Slashdot Mirror
Rooted Devices Blocked From Android Movie Market
tekgoblin writes "Google has released the Android Movie Market to Android tablets with Honeycomb 3.1 and in a few weeks for users with Froyo and Gingerbread. However Google has stipulated that the Android Movie Market will only be available to Android devices which are not rooted. So if you have a rooted Android device, don't expect to download anything from the Android Movie Market any time soon (or at least until a workaround is found)."
Which will be in about a week.
Carl Sagan quotes get you an automatic +5 on all posts.
And I was totally planning on abandoning Netflix and BitTorrent in favor of yet another half-baked movie service!
The world's burning. Moped Jesus spotted on I50. Details at 11.
I didn't even know there was a such thing as a "Android Movie Market", an honestly don't care, I don't plan to pay $3.99 to "rent" a movie to my phone. I'll be happy once Netflix comes to Droid.
sysadmins and parents of newborns get the same amount of sleep.
Google's Android Market != Android
Google dictating the terms of the Android Market being limited does not mean that Android is closed any more than Amazon requiring you to have an Amazon account to use their market does.
Keep on knockin'
https://robbiecrash.me
For all the idiots that are going to complain about Google reneging on their openness promises this was obviously required by the content owners. There is no way the studios will allow any of their precious precious movies to run on a device without them being absolutely certain that they know where the data goes from the network connection to the screen and they can ensure nobody copies it.
Believe me, I know. I run Linux and there is no way to get any of the legal paid for movie services on my computer. iTunes does not work, Netflix does not work, the Amazon thing does not work. (I can only get free services like Hulu).
So it is not Google's fault, Google has no choice about it. In fact they are to be commended on convincing the studios to release their movies on Android at all, because I am sure Android's open source scares the hell out of the studios.
The device IS open. The store is not. Their store, their rules ( actually its most likely the MPAA's rules ). I don't see a problem with it really. No one is forcing you to use their stores.
Now when they start trying to prevent you from rooting, or limiting where you can connect to, THEN we have an issue. Until then, its just a choice.
---- Booth was a patriot ----
Wasn't Android supposed to be open?
The issue isn't with the OS, it's with the store which has to deal with the movie studios supplying the store.
I don't have a rooted device, but I'm not going to access the Movie Market anyway (let me guess it's not available where I live; I haven't bothered to find out).
I see a movie about two or three times a year. When I do, we go to a movie house - big screen, plush seats, expectant crowd - and make an evening of it. Movie, then dinner somewhere, perhaps a beer or two someplace. Part of a full nights entertainment.
Watching a movie - made for big-screen immersion - by myself on a small screen, with distractions all around - no thanks, I'll rather do without.
Trust the Computer. The Computer is your friend.
On the other hand, these are also the most tech savvy users who might actually be swayed by a convenient and cheap (and legal) movie downloading system. Certainly I used to buy music from a certain Russian site because the cost was worth the convenience of high quality music on demand.
Physicist, consultant, science communicator
They are? Last I checked, you're free to use any third-party video store with Android. For that matter, you could run one of the half dozen BitTorrent clients directly on the phone/tablet in question and get your media that way, if you're so inclined - they're not blocked from the Market (and even if they were, you can always install an .apk).
The way this is different from Apple is that there any third-party video store app would have to do transactions through Apple, and pay the 30% cut.
This, plus I gather the MPAA has a part in twisting Google's arm to put certain stipulations in place to cover them. It just doesn't sound like the kind of thing Google would worry about themselves unless there were someone else involved in the deal. All speculation, of course. But food for thought.
What? They aren't blacklisting websites or even blocking third-party apps. They are simply blocking rooted phones from their movie store. Are you going to start complaining that WP7 and iOS phones can't connect to their store either?
Google is not saying what you can and cannot do with your phone. Google is saying what you can and cannot do with their movie marketplace, there's a BIG difference there. How dare Google dictate what people can and can't do with Google's movie store? You ever heard of the old "We reserve the right to refuse service to anyone?" Google is saying if you use a rooted phone, you don't get access to their marketplace. Google and/or the studios are a little worried that people with rooted phones might find a way to steal movies. If you don't agree with the paranoia, you shop elsewhere. It's similar to how some stores don't let kids in groups of more than 2 enter, or allow you to bring in a backpack or large bag, they don't want you shoplifting. Also similar to how certain businesses post signs about not allowing weapons (even though the constitution allows you to own those weapons). They aren't saying you can't own a gun, they're saying you can't take it into their store, THEIR property. Google doesn't want rooted phones in THEIR store, and that's their right. Trust me, keeping out a few teenagers (some of whom just might have been planning to steal stuff anyway) doesn't hurt a store's business, and the maybe 10% of rooted android devices out there won't be missed by Google either.
Eggs
Milk
Bread
Cat Litter
Soda
I can still play rented movies on a jailbroken iPhone.
Apple does nothing that detects jailbroken phones. They don't care.
Plainly Google does.
That is different...
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
Q: "Are you a rooted phone?"
A: "Ummm, why no, I'm not. Yessir. Not a rooted phone at all."
that isn't true. a major difference between jailbreaking and rooting is whether or not the vendor continues to provide you updates. A jailbroken iphone cannot be updated for security or for new features in the OS without possibly losing everything gained from jailbreaking. With jailbreaks, you end up with less functionality in some aspects and more in others and the things you lose can be very consequential.
On the other hand, a rooted android phone does not (generally) run that risk. There is now 1 example of a store you cannot access for now with a rooted android device.
as to your points about polish, your opinion is your opinion but don't turn an argument into a chance to market a device.
as to app count, if this research is reasonable,
http://asia.cnet.com/crave/study-android-to-overtake-ios-app-count-in-july-62208428.htm
then android will have more apps soon (July). And if the graph is reasonably accurate, the pace of android submissions continues to accelerate.
and as we all have read, android marketshare is outstripping iOS by a large clip. Hell, when I got my phone 2 years ago the best choice was an iPhone but even I'm excited to switch from what I've seen. I think the last great benefit to apple is being on AT&T so you can check things online while on the phone, which can be really useful. But I haven't looked to see if other networks support that yet and it isn't an iPhone exclusive.
Which is where one must ultimately make the decision, "Do I really want that content?"
The problem with the direction that the media is heading is it makes the underlying assumption that people need their content. Where in actuality, it is a want.
Do you not see the humour in the fact that one you've "rooted" your "open" phone, you're now locked out of the store run by the maker of that "open" phone?
I don't care how it's different from apple. I'm just pointing out that Android fanboys are just as blind to the idiocy relating to their chosen platform as the Apple fanboys.
You just described what every videogame console has already been doing.
But unlike Android, consoles aren't sold on a platform of openness. If non-rooted Andoid gains adoption because of this, then Google will have done more to neuter Linux than Microsoft ever could.
Wow, talk about fanboyism right?
-Carrier lock. Apple has a much harder hand on walled gardens, what with not even allowing "competing" apps very often, and we all know how belowed AT&T is. Plus, Nexus One/S anyone? My S had no branding whatsoever, no carrier lock, I have built-in tethering and wifi tethering, I can choose any app that I could possibly like without any restriction.
-Android is at approximately 360,000 apps (Androlib), while iOS is at roughly 390,000 (148Apps). If you think an 8% difference is enough to make Android the most evil thing ever, just go have fun with Jobs then. I like how 8% is "vast", though, especially considering this is just from the official Android Market.
-Less polished user interface? Matter of taste I guess. I find the Android interface very attractive, and fragmentation is a term invented by deniers. It was called "flexibility" before that. Flexibility to choose how your OS looks and feels, flexibility to pick your applications, launcher, theme, flexibility to do things that the developers might not initially have thought about, flexibility to make your device your device. The fact you can easily develop apps for Android without having to jump through hoops is a bonus, as somebody who knows how to code but has no interest in publishing apps.
-I don't exactly know why you're trying to make Apple look like the underdog here, because they clearly are not. Furthermore, I've never, ever seen anybody considering both rooting good and jailbreaking bad. Either they see both as acceptable/good, or they see both as bad. You're just cherry-picking negative reactions to jailbreaking and positive reactions to rooting to make your case, which is fallacious.
So I'll let you have fun with your conspiracy theories and go back to customizing my Nexus S. Ah, the possibilities!
Ah, sort of, but not quite. Android is open. Much like a BSD license, when one puts essentially no restrictions on something, one of the things that may happen is that people seek to close it up. You could argue that Google could have gone out of their way to prevent it, but you can hardly blame them for it happening. Ultimately this is just another version of the BSD vs. GPL debate. Whose freedom do you protect?
Further, there are phones and carriers that have these open versions of Android installed, meaning you DO have a choice. Vote with your wallet.
A movie store? Which at this point merely SAYS you're "locked out" of it? Do you not think that somebody will devise a way to have a rooted Android phone go "yeah man, I'm completely locked down! Movie please?" Assuming such is even necessary as we speak.
Fewer apps = less choice = less freedom eh?
Well, shit. I hope linux users read your post so that they can understand how their operating system has less freedom than Windows. Poor deluded souls!
Oh I get it. You're an Apple fanboi.
I didn't particularly agree with anything you had to say, but at least up until now they've been facts (albeit ones spun to your liking). Now you're annointing your opinion as fact. Not only that, you've wandered so far into the realm of ridiculous that I hope you have a fucking rope tied to your waist to find your way back. How good a UI is has to do with user freedom? Give me a break.
Fragmentation? It's an issue -- for developers. Even if we're going to let you have a pass on this one without spinning it in the opposite direction, you've already included it. It means less apps. Maybe.
All of these being simple flaws in your own argument, without making a counter-argument at all and taking most of your points without contention. Obviously it is quite easy to contend pretty much every single one of them if somebody who actually cares about the Android vs. iPhone pissing contest were so inclined.
In short: Your post is nothing but your opinions, presented as facts. In your terms, it is a fiasco in every way.
People might want to watch a movie on a train commute... where I live an hour each way is not particularly unusual. Also have you considered what could be done with a phone that has HDMI out?
The problem with thier policy is that a rooted device can be programmed to say "I'm not rooted, honest!"
However they had to make this official policy in order to get the media conspiracy to licence their vids. I'm just waiting for the day someone breaks ranks and the most of DRM disappears overnight.
- Fewer apps than iOS = Less choice = less freedom
Then Windows is logically the most free OS, right?
Do you not see the humour in the fact that one you've "rooted" your "open" phone, you're now locked out of the store run by the maker of that "open" phone?
I don't see the humor. I suppose I see the irony, but it doesn't in fact make the phone less open, any more than TiVo made Linux less open. The main difference is that it's not normal for Android phones to allow users to install their own OS without first finding an exploit of some sort, and that is a problem, but I don't see that being at all related to the video store -- the issue here is with the store, not the devices.
I'm just pointing out that Android fanboys are just as blind to the idiocy relating to their chosen platform as the Apple fanboys.
I suppose that's the definition of a fanboy, but I don't think you've shown that. Android as a whole is not idiotic, and neither is iOS. Aspects of them are idiotic, and I don't see anyone here "blind" to the problems with Android, though, curiously, there seem to be too many people who see the Apple App Store's closed nature as a good thing. Still, even among people who own iPhones, it seems like most people accept Apple's tyranny as something they can live with, not as something they'd prefer -- that is, they see it as a worthwhile exchange for a better experience overall.
And hey, AC, at least you've found a way to feel superior to fanboys of both.
Don't thank God, thank a doctor!
Let's look at how open they are:
Yes, let's.
- Carrier locked, walled garden, locked-down out of the box = Little choice, little freedom
This is a problem. However, if the existence of these is enough to make Android "not open", then neither is Linux, BSD, or, well, anything. There are TVs which run Linux, and they sure as hell don't let you install anything you want on them. Those TVs are not open, therefore Linux isn't? Is that what you're saying?
- Must root to be able to use important features
Which?
- When you root, you are locked out of other important features
Again, which? The only one we know of so far is a single video store, far from the only video store. If that's "important" to you, I feel sorry for how empty your life must be.
- Fewer apps than iOS = Less choice = less freedom
Even if this were true, and it's not clear it is, the apps which we do have are barely restricted even in the official market, and you don't have to buy them from the official market. In fact, unless the carrier locks the device, there's nothing stopping you from installing software from other sources, and you don't need root to do so.
See if this helps: Let's suppose that all iOS had was fart apps, while Android has both fart apps and actually useful apps. Would iOS then have "more freedom" because it had 10 billion fart apps, while Android only had a few hundred useful apps that were actually unique and useful?
And I haven't even addressed the massive amount of additional freedom developers get. I mean, let's start with, I don't need to buy a Mac to develop with. I can choose my own tools to a large degree, but even if I go with the official SDK, I can keep right on using my Linux laptop, or even a desktop that isn't an overpriced workstation. If I can make a programming language compile to Android, I can use it -- there has never even been the threat of limiting it to one or two languages as Apple tried to do.
- Less polished user interface,
WTF does a user interface have to do with freedom?
more fragmentation = less flexibility,
Problem: The PC is already "fragmented", and Linux itself even moreso. What "flexibility" have they lost? And what "flexibility" is missing from Android, for that matter?
smaller userbase,
First, dead wrong -- Android actually has a much larger userbase. I don't know where you get that from.
Second, WTF does this have to do with freedom? Again, from this, I'd have to conclude that Linux and OS X are both less free than Windows.
less choice = less freedom
But you haven't shown less choice.
iPhone jailbreak == Android root
I can buy a Nexus S which is literally designed to be rooted. Where can I buy an iPhone that Apple hasn't tried their damndest to prevent me from rooting, let alone given me the tools to do it right in the official SDK?
After jailbreak == You can use all iTunes, Apple App Store, AND alternate sources
After rooting, the only thing I can't use is one video store. I suppose that puts a jailbreak ahead if I were to grant your premise that it's equivalent to rooting my Android phone -- except I don't need to root it to use alternate sources, and alternate sources pretty much make this video store irrelevant.
Vastly more apps == Vastly more choice, freedom
Even if there were numerically more apps, you haven't shown that this is "choice" in any meaningful sense.
Less fragmentation, more polish == More ease of use...
That is the only one I can give you, since:
larger community,
Factually wrong.
Don't thank God, thank a doctor!
not an intention. A door is not "open" when it is shut simply because you intend for it to be open. Shut is shut.
Android's source is open.
Android as a platform is nowhere near it.
Techies care a great deal about the former.
Everybody else only cares about the latter.
But techies have done a good job of convincing everyone else that open source code for Android OS == open platform in the marketplace, in practice.
And the debates rage here on Slashdot as if there was some question about whether Android, in reality, in the marketplace, as a series of devices and carriers, is open. It isn't. It simply isn't.
But of course you can have the source.
Here you go, Grandma!
What's this?
It's the source code to Android! Can you feel the freedom pulsing through your veins?
Um, can I just watch a movie?
No, sorry, can't do that. Just read the source. SOOOO OPEN!
STOP . AMERICA . NOW
If EITHER of the devices does what you want (i.e., in my case - make phone calls, check email, browse intarwebs and store contacts) then what is wrong with either choice?
To me, the phone is a tool just like a hammer or a screwdriver. I don't care whether or not the castings/tools are available for me to easily make my own screwdrivers or hammers, so long as the ones I can purchase do the job that I purchased them for with a minimum of fuss. My iPhone does that. I'm quite sure an android phone would do that, also.
99.9% of other end users don't care either.
I run: Windows, OS X, Linux, FreeBSD. Just because you have a hammer, doesn't mean everything is a nail.
To what end? If the phone you purchased does what it says it can do on the box, then why is rooting it to run custom firmware an "important feature". Sure, it might be a desirable feature for a limited subset of users, but if it works as described/marketed, then I don't see how running custom unsupported firmware is an "important feature" other than for curiosity's sake.
Has any android handset been sold / had official marketing to say that "yes, you can run custom firmware"? If not, then don't be surprised if custom firmware is not supported.
I run: Windows, OS X, Linux, FreeBSD. Just because you have a hammer, doesn't mean everything is a nail.
And it's not the Android Market itself - it's the movie market...
I have no intention of watching a movie on my QVGA screen, so I'm sticking with Cyanogenmod.
Why? I bought my phone in the store, not from my carrier. Samsung does not prevent me from using a custom ROM. There is nothing in my contract barring me from using any phone I want. You are spreading FUD.
You're right. If you remove the movie studio oligarchies, then there won't be any major motion pictures; to pay for, or to pirate. Problem solved!
"National Security is the chief cause of national insecurity." - Celine's First Law
I don't care *who* 'wants' it, Google is going along with it (and has been going along with it from even before movie studios were involved). The whole reality that one has to root/jailbreak your phone means the vendor is not being completely open.
Though less 'open', WebOS at least gives end users more sanctioned control over their device. You enter a well-documented code to enable the option to provide root shell and sideload applications. Too bad they have not seen success in the market, *but* I would encourage people seeking a device that gives them control to consider it a haven from iOS, Android, BalckBerry, and WP7 devices. I personally will only buy a phone that needs such BS as 'jailbreaking' when I simply have no option left. I don't care how 'easy' it is *unless* the manufacturer comes right out and officially says "here you go, we have no intent on restricting you in the future, have fun" (see http://developer.palm.com/blog/2011/05/10-reasons-for-geeks-to-love-hp-webos/ number 2). I don't want to be stuck in a fight with the company I gave money to for the duration of my ownership of it.
OpenMoko also is open *and* gives ultimate control, but unfortunately is a pretty impractical platform for a lot of the stuff people want to do with their handheld devices.
XML is like violence. If it doesn't solve the problem, use more.
Just goes to show how, yet again....piracy wins!
So true. They've just driven everyone with a rooted phone to seek alternate sources of entertainment. I don't know what all the options are, but one of the easiest, cheapest, and most popular is "for free from the internet".
Media companies are hilarious. I can download full-sized Blu-Ray rips from the protocol that shall remain nameless on the day of release, but they are protecting the crappy Android quality movie files from the most savvy users.
W..w..W - Willy Waterloo washes Warren Wiggins who is washing Waldo Woo.
There's no walled garden. There's a door that has a requirement to enter, but I can just walk around and use a different door to get to the same area.
Limiting access in a single instance != walled garden. I can still use the regular Android market, or the amazon market, or install applications individually on my own, or any number of other ways of getting applications. Sorry, but there's no walled garden here...
That means that the source code for Android is available.
It does NOT mean that all the applications must be open source, it does not mean that every app must be able to access everything in the world.
It does not mean that the web browser on the phone can access a proprietary file format that is not compatible.
It means that the source code for the operating system itself is available and can be modified.
The FACT that Android is Open Source does give us, the users and potential users, a great deal of additional possibilities WITH THE OPERATING SYSTEM.
It does not mean that phone manufacturers or carriers have a requirement to allow us to run a custom version of Android- some make it quite difficult in fact.
It does not mean that software developers are required to open source their applications (although some do.)
It does not even mean that Google is required to open source all of THEIR applications.
Being open source does not guarantee the os is easier to use, more stable or more resistant to malware.
Being Open Source does NOT mean that it is trivial to modify the OS so that a user can remotely drive their car with their cellphone!
But there ARE a tremendous number of advantages that being open source DOES provide: since the source is open, once a device can be updated (rooting and exploits usually required- carriers and manufacturers fault, not Google) it can often be updated and extended to be able to do more and work better than it did originally. Usually this is because the custom versions of Android are based on Google's Android, not the carrier/manufacturer versions.
Yes, I use Android on phones and a tablet and I am very happy with them.
Many people are likely to be happier with iPhones and other smartphones, and I am happy they have them.
But the fact remains that at an OPERATING SYSTEM LEVEL, Android is open and Iphone is not.
On a Market level, iPhone is severely restricted and Android far less so.
There are those who claim that jailbreaking and rooting are the same- completely incorrect. Very different indeed.
Jailbreaking an iPhone is more akin to installing the Amazon Market for Android than it is to rooting.
Linux computers, watercooled, photography
I got a torrent client on my Android, that should do it.
I don't think it means anything for the Android platform. I think it sucks that I won't be able to access Movies while running my phone how I want. But, even if I didn't have a rooted phone, I couldn't access movies because I live outside the US. The reason I can't access it outside of the US is the same reason that rooted phones can't access it inside: Content providers and licensing.
If you want to get pissed about locking down content, then look at every piece of licensed content, and how much of it is available outside of your borders. Get pissed off about the fact that international licensing is such a shit show, that I can't even buy mp3s from Amazon's mp3 store, half of the iTunes catalogue isn't available to me, virtually none of the online radio providers work here.
Google wants to provide content to people that people want, because they can make money off of it. But, to avoid lengthy court battles, and providers refusing to profide content, they have to play by the content providers rules. It sucks, I wish that weren't the case. But to try to blame Google, Apple or Amazon for their content having ridiculous restrictions of whatever form, is moronic.
Keep on knockin'
https://robbiecrash.me