Synaptic Dropped From Ubuntu 11.10

An anonymous reader links to a story at Techie Buzz according to which (quoting): "When Canonical started developing the Ubuntu Software Center, I knew that a time will come when it will completely replace Synaptic. The Software Center is a noob-friendly replacement for Synaptic where users can discover new applications more easily. Unexpectedly, Canonical has decided that it is time for the Software Center to replace Synaptic as well. So, in the next daily build of Ubuntu 11.10, Synaptic will no longer be installed by default. The Ubuntu Software Center still lacks many important features that are present in Synaptic."

Comments

Install

[Jaysyn]

As long as you can install it from the Software Center, I don't see a problem. Did they need the space for something else on the ISO?

Re:Install

[drb226]

Ironic but true. Just like MS preinstalling only IE. As long as you can use it to get Firefox or Chrome or whatever, then no big deal.

Re:Install

[Have Brain Will Rent]

I'm pretty sure it wasn't a question of demographics.

Ummm, well, perhaps, but I was responding to someone who said it was a question of demographics... so that's how I framed my response.

even if you do not, yourself, have a grandma who is technologically ignorant, apathetic, or intolerant (or if you are yourself a grandma who is technologically savvy, depending on what your beef with the GP/GGGP is) you have certainly encountered at least one person who fits the description.

I've encountered at least one teen who was "Technologically ignorant/apathetic/intolerant" - shall we start substituting "teens" for "grandma"?

the alternative is for them to keep rephrasing "Technologically ignorant/apathetic/intolerant" in various ways

Ummmm, why do they have to keep rephrasing the above? "They" don't seem to mind re-using "Grandma/pa" over and over so why not use your phrase over and over?

that's both awkward linguistically and boring

And continually repeating ageist comments like "grandma" isn't (boring)? Come now.

Or you could just be trolling.

If you had a good argument to make you could make it without accusations/insinuations of trolling. It isn't trolling to point out ageist speech, which is a specific type of bigoted speech, when I see it.

You do get why bigoted speech is wrong don't you? That, among other things, it encourages false negative stereotypes about a particular group which ultimately leads to discrimination against members of that group to whom the stereotype does not apply?

And btw the onus is not on me to provide a non-ageist alternative; the onus is on the person wanting to generalize to do so in a manner that does not pander to bigoted and/or stereotyped viewpoints. But here you go, here is a substitute for free: "technologically unsophisticated:" which actually communicates the (presumably) intended meaning without inaccurately stereotyping any group. If that is boring to you that is too bad - your boredom does not an excuse for bigotry make.

And if you don't get all that then I can only suggest you go find your parents and tell them that they and everyone else old enough to have grandchildren are "Technologically ignorant/apathetic/intolerant".

Re:No big deal

[MightyMartian]

Or, alternatively, you can just install Debian. I've pretty much abandoned Ubuntu at this point.

Re:So long as aptitude is still there I don't care

[Superken7]

Exactly. For downloading and managing software, any user will have a far better experience by using Software Center. Synaptic probably features some more things (I don't know what, but regular user's won't care).

More romantic/nostalgic users that really need advanced(?) features and don't want command line tools but still want a very badly designed UI, can still apt-get synaptic. I don't think this is a big deal.

Re:Again

[MightyMartian]

Are these the opening lines to an unreleased Monty Python skit?

Re:By default

[Chris Burke]

Disclaimer: I never liked synaptic, mainly because for me its interface rendered it totally unuseful because it was hideous and not really well designed, plus it was easier for me to just apt-get.
I still use apt-get because its faster, but I think anyone can just pick up the software center and use it, unlike synaptic which I think is very confusing for noobs or even newcomers which are familiar with apt tools.

Right. I like synaptic for finding packages when I don't know their names because I find it easier to browse and conduct iterative searches than apt-cache search in a terminal. I don't see why it should be confusing for anyone familiar with the ins and outs of apt, but it's still just a basic gui wrapper around those tools.

It is not something that Joe Non-Linux-Lover can just sit down and use. I know; I have a friend who is a complete computer novice and is using Ubuntu. He manages just fine, but he doesn't go anywhere near Synaptic. Update Manager is the only way he, you know, manages updates. But when he needs something new on his machine, I have to walk him through step-by-step on using Synaptic over the phone.

Hopefully Software Center will be something he can actually use on his own.

Synaptic isn't it. Despite being, from my perspective, the "noob" way of interfacing with apt. I sometimes like doing things the 'noob' way, but hey, I'll still be able to!

I can't think of a reason to complain. I mean, if I can accept that Emacs doesn't come with a default install (which is much more important to me than a gui apt front-end), then I can handle this. I can't understand the whining. :P

Re:No big deal

[npsimons]

Or, alternatively, you can just install Debian. I've pretty much abandoned Ubuntu at this point.

Seconded. I only ran Ubuntu because it's what came with my system76 laptop; after it started having issues and crashing randomly(!), I backed up my files, wiped it and installed a fresh version of Debian (also wanted to do that from the start since Ubuntu didn't have encrypted drives out of the box). Surprise! My laptop no longer randomly crashes or locks up. I'm guessing it was the proprietary, binary only drivers, but what's weird is that I'm sure I'm running at least one binary blob under Debian that is probably identical to Ubuntu (the wireless driver). Oh well; if you Ubuntu users like teh shiny, that's fine by me. As long as I get to play with my 8 DVDs of science/engineering/sw dev packages, I'll be happy :)

Canonical needs to be more careful

[frisket]

I thought Unity sucked the first time I saw it. It still has defects, but having used it for a couple of months, it works, and it's not too bad.

Synaptic as always worked fine, and doesn't need replacing. But if Canonical is changing it for something else, they need to make sure they don't lose functionality, otherwise they'll lose their best marketing tool — the people who like Ubuntu and proselytise it well.

Unfortunately, Canonical is going the way of so many companies, becoming arrogant and thinking they know best, regardless. They need to develop some humility.