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Student Suspended For Posting On YouTube

Posted by Soulskill on from the don't-bring-none-of-that-innernet-'round-these-parts dept.

An anonymous reader writes "A Canadian student has been suspended from school and had the police called on him due to satirical animations that he posted to YouTube. Jack Christie, a 12th-grade student at the Donald A. Wilson Secondary School in Whitby, Ontario, Canada, created the videos in his own time, off-campus."

49 of 375 comments (clear)

  1. Re:Not funny by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Considering he's not 18 yet, he isn't out of place if he's acting as juvenile.. as he is by definition of his age.

    You're getting your panties in a twist in the same way as the board is.

  2. Happens every time by Rijnzael · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Schools in North America at least--if not everywhere in the West--seem to think that their disciplinary powers extend to any actions committed by students anywhere during their years of attendance.

    In my opinion, the only time a school should have the ability to initiate disciplinary action for an act committed off school premises should be after trial and conviction of a crime. Free speech protections often don't apply in schools (don't get me started on that), but a school has absolutely no right to restrict a student's speech off school grounds, and this would be aptly enforced by requiring disciplinary sanctions for off ground behavior be the result of a conviction in a court of law. This school would get laughed at if they even mentioned prosecution of this student for this behavior to a DA, so there's no reason they should be allowed to do this.

    1. Re:Happens every time by Haedrian · · Score: 2

      Schools in North America at least--if not everywhere in the West--seem to think that their disciplinary powers extend to any actions committed by students anywhere during their years of attendance. .

      I remember seeing this young person tossing stones near a car, and this old guy came and shouted with him, demanded to know what school he attended and went off to complain to the headmaster.

      I think its the idea that since you're spending most of your day at school, they're in charge of making you a 'good person' and not just imparting knowledge. At lower levels anyway.

    2. Re:Happens every time by Calydor · · Score: 2, Insightful

      By that logic we should all be medicated and brainwashed to all behave exactly the same, because of the minuscule risk that someone someday might do something to someone that isn't NORMAL.

      Please count the number of school shootings in the past twenty years in America and compare it to the number of children/young adults who have attended an institute of education during that time frame. I'm sure you'll find that children suffer far greater risks in life than another child snapping and shooting up his school.

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    3. Re:Happens every time by sl4shd0rk · · Score: 2, Informative

      Schools in North America at least--if not everywhere in the West

      Dude. Canada. RTFA.

      Besides, if TFA were about a US school, the kid would be from Texas and the video about Charles Darwin.

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    4. Re:Happens every time by Isaac+Remuant · · Score: 2

      heh, that's the problem with "americans". They've been calling themselves "americans" for so long they no longer remember it's a whole frigging continent.

      --
      "Science can amuse and fascinate us all, but it is engineering that changes the world. " - Asimov.
    5. Re:Happens every time by mangu · · Score: 2

      School shootings are very serious and the school staff should be proud of properly preventing it.

      Did they? I didn't know that a symptom of a lunatic assassin was posting cartoons on youtube. Can you point me to previous examples of this? Where can i find cartoons made by lunatic assassins? I want to be able to recognize them in the future.

    6. Re:Happens every time by RobertLTux · · Score: 2

      actually if you want to be precise its like 2.5 continents
      (North South and if you want to "Central" which is actually part of North)

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    7. Re:Happens every time by Opportunist · · Score: 2

      And that headmaster should have shown the man the door and tell him to ask for the youngster's parents' names next time, since it's neither his responsibility nor his prerogative to dictate what he can or cannot do outside the school area.

      A school has no business imparting "values". That's what parents are here for.

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
  3. Fuck everything about this by Mabbo · · Score: 5, Insightful
    "Gavin Russell, prime minister of the student government, gathered scores of signatures on a petition supporting Mr. Christie before two staff members warned him that, if he continued, he could also face punishment."

    I am ashamed of my country when I can read that, and it isn't followed by "The staff members were promptly fired". Believe it or not, the Charter of Rights and Freedoms applies even to high school kids, and no, your petty little school rules do not trump those Rights.

    1. Re:Fuck everything about this by toetagger · · Score: 2

      A spokeswoman for the Durham District School Board ... obliquely explained the school’s actions: “If something is considered detrimental to the positive moral tone of the school, it doesn’t necessarily have to happen inside the school [for us to get involved],” said Andrea Pidwerbecki.

      Looks like at least one more person to add to the list of people who should be fired!

    2. Re:Fuck everything about this by SuricouRaven · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Whenever I see mention of 'positive moral tone' or similar wording, I always read them as 'excuse to stick our noses into other peoples' business.'

    3. Re:Fuck everything about this by Pharmboy · · Score: 3

      In this instance, the "kid" is 18. He is an adult in the eyes of the law. That is what makes this extra messed up. They can't even use the "he has limited rights because he is a minor" argument.

      He is old enough to sign contracts, join the military, and vote. Just not old enough to express himself, apparently.

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    4. Re:Fuck everything about this by Mashiki · · Score: 2

      Unless I'm remembering my YCJA incorrectly at 18 he's still a kid in the eye of the law until he turns 19. In Canada 12-18 you're considered a child under the law. At 12 the mens rea fairy hits you in the head and you get the magic ability to tell right from wrong. At 19 you graduate from kiddie sentences to adult ones.

      Sure at 18 he can sign contracts, join the military and vote. But the law doesn't follow that. Actually in Canada you can join the military at 14 with parental permission, and sign contracts too. Voting not so much.

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    5. Re:Fuck everything about this by bwcbwc · · Score: 2

      Seems like some of those school administrators spent their winter holidays in Florida and got infected. I thought we had cornered the market on this kind of stupidity.
      1) We're talking about high school students here, not elementary or middle school. Even more-so, the student is 18, and is therefore not a minor under the law. Seems like the teachers at this school are doing their job encouraging critical thinking, but the administrators have a completely reversed agenda.
      2) We're talking about (sometimes crude) political expression. Protected speech.

      Maybe the school thought that these videos on YouTube would be seen as being directed to actual children, rather than satire. Resulting in "moral corruption" of youth worldwide. Shudders! But...
      3) Youtube TOS prohibit use if you are under age 13. "In any case, you affirm that you are over the age of 13, as the Service is not intended for children under 13. If you are under 13 years of age, then please do not use the Service." So distribution on Youtube actually implies that the videos are NOT intended for viewing by minors.

      The smart thing for the school to do after Mr. Christie refused to take his videos down would have been to actually view the videos and see if they could get Youtube to ban him for violations of TOS or community guidelines. But they went to the police. Enjoy the show, Ontarians.

      --
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  4. Right... by Haedrian · · Score: 5, Interesting

    The summery says: "Created the videos in his own time, off-campus."

    The video says: "This was done up back in November of 2010, for an economics course project."

    So I don't think its as independent from school as this summary wants to make you believe.

    1. Re:Right... by Haedrian · · Score: 2

      I dunno, if you presented something like that as part of your project, then your school has a right to 'butt in' of sorts.

      I don't think that the headmaster was just browsing youtube, found this channel and decided to pick on someone.

    2. Re:Right... by Maestro4k · · Score: 5, Informative

      The summery says: "Created the videos in his own time, off-campus."

      The video says: "This was done up back in November of 2010, for an economics course project."

      So I don't think its as independent from school as this summary wants to make you believe.

      That doesn't mean the school owns them however, so they have no right to threaten him with calling the police over the videos if he didn't take them down, which the same article tells you they did (emphasis added):

      He said his teachers had no problem with the content – one even lent his voice to an animation – and he didn’t get in trouble until he uploaded the videos to YouTube. He was swiftly given a one-day suspension. A few days later, his principal laid out an ultimatum: Take the videos down or the police would be called. He refused to budge.

      And since they didn't have an issue with them when he did them for the class project (and a teacher even participated in them), they're going to have serious trouble trying to get anyone to believe they only felt like they were a threat to the school's moral values after they were put on YouTube. If they were truly a threat they should have done something when he made them for the class project.

      So that has no bearing on the case. All the signs are that something in one (or more) of the videos made fun of the school principal and he's got a burr up his ass over it and is punishing the kid for refusing to bow to his perceived authority. (And given all the circumstances, I seriously doubt the school's going to win here. Their not doing anything when he presented them for the class project is going to damage any case they might have had irreparably. The fact that a teacher participated actively in one video will destroy any remaining chance they might have had.)

    3. Re:Right... by wrook · · Score: 2

      The summery says: "Created the videos in his own time, off-campus."

      The video says: "This was done up back in November of 2010, for an economics course project."

      So I don't think its as independent from school as this summary wants to make you believe.

      That doesn't mean the school owns them however, so they have no right to threaten him with calling the police over the videos if he didn't take them down, which the same article tells you they did

      It's not just the summary that's inconsistent, but the article as well. What this points to for me is that the article is garbage with respect to actually getting facts on the issue. Nothing about this makes any sense. I watched the video linked in TFA. Personally, I don't see why a school would demand that it get taken down. I didn't see any mention of the school (but it's possible I missed it). But, some schools are staffed by jerks. It's possible they went overboard.

      The really weird thing is that the police are involved. And the student is suspended while the police continue the investigation. What on earth would the police be investigating? The *only* thing I could possibly imagine is hate crimes. Again, there was absolutely nothing of the sort in the linked video. There appears to be copyright infringement, but that's not something that the police would get involved in.

      There is something seriously fishy about this article. Unless there is some clarification of the facts, I'm going to conclude that the reporter just has it wrong (conveniently so given the number of hits they are likely to get...)

    4. Re:Right... by mcgrew · · Score: 2

      How can you draw a picture of a principle? Did you mean "principal"? This story is, after all, about a principal seemingly without principles.

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  5. Re:Not funny by toetagger · · Score: 3, Insightful

    In your opinion, what is an 18 year old supposed to be doing, other than growing up? I think he's learning something very valuable right now - for example: It pays standing up for your own rights against authority - something most other grown ups have never dared to try themselves.

  6. Re:Freedom of Speech by mosb1000 · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Not saying anything about it particular to this case, just that its so very overused its become tiring. Pretty much anything can be justified, including urinating on religious symbols and taking images of them (and yes that happened).

    I'm not sure what you point is then. It's not like there's anything wrong with that

    Is anyone else tired of this whole "Freedom of Speech" excuse which always seems to crop up every single time?

    Anytime someone gets in trouble just for expressing themselves, you mean? I think a lot of people get tired of hearing about "authorities" trying to stop people from expressing themselves. I suspect you are the only one who is tired of the "excuse" that people need to be able to express themselves in order for society to function.

    On an unrelated note, if this kind of thing really does bother you, why did you even read the fucking summary?

  7. Re:What kind of punishment is a "suspension"? by Haedrian · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Second, if a student missed any essential classes because he is suspended, wouldn't it make all subsequent classes pointless because student won't be able to understand them (or, worse, misleading because student will misunderstand them)?

    Right, so in order to combat this, a student has to either:

    a) Work extra hard in his free time to study the topic enough to understand them
    b) Fail miserably and have to resit/restudy or waste a year.

    Both of which are punishments.

    Its also rather symbolic. Kinda like being "Suspended from work with pay". Its meant to warn you that you might end up permanently like that.

  8. I hate this summary by drolli · · Score: 4, Insightful

    The question should not be if he did it in his free time, off campus, but if it was related to the school.

    I can imagine a lot of things which one can do "during my free time" and "off campus" which should get you fired from school, even if there is no crime which can be persecuted.

    For example: contacting or ridiculing teachers in an inappropriate way (yes, these are employees and they have rights), the same for students (nobody should be forced to sit besides somebody bullying him at facebook, and if school is the primary contact for this person suspension is the right thing to do).

    All the news messages like "xzy got ... for doing ... on facebook" withou specifying what the content of ... was are as stupid as saying "he got in jail for swinging a piece of wood through the air", which may be technically correct, but could also be a baseball bat hitting the face of somebody after swinging through the air.

    Please dear media: separate means, motivations, tools, and fact of crime more carefully. It really does not matter today if you write somebody an insulting letter which you put up 1000 times in you town to lampposts or post an insulting video.

    1. Re:I hate this summary by MoonBuggy · · Score: 2

      The article also said that "Gavin Russell, prime minister of the student government, gathered scores of signatures on a petition supporting Mr. Christie before two staff members warned him that, if he continued, he could also face punishment."; if they're threatening members of the student government (pointless as such organisations usually are, it's an issue of principle) for daring to circulating petitions, they sound like a bunch of authoritarian thugs and I see absolutely no reason to give them the benefit of the doubt.

    2. Re:I hate this summary by jopsen · · Score: 2

      they sound like a bunch of authoritarian thugs and I see absolutely no reason to give them the benefit of the doubt.

      And that is exactly how they are presented. You don't known the wording for the petition in question, it could very well be inappropriate.
      That said, if the School weren't out of line, they should have agreed to an interview.

    3. Re:I hate this summary by Opportunist · · Score: 2

      THAT is the actual outrage. As soon as the organization ceases to be utterly pointless, the members get threatened to stop being useful.

      It's a bit like unions here, now that I think about it...

      --
      We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
    4. Re:I hate this summary by mysidia · · Score: 2

      For example: contacting or ridiculing teachers in an inappropriate way (yes, these are employees and they have rights), the same for students (nobody should be forced to sit besides somebody bullying him at facebook, and if school is the primary contact for this person suspension is the right thing to do).

      No. The right thing to do is to file a formal complaint, against the student, and get a judge to issue a restraining order.

      Any involvement of the school is only incidental, if there is no action happening on campus to punish. Of course, the victim can also confront the student on campus, and let the bully implicate themselves on campus, with FB page contents to be used as evidence.

  9. A comics early work usually sucks by TechBCEternity · · Score: 4, Funny

    Andy Sanberg said on the nerdist podcast. Film school is where you get out all your bad ideas. so we shouldn't care whether its funny, the only reason we're even watching his stuff is the principal hasn't heard of the Streisand effect

  10. You either have it or you don't by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

    I think you're the kind of person who gets fed up with this whole tired Freedom of Speech thing when you don't agree with what's being said.

    Either you have freedom of speech or you don't. You can't pick and choose.

    I live in Europe where there are many restrictions on what can and can't be discussed in public. I don't admire much about the politics in the US but one thing I very much admire is that if someone thinks something they have an absolute right to say it out loud.

    I can't see the point of urinating on religious symbols but if the symbols are owned by the person doing the urinating then let them. If a lot of people admire such action they will get a large audience and if nobody is interested they will have wasted their time. It is the people who would ban it that I am most concerned about because it is those people who don't have an interest in free speech.

  11. Re:Freedom of Speech by mosb1000 · · Score: 2, Insightful

    All these things need to be protected In order to promote reasonable discourse. If you take anything off the table you risk marginalizing legitimate viewpoints and ending discussion. Expression is much more important than people's desire to go through life un-challenged and un-offended. Anything can be considered offensive or subversive or dangerous or pornographic by the right person. You have to accept the viewpoints of others if you are really want to peacefully coexist with them. Just because people don't say something doesn't mean they didn't think it, and it's better to know what someone thinks than to stop them from talking, even if they are just trying to offend you. Too much goes unsaid already.

  12. Re:Awful attitude by SuricouRaven · · Score: 2

    I work at a school. I wish we had the first attitude, because a lot of our pupils are worthless little shits. But, being British, our attitude is more 'Do as we ask you, or we'll have to tell you again.' Sort of like the UN. There is no fear of the staff, so the pupils run riot.

  13. His mature and level headed reply by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

    He sounds very mature and level headed in his reply to the school via this youtube video, where he says "Jack Christie Addresses the Board"
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AnW2_i0Q_i4

    He also shows talent in writing and his style is something like South Park. The guy could have a career in the animation industry if he carries on with this kind of work. Isn't that what schools should be encouraging?! ... WTF is his tyrannical school for, if its not preparing him for a career!

    1. Re:His mature and level headed reply by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Insightful

      WTF is his tyrannical school for, if its not preparing him for a career!

      Forcing conformity and creating social pressure groups, while quietly feeding the students nationalist propaganda?

    2. Re:His mature and level headed reply by Isaac+Remuant · · Score: 2

      The reply is simply awesome. Not only is he smart but he delivers his point with comedic style and "shock value" as well.

      --
      "Science can amuse and fascinate us all, but it is engineering that changes the world. " - Asimov.
    3. Re:His mature and level headed reply by mcgrew · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I don't know about Canada, but down here in the US the schools' primary purpose seems to be removal of all traces of curiosity and creativity. Ever notice that when budgets get cut, the first things to go are art and music, but never sports?

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    4. Re:His mature and level headed reply by Austerity+Empowers · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Sports bring in the bucks. Segmented academics (i.e. gifted/avg/remedial) costs money, art costs money, band costs money (though sometimes brings in money). This is real life, I don't agree with it, but it's good preparation.

      Also down here in the US, our employers can suspend/terminate our employment for very similar reasons if our names are associated with them somehow. My former employer was well known for terminating employees for any number of out of work/no-work-related offsenses such as: getting in a bar brawl at the local titty bar (purportedly regarding one man banging the other man's wife), publishing some anti-Chinese government screed after having been sent there for 6 months by said employer, and expressing displeasure at the termination of another employee for recreational marijuana use off-campus and after hours.

      I think the kid is getting a taste of what being an adult is like, and I hope he likes it as poorly as we do. I don't know what legal protections are offered in Canada for this sort of thing, but this is what freedom of speech really means, at least down here. It's free assuming you can afford it.

    5. Re:His mature and level headed reply by HungryHobo · · Score: 2

      have you.... actually watched the videos at all?
      they aren't happy slapping videos.

    6. Re:His mature and level headed reply by HungryHobo · · Score: 2

      If the videos contained death threats or some such then talking about teenagers thinking they were immune to consequences would make sense.

      These though are just some slightly crappy absurdist humor.

      There's nothing particularly offensive or hateful in them unless you happen to care a great deal about joe lieberman.

      You do know that most teenagers think happy slapping videos are retarded too right?

  14. Police? by noodler · · Score: 2

    They called the police FOR WHAT???
    Isn't that a gross abuse of power?

  15. Re:Not funny by LWATCDR · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Actually I would say it is offensive mindless crap. But then so is much of what is on YouTube and frankly Slashdot. Sorry but the people that did this should be dismissed. I don't know how they thought that they could get away with punishing a student for putting this on YouTube. If the goal was for people to not see it they failed completely. The student is now a hero and more people will now see this crap than ever. If was to protect the school that was also a failure. But then I still don't know how that school district got away with spying on those kids with their laptops! No jail time and no mass dismissal in that case so I guess anything is possible. I hope Canadians all over the country protest this action. Too bad that they will be fighting for crap like this video but in this case it really is the principle that matters and not the actual content.

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  16. It's super effective! by Jesus_666 · · Score: 4, Funny

    Who needs Transformers when you have a school that can turn into Barbara Streisand?

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  17. Oh, come on. by Jesus_666 · · Score: 5, Informative

    Everyone knows that satire means you're dangerous. Let me explain:

    Satire means you have no respect for authority.
    Having no respect for authority means you have no respect for the police.
    Having no respect for the police means you have no respect for their guns.
    Having no respect for guns means you place no value on your own life.
    If you place no value on your own life, why place a value on other people's lifes?
    And since you value neither your own life nor that of anyone else you're practically guaranteed to commit at least a murder-suicide.

    Satirists should be shot and then carpet-bombed for the safety of us all.

    --
    USE HOT GRITS WITH STATUE OF NATALIE PORTMAN (NAKED AND PETRIFIED)
  18. Re:Not funny by Opportunist · · Score: 3, Insightful

    What changes magically in a human being in those few nanoseconds before and after the 18th birthday? That's something nobody ever managed to explain to me sensibly.

    We want to put a discrete point in time on something that is a gradual process spanning years. I know people who were responsible and mature before they were 14, and others who might have a chance to reach it should they live to 40. And while both are certainly the extremes, 18 will at best be the median age people mature at.

    And since we put so much emphasis on this special quality "maturity", and so many laws, regulations, duties and privileges hang on it, from voting to driving to sex and criminal offenses, simply doing a "one size fits all" is most certainly going to end up with a lot of wrong decisions.

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  19. Re:Not available in your country by Nimatek · · Score: 2

    It's actually Germany's fault. The GEMA ruined our youtubes. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gesellschaft_f%C3%BCr_musikalische_Auff%C3%BChrungs-_und_mechanische_Vervielf%C3%A4ltigungsrechte

  20. Re:Something stuck out to me... by mysidia · · Score: 2

    Apparently petitions are also banned by the cryptofascists who run this school.

    Maybe time to start a Slashdot.org petition and letter writing, and phone complaint campaign....

    Dear. Principal XXX XXXX

    Please kindly reinstate Mr. Christie, apologize to this person, and compensate him for the unjust misbehavior of you and your school, and immoral suppression of expression.

    Regards,

    The very irritated intellectual community you have angered.

  21. Couple of points by RogueWarrior65 · · Score: 2

    1) How is it that school administrators had the time to look at this drek? Is this what we're paying them unhealthy sums of money to do?
    2) I dare say that if this happened in the good old U.S. of A., the ACLU would be all over the school like stink on sh*t bleating about First Amendment rights.

  22. Re:What kind of punishment is a "suspension"? by Velex · · Score: 2

    Undoing some mods to reply, but c'est la vie.

    I thought being forced to go somewhere and spend time around people who were routinely abusive towards me was punishment.

    Seriously. I'm almost 30. Some scars never heal, I guess. At least I didn't go through with killing myself.

    I've been in and out of talk therapy since I got away from that torture, but talk therapy isn't worth a damn.

    Yeah, I know, someone's going to call me a pussy for posting this. I don't care. Bullying is a problem. For me, bullying caused me a life-long psychological problem.

    You can call me a pussy and make fun of me some more for it, I don't care. I'm the one who has to deal with it. I guess if it hasn't gone away by now it's not going to.

    A lot of times I wonder what I might have been capable of if I hadn't been forced into a school that seemed hell-bent on systematically destroying my self-esteem. One smart kid somewhere else gets encouraged by his teachers to use his knowledge to find new medicines and cure diseases. This smart kid gets a threat to get the FBI involved when all he wanted to do was find other kids who were interested in programming. Good times. I'm all grown up now so why should I give a shit I guess.

    I keep trying to recover from my problem, but the worst thing that public school did was teach me that despite having a 160 IQ and all the talent that god gave me, in the end I'm worthless. That takes away all motivation to solve my problem.

    Go ahead and call me a faggot pussy. I don't care. I'll just drink another beer. You're not going to hurt me any more than I already am. I'm just pointing out a problem with modern factory-style education that causes a sub-optimal allocation of resources. My money could feed starving children in worse parts of the world. Instead, I give it to the guy at the liquor store for some more booze. God gave me a lot of talent, but my will to live was crushed by my schooling. I'm not trying to toot my own horn. That was god's choice, and I wish I could use it better. C'est la vie.

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  23. Re:Not funny by mr_mischief · · Score: 2

    Honestly, while I've visited Canada I've never lived there. However, being from the uptight US midwest, I have to say the part that would have bothered most schools where I'm from more than anything is the offer of cocaine to school children near the end of the video.

    BTW, while everyone is comparing it to South Park, the time-setting exposition in the titles seems much more inspired by the opening sequence of Aqua Teen Hunger Force the Movie to me, with equally confusing opening titles.