LimeWire Settles For $105 Million

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LimeWire Settles For $105 Million

Posted by Soulskill on Friday May 13, 2011 @05:17AM from the pocket-change dept.

eldavojohn writes "LimeWire has settled its suit with the RIAA for $105 million. It's several orders of magnitude lower than the $1.5 trillion initially demanded by the RIAA, but it ends a nearly five-year legal battle. P2P networks take heed; the monster may start looking for other targets."

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Does anybody actually buy music anymore? by improfane · 2011-05-13 05:21 · Score: 4, Interesting

There is plenty of music that is free and legally free. Find small artists that release MP3s then buy an album from them if you like enough (Edgen). Use Spotify if you can.
Buy second hand, RIAA gets nothing. I can live without new music. If you can't control your impulses, RIAA will never die. I'm waiting for the most recent Duran Duran album to get cheaper.

--
Slashdot needs Geekcode | Can anyone recommend any good SCIFI? My tastes: Foundation, Startide Rising, CITY, Ringworld,
1. Re:Does anybody actually buy music anymore? by kvvbassboy · 2011-05-13 05:24 · Score: 2
  
  I am all for this, actually. I feel that small time musicians should setup a "donation" page on their website through paypal or something, which allows their fans to pay them directly for music.
2. Re:Does anybody actually buy music anymore? by Desler · 2011-05-13 05:27 · Score: 4, Informative
  
  Yes. Have you heard about this new service called "iTunes"? I hear Apple thinks it'll be successful in a few years.
3. Re:Does anybody actually buy music anymore? by TheCouchPotatoFamine · 2011-05-13 05:27 · Score: 2
  
  This is the entire POINT of DRM -- they want to make it impossible to buy music second hand. muHAHAHAHAHAHA
  
  /evil
  //especially when you realize this means media can't be handed down from father to son, illuminating the ages for our future generations
  
  --
  CS majors know the time/space tradeoff, but they never get taught the 3rd, crucial, tradeoff of the set: comprehension!
4. Re:Does anybody actually buy music anymore? by Anonymous Coward · 2011-05-13 05:34 · Score: 5, Insightful
  
  Why should it be my mission on Earth to try and make the RIAA die?
  I like small artists and I buy directly from the ones I know, but sometimes I open my wallet for mainstream artists. Do you seriously imagine that even a statistically significant number of people care about the RIAA, much less will actually alter their behavior to try and destroy them?
  I'm no fan of the RIAA suing little old ladies and twelve-year-olds, but all the profess musicians I know are not OK with people getting their music for free and are quite comfortable having the RIAA or anyone else go after the people who are downloading it without paying for it. What they care about, and what I'm happy to oblige them on, is cutting out the increasingly unnecessary middlemen and providing a direct line of purchase to the artist.
  When I was in college and downloading music was new, I (and everybody I knew) did it. Then we grew up and got jobs (well, most of us got jobs) and realized that it was, in fact, getting something for nothing, and that no matter how many window/front door/car analogies you make, that is usually ripping somebody else off, even if you don't call it 'stealing.'
  The fruits of other people's labors has a price - whether or not you feel like paying it. But to answer your inane question, yes, just about everybody buys music these days.
5. Re:Does anybody actually buy music anymore? by Aquitaine · 2011-05-13 05:35 · Score: 2, Insightful
  
  Accidentally posted this AC before. Reposting...
  Why should it be my mission on Earth to try and make the RIAA die?
  I like small artists and I buy directly from the ones I know, but sometimes I open my wallet for mainstream artists. Do you seriously imagine that even a statistically significant number of people care about the RIAA, much less will actually alter their behavior to try and destroy them?
  I'm no fan of the RIAA suing little old ladies and twelve-year-olds, but all the profess musicians I know are not OK with people getting their music for free and are quite comfortable having the RIAA or anyone else go after the people who are downloading it without paying for it. What they care about, and what I'm happy to oblige them on, is cutting out the increasingly unnecessary middlemen and providing a direct line of purchase to the artist.
  When I was in college and downloading music was new, I (and everybody I knew) did it. Then we grew up and got jobs (well, most of us got jobs) and realized that it was, in fact, getting something for nothing, and that no matter how many window/front door/car analogies you make, that is usually ripping somebody else off, even if you don't call it 'stealing.'
  The fruits of other people's labors has a price - whether or not you feel like paying it. But to answer your inane question, yes, just about everybody buys music these days.
6. Re:Does anybody actually buy music anymore? by MozeeToby · 2011-05-13 05:39 · Score: 2
  
  The problem is, and always has been, studio time and advertising. Those are the only real services that a record label produces in a world with modern technology, but without them it's almost impossible for a band to go mainstream; they'll be forever stuck in a small genre or geographical niche. I think a solution to this would be to enourage all bands of any popularity level to identify a half dozen or so bands that are less well known than they are and offer their support to them. That support would obviously vary based on how big the supporting band is.
  A band that is widely established and popular might donate the studio time to a band that is regionally popular but not yet on in the national spotlight. A somewhat well known regional band might invite a local band to open a few shows for them and bundle a song on their next album. An established local band might help a brand new garage band line up gigs that the garage band wouldn't have a chance of getting without help. Imagine you're a band and you have a choice between siding with an RIAA label or the band that inspired you to play in the first place, which would you chose?
  Without a way to replace advertising and capital there will always be new bands willing to sign any contract with a label to get their names bumped up to the national level. And with enough advertising their music will sell to the masses even if it's derivative crap, it's just a fact of human nature. Any plan to eliminate the major labels has to take into account that the record labels do serve a purpose, it's just that the purpose has nothing to do with making music and everything to do with advertising and providing capital. Those roles need to be filled, otherwise new bands will without a doubt be lured in by the promise of instant wealth and fame.
7. Re:Does anybody actually buy music anymore? by improfane · 2011-05-13 05:40 · Score: 2
  
  Most of my music has been passed down to me by my family who have purchased it. That's not pirating although the RIAA would want you to think it is.
  What those artists don't realise is that the money RIAA wins never returns back to the artist.
  
  --
  Slashdot needs Geekcode | Can anyone recommend any good SCIFI? My tastes: Foundation, Startide Rising, CITY, Ringworld,
8. Re:Does anybody actually buy music anymore? by Anonymous Coward · 2011-05-13 05:48 · Score: 2, Interesting
  
  The problem is, and always has been, studio time and advertising.
  It's getting easier and easier to record music on a shoe-string budget, and it's getting easier to promote it yourself thanks to social networking and such. If the RIAA isn't obsolete already, it's getting there fast.
9. Re:Does anybody actually buy music anymore? by spikenerd · 2011-05-13 05:58 · Score: 3, Informative
  
  Downloaders are not the only ones "getting something for nothing". Content creators are granted rights far beyond those granted by nature to control copies of their works even after they distribute them. All of the laws and government-operated judicial system necessary to make this work are provided at the expense of tax-payers. In exchange for these expensive services, and for the people respecting their "rights", the content belongs to the public after a limited time ...except that those lyin' cheatin' thieves have stolen all the value from the rightful owners by lobbying to redefine "limited time" to extend so long that the public never gets anything worth value. Well, as a tax-paying citizen, I'm tired of being ripped off. I want all that content that rightfully belongs to the public domain! That's why we must fight the RIAA--they are exactly what they call us--pirates and thieves.
10. Re:Does anybody actually buy music anymore? by khellendros1984 · 2011-05-13 05:58 · Score: 2
  
  RIAA *is* the middleman. And they're the ones indiscriminately attacking people without sufficient proof of their guilt. Copyright infringement is a crime, and it's immoral, true. But offers for cash settlements are nothing short of blackmail and extortion.
  Regardless of anything else they do for an artist, the facts that matter to me as a consumer are: The RIAA believes that it deserves to make money on non-RIAA-members' music, they list non-member (seventh question down) labels as members, legally attack individuals without sufficient evidence, extort money from massive lists of people....basically, they're the mob.
  There's nothing they can provide to me that makes it worth doing business with the mob.
  
  --
  It is pitch black. You are likely to be eaten by a grue.
11. Re:Does anybody actually buy music anymore? by maxume · 2011-05-13 06:05 · Score: 2
  
  The two biggest music stores and most CDs are all free of DRM, you appear to be flogging something that has already begun to rot.
  
  --
  Nerd rage is the funniest rage.
12. Re:Does anybody actually buy music anymore? by Threni · 2011-05-13 06:24 · Score: 2
  
  They probably control more than 51% of the music provided by it, however, so in that sense they DO control it.
13. Re:Does anybody actually buy music anymore? by butalearner · 2011-05-13 06:27 · Score: 2
  
  If everyone buys secondhand, then how will new music filter down into seconhand venues?
  That's the point: RIAA artists stop making money so they leave RIAA labels and release their music directly. Everybody* wins.
  * As the RIAA is made up of soulless automatons, I figure they don't count as people.
14. Re:Does anybody actually buy music anymore? by Desler · 2011-05-13 06:27 · Score: 3, Insightful
  
  Lots of people care about the RIAA, want it gone, and refuse to buy music.
  And by "lots of people" you mean "lots of people in your niche group". How many average people in Best Buy who are buying CDs give a rats ass or even have likely ever heard of the RIAA?
15. Re:Does anybody actually buy music anymore? by Anthony+Mouse · 2011-05-13 06:29 · Score: 2
  
  If literally everyone only buys secondhand then the RIAA member companies go out of business and are replaced by some apparatus that it is not unconscionable to fund, so people can go back to buying new music. If not everyone gets in on the boycott, it deprives the RIAA of at least some money -- which is that much less money they have to lobby against your interests -- and there is still a supply of secondhand music from the people who don't have enough awareness or conscience to join the boycott.
16. Re:Does anybody actually buy music anymore? by TheCouchPotatoFamine · 2011-05-13 06:43 · Score: 2
  
  This is an excellent point! Add that to the mickey-mouse act, and the desire to make it impossible to share culture freely to generations is being squashed, and the presumption of the grandparent, to presume it's a non issue because of some small, non-legally-binding voluntary participation, completely misses the point that DRM will be a recurring problem for the rest of human discourse. Not 10 years, or 20, but for the rest of our future we will have to be wary of those that would deny information, for in their hearts they imagine themselves our masters.
  
  --
  CS majors know the time/space tradeoff, but they never get taught the 3rd, crucial, tradeoff of the set: comprehension!
17. Re:Does anybody actually buy music anymore? by bws111 · 2011-05-13 06:50 · Score: 2
  
  Yeah, it costs nothing. Because of course the songwriter worked for free, the musicians worked for free, any support people (management, etc) worked for free, all the people involved were housed and fed for free, the building they recorded in was built and maintained for free, all the equipment (instruments and recording) was free, the utilities for the building were provided for free, the product was marketed for free, the hosting for distribution was provided for free, there were no taxes paid on any of the above, etc.
  If you truly think it is 'free', why don't you start your own label? Pay the artists a fair price (unlike what they get paid by the RIAA, according to slashdot). Give them equipment and studio time. Get them to create songs that the public wants. Market the songs for them. Then, give away the result for free, because that is what you believe the real cost is. Let us know how long you can sustain that.
18. Re:Does anybody actually buy music anymore? by TheCouchPotatoFamine · 2011-05-13 07:51 · Score: 3, Informative
  
  That's BULLSHIT. You're hocking ring tones to children on locked down phones. THAT'S who you're cheering for. There is no damned reason a song deserves money when you get right down to it and it's draining money from things that would actually help the world:
  
  it's so easily duplicated,
  it's not a precious resource (there are decades of music, that the RIAA is obscuring)
  it's easily created from scratch
  
  You're saying some arbitrary imaginary dopamine rush needs to be protected with the same vigor as a piece of food that can actually feed and sustain life... oh wait, "stealing" music will get you MORE trouble then *actually* stealing food.
  
  pure ego, man, pure ego. GO TEAM FOSS.
  
  --
  CS majors know the time/space tradeoff, but they never get taught the 3rd, crucial, tradeoff of the set: comprehension!
19. Re:Does anybody actually buy music anymore? by Shippu · 2011-05-13 08:37 · Score: 2
  
  Spotify doesn't really help artists http://www.informationisbeautiful.net/2010/how-much-do-music-artists-earn-online/
20. Re:Does anybody actually buy music anymore? by Lunix+Nutcase · 2011-05-13 08:51 · Score: 2
  
  Hang around in a 5th grade schoolyard and you will hear them talking about the music they downloaded, not the music they bought.
  Yeah because before P2P downloads children in the 5th grade age range was the bellweather of healthy music sales...
Question/Opinion I have about song value by Huntr · 2011-05-13 05:34 · Score: 5, Interesting

According to TFA:

Having facilitated the mass piracy of billions of songs

So, the RIAA settled for $105 million after determining that Limewire helped people pirate "billions" of songs. Shouldn't that, then, set the value of "a" song that is shared? A conservative estimate of 2 billion songs for $105 mill is, what, about a nickel a song? Should use that value when determining damages against Jammie Thomas and anyone else.
JM convoluted O, of course, but I'm not the one settling for relative peanuts.
1. Re:Question/Opinion I have about song value by mckorr · 2011-05-13 06:00 · Score: 2
  
  Actually, that's kind of brilliant. I'm sure some bright lawyer for the defendant will do just that, and I wouldn't be surprised if he pulls it off.
  
  Now, how do we start a class action against the RIAA for price gouging by charging us 99 cents a song? They set the value, let's make them stick to it!
Re:If they can win hundred million buck settlement by MoonBuggy · 2011-05-13 05:36 · Score: 3, Insightful

I'm wondering where the hell Limewire got $100m in the first place? What part of their model made them that kind of money?
Where did they get $105 Million by slyborg · 2011-05-13 05:36 · Score: 2

What amazed me about this story was that Limewire had that kind of money in the first place...how did they get it?
Nothing to do with music by prodigyx · 2011-05-13 05:36 · Score: 2

This money get used to push internet censorship bills like COICA and Protect IP through congress, and into Obama's pocket in exchange for appointing their lawyers into powerful government regulatory positions. The RIAA has very little to do with music. It is an evil organization and currently one of the biggest threats freedom and privacy both in the US and around the globe.
Gorton, the Owner, Is Allegedly Worth More by eldavojohn · 2011-05-13 05:44 · Score: 4, Informative

The owner is allegedly worth way more than that. From the article:

During his damages hearing last week, RIAA lawyers suggested his net worth was larger than that. They noted he possessed $100 million in an IRA account. His Manhattan home is worth more than $4 million. In addition to Lime Wire, Gorton operates a hedge fund and a medical-software company. Gorton's lawyers claimed in court that he made little money from Lime Wire. Maybe, but records show the privately owned company generated $26 million in revenue in 2006 and sales climbed dramatically after that. During most of Lime Wire's 10-year history, Gorton was chairman, CEO, and only board member.

Disclaimer: I'm the submitter so I'm probably the only person that read the article which gives me an unfair advantage.

--
My work here is dung.
Re:$1.5Trillion??? by Java+Pimp · 2011-05-13 05:47 · Score: 2

No, but when they made that request they did so with a pinky to the corner of their mouth.

--
Ascalante: Your bride is over 3,000 years old.
Kull: She told me she was 19!
Re:If they can win hundred million buck settlement by Danny+Rathjens · 2011-05-13 05:49 · Score: 4, Informative

The "criticism" section of the wikipedia article divulges some likely income streams they had. e.g. last year when they bundled the ask.com toolbar and

Prior to April 2004, the free version of LimeWire was distributed with a bundled program called LimeShop (a variant of TopMoxie), which was spyware. Among other things, LimeShop monitored online purchases in order to redirect sales commissions to Lime Wire LLC. Uninstallation of LimeWire would not remove LimeShop.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Limewire#Criticism
Re:If they can win hundred million buck settlement by gstoddart · 2011-05-13 05:52 · Score: 2

I'm wondering where the hell Limewire got $100m in the first place? What part of their model made them that kind of money?
Apparently, because it was a subscription service:

records show the privately owned company generated $26 million in revenue in 2006 and sales climbed dramatically after that. During most of Lime Wire's 10-year history, Gorton was chairman, CEO, and only board member
They also claim he's got over $100M in an IRA account.
I never used it, so I have no idea of what the revenue source was (ads + subscriptions?)... but he must have made a fair pile to have that much banked. And, apparently he made most of it selling someone else's stuff. I've no idea of what kind of business model he had ... but apparently it was lucrative, and somewhat illegal.

--
Lost at C:>. Found at C.
Re:$1.5Trillion??? by Beardydog · 2011-05-13 05:54 · Score: 2

If we all payed for our media, there would be no deficit. Revenue would increase as the big labels create new jobs. The millions of unemployed in the US would be hired to stand in studios, sticking their arms and legs out to act as human anacoustic paneling. Those of us with exceptional talent can try our hand at realtime vocal active noise cancellation. Hint: work on your latency...
A legal double standard by roadsider · 2011-05-13 06:17 · Score: 3, Interesting

I acquired more music using Maxell cassette tapes than I ever did with any p2p software. In any given college dorm pre-internet era, you spent a good chunk of your available time taping floor-mate's records. After all, why else would you buy a 90 minute chromium oxide cassette if not to record two 43-minute LPs? On the equipment I used at the time, you couldn't tell the difference in quality, so why doesn't/didn't the RIAA go after Maxell, TDK, Memorex and the other manufacturers of high quality cassettes?
Limewire didn't kill the music industry. The music industry killed the music industry.
Re:$1.5Trillion??? by zeroshade · 2011-05-13 06:17 · Score: 2

If we all payed[sic] for our media, there would be no deficit
Broken window fallacy plain and simple. The money that is not spent on media is instead spent on other things. Thus there would be no difference. The music industry as a whole is making more money than ever. Even the labels are making hefty billion dollar profits. Learn some economics. :)
Re:If they can win hundred million buck settlement by kokojie · 2011-05-13 07:18 · Score: 2

Limewire is owned by the Lime Group, which also owns hedge funds and other companies that worth billions of dollars. This is one of the reason RIAA went after Limewire, because the potential payout is huge. The $100m will be paid by Lime Group.