someone will care when they have to put in the notes to the financial statement that something happened.

      Management would be very unhappy if they were forced to report that, our trade secrets relating to the manufacturing we do may have been leaked, that our competitors know our cost structure, that we lost customer data, etc etc. The last on is embarrassing and might cost some current business, the first two could seriously harm the competitiveness of the company going forward. IT Security IS IMPORTANT we are not just your BITCH. We play a role just like every other department. We need you to be able to do what you do so we have job, you need us to make sure you are able to keep doing what you do, so you have job. That is why its called a (corp)oration, we are supposed to be cooperating.

      --
      Repeal the 17th Amendment TODAY! Also Please Read http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/right-to-read.html
    14. Re:The number of devices is not most relevant by Hylandr · · Score: 4, Informative

      The only thing that leaves me inclined to go wireless is not having to pull butt loads of cable through ceilings and attics. Then things like security, PCI DSS and HIPAA are brought into the mix and reality sets in, as I head back into the attic. One of the places I worked at was trying to use an apple airport for a firewall. We were scanned for PCI DSS compliance and gave us a report of every single device on our network. I yanked that in my first 30 days there. Don't even get started on the wireless encryption bit. Really

      - Dan.

      --
      ~ People that think they are better than anyone else for any reason are the cause of all the strife in the world.
    15. Re:The number of devices is not most relevant by Charcharodon · · Score: 3, Interesting
      :) I can give you 1,000mbit connection all to yourself over a wire which you can plug into your desktop/laptop.

      Or I can give you a 300mbit wirelss connection that you have to share with every office drone within 300ft who is watchin youtube on their portable and non-portable devices.

      Even with a thousand fold improvement in wireless bandwidth the unwashed masses will still be bringing the network to its knees while the wired network won't even break a sweat with 10 times the traffic.

      Maybe what they really need is a very short distance wireless router that covers the distance of say a room or four cubicals or maybe not much beyond your own cubical/office. You'd get the benefit of being wirelss without the downside of sharing.

      Of course the bean counters will just say plug your damn device in instead of having to spend an extra 100-200$ per employee so they can be lazy.

    16. Re:The number of devices is not most relevant by lwsimon · · Score: 2

      I look around at the Fortune 100 company where I work, and I note that every single executive is carrying an iPad. I regularly see them pulling down enormous PowerPoint presentations, spreadsheets, and watching Netflix.

      This is the first wave, of course - soon, VPs will need one to feel important - then Directors, then Sr. Managers, and on down. The iPad is on the path to finally cracking the corporate market for Apple.

      --
      Learn about Photography Basics.
    17. Re:The number of devices is not most relevant by Mr.+Slippery · · Score: 2

      We don't make money by having a little walled garden network which isn't any good

      No, but your company loses money, and maybe go out of business, if you have a security breach and disclose vital data.

      You've lost an understanding of what your job is: You job is to help ME bring in money.

      An admin's job is also to help prevent YOU from doing something boneheaded that loses money or even kills the company. (And the more someone spouts this sort of big ego bullshit, the more I'd suggest to admins to keep a close eye on what they're doing.)

      --
      Tom Swiss | the infamous tms | my blog
      You cannot wash away blood with blood
    18. Re:The number of devices is not most relevant by Mr.+Slippery · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I look around at the Fortune 100 company where I work, and I note that every single executive is carrying an iPad.

      Yes, but this thread was about people doing work. Not about people who parleyed social connections into dead-wood positions where they rake in large salaries to get in the way of the people who actually get shit done. (Or am I being cynical?)

      --
      Tom Swiss | the infamous tms | my blog
      You cannot wash away blood with blood
    19. Re:The number of devices is not most relevant by icebraining · · Score: 2

      How many of them actually involve pulling "boatloads of data"? If you have an iPad, you should at most use it for the UI layer and leave data processing to a decent machine (plugged to Ethernet).

    20. Re:The number of devices is not most relevant by mjwalshe · · Score: 2

      some people obviously have zero ideas about basic physics and how wifi works and just how much more expensive a wireless network its when compared to wired one.

    21. Re:The number of devices is not most relevant by cynyr · · Score: 2

      please explain to me how you would crimp something that looks like micro hdmi at home reliably?

      --
      All of the above was encrypted with a Quad ROT-13 method. Unauthorized decryption is in violation of the DMCA.
    22. Re:The number of devices is not most relevant by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      how do your friends daughters and your wife not get headaches from:
      tv signals
      radio signals
      cellular signals
      gps signals
      sunlight
      cosmic rays/cbmr
      garage door openers
      remote controls
      hell just sitting in front of a monitor or tv.

      you are BOMBARDED with electromagnetic radiation all day every day. anecdotal story is fail.

    23. Re:The number of devices is not most relevant by Culture20 · · Score: 2

      net-sec is supposed to be the everyone bitches. To every IT department: you are everyone bitches, we do not care about your concerns

      This is where great ideas like storing passwords and credit card numbers in clear text in a publicly accessible database come from. Sony programmers likely said the same thing to Sony's network security team and sysadmins.

    24. Re:The number of devices is not most relevant by MeatBag+PussRocket · · Score: 5, Interesting

      Your job may be vital to your organization, and you may be "goddamned good" at it, but thats really besides the issue. Any corporate network contains mountains of proprietary data that is placed at risk when people who dont understand how to manage that data (you) attempt to hook up whatever you damn well fancy. Computers are not magic no matter how much you'd like to believe otherwise. Ethernet is not powered by unicorn blood an IT staff are not wizards (no matter how much some of us would like to believe otherwise). Getting a virus is only one potential problem, and truthfully the ability to not get a virus has no bearing on "knowing what you're doing"

      At the end of the day, if your flashy electronic status symbol causes a network issue and then no one in your office can work, it really doesnt matter how 'goddamnded good' you are at your job, you cant do everyone elses too.

      I've seen a number the power-suit, anger-management, "i'm a type-A", throbbing hard-ons; thinking they're the next Richard Branson. its a great wet-dream until you fuck up and get punted from your high horse by people that care about advancing the goals of the business over their own personal agenda.

      --
      i wage a holy war against the apostrophe.
    25. Re:The number of devices is not most relevant by dlgeek · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Easy. You terminate your custom cable at the wall jack with your existing tools and only use the new connector for the last few feet to the device - and you purchase that cable.

    26. Re:The number of devices is not most relevant by MeatBag+PussRocket · · Score: 2

      i totally agree that workplace health is an important part to many things (including productivity) but the notion that an iPad is an adequate replacement for a desktop or even a laptop in terms of productivity absurd. If everything you do on a computer would be no less constrained by use of an iPad i serously doubt you need a computer at all. Its useful for reading email and reviewing documents and the like, but composition is really impractical, If its not a Mac or mixed OS environment already, setting that up can be cumbersome, et al. i mean, its a cool device, but lets not be fooled into thinking its going to be a good replacement for a desktop, ever.

      --
      i wage a holy war against the apostrophe.
    27. Re:The number of devices is not most relevant by CastrTroy · · Score: 2

      How big exactly is an enormous powerpoint presentation? How big are these spreadsheets. Excel only handles 65,000 rows, the data can't possibly be that big. Maybe if you stick some movies in that powerpoint it can get pretty big. I'd be surprised to see a spreadsheet that took up more than 50 MB. Netflix, while having large files, doesn't actually require that much bandwidth, as you have the entire time the movie is being watched to download it. For this kind of stuff wireless is fine. But one you start talking big data, where you need to transfer gigabytes of data around in minutes, you really need to move to a wired connection.

      --

      Anthropic principle: We see the universe the way it is because if it were different we would not be here to see it.
    28. Re:The number of devices is not most relevant by Bacon+Bits · · Score: 2

      Your NetFlix comment makes me think you're being sarcastic, but let's take the comments seriously:

      I look around at the Fortune 100 company where I work, and I note that every single executive is carrying an iPad.

      Again, you need to find someone doing real work on an iPad. Executives don't do real work on a computer. They pay other people to do that. They do their real work on the telephone and face-to-face.

      I regularly see them pulling down enormous PowerPoint presentations, spreadsheets, and watching Netflix.

      They're viewing. Viewing is not working on the device. Creating is doing working on the device. In this case the iPad is little better than a printed document or a DVD player.

      --
      The road to tyranny has always been paved with claims of necessity.
    29. Re:The number of devices is not most relevant by Anthony+Mouse · · Score: 2

      There is no more spectrum. You can't manufacture it, you can only reallocate it. There still comes a point at which all of the allocated spectrum is consumed and there is no more, and that scarcity means that it isn't exactly cheap.

      Efficiency has the same limits. If you already have something which is 50% efficient (i.e. 50% of the Shannon limit), it is physically impossible to more than double your available bandwidth through efficiency improvements, and in practice you can't even do that.

    30. Re:The number of devices is not most relevant by satcomjimmy · · Score: 2

      Anyone who needs to pull boatloads of data needs to sit the hell down

      Sure, in May 2011. The idea is that, moving forward, let's not have to sit down. Let's be able to pull, process and use that boatloads of data on the go.

      When you develop 802.11z which utilizes different frequencies and gets you the bandwidth you need on a channel scheme that mitigates interference among the hundreds of people that share the space you want to connect in, let us know. Until then, trust the network engineers in the discussion that explain what you want is not always feasible, at any cost. 802.11n will not fix the problem, though it does help. It is also expensive and still inherently not in the same category of wired networking for all of the same reasons that every other version of wireless networking has always lagged behind the wired LAN.

    31. Re:The number of devices is not most relevant by newcastlejon · · Score: 2

      Think video production, 3d animation, CAD, etc. We are talking multi GB of part files, or TB of raw video footage.

      Not on an iPad though. As has been mentioned before, wi-fi is quite adequate for streaming whatever you might need.

      You're not doing real CAD on an iPad, though you might be using one to view a model.

      You're not doing real video editing on an iPad either, though you might be trimming or resizing some home movies.

      You're definitely not working with TB of footage on a device with less than 100GB of memory.

      --
      If God forks the Universe every time you roll a die, he'd better have a damned good memory.
    32. Re:The number of devices is not most relevant by lpp · · Score: 2

      But that versus my wife's head, it'll be a no brainer.

      I don't think I need to add anything here.

    33. Re:The number of devices is not most relevant by jedidiah · · Score: 2

      Use less lame devices.

      Wireless networking is highly problematic for a number of reasons. Those problems disappear once you use a proper network.

      A situation that may be tolerable for a self-centered early adopter may not scale to hundreds or thousands of seats.

      The idea that corporations should go wireless because that's the only way that some Apple devices can connect just demonstrates how poorly suited Apple products are for business or "serious work" in general.

      "I've followed our glorious cult leader over the cliff. Now deal with me."

      --
      A Pirate and a Puritan look the same on a balance sheet.
    34. Re:The number of devices is not most relevant by jedidiah · · Score: 3, Interesting

      > some people obviously have zero ideas about basic physics and how wifi works and just how much more expensive a wireless network its when compared to wired one.

      It's almost as if these conspicuous consumers like to brag about their willful ignorance while denigrating anyone with a clue or more interesting requirements.

      --
      A Pirate and a Puritan look the same on a balance sheet.
    35. Re:The number of devices is not most relevant by RogerWilco · · Score: 2

      We are nowhere near 100% utilization of spectrum, though.

      We are much closer to that than you might think. Only certain frequencies are suitable for certain applications. There are actual physical limitations.

      I'm working in radioastronomy. There is a serious chance that in the near future only a few remote locations on earth and the backside of the moon will be suitable for any kind of scientific work. Most of the spectrum in most of the inhabited world is allocated and being used. A few frequency ranges are reserved for radioastronomy, but there is a lot of commercial pressure on governments to give that up.

      I predict an astronomical observatory on the backside of the moon before 2050. If trends continue, by then it will be the only radio-quiet place left.

      --
      RogerWilco the Adventurous Janitor
    36. Re:The number of devices is not most relevant by MikeBabcock · · Score: 2

      I suggest you not believe your iPad was designed to handle serious GB or TB of data transfers and use a real computer.

      PS blame Apple for not being enterprise-ready, not the enterprise for ignoring Apple's stubbornness.

      --
      - Michael T. Babcock (Yes, I blog)
    37. Re:The number of devices is not most relevant by yuri+benjamin · · Score: 2

      As I always said,
      Do not underestimate the bandwidth of a pack mule loaded with DAT tapes.
      Or an African swallow carrying an SD card.

      Or two African swallows carrying a 2TB portable drive between them (assuming a 2TB portable drive is about as heavy as a coconut).

      --
      You make the mistake of thinking you can educate the fundamental stupidity out of people. You can't.
  2. Too bad it won't work by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    High latency, low throughput, and a shared collision domain.
    What's not to like?

    1. Re:Too bad it won't work by Idbar · · Score: 2

      You also missed interference. If there's something you don't want is a clown with a jammer bringing all your network down (in addition to having probably a security leak if they patiently listen to your high-demanded service - which brings the topic of extreme overhead in packet transmissions for security reasons).

      Not to say that wireless is good and useful. But wired is and always been more reliable since people use switches instead of hubs. But perhaps what this guy is proposing is creating a "wireless switch" that avoids such collisions and interference from the outside world.

    2. Re:Too bad it won't work by hairyfish · · Score: 2

      Lol, mod up. I manage wireless infrastructure for a large warehouse. We have best-that-you-can-buy wireless, and it's still flakey for all the reasons you described. Give me the speed and reliability of wires any day.

    3. Re:Too bad it won't work by YoopDaDum · · Score: 2

      Yes indeed, for most people interference is the main issue. If you're in a dense area you'll have plenty of others WiFi networks around, with everybody stepping on each other foots^H^H^H^H^Hantennas. Where I work you can't get a good connection close to the windows due to too many interferers from outside. Yeah it would be possible to put your own APs all around close to the windows and win, but it's too much of a pain. People use their smartphones and cell connection. Chalk one up for proper network planning and managed spectrum.

      Now this may be less of a problem in some parts of the US where there is plenty of space and businesses have less to fear from neighbor networks interference. Then the issue mentioned in the article (scaling to many devices) can be the problem: WiFi doesn't behave well when there are too many clients using it at the same time. It's CSMA/CD so it's to be expected. A system with centralized scheduling (as in cellular networks) would fare much better here. Hyperlan, once a competitor of WiFi, used this. But it was as a result more complex, longer to specify and would have been more expensive (at first. The added complexity is peanuts nowadays, see the femto BSs for cellular). WiFi arrived first with good enough and cheap devices, and won the market.

      In any case, the guy writing the article as no clue about wireless. Saying that the main issue is not having a central management covering wired and wireless... Wow!

  3. No, can't be done. by SuricouRaven · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Ye cannae change the laws of physics!

    Seriously, though... wireless has serious inherent disadvantages. Susceptibility to interference, a single collision domain, much lower bandwidth in the analog sense. It's good for mobility, but if you try to run a whole site-LAN on wireless it just wouldn't work - even if you utilised the 800MHz, 2.4GHZ and 5.0GHz bands all at once. Maybe if you put little 60GHz nodes in every room, but it'd be far too expensive.

    1. Re:No, can't be done. by DigiShaman · · Score: 2

      In production, it also doesn't plain work. Even in a small business comprised of about 8 employees and three WiFi APs, packet loss will incur in an area with crowded airspace. Try a shared office complex or anything above the 3rd floor of a tall building for example. File based databases aslo hate it (use SQL bla bla bla, ya I know. Tell it to the devs). After about a month of bitching each day, and constant tweaking and tuning WiFi settings, analyzing with WiSpy, etc, we finally resolved the issue. We hired a contractor to run CAT5e cable. Problem solved, and haven't heard so much as a peep within the last several months thereafter.

      FUCK WIRELESS!!!

      --
      Life is not for the lazy.
  4. wireless networks in critical infrastructure by OzPeter · · Score: 4, Insightful

    One of the advantages of a wired network is that the data only leaves the premises at well defined locations that you control. With wireless networks it floats over the aether in all directions. And before you can say "encryption will protect me", think about how easy it would be to build a transmitter running on the same frequencies as the wireless network and sit that just outside the company and pointed inwards - instant denial of service attack with zero traceability.

    --
    I am Slashdot. Are you Slashdot as well?
    1. Re:wireless networks in critical infrastructure by Amarantine · · Score: 2, Interesting

      One of the advantages of a wired network is that the data only leaves the premises at well defined locations that you control.

      Well defined locations you control, or well defined locations you *think* you control? It is very well possible to do port security at the access layer of your network, but how many networks have that? There's always some outlet somewhere for a printer that nobody uses... Somebody sneaks his way into the building, hooks up an accesspoint to that port, sits in his van outside, and can hack away at your network. Really, wired is not always as safe as people think.

      In fact, i remember a customer with a voip network, and had a sip intercom at the front door... I got sniggered at when i suggested that anybody could screw off the intercom, and had free access to the network. Went into my report anyway.

      And before you can say "encryption will protect me", think about how easy it would be to build a transmitter running on the same frequencies as the wireless network and sit that just outside the company and pointed inwards - instant denial of service attack with zero traceability.

      Zero traceability? Get an Aruba wireless network controller with sufficient accesspoints, put a map of your building in the controller, and it will tell you where rogue transmitters are, including those outside of the building (if you left enough white space around the building map when uploading). Cisco has similar solutions, and i'm sure there are many more.

  5. Why are these things using WiFi? by betterunixthanunix · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Printers? Video surveillance? HVAC? Electric meters? Why are these things using WiFi, when they rarely move and are always plugged into an external power source?

    --
    Palm trees and 8
    1. Re:Why are these things using WiFi? by ledow · · Score: 5, Insightful

      That's no excuse.

      I work in schools (i.e. limited budget). It's just not sensible or practical to have ANY of that stuff running Wifi, especially in solid-build buildings, near residential areas, or anywhere you need something to STAY connected.

      We have HVAC controls - on a Cat5 outlet that we put in specially. The electrician ran it in with the electrical outlets and the AC engineers run it with their cabling happily too - for the price of the cable / box and a little extra labour.

      We have a printer in every room. Usually wired to the same Cat5 outlet as the main computer outlet.

      We have door-controls - same thing. All over Cat5/IP, even down to the individual door activators and swipe-card sensors.

      We have VoIP - same thing. If there isn't a socket where we need it, Cat5 goes in for no more than a phone line of the same length / distance.

      We have CCTV - all wired to Cat5 sockets rather than with Coax back to a central point because that would mean more unnecessary cabling when the Cat5 does the job and STILL supplies Gigabit Ethernet to several other devices on the same point.

      And then eventually you realise - after a while, in any large building, you still always have a Cat5 point within 100m (usually within 10m) and from there you can do everything you need to split it / put a switch in and join even more stuff to the normal network.

      Cat5 is a universal deployment that virtually everything can use once plugged in and can be extended to ridiculous means (i.e. Gigabit to every outlet, so you CAN stream multiple CCTV channels from the other end of the building without having to worry about the wireless bandwidth / interference in between and/or knocking out other systems).

      Whereas our wireless deployments? In the middle of a residential area, we can't get more than 8 machines into a room reliably using Wifi - even with flooding 3 channels full from school AP's - ( and where reliability means "can login via LDAP without having to constantly retry") because of the interference and up/down-ness of it all - training days we only use switches and hard cables now.

      What we do expose to Wifi can be picked up miles away if you want to but can't be used reliably on the other side of the room. Wireless CCTV interferes like hell and knocks out both itself and the Wifi and other 2.4GHz gadgets.

      Yet with wired cabling we can cover the entire building with the minimum of fuss. Diagnosis is simple (green light on switch = working). Things don't change over time. We can have redundant and even circular links. We don't drown out our neighbours.

      It costs LESS than the Wifi crap - hell a run of Cat5 to the maximum run (with installation costs and sockets) costs less than a single access point (without installation costs) if you have decent contractors that aren't conning you. If you have in-house staff, you also save the "profit" that you would have given the contractor.

      Copper cabling saves you so much more hassle and time and money and effort and extraneous costs, if you're being charged sensible prices, and stays that way pretty much forever - use your brain and install Cat6a now and you're save until each outlet needs more than 10Gb/s. Install wifi now and for MORE cost, you get LESS service, LESS reliability and in before you even get to 200MB/s you're going to be replacing them ALL.

  6. Security, Availability, Expandibility. by Bilby+Baggins · · Score: 4, Insightful

    These are the three things that WiFi still can't compete in against a wired network.

    Even the most secure wireless is still much more susceptible to attack then a wired network. Even with the most modern access control and protection methods (which are neither cheap nor convenient) the sheer massive avenue of attack WiFi presents creates a problem for many large corporations. Ask JPMorgan Chase how much WiFi connectivity they have. Or pretty much any US Government building.

    Even if you do as the article suggests and call in an expensive contractor to map out the best locations for access points, you have to find out if it's even feasible to run network and power to that location. Even with the best-possible placement you are going to have dead zones, and the size and location of dead zones will vary depending on the devices used. My Toshiba laptop got service in places a virtually identical Macbook did not- let alone the poor wireless reception most mobile phones and devices provide. So you have to deal with irate users, and try to find places to install additional access points to cover the dropped zones.

    When I worked for a small non-profit K-12 school, during teacher inservice days I always had to install 2 additional access points in the gym so that the teachers could all connect on their laptops, as the single AP currently serving the gym was not sufficient. Even then, transferring any large file from the server or online either brought the network to a standstill or required tethering each machine to an ethernet cord to do the transfer. Most high-tech oriented conferences, the wireless is all but useless if it's available publicly, due to the hundreds of devices all connecting within a limited frequency space and bandwidth. There is just not enough bandwidth in a small space available to deal with more then a handful of data-rich connections. Spread across multiple spheres of AP reception the problem is reduced, but not eliminated! My bedroom is WiFi-connected only due to wiring constraints and connecting from my laptop to my server via VNC or to copy files is very... very... slow. And really, try having a LAN party over wireless- I can run hundreds or thousands of network cables through a small room and connect everything I need for nearly any project or task inexpensively, and know that the network will be robust. Working with WiFi in anything other then a solo arrangement is a lesson in frustration.

    TL;DR - Until security protocol and access control methods are more robust and available; until tools to design, implement, and test wireless networks are more plentiful and robust; and until bandwidth availability is not on par with but exceeds that of standard CAT5- wireless is but an adjunct, a convenient add-on to the main structure of a wired network in a business. ... err, not that I'm impassioned about it, or anything.

  7. Borg by arisvega · · Score: 4, Funny

    What needs to happen, argues Aberdeen Group's Andrew Borg

    So a Borg is giving suggestions as to how Earth's networks are to be set up?

    Careful now, people.

    --
    The three laws of thermodynamics:(1) You can't win. (2) You can't break even. (3) You can't even quit.
  8. Limitations exist on shared media by gavron · · Score: 2

    The limitations of a shared medium preclude its being the "core" of any LAN that is actually seeing sustained use.

    History (skip if tl;dr)
    Ethernet, as originaly designed by Digital, Intel, and Xerox (DIX) was a shared medium. Transceivers sat on very think cable with vampire-taps piercing the cable to provide station connections. That is 10Base5. (10Mbps, 500meter max length). An improvement in technology allowed switching to 75ohm coaxial cable with BNC connectors, three-way connectors instead of vampire taps, and allowed four repeaters instead of the previous two. (10Base2 was commonly called Thinnet, as the coax cable was much thinner than its predecessor.)

    Both of those are shared-media. That means every station receives every other station's transmissions. It's half-duplex in that only one side can transmit in any one time. The concept of "Collisions" and collision-backoff intervals were employed to minimize multiple stations transmitting at the same time.

    With the advents of twisted-wire Ethernet (10Base-T) and having stations "home run" to a master repeater, this didn't change much other than the way in which cable was laid. HOWEVER, it prepared the ground for the existence of "smart repeaters" which would "learn" where each Ethernet MAC address was, and only forward frames to the right ports. This switching capacity led to them being called ... switches.

    NON-Shared Medium comes into existence:
    Switches now allow treating the network as a NON-shared medium. For example, Alice's PC can talk to Printer Bob, while Charlies PC talkes to file-server David, and neither's Ethernet frames interfere, hold up, or affect each other. That's what wired Ethernet is like in today's "modern" network.

    WiFi however is a shared medium. AT THE VERY BEST it would be like going back to pre-switch days. If Alice's PC is transmitting, neither Printer Bob nor Charlie's PC or file-server David can be transmitting. Everybody queues up, and overall throughput drops by a function of the number of transmitting stations. But wait, WiFi has other issues which means it's not "at its very best." Some of these include hidden-nodes, RFI, limitation on channel-use, and adjacency issues. Additionally, most WiFi devices will transmit at the speed of the slowest station. So if you have a 802.11b node, it will slow down the 802.11g or 802.11n traffic. In other words, a WiFi network is worse than pre-switch wired networks by a significant amount.

    CORE vs EDGE:
    When you design a product (and a LAN is a product... it's used by everyone in the house/office/factory,etc.) a design should be based on accomplishing the goals. With LANs that's usually HIGH throughput, LOW cost, LOW errors. For that to work, the "bottlenecks" should not be in the center of this great star cluster of communication, but at the edge.

    That is why the core needs to have the MOST bandwidth. (For some 100Mbps full-duplex wired is sufficient. For some of my clients 10Gbps is not enough.) The edge, where small-bandwidth devices exist (e.g. Android Phone, iPhone, Netbook, laptops) is the ideal deployment of WiFi for three reasons:
    1. These devices are mobile. It makes sense they should be able to connect everywhere.
    2. These devices use little bandwidth. It is unlikely they would normally saturate the wireless network.
    3. These devices typically are complementary... so if a user has BOTH an Android phone AND a laptop... it's unlikely both will be using lots of data at the same time.

    Ehud Gavron
    Tucson AZ

    P.S. "Wireless" as used her is "WiFi" which is wireless Ethernet. So it's not really "Wireless vs Ethernet" but rather "Wireless vs Wired".

  9. Re:Ethernet != Wired! by Tacvek · · Score: 3, Informative

    Ethernet (IEEE 802.3) defines the physical layer (layer 1) and MAC layer (lower half of layer 2). Both of those are specific to wired connections.
    Wifi (802.11) defines the wireless physical layer and MAC layer. Again both of those are specific to wireless connections.

    The MAC layer of both were deliberately designed to have similar frame formats, but they are most definitely not the same. You cannot simply emit a WIFI frame on Ethernet and expect it to work.

    Both utilize the same LLC layer (upper half of layer 2) specified in (IEEE 802.2).

    So, no Ethernet is not a Layer 2 technology, and it most definitely implies a wired connection.

    --
    Stylish sheet to fix many problems in Slashdot's D3: https://gist.github.com/801524
  10. Well, we can. by Cyberax · · Score: 4, Informative

    4 years ago I've helped to manage a mesh WiFi network for a fairly large enterprise. It covered a large building with about 1000 people working simultaneously. It was first intended as a temporary network (they had to relocate quickly, because of a fire in their old building). But it worked well enough to become the main network.

    Keys to success: low-power APs with WDS, and gigabit Ethernet trunks + switches with STP. We used WPA with pre-shared password for wireless security and then IPSec for IP-level security (it was used with the wired network earlier so no setup was required).

    As far as I remember, an average access point served about 15 clients. We manually set all the access points to the lowest possible power level, but apart from that we did no additional setup.