Sergey Brin: Windows Is "Torturing Users"

jbrodkin writes "Google created Chrome OS because Windows is 'torturing users,' Google co-founder Sergey Brin says. Only about 20% of Google employees use Windows, with the rest on Mac and Linux, and Brin hopes that by next year nearly all Googlers will be using Chromebooks. 'With Microsoft, and other operating system vendors, I think the complexity of managing your computer is really torturing users,' Brin told reporters at Google I/O. 'It's torturing everyone in this room. It's a flawed model fundamentally. Chromebooks are a new model that doesn't put the burden of managing the computer on yourself.' Google claims 75% of business users could be moved from Windows computers to Chrome laptops."

Comments

Isn't leaving things out fun?

[Rhywden]

I love how "With Microsoft, and other operating system vendors, I think the complexity of managing your computer is really torturing users" becomes "With Microsoft, I think the complexity of managing your computer is really torturing users"

Re:Isn't leaving things out fun?

[Rary]

A more accurate headline would've been "Sergey Brin thinks managing your own computer is 'torture'."

More interesting is the implication that, with the exception of about 20% of their employees, the brilliant engineers at Google can't handle managing their own computer. I use Windows at work. I can't say that I spend a whole lot of time "managing" my computer. I'm too busy getting work done— and hanging out on Slashdot, of course ;).

Re:Isn't leaving things out fun?

[jimicus]

I use Windows at work. I can't say that I spend a whole lot of time "managing" my computer. I'm too busy getting work done— and hanging out on Slashdot, of course ;).

If you're working for a company of any appreciable size, there is a very good chance your IT department is using AD to ensure that the amount of work you have to do in terms of managing your computer is nil or as near as possible nil.

If you're not working for a company of any appreciable size, the amount of work you'd have to do is pretty small anyway.

Re:Isn't leaving things out fun?

[Anonymous Coward]

The actual translation is "When you use Windows without Chrome, we can't track everything you do, and use that information to make money".

Re:Isn't leaving things out fun?

[whoever57]

. Every year or so I wipe the drive with a fresh XP-CD install, and need to reinstall my favorite programs, but that would be true of any OS, whether it's Mac, Lubuntu, or Chrome. Otherwise WinXP just works

You have the strangest idea of "just works". Needs a re-install every year is part of "just works"? And, unless you are moving to a newer distro, Linux distributions don't need a re-install every year.

Re:Isn't leaving things out fun?

[tuffy]

If you've been using Windows for 20 years, naturally it's not going to seem very hard to manage. But for computer illiterates, stuff like files and folders are baffling - not to mention what happens when they're faced with the control panel.

A lot of people just want some appliance that lets them read email and browse the web with a minimum amount of maintenance. That's why they're out buying iPads and that's where this CromeOS thing is aiming for also.

Re:Isn't leaving things out fun?

[godefroi]

Some things are just quicker and easier when done from the command line - provided that you happen to know the commands, of course.

I'm pretty sure that's exactly what Sergey is referring to when he says "torture". If Windows, by his definition, is torture, then Linux is doubly so.

This is all shocking, of course, given that Google is trying to push a whole new level of walled-garden computing on us. Think you'll get a command shell on that shiny new ChromeOS computer?

Re:Isn't leaving things out fun?

[irreverentdiscourse]

Unless you watch goat porn all day, XP doesn't need to be reinstalled every year either. That's poor management of your own computer, maybe you are their target user... and better suited for a simpler ChromeOS?

Re:Isn't leaving things out fun?

[Eric Green]

So, Rary, what is your backup policy? Do you do daily full backups rotated off-site, or do you rely on a single backup that is overwritten every day? Have you tested your restore mechanism to make sure that your backups can get you back to where you were the previous evening? If you lose a file, do you have a mechanism in place for retrieving it from backups? What if the file isn't on your most recent backup, do you have some way to retrieve it from a past backup? What mechanism do you have in place for validating that Windows updates do not break critical software on your system? Are you using a user ID that has install permissions in system folders? Do you have Javascript enabled or disabled in your browser? Which antivirus are you using? Which firewall program are you using, and what firewall exceptions are needed in that firewall for the software you require for your work to run? What anti-spyware program are you using, and are you *sure* you don't have spyware installed on your Windows system?

If you're using Windows at work at even small companies, you're using AD, where all these configuration decisions are made by the network administrator team and your desktop is pretty much locked down, with the exact validated set of software and OS patches needed to run, and you don't have administrative access to fubar the system. The usual exception is if you're a developer, where you need to regularly blow things away to test your software. Even there, you're better off using VMware or KVM rather than doing it on actual physical hardware.

BTW, Linux isn't much better here, other than that it usually comes pre-configured with defaults that work for most folks for everything except backups. I have glumly come to the conclusion that if I want something equivalent to or better than MacOS's Time Machine on Linux for doing time-based incremental backups, I'm going to have to write it myself, and it's going to have to rely on LVM's snapshotting mechanism to do a consistent backup until BTRFS is ready. Yay team. At least we have SQLite nowadays, not like when I designed BRU Server back in the late 90's...

That said, ChromeOS isn't useful for me. It might be useful for my mother, though. All she does is read email and browse the Internet. The only reason her machine, an HP laptop, isn't a reeking virus-infested spyware-riddled useless pile of plastic is because my brother does all the administrative stuff for her. Otherwise it'd be useless.

Re:Isn't leaving things out fun?

[Hijacked Public]

I use Windows at work and OSX at home and if, under the heading 'managing', you lump having to respond to all the little administrative nagging that Windows does I'd have to agree that is is torture.

Windows can't seem to understand that I'm working on something, even though Microsoft made both the OS and the word processing program I'm using. the OS blits things at me from the taskbar that I don't care about: your AV hasn't been updated recently, updates are available, three or four distinct messages just for plugging in a USB drive, it can't see my wireless network, etc etc. Then you have all the 3rd party crap doing the same thing, which I can't blame Microsoft for directly but can be unhappy that they've enabled that kind of behavior by their ridiculous security model that gives installations free reign over the entire OS.

By contrast OSX, when it has updates, opens a dialog in the background. If it loses a wireless connection or can't find one it doesn't do anything disctracting. If I plug in a USB drive an icon simply appears on my desktop, no celebration of having accomplished that mundane task is launched.

Curiously, with iOS Apple can't seem to apply this same practice of getting the administrative debris out of the user's way so they can actually use. If they don't fix notifications before my phone is up it's off to Android for me.

Re:Isn't leaving things out fun?

[tuffy]

I'm also not sure, even on a browser based setup, how you are going to avoid some sort of hierarchical folder / file structure for organizing your mail / bookmarks / photos / videos / documents / whatever. If people are confused by files & folders in Windows, they are still going to be confused by that in Chrome.

Computer illiterates don't organize things hierarchically, at all. Look at their desktops. Once in awhile they'll put things of value in a particular folder, but most of the time everything's just spread out all over until their screen is filled with icons. Or their email box is one giant list of messages they'll either scroll through, or use the search box to sort out.

For these folks, that sort of organization isn't something they understand the value of, or would be able to accomplish if they did. It's "computer maintenance" stuff which is taking time away from the other things they'd rather be doing.

Google thinks people shoud use their os, shocker

[Anonymous Coward]

Really? This passes for a story, this is a blatant ad.

I feel no torture as I write this from my Windows box.

Another shocker

[LighterShadeOfBlack]

Company bringing out product says competition bad. News at 11.

Negative quote about "Microsoft and others" summarised on Slashdot as negative quote about Microsoft. News at 11.

Is anyone else as bored of this shit as me?

Windows tortures users... what's new?

[erroneus]

The things [exclusively] Windows users experience passes for "normal" most of the time and they never realize the abuses they deal with on a regular basis.

These things simply don't exist in other OSes. Things like shutting down taking almost as much time as starting up? What could be going on in the background in the shut-down process that could or should take so long?

But to be fair, it's not just Microsoft Windows that is the cause -- it's all those damned vendors who feel like they need to install a "quick load widget" with every program. And guess what happens when EVERYTHING installs one of those? Yup! (Damn you HP and all the rest! We don't want you quick-launchers and your damned ink/toner monitors!! We don't want your convenient drag and drop DVD burner tray applet!!)

This is what really tortures users. Any one of these things by themselves are not so bad. But any combination of them will cause torture.

Read between the lines

[Manip]

If you read between the lines, this is a play to take away a user's ability to change the system rather than hiding that complexity to make the system easier to use. The difference is, in principle, about who ultimately controls the system. Google are going to roll out an Apple-like OS that locks the users in and make the same claim Apple makes about a better user experience to justify their choices.

Also, as a random aside, any company which moves their staff to Linux has lost a lot of legitimacy when they claim they have interests in bringing up the standard of usability or the user experience. Linux is far worse than Windows in terms of user experience (& complexity). I wouldn't even compare Linux to Windows 7, I would compare Windows 95 to Ubuntu 11, and honestly feel Windows 95 would win that battle.

Last point, I bet 70% non-Windows, means at least 60% on OS X, and approximately 10% on Linux.

Re:Read between the lines

[SiChemist]

Wow, just wow. So much FUD packed into so little space. It's almost impressive.

True for most users

[Neil Boekend]

Most users I know can not be trusted with managing their own system. Common users switch of UAC, clearing the path for virusses. Common users use outdated licenses of useless AV packages (so they will not get updates) clearing the path for virusses. Common users feel backups are a waste of time or forget about them. Common users install stuff to watch pr0n or puppies. Common users click links in mails from friends, even if it's clear the mail wasn't actually send by said friends. Common users don't know shit about how to use a computer responsibly.
For them a Chromebook could be a good solution.
I am not a common user (although I am not above doing stupid things). I want to be able to configure my system to MY preferences, not some default that makes me cringe in some corners of usage.
As with everything: there is no such thing as a single perfect solution.

Well I must be in that other 25%, then

[davidbrit2]

I'd like to see a DBA, or anybody in IT for that matter, run Chrome OS nearly exclusively. That would be torture.

And I don't have to spend any undue amounts of time "managing" my computer. Maybe a new software package here and there, an occasional security update, driver update, etc. It's less effort than the real work I do, that's for sure.

Re:Echo of Marc Andreesen.

[gmueckl]

The opportunity for browsers to take over the desktop has been stronger than ever with the rise of such heterogeneous environments on phones, tablets, PCs, home appliances, gaming consoles etc. because it's a sort-of unified platform that faces the user and is simple to use with the juicy meat of the applications neatly tucked away in some server room in a totally controlled, purpose-built and professionally managed environment (for what that's worth - shrug). When you're able to target the browser you don't have to deal with half a dozen completely different system interfaces anymore on the client side, meaning you don't have to rewrite your client big time for every new platform that comes along.

And Google actually knows how to run the servers and write the software in order to make a profit. So the chances are that Google will take a considerable portion of the market with this. If this is for better or worse, only time will be able to tell.

You may be doing that more often than needed

[name_already_taken]

I've had Windows XP for almost ten years now, and I don't have to "manage" anything. Every year or so I wipe the drive with a fresh XP-CD install, and need to reinstall my favorite programs, but that would be true of any OS, whether it's Mac, Lubuntu, or Chrome.

Seriously? Do you really need to?

I've got a Windows 2000 install that's still going strong at 10 years old, and a couple of XP installs well over 5 years old. We even have a couple of Linux systems that have been running continuously longer than you keep Windows XP around - we only had to restart them during a UPS replacement. The Mac OSes only get upgrades (which counts as an install, I guess) when The Steve unveils a new version, so the system OS install I'm using right now is however old 10.6 is (about a year and a half). I have an install of OS X 10.5 on a PPC Mac at home that is still working just fine after 5 years.

So, this begs the question, what are you doing to screw up your XP installs in a year?

Even my boss, the resident malware catcher (seriously, I think he actively tries to get malware on his system) is using a three year old install of XP.

I think you'd be safe to extend your reinstall interval.

ridiculous headlines

[ruffled]

Google vs. Windows?
Facebook vs. Google?


Since when did Slashdot become a posting for second-rate articles that are all FUD and gossip mongering when there are actually a whole lot more interesting and thought-engaging articles out there?

Slashdot eds please focus on posting real news again and leave the drivel aside. You are not digg.com and the /. rep does more for the site than your stupid clicks.

Re:Yeah, try installing Linux sometime, boddy

[internerdj]

I've tried. I really have tried to use linux at home. I no longer have time at home to find obscure answers to find out why my machine isn't doing something that should be basic. The reason I have a windows box at home is the same reason I game on a console now instead of my computer. I want to put something new in my machine and it just work; and most users would trade the keys to their bank accounts for that.

If managing windows is "torture"...

[wjousts]

...I'm pretty sure Linux ain't the cure.