Slashdot Mirror
Could Amazon Reviews Be Corrupt?
adeelarshad82 writes "In the first academic study of its kind, Trevor Pinch, Cornell University professor of sociology and of science and technology studies, independently surveyed 166 of Amazon's top 1,000 reviewers, examining everything from demographics to motives. What he discovered was 85 percent of those surveyed had been approached with free merchandise from authors, agents or publishers. Amazon is encouraging reviewers to receive free products through Amazon Vine, an invitation-only program in which the top 1,000 reviewers are offered a catalog of free products to review. John Dvorak puts up an argument which hints that some of these Amazon reviews may be corrupt."
I trust this guy's review. It's absolutely true
I can't believe I read that entire summary only to be lead into a link to a Dvorak column. It's like the slashdot version of being rick rolled. And I fell for it. Bravo samzenpus, bravo.
"UNIX is very simple, it just needs a genius to understand its simplicity." -Dennis Ritchie
...that I bought my Three Wolf Moon shirt on false promises, I will be quite put out.
--I'm so big, my sig has its own sig.
-- See?
The analogy with payola is flawed. On Amazon, no matter how many glowing astroturf reviews there are, anybody can write a negative review that gives solid reasons why they didn't like it, and negate all the positive reviews if you're convinced those drawbacks are a dealbreaker for you. Yes, all online reviews (especially positive ones) should be taken with a grain of salt, but overall I've had good results from using the Amazon reviews to guide my purchases. (In fact I consult them even if I know I'll be buying elsewhere).
I was invited to join the Amazon Vine program when I was somewhere in the 2,000-3,000 range in terms of reviewer rank, so it's definitely not the "top 1,000 reviewers". Every review that results from the Vine program has a green highlighted link on the review stating it's from the Vine Program with a "What's this?" link that people can use to find out what it's about. So it's made very clear when a reviewer got a free copy to play with.
Technically, all the "free" products are still owned by Amazon, so they could ask for them back at some point. Some large items like exercise equipment are loaned only for 30 days and then picked up. Certainly some Vine members probably eBay everything valuable they get, but this is clearly against the terms of the program.
Books are sometimes un-edited pre-release copies without final art or perhaps printed in black-and-white, as any book reviewer might get.
I've written five star and one star vine reviews, and Amazon accepts all of them.
It's fun to actually get some benefit from posting about stuff you like. Free stuff to review on Amazon, free add-free Slashdot for having really good karma, etc.
Yes, reviews can be shills, emails can be spam, phonecalls can be telemarketers, pages in magazines can be advertisements, etc.. But if you have any kind of a hard time identifying them as such, you've been living in a CAVE for the last generation or so. There's a lot of yahoos out there and you need to take everything with a grain of salt. You needed Dvorak to tell you THAT?
I wrote a few Amazon reviews, then noticed a review that had absolutely no bearing on the item being reviewed. I reported it and Amazon stated that they found no reason to remove the review. I replied with full detail outlining how unrepresentative the review was and how misleading it was to consumers. I received a reply stating that it didn't violate their review policies, and that they wouldn't hear any more complaints about the issue. I forwarded the specific details out of their own publicly posted review policy that were violated, and received a "We'll take a look at this", which was obviously a brush off. Months later, no response and the fraudulent review remains.
I've henceforth removed all of my reviews, and I forward my clients to Newegg instead. Newegg's customer service has been better anyway.
While this may not be directly related to the story presented in TFA, it does speak to the lack of integrity in the Amazon review process when obviously false or misplaced reviews are allowed to remain, even when pointed out and explained to a human being (as opposed to a automatic responder).
I'm in Vine. I occasionally get a free book or food item, and then review it (that's the deal). My reviews are clearly (and automatically) tagged as 'Reviewed as part of Amazon Vine program'.
Looking back at my reviews I don't see where I've been any more charitable to Vine products than products I bought myself. In fact, I seem much less likely to rate them five stars - the barrier to entry is lower so I'll order a free product when I might not have paid for it. Though it's still self-selecting in that I won't order anything I don't think I'll like in the first place, so most of the reviews are four or five (but definitely not all).
And before you get too jealous, remember that reading the book and writing a decent review is a significant amount of work. /Having/ to do a review of something you're supposed to be enjoying can turn it into work. Wah wah wah, but it's not all roses and unicorns.
I have written some quite negative reviews on products for Amazon and they have all been posted. Including the one blasting the Kindle because of its DRM.
What I normally find though is that there are rebuttals through the comment system when my negative review is controversial.
The Vine stuff though - I have definitely seen some reviews that are influenced and have written them off. Now that I know that the top 1000 reviewers are getting free product I will certainly discount their opinions.
There's no doubt there. I recently purchased a book that was reviewed fondly here on ./ and noticed that all the reviewers on Amazon were RAVING about it; every review had 9 out of 9 "this review was helpful" ratings. Then I read the book and found it to be utter garbage, so I wrote a review detailing why it was not living up to the reviews or promises. Within a couple of days there were 9 people saying my review wasn't helpful...but there weren't 9 MORE people saying the other reviews were helpful(they remained at 9 out of 10)...just that mine was unhelpful.. I'm 100% certain the reviews were rigged. I don't dare reveal the book for fear the author has mod points...
0x09F911029D74E35BD84156C5635688C0
I'm an Amazon Vine member. I was told that I became a member by the number of "helpful" votes my comments got.
Most of my reviews for things I buy are positive - but I research before I buy things.
As for Amazon giving me things to review; it's true.
Each month or so, I get a list of things I can order (for free, with no shipping charges). As long as I review 75% of the items I receive, I can participate in the program.
I fully believe that the "top 1,000 reviewers" part is untrue. I can't see any way that I'm a top 1,000 reviewer.
I just checked, and I'm in the top 8,000. However, I have over 300 helpful (out of about 400) votes.
1) They place a "Vine Voice" tag in my profile, and by each review - even if I pay for the product
2) They place a "Customer review from the Amazon Vine Program" by each review I do for Vine (free product)
Mostly I get *review copies* of books. These are pre-press, and the same ones that go to reviewers (hmmm). They are printed on cheap paper, are not hardbound, and clearly marked as "not final copy". I occasionally get a small electronic device, but usually a $10 to $20 item. The most valuable item I received was a popular piece of office productivity software.
I have no moral issue with receiving these items. It's the same as sending review items to book reviewers, bloggers, journalists, etc.
The reviewed items are clearly marked that I didn't pay for them. I have given 5 star and 3 star reviews.
The process is pretty transparent.
Remember when amazon.ca displayed real names instead of logins for a day in 2004 due to a glitch?
The articles about it have a bad habit of disappearing, so I archived them here:
http://ciaran.compsoc.com/amazon-reviews-are-fake.html
I often look at Amazon reviews when deciding what books to get for language learning, but 80-90% of comments aren't credible. I still find it useful, but you have to know the limits of what you're looking at.
Expert in software patents or patent law? Contribute to the ESP wiki!
Does anyone actually believe the reviews they read on Amazon, anyways? It's pretty easy to tell when someone's fronting a product.
I've noticed that there are a lot of fake negative reviews too. If the book touches on a political or social issue then the opponents of the book's perspective seem to organize a negative review campaign. I've seen books with equal numbers of positive and negative reviews overall, but if you only look at reviewers who are also identified as purchasers of the book then the reviews massively shift to the positive, sometimes 5:1 or 10:1 in favor. The content of the more negative reviews also suggest that they have not read the book, reciting talking points that are in direct contradiction to what the author actually wrote.
Really? Do you think they're biased because they got a free $2 pack of erasers to review? You understand that they have absolutely no obligation to write a positive view, right? In fact, writing an inaccurate review would negatively impact them, because people would rate the person's review as "not helpful" and it wouldn't be long before they are no longer in the top 1,000 reviewers (and remember, you only reach the top 1,000 reviewer spots because other consumers have found your reviews to be helpful in the first place). Also, it's not like it's a secret if someone is part of the Vine program. It says "VINE REVIEWER" right by their name on the review and points out that the product being reviewed by that person was provided them through the VINE program. Pretty transparent.
Personally, I participate in the Vine program for kicks. I let them send me stuff that I otherwise would never care about or want or buy and am only accepting, for the sake of giving a review on something unusual. I've written positive reviews. I've written extremely critical reviews. They've all been posted. They've never been altered or removed.
Meh it don't phase me. half my posts are modded as insightful, the other half flamebait or troll and I never do anything different than I always do, which is call it as I see it.
As for Amazon I just ignore the top guys and look for the MOR written by average folks. you can usually spot them pretty easy as they do the classic newegg Pro/Con layout and give a nice general overview. Working in retail I know you simply can't please everyone, and what works great for one person might be shit for another. I also know that you will get the occasional bad device, we've all gotten the drive that was DOA or the motherboard that was flaky. When you are cranking things out like flapjacks it happens.
So just ignore the bullshitters and look for the average folks. by doing that so far knock on plastic I've never gotten burnt, even on some of the cheaper junk I've gotten there like my little Zoom Bass Pedal which I absolutely love. Its cheap but it has a nice compressor and a fat fuzz and the built in wah pedal makes it easy to change sweep or level of an effect. But when I looked at the reviews there were a handful at the top that made it out like the second coming, and a few at the bottom that acted like it gave them an STD. The guys in the middle were "Nothing fancy, a few effects are cheese, but as long as you don't stomp the crap out of it the thing is low noise and has some good basic effects" which is all I wanted it for.
So just keep it MOR and ignore the ass kissers and the haters. There are always apple polishers in every bunch, whether they are paid or not, just as there are always those that will find everything to be shit. The key is to stick with the normal Joe reviews and ignore the rest, at least that is what works for me.
ACs don't waste your time replying, your posts are never seen by me.
Really? Do you think they're biased because they got a free $2 pack of erasers to review?
Yes.
If free stuff didn't result in better reviews, businesses wouldn't be giving away free stuff to reviewers.
Medical doctors are highly paid, non-anonymous, well-educated, and government-licensed, but their prescribing habits are still influenced by pharmaceutical company reps giving out logo-covered pens. If an elite group of highly-trained, thoroughly-tested individuals making life-or-death decisions can be influenced by crappy gifts, do you really think some anonymous, unpaid, unregulated, and unsupervised reviewer is going to be more resistant to that sort of influence?
~Idarubicin
How many stars should a product receive that breaks within a half hour of opening the product without being seriously abused by the purchaser?
Oh, 2 to 3 stars, I see that this is a scale that goes from good to great. Now, how would Mr. Sherman respond to that...
I was in Vine for 2 or 3 years. I wrote honest reviews - good and bad for what I was given.
There is zero pressure to give a good review from Amazon and not really any contact from the source of the items. The closest I guess, was that some items had a little letter with them to the Vine member asking them to get in touch with the manufacturer (don't remember any of these with books) to see if the problem could be fixed. I never had to do that though.
There is a tendency for Vine members to get unhelpful ratings from other Vine members trying to push the "competition" down in the reviewer standings. The Vine forums are an interesting place with lots and lots of complaining at Amazon and other reviewers.
It's hard to believe that's how Micronians are made. Why don't we see it right now by having you both kiss one another?
Yeah, I'm no where near anything resembling a high rank, yet I got a Vine invite also. I rather enjoy the program (got some rather nice free stuff, and some crap too, all reviewed honestly), and Amazon makes the disclosure quite explicit.
One of the strengths of the Vine program (vs. vendors mailing stuff to random bloggers) is that vendors have zero leverage over Vine reviewers. A negative review does not in any way impact eligibility for future Vine-distributed products. (I've written some pretty scathing reviews for some of the stuff I've received, yet I just got a 2TB NAS box last month for review.
I will admit that the "This review provided through Vine" note was only after the FTC decreed it was deceptive not to make such a note. Prior to that, it was optional.