41% of Chinese Websites Shut Down In 2010

To answer your question by RobertinXinyang · 2011-07-14 00:50 · Score: 5, Informative

I am in P.R. China and I have never had trouble accessing Slashdot. In fact, it is so reliable that it is the site I typically check if I want to see if the internet connection is working.

Re:To answer your question by operagost · 2011-07-14 01:32 · Score: 4, Funny

I guess if the opposite was true, we wouldn't have heard from you!

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Re:To answer your question by jacksonyee · 2011-07-14 01:37 · Score: 4, Interesting

I've been a daily Slashdot reader since 1997, and I've been exploring China since March of this year. The only time that I've ever had Slashdot blocked was with the Falen Gong article a couple of months back. Apparently, there was a url keyword detection routine which filtered the page out. Every other page has loaded just fine. Fortunately, since I have a shell account on a U.S. server, ssh -D [port] got around it quite nicely.
I'm not sure how it is in the rest of the country, but here in Kunming, if you run a website, you have to have it registered with the police, which means that someone is probably periodically checking on your site to make sure that the content is considered appropriate and "harmonious." It is definitely a big brother approach, but considering the situation with the cameras in London, Homeland Security in the U.S., and the filtering in Australia, I really can't see an open web besides perhaps a couple of the European countries. To be honest, it reminds me an awful lot of the early gated communities like AOL, only this time, we're dealing with government rather than corporate interests.
Youtube, Dailymotion, Twitter, Facebook, and other such sites are blocked on a constant basis requiring a VPN or SOCKS proxy to get around. It's a bit of an annoyance, but most people around here simply use the native Chinese versions and don't notice anything of the outside world. It's only us foreigners that really know what's going on.
On the one plus side, China Telecom has a 3G mobile data plan with a 100 hour per month limit. I haven't found a data cap on it yet, and I used 17GiB last month watching Stargate: Universe. It's 500 yuan for the adapter and 400 yuan for six months, which works to ~67 yuan, or slightly over $10 per month use. Take that, AT&T!
Whenever I finish exploring here and get to Europe, I'll get a chance to see how all of you fancy Europeans have been haggling us Americans about our data plans and cell phones for years. ;-)
Re:To answer your question by Anonymous Coward · 2011-07-14 01:41 · Score: 0

I am in P.R. China and I have never had trouble accessing Slashdot. In fact, it is so reliable that it is the site I typically check if I want to see if the internet connection is working.
I love it when people call China the P.R. or People's Republic... Such a delusional misrepresentation. Do you HONESTLY think that it is YOUR republic and YOU have control? It is more like the totalitarian oligarchy of China - aka T.O. China.
Re:To answer your question by Anonymous Coward · 2011-07-14 01:44 · Score: 0

I am in P.R. China and I have never had trouble accessing Slashdot.
We'll soon fix that. FREE TIBET! FREE TIBET! FREE TIBET!
Re:To answer your question by Anonymous Coward · 2011-07-14 01:45 · Score: 0

"It's a bit of an annoyance, but most people around here simply use the native Chinese versions and don't notice anything of the outside world."
In other words, it's working exactly as intended. :-(
Re:To answer your question by gad_zuki! · 2011-07-14 02:04 · Score: 5, Insightful

>It is definitely a big brother approach, but considering the situation with the cameras in London, Homeland Security in the U.S., and the filtering in Australia,
Cameras in public spaces or being searched before getting on a plane have nothing to do with state enforced censorship. I'm not sure why so many Chinese find it believable that their limits of expression are normal and fit in with the West. They don't. Its just propaganda to make you feel better and not to try any pesky revolution or uprising.
Re:To answer your question by digitig · 2011-07-14 02:21 · Score: 3, Informative

It doesn't matter whether the name is true or not, it's still the name, and distinguishes the People's Republic of China from the Republic of China.

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Re:To answer your question by JonStewartMill · 2011-07-14 02:44 · Score: 2, Interesting

"It's a bit of an annoyance, but most people around here simply use the native Chinese versions and don't notice anything of the outside world."
In other words, it's working exactly as intended. :-(

The Chinese are more like Americans than you expected?
Re:To answer your question by Anonymous Coward · 2011-07-14 02:46 · Score: 0

yea, i concur with that. I had no trouble accessing it in Shanghai. I could also access myspace and soundcloud and several other bif sites.
There seens to be a method to their nadness.
Re:To answer your question by dave420 · 2011-07-14 02:52 · Score: 1

Cameras in London? You mean the cameras which are overwhelmingly in the hands of private citizens, which are not run by the state, and from which anyone can request copies of any footage of themselves they might have captured? It's not really a valid comparison :) The "open web" is perfectly possible in all but the handful of countries which block sites.
Re:To answer your question by Anonymous Coward · 2011-07-14 02:55 · Score: 0

Maybe you're the victim of propaganda making you think that TSA checkpoints and CCTVs on every corner are somehow better tahn state sponsored censorship?
Both are terrible IMO.
Re:To answer your question by jacksonyee · 2011-07-14 03:00 · Score: 3, Interesting

It's interesting that you should use the word "normal" in your post, because here in China, Internet filtering is indeed normal, the same way that you would considering post-9/11 groping to be normal and being constantly watched in the streets of London normal. Do I agree with it? Certainly not, but every place has its own culture and laws, and for the most part, the modern Chinese people are getting along just fine without trying to fit in with Western ideals.
It's actually quite amazing to me how much China has progressed from the days of the Cultural Revolution though. Between all of the new high-tech buildings, the girls in miniskirts out on the streets, the new high speed train which rivals the Japanese, and the huge influx of luxury items, it's hard to believe that this was a nation torn apart and hungry just half a century ago. Now, I believe that the Bill of Rights (not the Constitution itself, due to that nasty 3/5th compromise) is one of the greatest ideas in history, but China has placed economic freedom above political freedom in its efforts to pacify its people, and having a chance to be here and talk to various people, I've actually found that it's working decently well.
Not every place is like the U.S., but not every place is like the Middle East either. I really don't know how the "China model," as it's often called, is going to end up, but to be honest, propaganda is everywhere. How many times have you watched a commercial where everything was true? How many people do you know who watch Fox news or listen to Rush Limbaugh? Even NPR and the BBC have their own biases. How many actual, purely objective articles can you find in the mainstream media? Certainly, we don't have the state mandated media in the U.S. like China does, but the important thing to accept is that everyone has their own propaganda, no matter where they are. It's just a matter of which ones you agree with and which ones you don't.
Do the things that work for the U.S. automatically work in China? It's going to be very interesting to find out in the next ten to twenty years as China continues developing and opening up to the world. I'm curious to see how this huge housing bubble and the enormous debts of the local governments are going to turn out, but there's no denying China's growth and advancement in the last 30 years. With Russia's fade from glory, I'm hoping that some competition can get the U.S. out of its current funk and start being the country that we're capable of being. If not, China will be glad to sell us everything that we need, and once they get past the copying stage and start innovating for themselves, it's going to be scary.
Re:To answer your question by v1 · 2011-07-14 03:11 · Score: 1

It's a bit of an annoyance, but most people around here simply use the native Chinese versions and don't notice anything of the outside world.
Yep, ignorance is bliss.

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I work for the Department of Redundancy Department.
Re:To answer your question by Rincewind42 · 2011-07-14 03:13 · Score: 1

I'm also in China. Never been any problem getting Slashdot in the last 6 years. However, the Great Firewall isn't so great. I can update my Facebook, Twitter and I'm watching Youtube right now. Their not normally available. You just have to know how to jump the wall.
Re:To answer your question by BrokenHalo · 2011-07-14 03:15 · Score: 1

As opposed, of course, to the Chinese People's Republic...
Re:To answer your question by MobileTatsu-NJG · 2011-07-14 03:21 · Score: 1

In fact, it is so reliable that it is the site I typically check if I want to see if the internet connection is working.
You don't do that by clicking any of the article links, do you?

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"I like to lick butts!" by MobileTatsu-NJG (#32700246) (Score:5, Informative)
Re:To answer your question by zach_the_lizard · 2011-07-14 03:40 · Score: 1

No love for Xinjiang? Darn Tibetans get all the attention...

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SSC
Re:To answer your question by Anonymous Coward · 2011-07-14 03:42 · Score: 1, Informative

You know what site my U.S. govt censors? None. Not a single one. They do shut down a handful of sites though. Child porn sites for one which I am ok with since raping children is pretty fucked up. The only other thing I can think of is them shutting down online gambling sites. You could argue they should just stay out of that and collect taxes, but oh well, guess if I want to illegally gamble online I will have to do it on out of country servers.
The point is that you guys don't have freedom of speech. The government decides what words can and can't come out of your mouth. They decide what words can and can't be seen by your eyes. I am sorry that you can't realize that, but it is oppressive. "Do the things that work for the U.S. automatically work in China?" Yes, yes they do. You may have a hard time believing it because your govt wont allow you to even attempt it, but humans are humans are humans are humans. We have all the same social capabilities no matter where we are born. What is in your DNA but not mine that would prevent you from being able to have freedom of speech without tearing each other apart? Nothing. We are the same. These countries try to divide us and make you think you are SOOOO different, but we are all humans plain and simple. The only difference is location and cultural history, which is only significant if you want it to be. Please quit being so brainwashed and help move your country forward in to this century. Your fellow Chinese brothers and sisters need your help.
Re:To answer your question by jmac_the_man · 2011-07-14 03:52 · Score: 3, Interesting

Now, I believe that the Bill of Rights (not the Constitution itself, due to that nasty 3/5th compromise) is one of the greatest ideas in history
Interestingly, the point of the 3/5 compromise was to kill slavery. If a slave counted for one person for purposes of representation, the slave states would have 2/5ths more representation than they got under the actual Constitution. They would have used that extra representation to hang on to slavery for as long as possible.
This is one of the most misunderstood concepts in American history.
Re:To answer your question by countertrolling · 2011-07-14 03:56 · Score: 1

... we're dealing with government rather than corporate interests.
You must be way ahead of us if you can distinguish the two

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For justice, we must go to Don Corleone
Re:To answer your question by jellomizer · 2011-07-14 04:01 · Score: 1

Why would it, anyone with reasonable intelligence wouldn't believe a word on Slashdot anyways. Slanted Stories, Comments from numbskulls like me who just debate people and often will just play devils advocate just to keep things interesting and fight off boredom.

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If something is so important that you feel the need to post it on the internet... It probably isn't that important.
Re:To answer your question by jmac_the_man · 2011-07-14 04:02 · Score: 1

There's a different country called the Republic of China. (You probably know it as Taiwan.) It's like how anyone who uses the phrase "USAian" is an idiot, because, among other things, there are two countries on the American continents with "United States" in their name, while there's only one with "America."
Re:To answer your question by maxwell+demon · 2011-07-14 04:04 · Score: 1

No love for Xinjiang? Darn Tibetans get all the attention...
Where's the Dalai Lama equivalent of Xinjiang? I'm sure without the Dalai Lama few people would know of Tibet either.

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The Tao of math: The numbers you can count are not the real numbers.
Re:To answer your question by maxwell+demon · 2011-07-14 04:10 · Score: 1

It doesn't matter whether the name is true or not, it's still the name, and distinguishes the People's Republic of China from the Republic of China.
Indeed. Just as during cold war, the German Democratic Republic was the part of Germany which was not democratic.

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The Tao of math: The numbers you can count are not the real numbers.
Re:To answer your question by Anonymous Coward · 2011-07-14 04:14 · Score: 2, Informative

but to be honest, propaganda is everywhere. How many times have you watched a commercial where everything was true? How many people do you know who watch Fox news or listen to Rush Limbaugh? Even NPR and the BBC have their own biases. How many actual, purely objective articles can you find in the mainstream media? Certainly, we don't have the state mandated media in the U.S. like China does, but the important thing to accept is that everyone has their own propaganda, no matter where they are. It's just a matter of which ones you agree with and which ones you don't.
Yes, it's human nature that organized groups enjoy pushing their own agenda, and are willing to hide certain facts or bend the truth in order to do it. When governments do it, we call it propaganda. When companies do it, we call it advertising. It's everywhere.
The critical difference here is what a government does when you publicly disagree with its propaganda. You mentioned the Bill of Rights; consider Freedom of Speech. Yeah, it's not carte blanche to say whatever you want (you can't scream "Fire!" in a crowded theater, and recent hate crimes legislation comes to mind). But it *does* mean that the US *cannot* imprison political dissidents like the PRC. And if we tried, that shot would be heard around the world.
(Indeed, the US has other ways of silencing a political dissident, such as labeling them a terrorist, or using the media to marginalize them and/or paint them using loaded terms. That's true and worrisome, but it's not the fundamental issue here, so don't let it become a red herring)
Astounding economic growth doesn't excuse human rights abuses. Just because a system of government "works decently well" doesn't mean it shouldn't be changed.
P.S. Last Sunday I was in Beijing, and visited a certain heavenly-peace-gate square. The surveillance there puts anything else I've seen to shame. Security checks, camera installations every thirty meters, and at least 50 uniformed officers inside -- not to mention a number of under-cover ones. And for what? Not to protect property, even government property... but to ensure nobody can speak out. Tell me it isn't a sickening irony that the current period in history is called the "liberated era".
Re:To answer your question by AvitarX · 2011-07-14 04:58 · Score: 1

They absolutly are better (though both are bad).
We can safely be told the truth about these things, and make a choice to support our government or not.
Society as a whole supports these things (or doesn't really care enough), but the word is out and discussed.

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Re:To answer your question by russotto · 2011-07-14 05:31 · Score: 3, Informative

the modern Chinese people are getting along just fine without trying to fit in with Western ideals.
Ooh, the culture card. To oppose Internet censorship is to be provincial, parochial, imperialist, colonialist, or whatever the bad word is today. Imagine how silly it would be if someone from some other culture objecting to TSA groping were to be told that the US was getting along just fine without trying to fit into that other culture's ideals.

(not the Constitution itself, due to that nasty 3/5th compromise)

You do understand that it was the free states which wanted a slave counted as zero, and the slave states who wanted a slave counted as a full person, for the purposes of representation?

I really don't know how the "China model," as it's often called, is going to end up, but to be honest, propaganda is everywhere.
Indeed it is. Enjoy your job at the (Chinese) Ministry of Propaganda.
Re:To answer your question by arth1 · 2011-07-14 05:44 · Score: 1

It's like how anyone who uses the phrase "USAian" is an idiot, because, among other things, there are two countries on the American continents with "United States" in their name, while there's only one with "America."
Claiming that Americans has a right to the name because it's the only country on the continent with America in the name is disingenuous, because by that measure, the only Africans are those from South Africa.
"United States Virgin Islands" isn't causing ambiguity, because the citizens of that state are ALSO citizens of the United States of America.
"United Mexican States" isn't causing ambiguity, because it's not United States, it's United Mexican States.
America, on the other hand, is ambiguous, because it also is a collective noun for the Americas.
The reason why Canadians don't like being called Americans is because US Americans have usurped the term. Many other Americans have no issue being called Americans. Cause they are, just like someone from Niger is an African.
Yes, USAian is silly. Use US American unless it's clear from the context that you mean someone from USA.
Re:To answer your question by JordanL · 2011-07-14 06:20 · Score: 1

Astounding economic growth doesn't excuse human rights abuses.

In this way I think, sadly, that the Chinese are just buying in to the "we're rich therefore we're right" concept, right as America is FINALLY starting to admit that the ideology has decimated so many facets of our society.

I hope you Chinese citizens don't spend as long wallowing in your own supposed superiority as we did. Wasted some of the best years of our society so far on complete nothingness.

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FanFictionRecs.net
Re:To answer your question by tqk · 2011-07-14 06:36 · Score: 2

You know what site my U.S. govt censors? None. Not a single one.
Does Immigration & Customs Enforcement (ICE) not ring any bells for you? At the behest of Disney, et al, they're stealing domain names, often on the flimsiest of evidence.

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"Tongue tied and twisted, just an Earth bound misfit ..." -- Pink Floyd.
Re:To answer your question by Anonymous Coward · 2011-07-14 06:36 · Score: 1

"China has placed economic freedom above political freedom"
What 'economic freedom'? What are you talking about? Almost 85% of the population are dirt poor.
Re:To answer your question by Anonymous Coward · 2011-07-14 07:54 · Score: 0

I think the biggest difference is that the Chinese, by and large, don't mind censorship, whereas pretty much everyone who goes to the airport feels violated (at least in my experience).
Re:To answer your question by shutdown+-p+now · 2011-07-14 08:42 · Score: 1

Natural languages evolve in non-obvious ways. In English, American means "citizen of native of the USA", and nothing else. This has nothing to do with someone "usurping" the word - it's just the way it is. In other languages (e.g. Spanish, I believe?) things are different, but this has no relation to proper use of the word in English. The fact that some people are so mad about this whole issue would be funny if it weren't so sad.
(I'm not an American)
Re:To answer your question by AftanGustur · 2011-07-14 09:15 · Score: 1

I haven't found a data cap on it yet, and I used 17GiB last month
17 Gigs ?? Wow ... I once went to 370 Gigs with mine here in Europe (downloaded a bunch of Bluray movies) and nothing happened.

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echo '[q]sa[ln0=aln80~Psnlbx]16isb572CCB9AE9DB03273snlbxq' |dc
Re:To answer your question by Anonymous Coward · 2011-07-14 09:31 · Score: 0

The "culture card"?

I'm so tired of this "playing the foo card" nonsense. It's not making an argument, it's just lame ad hominem that demonstrates your inability to make a point.

The poster never said _anything_ about imperialist, colonialism, or any of the other terms you mentioned. The poster simply stated that censorship was "normal" in China while it certainly would not be "normal" in the West.

You're waaay to sensitive.
Re:To answer your question by lennier · 2011-07-14 10:31 · Score: 1

wouldn't believe a word on Slashdot anyways. Slanted Stories, Comments from numbskulls like me who just debate people and often will just play devils advocate
So... you're saying that since you're playing devil's advocate, Slashdot comments are perfectly trustworthy?
But that would mean that you're sincere, which would mean that... so, if I asked you which door the white knight would tell the black knight to go through that didn't lead to certain death... what would Douglas Hofstadter answer?
(Trick question! Douglas Hofstadter always answers "Douglas Hofstadter".)

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You are not a brain: http://books.google.com/books?id=2oV61CeDx-YC
Re:To answer your question by Anonymous Coward · 2011-07-14 10:55 · Score: 0

It's interesting that you should use the word "normal" in your post, because here in China, Internet filtering is indeed normal, the same way that you would considering post-9/11 groping to be normal and being constantly watched in the streets of London normal. Do I agree with it? Certainly not, but every place has its own culture and laws, and for the most part, the modern Chinese people are getting along just fine without trying to fit in with Western ideals.
Very few in the US consider post-9/11 groping to be normal, the point is that we can complain about it on the interwebs without our government shutting us down for speaking out politically. The multi-culti bs is so thick in your post its disgusting.

Certainly, we don't have the state mandated media in the U.S. like China does, but the important thing to accept is that everyone has their own propaganda, no matter where they are. It's just a matter of which ones you agree with and which ones you don't.
Yeah what you are missing is that the media in the US does not contain the full weight and authority of the entire government behind it and therefore has no power over the individual. The media, by being an extention of the government, does have power over the individual in China and by being an extention of the government has a limited to a non-existent ability to question said government. Yes, there may be bias inherent in media throughout the world, but that doesn't support the point you are laboring to make. The situation in the US and the situation in China, per the media, is not equal. So stop trying to equate everything. Things can be different without one or the other necessarily being better than the other, but that is not so in this case.

it's going to be scary.
Yeah, things tend to get that way with communist totalitarian governments.
Re:To answer your question by jc42 · 2011-07-14 11:26 · Score: 1

You know what site my U.S. govt censors? None. Not a single one. They do shut down a handful of sites though. ...
So shutting a site down doesn't count as censorship? That's certainly an, uh, "interesting" interpretation of the words. Do you by any chance work for Homeland Security? Or just in advertising? ;-)
Someone else has already pointed out the story of the US government forcibly taking over domain names. I suppose some people might also not consider that to be censorship, since you can still use the numeric IP address.

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Those who do study history are doomed to stand helplessly by while everyone else repeats it.
Re:To answer your question by jc42 · 2011-07-14 12:42 · Score: 1

I love it when people call China the P.R. or People's Republic... Such a delusional misrepresentation. Do you HONESTLY think that it is YOUR republic and YOU have control? ...
So how is this different from the American use of the term "public" to mean "owned by the government"? One could easily see a certain level of cynicism here, since very few of the people who use such terminology would expect that they could just start using any "public property" as their own, and not get arrested and charged with a crime.
The streets on two sides of our yard would be called "public" by nearly everyone, but if I were to start digging up the pavement and converting it to an extension of my flower garden, you can bet I'd be interrupted by police and told in no uncertain terms that I'd done something illegal.
Of course, the Chinese government's habit of calling itself a People's Republic (actually Renmin Gongheguo) is widely understood as the same sort of euphemism, similar to how they continue to insist that their government is Communist, they all follow Marx, etc. Yeah, right. But it's not materially different from the similar pretenses to "public" property here in the US.

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Those who do study history are doomed to stand helplessly by while everyone else repeats it.
Re:To answer your question by jmac_the_man · 2011-07-14 15:33 · Score: 1

Yes, USAian is silly. Use US American unless it's clear from the context that you mean someone from USA.
The American continents are a big place. (Technically, they're TWO big places.) There is a wide variety of... well, pretty much everything. The richest people on Earth live here, but so do some of the poorest. Every kind of terrain, from Arctic tundra to sweltering desert, is represented. There are democratic republics and communist dictatorships. And there's no central government overseeing the whole thing.
Europe is more homogeneous in pretty much all those ways. (There's also the EU, which is supposed to be a "Government of Europe, right?") Because most places in Europe are more similar to each other than most places on the American continents, it makes sense to talk about "Europeans" generally. Realistically, the only things that pretty much everyone from North or South America has in common is that they're people. They have that in common with Europeans too.
If, for some reason, you need to refer to everyone from North or South America, the term is "North and South Americans." Otherwise, the context in all cases "American" is used means "from the United States of America." If you think otherwise, you're being deliberately obtuse.
Re:To answer your question by tehcyder · 2011-07-14 23:30 · Score: 1

I am in P.R. China and I have never had trouble accessing Slashdot. In fact, it is so reliable that it is the site I typically check if I want to see if the internet connection is working.
Why don't you just use Google like most people? Oh, wait...

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To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it
Re:To answer your question by tehcyder · 2011-07-14 23:43 · Score: 1

It is definitely a big brother approach, but considering the situation with the cameras in London, Homeland Security in the U.S., and the filtering in Australia, I really can't see an open web
If you are referring to CCTV cameras, what do publicly sited cameras have to do with the web?

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To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it
Re:To answer your question by tehcyder · 2011-07-14 23:51 · Score: 1

They were obviously talking about how the UK is using the internet to police cctv cameras (extremely big brotherish)
And how does this amount to censorship by the government? Please explain, I'm obviously missing something.

Or is it just a "teh evil gobmint...using r intarwebz!" knee jerk reaction?

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To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it
Re:To answer your question by tehcyder · 2011-07-14 23:54 · Score: 1

What the fuck is wrong with you paranoid twats? Who cares about CCTV cameras on public streets? All they are used for is helping to catch criminals. If you're thick enough to murder someone in front of a camera, how can you complain when the eveil police use that camera footage against you?

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To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it
Re:To answer your question by tehcyder · 2011-07-14 23:59 · Score: 1

"China has placed economic freedom above political freedom"
What 'economic freedom'? What are you talking about? Almost 85% of the population are dirt poor.
The model of capitalism is that it is OK to have the majority of the population poor, just as long as the rich are getting richer. Oh yes, and in theory this wealth mysteriously trickles down to everyone thanks to the generosity and public-mindedness of the rich capitalists.
In practice, the majority have to fight for a share of the wealth, starting with organising themselves into unions.

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To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it
Re:To answer your question by tehcyder · 2011-07-15 00:09 · Score: 1

To clarify, in English English you have (starting from the top) Canadians, Americans, Central Americans and South Americans.

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To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it
Re:To answer your question by RobertinXinyang · 2011-07-15 00:19 · Score: 1

Sorry to bust your bubble; but, Google works fine too. It does default to a Chinese version; but, there is a redirect link on the page to go to the English version.
What doesn't work, as some have alluded to, is youtube and facebook. Yes, there are workarounds; but, I haven't gotten any of the free workarounds to work.
Re:To answer your question by arth1 · 2011-07-15 03:44 · Score: 1

In English, American means "citizen of native of the USA", and nothing else.
Um, no, it doesn't.
Webster says:

American A*mer"i*can ([.a]*m[~e]r"[i^]*kan), a. [Named from
Americus Vespucius.]
1. Of or pertaining to America; as, the American continent:
American Indians.
[1913 Webster]
2. Of or pertaining to the United States. "A young officer of
the American navy." --Lyell.
[1913 Webster]
Merriam-Webster says:

Pronunciation: [snipped due to /. not handling unicode]
Function:noun
Date:1568
1: an American Indian of North America or South America
2: a native or inhabitant of North America or South America
3: a citizen of the United States
4: american english
Collins says:

American ([snipped due to /. not handling unicode])
- adj
1. of or relating to the United States of America, its inhabitants, or their form of English
2. of or relating to the American continent
- n
3. a native or citizen of the US
4. a native or inhabitant of any country of North, Central, or South America
5. the English language as spoken or written in the United States
Collins English Dictionary - Complete & Unabridged 10th Edition
2009 Â© William Collins Sons & Co. Ltd. 1979, 1986 Â© HarperCollins
Re:To answer your question by Anonymous Coward · 2011-07-15 03:45 · Score: 0

> I really can't see an open web besides perhaps a couple of the European countries.
Taiwan. Singapore.
Re:To answer your question by Anonymous Coward · 2011-07-15 03:55 · Score: 0

Contractors are joking referred to as "60 percenters" where I work.
Re:To answer your question by russotto · 2011-07-15 06:49 · Score: 1

I'm so tired of this "playing the foo card" nonsense.
So you're saying I'm playing the "playing the foo card" card?

Not blocked by water-and-sewer · 2011-07-14 00:50 · Score: 4, Informative

Slashdot is not blocked in China, but citizens are forced to use older browsers that choke on Slashdot's excessive CSS and Javascript goodness. The result is an experience - not unlike my own - that makes Slashdot increasingly too annoying a site to visit.

--
If this were Usenet, I'd killfile the lot of you.

Re:Not blocked by killkillkill · 2011-07-14 01:01 · Score: 4, Informative

It's the same experience on new browsers as well.
Re:Not blocked by Anonymous Coward · 2011-07-14 01:15 · Score: 0

Why are they forced to use older browsers?
I'm in China and using Firefox 4.0.
I think you are confusing with Cuban cars:)
Anyway, Slashdot is the most reliable site available here.
Re:Not blocked by Lord+Lode · 2011-07-14 01:20 · Score: 4, Insightful

./ is annoying in new browsers too. I can't click a link anymore without the page doing a random scroll-jump instead. Same for middleclicking, or trying to moderate something, or anything else that requires clicking any of the 3 mouse buttons on ./.
Furthermore it often shows an eternal "loading" spinning thing at the bottom.
Re:Not blocked by Anonymous Coward · 2011-07-14 01:25 · Score: 0

And yet, here you are.
Re:Not blocked by sgt+scrub · 2011-07-14 01:30 · Score: 1

I'm using Firefox 5 and all is good. Are you using IE or is your idea of "new browsers" Firefox 3 and IE5?

--
Having to work for a living is the root of all evil.
Re:Not blocked by Samantha+Wright · 2011-07-14 01:31 · Score: 5, Informative

It's not actually link-clicking that's causing what you describe. A post with collapsed parents will expand the parents one by one (and jump uselessly) when anything within it is clicked. You'd think that would be obvious enough a UI design disaster to avoid, but apparently they really are brain-damaged here.

--
Bio questions? Ask me to start a Q&A journal. Computer analogies available for most topics!
Re:Not blocked by cyfer2000 · 2011-07-14 01:40 · Score: 3, Informative

Banks forced people to use not so great browsers (technically not older). Banks in China usually use ActiveX for encryption things, so IE is your only choice if you want to use online banking.

--
There is a spark in every single flame bait point.
Re:Not blocked by Anonymous Coward · 2011-07-14 01:47 · Score: 0

Since when are citizens forced to use older browsers??? Firefox, Safari, Chrome and other sites are all reachable for acquiring the latest browsers. Hell, many corporations in the US still (try to) force their employees to use older browsers than the Chinese citizens I know over here. And as for speed, it (largely) ain't the browser's fault. It is the poor DSL services, the effects of the GFC (esp. on gmail) and god knows what circuitous links from 2nd and third tier cities to overseas sites.
Re:Not blocked by DrgnDancer · 2011-07-14 01:56 · Score: 1

I'm using Firefox 5 and get exactly the same symptoms he is. I'd love to know what I'm doing wrong.

--
I don't need a million points of light, just two points of multi-mode fiber and a 10 Gig-E router.
Re:Not blocked by Anonymous Coward · 2011-07-14 01:59 · Score: 1

Firefox v3.6.19 was released on 7 July 2011. How exactly is that "old"?
Re:Not blocked by Anonymous Coward · 2011-07-14 02:08 · Score: 0

How are they forced to use older browsers?
Re:Not blocked by Anonymous Coward · 2011-07-14 02:21 · Score: 0

Indeed. Just 2 weeks ago I got a security upgrade for Iceweasel on my Debian desktop, I'm at 3.5.16-8 now.
Re:Not blocked by Anonymous Coward · 2011-07-14 02:24 · Score: 0

Slashdot is not blocked in China, but citizens are forced to use older browsers that choke on Slashdot's excessive CSS and Javascript goodness. The result is an experience - not unlike my own - that makes Slashdot increasingly too annoying a site to visit.
What are you talking about? How are citizens forced to use older browsers there?
Re:Not blocked by sgt+scrub · 2011-07-14 02:26 · Score: 0

Is it possible you, or someone upstream, is blocking some of the content? That would be my guess.

--
Having to work for a living is the root of all evil.
Re:Not blocked by Anonymous Coward · 2011-07-14 02:34 · Score: 0

I'm not sure what planet u are on but last time I checked, there were no restrictions on which browser to use in china
Re:Not blocked by Anonymous Coward · 2011-07-14 02:35 · Score: 1

Slashdot _should_ work with Firefox 3, for christ's sake! Hell! Given how many (computer literate) people here use NoScript and similar, it should even have a way to gracefully degrade when you're blocking Javascript (i.e. it should support Lynx and Mosaic).
The horrible truth is that, even with Javascript enabled, Slashdot acts, at best, erratically (especially if you're just a lurker and don't have a /. account).
Please DO explain to me what wonderful technology Slashdot requires that CAN'T be done with Firefox 3 or IE5? HTML5 Canvas?
Protip: if it ain't broken, stop trying to FIX it!
Protip 2: not everyone is using the bleedingest-edge software out there (yes, that also applies to Slashdot users) because most of us don't have time or the will to fucking reinstall Firefox every time they decide to release a new major version (especially when the current version works kinda ok and every new version seems to work worse than the last one, besides breaking compatibility with your favorite extensions).
I'm using Firefox 3.6.18 which was released in June 21st 2011. Yes, I know, fucking ancient history.
The only reason why I still come to Slashdot is (I think) the same reason everyone else still does: the often insightful comments.
Reddit (as an example) seems to work perfectly well with Firefox 3, as well as 99,999% of all websites out there. Why is it that Slashdot (a website that's supposedly aimed at computer literate people and, as such, should be managed by computer literate people) developers can't seem to make it work for Firefox 3? Too hard for you?
tl;dr: Slashdot's programming is UTTER CRAP. I remember how it was before all this Web 2.0 redesign and it worked WAY better than it does right now. /rant
Re:Not blocked by rossdee · 2011-07-14 02:56 · Score: 1

"I'm in China and using Firefox 4.0"
Firefox 4 is an older browser.
I think Mozilla is working on version 8.0 right now. The official release is 5.01
Re:Not blocked by Lord+Lode · 2011-07-14 02:57 · Score: 1

FF4.
Re:Not blocked by Anonymous Coward · 2011-07-14 02:58 · Score: 0

I use IE9 for the mostpart and have yet to observe that behavior....
Re:Not blocked by gorzek · 2011-07-14 03:05 · Score: 1

Was there something wrong with good old HTTPS? Using ActiveX for encryption... now I have something new to give me nightmares.

--
Check out my world simulator thingy.
Re:Not blocked by Lord+Lode · 2011-07-14 03:11 · Score: 1

Argh, I just realized I typed ./ instead of /.
But hey, maybe it should not be called /. anymore with its current JS implementation :p
Re:Not blocked by Rincewind42 · 2011-07-14 03:23 · Score: 1

Complete nonsense. Nobody is forced to use any particular browser in China. Though almost everyone here runs Win XP with IE6 it's because they are pirated copies of windows and so blocked from windows update by MS. There's nothing to stop people using Firefox or Chrome if they wanted.
Re:Not blocked by Braino420 · 2011-07-14 03:40 · Score: 1

It's ridiculous. I got so fed up with the threshold sliders not working, especially on my phone, and having to keep clicking "more comments" that I just switched back to the "Classic Discussion System". Account > Discussions and then select the radio button.

--
They call me the wookie man, I guess that's what I am
Re:Not blocked by ajo_arctus · 2011-07-14 03:54 · Score: 1

I'm on FF and I see the same thing too. I wonder, could ad-block plus cause this? Interesting -- I'll try turning it off and seeing if that fixes the random page jumps...
Re:Not blocked by Anonymous Coward · 2011-07-14 03:57 · Score: 0

Huh? Citizens are forced to use older browsers? Haven't noticed that yet.
Re:Not blocked by maxwell+demon · 2011-07-14 04:12 · Score: 2

Was there something wrong with good old HTTPS?
Maybe it lacked government backdoors?

--
The Tao of math: The numbers you can count are not the real numbers.
Re:Not blocked by sxeraverx · 2011-07-14 04:14 · Score: 1

It's the same on the iPhone. It's always a gamble whether you click the right link or just the blank space next to it because everything's a link and the phone can't guess where you meant to click anymore. Moreover, the JavaScript makes it so that it's always a gamble whether you'll be ably to type in the text box or not, and the comment submission process is just painfully slow. It's not just the quality of the articles on this site that's been steadily falling.
Re:Not blocked by gorzek · 2011-07-14 04:17 · Score: 1

Good point. I wasn't thinking like a fascist.

--
Check out my world simulator thingy.
Re:Not blocked by MaskedSlacker · 2011-07-14 06:39 · Score: 1

I'm in the US using Chrome and I have this problem when I come to a comment thread from the notification email and everything except the last reply is hidden. Every click involved in replying to the new comment uncollapses the next level up, and jumps to it. I usually have to click the text box 4-5 times before it will let me type a reply.
Re:Not blocked by Anonymous Coward · 2011-07-14 06:45 · Score: 0

Since when did the state mandate what flavor of browser you are using? I was there for a month and never had any issue using whatever browser that tickled my fancy.
Re:Not blocked by shutdown+-p+now · 2011-07-14 08:43 · Score: 1

Last I checked, nothing prevents you from using IE for your online banking, and a different browser for everything else.
Indeed, only a few years ago it was very common to have to resort to such things in Western countries as well. There are many creative ways to break HTML in non-IE browsers other than ActiveX, and I have long suspected that knowing them all is part of the job interview for web developers in banking.
Re:Not blocked by shutdown+-p+now · 2011-07-14 08:47 · Score: 1

What he describes can be observed when you have a post open, but several of its parents collapsed. This does not normally occur on article pages, but is what you see when you click on the link in those "you've got a reply to your comment" notification emails. Alternatively, here is a link that will display your own post that way.
Now go there, and try to click on any of the words in your post (e.g. assuming that you're trying to select them to copy/paste). Notice how it expands the parent post and moves focus over to it. Now click on "Reply", and then try to click on the textarea that appears.
Re:Not blocked by shutdown+-p+now · 2011-07-14 09:07 · Score: 1

The sliders seem to remember their position across all devices - they must be associated with a login - so setting them from your desktop browser should keep working on the phone/tablet.
I wish I could just switch to Classic, but then I lose the ability to expand child comments, and have to open them in new tabs, which is particularly inconvenient on mobile. Sometimes I think it would be easier to write a comment scraper (over Classic), and a sane UI on top of that - it would probably be faster than waiting for /. code monkeys to fix all that stuff, given that the expand-parent-when-clicked bug has been around for several months now.
Re:Not blocked by Anonymous Coward · 2011-07-14 12:51 · Score: 0

I can verify. Using firefox 8 nightly. It's like, 4 better than firefox 4.
Re:Not blocked by aiht · 2011-07-14 20:01 · Score: 1

Interesting...
I don't tend to use that view, so had no idea what everyone is always complaining about.
On that kind of page, I see the same symptoms in Opera (11.5) too.
Re:Not blocked by tehcyder · 2011-07-15 00:17 · Score: 1

Stop using a computer from 1996 then.
Why should he?

--
To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it
Re:Not blocked by tehcyder · 2011-07-15 00:23 · Score: 1

Protip: if it ain't broken, stop trying to FIX it!
You are like so Web 1.0 you probably prefer serif fonts.

--
To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it
Re:Not blocked by tehcyder · 2011-07-15 00:27 · Score: 1

I got so fed up with the threshold sliders not working, especially on my phone,
Holy crap, I cannot even begin to imagine how horrible slashdot would look on a phone.

--
To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it
Re:Not blocked by sgt+scrub · 2011-07-15 01:47 · Score: 1

I thought it expanded the parent for me when I click on my post so I can review or cut and paste out something I want to comment on. When I click on "Reply to This" it again centers on the cursor in the Comment box. I guess I'm used to gui interfaces automating things for me if I want them to or not so I ignore it. Regardless. That is not a "random scroll jump" IMHO. I thought he was actually getting random focus points, which is still possible. If not then he should have added "Get off my lawn" so we would know it was just frustration with the change of focus instead of a real issue.

--
Having to work for a living is the root of all evil.
Re:Not blocked by shutdown+-p+now · 2011-07-15 04:18 · Score: 1

It is a real issue. When you're replying to someone's comment (i.e. already in the textbox), and want to reposition the cursor or select something in the textbox with the mouse, this "feature" completely steals input focus and rewinds to whatever parent comment it expands. This is unbelievably annoying to anyone who is used to using both mouse and keyboard while editing.
Re:Not blocked by sgt+scrub · 2011-07-17 00:44 · Score: 1

I see. I don't click outside of the text box after starting my post so I've never noticed it. It repositions you to the top most parent on clicking out. Then if you click in the Comment box it repositions you to the top most parent again. Maybe /. should have a poll on if readers want focus removed.

--
Having to work for a living is the root of all evil.
Re:Not blocked by shutdown+-p+now · 2011-07-17 08:55 · Score: 1

For me it refocuses you even if you click inside the textbox, once the focus is already there. Say, if you're typing text, and try to use mouse to change cursor position or select a part of what you've just typed.
Re:Not blocked by DaVince21 · 2011-07-25 13:03 · Score: 1

Gee, you sure understand the meaning of new.

--
I am not devoid of humor.
Re:Not blocked by DaVince21 · 2011-07-25 13:04 · Score: 1

Sorry for the late reply, but you could just use the inferior browsers for *just* those banking websites.

--
I am not devoid of humor.

Slashdot blocked today ? by Anonymous Coward · 2011-07-14 00:51 · Score: 0

"Anyone behind the firewall know if Slashdot is currently blocked? I've heard it varies."

==> Now it is...

Re:Slashdot blocked today ? by Anonymous Coward · 2011-07-14 02:24 · Score: 0

Falun gonged?

Facebook and Youtube varies by Anonymous Coward · 2011-07-14 00:52 · Score: 2, Informative

Just spent 36 days in china.
Youtube would work maybe 1 or 2 clips, before you had to change connection.
Facebook, would work for an hour or so and then be offline for an hour. Keep bouncing up and down.

Slashdot is partly accessible by Anonymous Coward · 2011-07-14 00:53 · Score: 1

Slashdot is partly accessible like others 59% web sites in the world, but the speed is very slow.

Re:Slashdot is partly accessible by Anonymous Coward · 2011-07-14 01:39 · Score: 0

Actually, I have no problems accessing Slashdot from Kunming with or without using a VPN to bypass the GFC. been that way since 2009. As for speed, it isn't that bad except for when it is (maybe 10% of the time). But I surely do miss my FIOS line in Dallas. 4Mbps DSL shared with up to 11 others sucks.

if Slashdot is currently blocked? by renzhi · 2011-07-14 00:54 · Score: 2

Short answer: No.

Longer answer: Usually no. It has been blocked a couple of times in the last few years, but that usually only lasted one day, or half a day. The fact that /. was blocked was probably a mistake in filter manipulation. It's not blocked, because probably the firewall admins waste their days away, lounging here too?

Re:if Slashdot is currently blocked? by d4fseeker · 2011-07-14 01:02 · Score: 1

It's only blocked when the boss comes in to check whether they are working or not.
"We can't have been browsing on Slashdot, see it's blocked. The filter rule is right here"

Re:Ough by obergfellja · 2011-07-14 00:56 · Score: 0

"... and they dumped pigs..." - exert from Carry I stopped at the word pigs even though it is mid sentence as well.

Pr0nography?? by Anonymous Coward · 2011-07-14 01:01 · Score: 1

Those Christians are always trying to force their ways on everyone. In a more enlightened atheist society this would never happen!

Oh wait...

Re:Pr0nography?? by royallthefourth · 2011-07-14 01:31 · Score: 5, Funny

In a more enlightened atheist society this would never happen!
Only according to a typically immoral, decadent liberal.
In a socialist society, both men and women will have respectable employment and not turn to work in pornography to make a living. The reification of private intimacy to marketed commodity is the very height of alienation; on the other hand, it still exists outside the market as a homemade expression of individualist nihilism, the consistent self-indulgent stamp of the culture industry that has appropriated and homogenized everything in its contact. Sex is replaced with watching sex. Social bonds break down as partners become as interchangeable as the URL in the browser. It is the another illegitimacy in the wake of Enlightenment subjective rationality: that only the method by which free speech is achieved may be debated, while the objective remains as a dictator.
Not to suggest that China has much communist credibility remaining these days...
Re:Pr0nography?? by Anonymous Coward · 2011-07-14 01:59 · Score: 0

Wait, what does Christianity and China have in common anyway? Where are you going with this?
Re:Pr0nography?? by Mindcontrolled · 2011-07-14 02:19 · Score: 1

Whoa. Been a while since I heard someone talk proper Theory. Look, folks - this is how a communist looks like. Before decrying something as "communism", check whether its proponents can talk like this. If not - not the real deal ;)

--
Ubi solitudinem faciunt, pacem appellant.
Re:Pr0nography?? by Anonymous Coward · 2011-07-14 03:44 · Score: 0

10/10
Superb troll post.
Re:Pr0nography?? by Anonymous Coward · 2011-07-14 04:47 · Score: 0

*sigh*
I know you're trolling but I can't seem to resist responding.
I love the use of the classic propaganda phrase "decadent liberal" as a pejorative. With your opening sentence you imply and attempt to make "truthy" the idea that freedom and prosperity (liberal decadence) are inherently immoral.
"Your poverty and deprivation are noble! Obedience is Right and Good, people who are free to make their own choices are Bad"
With your second sentence you conflate your sexual mores with socialism itself in an attempt to leverage the force of support for socialism to force your other ideas on everyone. Debate is short-circuited, expressions of sexuality you object to are portrayed as part and product of capitalism so that that they can be condemned as anti-socialist.
Pornography is accused of paradoxically promoting promiscuity and simultaneously replacing sex.
"Exploring and enjoying your own sexuality is nihilism and subjugation to commercial industry". Again, sexual pleasure is condemned as nihilism and inherently Bad. Happiness and pleasure are as usual portrayed as bad things, deprivation is sold as desirable in order to pacify a population deprived of health and happiness by ineffective central economic management.
You conclude by asserting that black is white. Freedom is dictatorship.
Re:Pr0nography?? by royallthefourth · 2011-07-14 05:15 · Score: 1

Your entire counter-argument rests upon conflating happiness with the consumption of pornography. You're a simple pervert manipulating my post in a weak attempt to justify your own shameful lifestyle to yourself.
Re:Pr0nography?? by Anonymous Coward · 2011-07-14 05:37 · Score: 0

Reveling in sexuality is demonstrably pleasurable. Provable with an MRI.
Your assertion that it is a perversion is also evidently a fallacy. As deriving pleasure form sexuality is a biological fact it is clearly denial of that which is the perversion.
Re:Pr0nography?? by kefkahax · 2011-07-14 05:54 · Score: 1

I know two ladies and one guy in pornography. Neither of them needed to turn to pornography to make a living, both of the ladies were becoming more and more successful models prior, actually (it's a long road to fame in those industries). All three of them enjoy sex, are not timid about their bodies and enjoy their work. They are picky about which companies they will do work for, however. Some of the companies treat their employees like shit, but that's the same for every industry. That ignores that fact that many of these porn stars run their own studios and companies, also.

--
Easy BitCoins
Re:Pr0nography?? by Anonymous Coward · 2011-07-14 06:02 · Score: 0

I should also say that if you think that the "rightness" or "wrongness" of sex or porn is my entire argument you have missed the more important point.
The more important point was that stretching the meaning of socialism to include regulating what people do with heir penises is intellectually dishonest, morally reprehensible and socially dangerous. Choosing an economic system for a nation is certainly the purview of a government but empowering the state to control citizens personal interactions, their relationships
and the things they see, hear and think is unjustifiable and inherently diminishes the value and enjoyment of our lives.
Re:Pr0nography?? by Anonymous Coward · 2011-07-14 06:33 · Score: 0

furthermore commercial porn is only one part of the nudity on the Internet.
There is also a staggering amount of sex and nakedness on the net created and posted purely for the enjoyment of it.
Re:Pr0nography?? by tehcyder · 2011-07-15 00:31 · Score: 1

I know two ladies and one guy in pornography.
Names and pix or it didn't happen.

--
To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it

Chine by Ironchew · 2011-07-14 01:06 · Score: 0

Wikipedia says it's the French name for China. The Grammar Nazi in me was saddened to hear that.

Re:Chine by Chrisq · 2011-07-14 01:17 · Score: 4, Funny

Wikipedia says it's the French name for China. The Grammar Nazi in me was saddened to hear that.
Not really, the French have a history of accomodating Nazis.
Re:Chine by Anonymous Coward · 2011-07-14 01:39 · Score: 0

Not really, the French have a history of accomodating Nazis.
[citation needed]
Re:Chine by Chrisq · 2011-07-14 03:23 · Score: 2

Not really, the French have a history of accommodating Nazis.
[citation needed]
[history lesson needed]

Try starting with Vichy France

Quick experiment for you /.ers currently in China by poity · 2011-07-14 01:09 · Score: 4, Interesting

Anything happen when you search Tiananmen in the Slashdot searchbox? It used to time out the entire domain for me.

--
your thin skin doesn't make me a troll

Did News Corp buy slashdot? by Dunbal · 2011-07-14 01:17 · Score: 1, Insightful

there were were 41% fewer websites at the end of 2010 than a year earlier.

This does not mean that 41% of the sites were shut down by the government. In fact, nowhere in the article does it say the websites were "shut down" at all. There are many other reasons websites go offline, like people getting bored of maintaining them, their not being popular, their failing to make a profit or break even, etc. Sensationalistic reporting, now on slash!

--
Seven puppies were harmed during the making of this post.

Re:Did News Corp buy slashdot? by sgt+scrub · 2011-07-14 01:34 · Score: 1

There are many other reasons websites go offline
All the pr0n is downloaded.

--
Having to work for a living is the root of all evil.
Re:Did News Corp buy slashdot? by rbrausse · 2011-07-14 01:55 · Score: 2

this document of the .cn-registry is interesting.
sure, the thing is biased but take a look at page 23:

In the first half year of 2010, the number of internet sites in the globe has fallen and that in China has declined synchronously. According to the statistics of Netcraft, in the first half year of 2010, the number of internet sites in the world has been decreased by 27 million7, with a drop of 11.5%. An important reason for the drop of total sites is the expiration of web hosting services.
TFA compares end of 2009 with end of 2010, the survey is unfortunately older (June 2010) so it is not possible to see the same data from the 2 different POVs...

China/. by Anonymous Coward · 2011-07-14 01:25 · Score: 0

Live from a Yangtze cruise, SlashDot is good to go.

Just wrong by Anonymous Coward · 2011-07-14 01:26 · Score: 0

This is not what the article says. Read it carefully. At no time does the article specifically state that the cause of these websites shutting is to do with the government. It does mention various things about laws, juxtaposition to statements about websites closing. A causation is never stated.

The BBC are somewhat infuriating at times with cheap journo tricks. Slashdot shouldn't be encouraging it, we're meant to know better.

Re:Quick experiment for you /.ers currently in Chi by Anonymous Coward · 2011-07-14 01:26 · Score: 0

Sounds like a problem with your browsers spell checker?

False summary by wvmarle · 2011-07-14 01:34 · Score: 2

I haven't read the BBC article but have read this in the local Hong Kong paper today.

Lots of sites closed, but the opinions vary on why. The state-sponsored bodies in China claim it is because most of those sites went bankrupt, while others (mainly foreign human-rights activists) claim it's the government forcing them to close. Fact is lots of sites closed, yet the total number of pages available is a whopping 90 billion. Yes that's like 70 pages for every Chinese citizen. And many more if you only count Chinese Internet users.

Some web sites are for sure closed by the government, mainly for pornography, but also sometimes for political speech. Though it seems the Chinese actually enjoy quite some freedom on-line.

And Twitter not available from within China, who cares when you have Weibo? Most Chinese can't read English anyway. And no Google? Well they have Baidu.

Yes it's censored, but no they don't miss out on too much functionality either. It's not that the Chinese can not do those things by themselves, and they do it in Chinese catering to Chinese users. It may be an American viewpoint but all the time I hear "no YouTube, no Google, no Twitter" as if that's the complete Internet?! I'm happy there is more than those few sites. Much more.

And on the importance of Twitter in China... how many non-Chinese will ever look at what's going on on Weibo?

Re:False summary by Anonymous Coward · 2011-07-14 01:49 · Score: 1

And Twitter not available from within China, who cares when you have Weibo? Most Chinese can't read English anyway.
This sentence alone highlights the ridiculousness of your argument. If most Chinese people can't read English, why do the authorities care if the Chinese people can use Twitter or not?
It's not the fact that these particular sites are blocked, it's the fact that innocuous sites such as these are blocked.
Yes, Chinese people can talk about all the important things to people the World over (shopping, sport etc) and yes, they can talk about what the government and the powers that be are doing, but don't you dare question what they are doing. Don't you dare criticise. Constructive criticism is actually worse than baseless criticism, because it's harder to rebut and just say "you're wrong" and get away with it.
You may say that the last paragraph has opinion in it, and it does, but it is based upon my experience of living in China. There are many great things about living in China, and many many great people that I've met in China; but here is where I stop being Chinese and be my western self: I can accept that I like things about China __AND__ that there are things which should really be improved. A distinction which nationalists in every country seem to have difficulty grasping.
Re:False summary by Anonymous Coward · 2011-07-14 02:38 · Score: 0

small information sites don't go down beause they go bankrupt, more often they stay online after the owner goes bankrupt. but that's the nasty thing about censorship: not being able to talk about it. if they don't have youtube they don't have the complete internet and that's even taking into account that youtube itself is censored and i'm not american either. missing out on the full internet puts them at a serious disadvantage at education, almost as big as not understanding english. but the real problem with the chinese censor system is of course that they can't know how much they can talk about it even!
Re:False summary by Rincewind42 · 2011-07-14 03:35 · Score: 2

I signed up for a Weibo account last week. I've had a Renren account (Chinese Facebook clone) for over a year now. I can't effectively use either of them due to language difficulties. Really need to practice my Chinese reading. So this gives some insight into how Chinese people view western sites. They just can use them - so they don't care that they are blocked. Why would you worry that Youtube is blocked when you have all the videos you need on Youkou or Tudou.
Re:False summary by Anonymous Coward · 2011-07-14 03:50 · Score: 0

The point has always been that it is a walled garden. Your point appears to be that it is 'just' a walled garden.
The reason being able to access popular 'western' sites is important is that these sites, would constitute a massive information flow not controlled by the Party's perspective.
If Twitter became popular in China, then its use as

We are protecting you from you by Anonymous Coward · 2011-07-14 01:35 · Score: 1

For make glorious nation; we, the People's Republic of China have decided that it's best to protect the people from the people. The people know better than the people what is right to view, read, listen and also which thoughts are good. The people are making sure the people are not harming the people.

The best thing about this is that the people have chosen what the people want to do and how they should do it. So say the people.

- The People's Dictatorship of the Time Travelling Republic of China.

OpenVPN is one option by Anonymous Coward · 2011-07-14 01:38 · Score: 1

Assuming Amazon doesn't filter you out by IP address, people living in China can register an Amazon EC2 Ubuntu micro instance which will be free for the first year if you are new to Amazon EC2, and install OpenVPN on it and then use the OpenVPN client from their own machine.

I'm a US citizen but I use it all the time b/c it prevents content from being blocked when I'm overseas, and makes my IP address appear to be USA (N. California in my case) so that I can watch online content that is refused to people outside the US.

An additional benefit to OpenVPN is that it doesn't look like VPN traffic b/c it works via SSL/TLS and looks a lot like normal http traffic, making it less likely to be noticed at all. Most VPN's that are IPSEC, which makes them very obvious and easy to block.
There are a couple things that make it look slightly different from normal https browsing traffic:
1. UDP protocol - this is the default and recommended as most optimal for performance, but you can choose TCP instead if you like.
2. Port number - default is 1194, but this you can easily change to 443 with no issues.
3. Traffic "shape" - The "shape" of the traffic will of course look different than normal https web traffic, The most obvious thing is that you will have a lot more traffic (all of yours) going to a single web server in the USA that is not actually servicing web requests on port 443. I'm going to take a wild guess and say that PRC probably is not set up to notice/block this. As far as I know, it requires somewhat sophisticated heuristics to detect (please correct me if I'm wrong).

I don't know how the clients are for Linux or MS Win, but for OS X users, Viscosity works great and is super simple to use.

The server is relatively easy to configure if you are comfortable with Linux and bash, but if you get stuck just check out some more howtos and you can figure it out.

Good luck!!

If it was blocked... by Bertie · 2011-07-14 01:39 · Score: 1

How the heck would you expect them to post on here saying so?

Durr.

Re:If it was blocked... by Sinthet · 2011-07-14 02:09 · Score: 1

I'd imagine 95% of the slashdot crowd could very easily get by the Great Firewall. At least one person in that 95% must be living in China.
Re:If it was blocked... by njahnke · 2011-07-14 07:05 · Score: 1

he's interested in whether it's blocked, not that it's blocked. if some people post here from the prc then he can assume it's not blocked in some places at some times, which presumably tells him more than he knew before asking his question.

Re:Quick experiment for you /.ers currently in Chi by jacksonyee · 2011-07-14 01:39 · Score: 2

Just tried it here from Kunming with the results:

Wikileaks Cables Say No Bloodshed Inside Tiananmen Square 235 2011 2009 Bing Censoring All Simplified Chinese Language Queries 214 Chinese Social Websites Go Under "Maintenance" 84 Twitter, Flickr, Hotmail, Others Blocked In China 151 20 Years After Tiananmen, China Stifles Online Dissent 235 China Blocks YouTube, Again 127 China Makes Arrests To Stop Internet Porn 204 2009 2008 China Does U-Turn, Lifts Ban On Websites 133 China Allows Access to English Wikipedia 219 2008 2007 Users Rage Against China's 'Great Firewall' 277 Yahoo Confirms Beijing Blocking Flickr 163 2007 2006 Helping Other Big Brothers Go High Tech 97 Yahoo China has the Worst Filtering Policy 184 Poor Spelling Beats Google's China Filter 248 2006 2005 Business At The Price Of Freedom 254 2005 2001 China Prosecuting Webmaster Over Site 27 Today Follow us: Twitter Facebook RSS Feed

Stupid Slashdot not respecting my pre element...

Re:OK, I'm a grammar nazi, so sue me by cc1984_ · 2011-07-14 01:43 · Score: 1

True, but being a grammar Nazi does not prohibit me from correcting typos

Re:OK, I'm a grammar nazi, so sue me by JonySuede · 2011-07-14 01:44 · Score: 2

Chine is french for China, maybe he wanted to be smug!

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Jehovah be praised, Oracle was not selected

subject by Legion303 · 2011-07-14 02:13 · Score: 1

I wish the Chinese government were at least partly as zealous about shutting down forum spammers.

Porn by Cockatrice_hunter · 2011-07-14 02:17 · Score: 3, Funny

Almost think that the takeaway from this article is that 41% of websites in china are porn,

Re:Porn by Rincewind42 · 2011-07-14 03:43 · Score: 1

There's actually quite allot of porn available behind the Great Firewall of China. One thing that westerns don't understand about China is that the whole country is corrupt to the core. If you have enough money, you can get around almost any law. Just bribe a few officials and you can sell porn quite openly in the shops.
So what I reckon happened was that 41% of website failed to pay their bribes on time.
Re:Porn by tomcode · 2011-07-14 04:38 · Score: 1

So it's a lot lower than the rest of the world.

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f u cn rd ths u cn gt a gd jb n cmptr prgmng
Re:Porn by njahnke · 2011-07-14 07:06 · Score: 1

how many are porn outside of china?

Re:Quick experiment for you /.ers currently in Chi by donscarletti · 2011-07-14 02:18 · Score: 4, Interesting

Tiananmen is a symbol of China and features on the Chinese national crest and is certainly not blocked. Tiananmen Square is where Chairman Mao's body rests and the site of a monument to the people's fallen heroes, it is not blocked either. There is however a particular date 22 years ago that if you mention in any way, the domain will be inaccessible for the next 10 minutes.

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When Argumentum ad Hominem falls short, try Argumentum ad Matrem

but where would you put it? by Thud457 · 2011-07-14 02:26 · Score: 1

FREE?!!!!
I'll take two!

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the preceding comment is my own and in no way reflects the opinion of the Joint Chiefs of Staff

Re:but where would you put it? by HeckRuler · 2011-07-14 02:37 · Score: 1

Make sure they include the source. And remember, if you annex further lands into your Tibet you MUST free them as well.
Re:but where would you put it? by dgatwood · 2011-07-14 04:05 · Score: 1

Hello, China? I think I have something you may want, but it's gonna cost you. Yeah. That's right. All the tea.

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Check out my sci-fi/humor trilogy at PatriotsBooks.
Re:but where would you put it? by jc42 · 2011-07-15 07:24 · Score: 1

FREE TIBET! FREE TIBET! FREE TIBET!
FREE?!!!! I'll take two!
There was a fun failure of the same sort described recently at hanzismatter.blogspot.com, which is dedicated to documenting non-Eastern misuse of Chinese tattoos that don't quite say what the tattoo's owner thought. The explanation of one bizarre tattoo was that the person wanted the slogan "live free or die", and got it, sort of. But the "free" was the Chinese for "no cost", and the "die" was as in "tool and die". The result was baffling to anyone who could read the characters.
Of course, the English use of "free" with several unrelated meanings is known as a major cause of all sorts of problems. For example, how much free space do you have on your disk drive right now? (And wouldn't a disk drive out in free space have a rather long response time? ;-)
It's common to get such multi-meaning words wrong in translations. There are a lot of "Engrish" sites that get a good deal of humor from this.

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Those who do study history are doomed to stand helplessly by while everyone else repeats it.
Re:but where would you put it? by jc42 · 2011-07-15 07:55 · Score: 1

Just for fun, I decided to check with hanzismatter.blogspot.com and see if I could find that tattoo. On their front page, I found something more fun: There's a photo of another tattoo that was apparently intended to say "ride hard die free". Again, it makes the same two mistakes. The "die" character translates as "die casting/molding"; the "free (2 characters) means "no cost". The poster remarks:

I guess this young man is quite proud and wants everyone to know he enjoys "freely shoving die-casted figurines up his ass"? ... Kinky.
Anyway, the English word "free" causes a lot of translation problems, and is a good source of linguistic humo(u)r.

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Those who do study history are doomed to stand helplessly by while everyone else repeats it.

Re:Ough by kestasjk · 2011-07-14 02:26 · Score: 1

I stopped reading at "bet".

.. and yes, I did. I just didn't have time for those last two words. I have stuff to do. Important stuff.

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// MD_Update(&m,buf,j);

Re:Quick experiment for you /.ers currently in Chi by Thud457 · 2011-07-14 02:32 · Score: 1, Funny

I don't for a minute believe your fairy stories. It's like claiming you will be snatched away if you say the name Candleja

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the preceding comment is my own and in no way reflects the opinion of the Joint Chiefs of Staff

Sofi Oksanen begs to differ by decora · 2011-07-14 02:33 · Score: 1

consider her two books, "Stalin's Cows" and "Purge"

Re:Sofi Oksanen begs to differ by royallthefourth · 2011-07-14 03:14 · Score: 1

The Nazi apologists always disagree.

Zhao Lianhai begs to differ by decora · 2011-07-14 02:36 · Score: 1

he was sentenced to prison (in part) for running a website about the poisoned baby milk scandal.

its not hard to explain why that happened. there was no boredom involved.

Re:Zhao Lianhai begs to differ by Dunbal · 2011-07-14 03:03 · Score: 2

And you would be sentenced to prison for not submitting to a TSA pat-down. Moral of the story - breaking the laws of your country result in jail.
By the way, this has nothing to do with the other 1,299,999 websites that disappeared from the internet. But I guess this is the kind of rationalization you need to construct when you live in a country that tells you every day how free you are, when really you're no better off than anyone else and much worse off than quite a few. Yeah, keep focusing on those exceptions and believe them to be the "norm" elsewhere... hone your "China is evil" training so that you can be ready to throw your life away when your government decides it has to kill you before it loses control of you.

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Seven puppies were harmed during the making of this post.
Re:Zhao Lianhai begs to differ by Anonymous Coward · 2011-07-14 04:19 · Score: 0

And you would be sentenced to prison for not submitting to a TSA pat-down.
Arrest is not a prison sentence. It's pretty awful, but not even in the same league.
Re:Zhao Lianhai begs to differ by Anonymous Coward · 2011-07-14 04:36 · Score: 0

You get sentenced for running a website about TSA pat-downs. Or was that guy actually behind the poisoned baby milk scandal?

i just posted a link to Weibo in a /. article by decora · 2011-07-14 02:38 · Score: 1

a few weeks ago.

it was about how some people got 18 months in prison for industrial espionage... what were they spying on?

the size and shape of the ipad 2. they were going to make cases for it, before it was released.

im glad the chinese communist party caught these horrific criminals and put them in jail.

Re:OK, I'm a grammar nazi, so sue me by alexhs · 2011-07-14 03:11 · Score: 1

Well, apparently CmdrTaco took your corrections. If I didn't miss something, the only difference now is "bit-"/"article -" (missing space after bit BTW, and it should be an em dash "—", not an hyphen-minus "-").

However, you didn't correct what I believe is another grammatical error :

"Anyone behind the firewall know" : Shouldn't that be "Anyone behind the firewall knows" ? Or is that a valid ellipsis with an interrogative form : "(Does) anyone behind the firewall know" ?

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I have discovered a truly marvelous proof of killer sig, which this margin is too narrow to contain.

Re:OK, I'm a grammar nazi, so sue me by cc1984_ · 2011-07-14 03:22 · Score: 1

"Anyone behind the firewall know" : Shouldn't that be "Anyone behind the firewall knows" ? Or is that a valid ellipsis with an interrogative form : "(Does) anyone behind the firewall know" ?

I think it could be argued either way, in which case I was prepared to give the benefit of the doubt :)

Re:Quick experiment for you /.ers currently in Chi by TheGratefulNet · 2011-07-14 03:27 · Score: 1

Yahoo Confirms Beijing Blocking Flickr 163

what is the status of flickr, btw? is that viewable in china?

I bought some item from china and it was defective. had to email them for an rma; and it seems currently the 'fashion' to have to take a picture of the item (??) before they'll allow an rma. not sure what that's about - a photo could be of anything! but to them, its some kind of 'proof' (go figure!)

so I pointed the guy at my flickr page where I took a photo of the defective item. he claimed he could not see it. I uploaded to my personal non-commercial non-ad, non-controversial site (just all hand coded in html using vi; nothing 'big' at all about my site) and he could not see THOSE photos, either. he insisted on my using photobucket and I had to spend time creating an acct there just to post a photo.

wtf??

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"It is now safe to switch off your computer."

Gweilo say Falun Gong is tops by triffid_98 · 2011-07-14 03:36 · Score: 1

Is China blocking Slashdot? I'm sure it is now.

weird firewall by zAPPzAPP · 2011-07-14 03:44 · Score: 1

What causes this?
Are they blacklisting single videos on youtube? But why does changing the connection solve this? Are they listening in on your connection and modify blocks individually just for your session?
Why would they block a site (facebook) and then unblock it an hour later? The content is most likely unchanged.
Are they using a rand() to decide on blocks?

Re:weird firewall by DigiShaman · 2011-07-14 05:12 · Score: 1

ISPs double and even triple NAT their networks. Routing tables and DNS is all jacked up too. It could be intentional, but I'd rather suspect incompetence if anything. I've seen this kind of behavior with a few residential connections and hotels in China over the years. Trust me when I say that it's a mess. Duct tape and bailing wire. That's what it seems to be held up with. Sheesh.

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Life is not for the lazy.

Re:OK, I'm a grammar nazi, so sue me by countertrolling · 2011-07-14 03:46 · Score: 0

No, it snot

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For justice, we must go to Don Corleone

Wikipedia by MyFirstNameIsPaul · 2011-07-14 03:52 · Score: 1

Wikipedia is another somewhat popular site that is blocked. They also seem to have some way of determining that a user is using SSH to connect to a SOCKS proxy. I could tool around on my server all night, but as soon as I started browsing the connection became so slow it was unusable for any purpose, and yes, DNS lookups were being done through the proxy.

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I once took an excursion to Reddit, and later HN. Unlimited up/down voting sucks when dealing with a hive-mind.

I run an ISP in China - Truth below - by Anonymous Coward · 2011-07-14 03:59 · Score: 1

The real truth is that they wanted control over the internet, and now they have it.

2 years ago, China was a spammer haven, as domain registration was cheap, and USA based spammers (which still is the source of 99% of spam) registered a gazillion odd spam domains. The powers that be decided to change that.

They changed the law.
First it only affected new domain registrations, you needed to provide real info for those registrations.
Once they had that down, then they extended that to only Chinese people or Chinese organizations could register chinese domains.
Then they started enforcing ICP registration for domains - each domain in china requires an ICP licence, or it can't be hosted.
For bonus annoyance points to do a ICP registration the website must be shutdown till the licence gets issued.

Then they extended that to no ICP licence, no domain - if your domain doesn't have an ICP licence, bam, its put in suspended state at the registrar.
Now they're rigorously enforcing ICP registrations to the n'th degree.

They've been cancelling those left right and center for no real reason, forcing people to resubmit.

Currently an ICP submission requires that you have an ISP licence, as only ISP's can submit ICP's for their hosted domains.
Each ISP has to verify sites as follows. Have the owner or representative for the site provide fill in 3 forms, make certified copies of business licence, copy of their ID, and take a photo of them in the ISP's office. These are scanned and submitted to the local Telecom authority throw the ICP backend registration system. The user is then assigned a login and password where they can check their ICP licence at the MII official website.

Its been a major fucking pain in the ass for us recently as they've been arbitrarily cancelling perfectly good ICP licences without notice or reason. The Telecom bureau for each region does publish blacklists, but guess what - the cancelled ones don't appear.

If you host a domain with a cancelled licence (which unless you literally check all your clients licence stuff daily, you have no way of knowing about currently), then the Telco will also do fun lets call you at 6:30 on a Friday evening, and tell you that you have 30 minutes to remove that domain, or they shut down that ip address (shutting off hundreds of clients). What fun.

Its gotten to the point that I'm moving all my non .cn clients oversea's because we can't keep up with their bullshit.

They keep changing the rules, they don't have a decent mechanism in place for tracking stuff, and there is no fucking warning if they arbitrarily cancel a licence.

Thats pretty much it in a nutshell.

Lawrence at computersolutions.cn

Re:I run an ISP in China - Truth below - by kermidge · 2011-07-14 05:45 · Score: 1

Thanks for the good information.
Sounds like way too much fun.

Crime against humanity by nightfire-unique · 2011-07-14 04:11 · Score: 1

I move that we promote censorship to a crime against humanity. It is torture and starvation of the mind, and disgusting on every level.

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A government is a body of people notably ungoverned - AC

porn? by Anonymous Coward · 2011-07-14 04:33 · Score: 0

In fact, they unlocked a lot of porn website! Nobody has a real answer about why they did that... the only logical reason I found is that the great firewall was overloaded and they preferred to allow some of these websites and continue to block political websites!
Keep people busy so they don't think to do other things! ;-)

Re:Quick experiment for you /.ers currently in Chi by Anonymous Coward · 2011-07-14 04:42 · Score: 0

flickr is fine. photobucket is blocked though, so thats weird!

China stopped allowing anonymous domains by Animats · 2011-07-14 04:57 · Score: 1

This is because China stopped allowing undocumented domain registration. Registering a domain in China now requires a national ID and a business license. GoDaddy then stopped registering ".cn" domains, probably a good thing.

A possible solution... by Anonymous Coward · 2011-07-14 05:17 · Score: 0

/. and other news sites should provide the option to end-users to switch to an image mode where instead of text articles they will see text embedded in images in place of the articles instead. This way, there's no way to filter by the words in the article. In addition, all URL links should be masked with a URL shortener. This would solve censorship in many countries, so information can flow freely. The online press should seriously consider implementing this. It could usher in a golden age of freedom of information.

Re:Quick experiment for you /.ers currently in Chi by Anonymous Coward · 2011-07-14 05:40 · Score: 0

You mean April 15, 1989?

imitation is sincere flattery by Anonymous Coward · 2011-07-14 06:04 · Score: 0

C'mon, the FBI and DHS are copycating this exact same domain seizure and shutdowns.
Seems like some of our elected officials seems to like what the Chinese are doing.

Re:Quick experiment for you /.ers currently in Chi by SleazyRidr · 2011-07-14 08:18 · Score: 1

Great, now people in China can't read this story about China. Thanks a lot jack-ass!

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Is 1563649 a prime number?

Re:Ough by shutdown+-p+now · 2011-07-14 08:33 · Score: 1

I stopped reading at "Re:".

I mean, it's the next logical step after NRTFA and NRTFS.

English vs. Mandarin by jcarr · 2011-07-14 10:29 · Score: 1

Interesting, but it seems you are searching and writing in English. If slashdot was in Mandarin, would it then get blocked?

Welcome to Democracy! by Anonymous Coward · 2011-07-14 13:45 · Score: 0

That kind remind me of "The Lord of War"

Yuri Orlov: Democracy? What have you been drinking Andy?
Andre Baptiste Sr.: Heh, you have not seen the news. You know, they accuse me of rigging elections. But after this - [holds up a newspaper with the headline "U.S. Supreme Court Reverses Recount Ruling"] - with your Florida and your Supreme Court of Kangaroos, now, the U.S. will shut up forever!

Re:OK, I'm a grammar nazi, so sue me by tehcyder · 2011-07-14 21:34 · Score: 1

That's the nitpicking park. Obviously a typo.

Typos are excusable in hastily written emails or posts to internet forums, not as fucking news headlines on a serious web site.

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To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it

Re:OK, I'm a grammar nazi, so sue me by tehcyder · 2011-07-14 21:37 · Score: 1

"Anyone behind the firewall know" is correct. "Knows" would be wrong. As you say yourself, it is an elided interrogative. There is no possible way that "knows" would be correct.

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To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it

Re:Quick experiment for you /.ers currently in Chi by Ginger+Unicorn · 2011-07-15 01:10 · Score: 1

April 15th was the hillsborough disaster. He (intentionally?) got the date wrong.

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(1.21 gigawatts) / (88 miles per hour) = 30 757 874 newtons

Re:Quick experiment for you /.ers currently in Chi by SleazyRidr · 2011-07-15 02:00 · Score: 1

Oh... In that case I'd like to rescind my previous comment and offer the AC a high-five. Now if you'll excuse me, I'm off to brush up on history.

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Is 1563649 a prime number?

horrible by piyushwadhwa · 2011-07-15 07:42 · Score: 1

Chinese govt. want the people to see only those things which govt. want them to and not the ones which people want to see

Re:access from P.R. by timla · 2011-07-15 13:34 · Score: 1

I am curious, one site I admin get's extremely little traffic from China - I'm theorizing it's either due to it not being in China's version of search engines, or it's outright DNS or IP blocked. Link is www.witts.ws. What do you think?

Re:access from P.R. by RobertinXinyang · 2011-07-15 14:24 · Score: 1

I really was expecting some weird porn site when I clicked on it; however, I was willing to try and see if yous was a legitimate question. For all following, it is a legitimate site.

Back to your question, Yes, the site loads fine. However, you are relying on youtube for your video and youtube is blocked in China. So, where you have video, I get big white blocks that say

This webpage is not available
The webpage at http://www.youtube.com/embed/qPuH3DqP5tQ?rel=0&hd=1 might be temporarily down or it may have moved permanently to a new web address.
Here are some suggestions:
Reload this web page later.
Error 101 (net::ERR_CONNECTION_RESET): The connection was reset.

This is the standard message I get in any youtube embed.

As far as why you are not getting many hits, Your website really isn't that interesting. It is not clear what you are selling. If it is a "plain old religious website" the message is not clear. If you are selling a product, that is also not very clear. Possibly the videos make a presentation. However, as it stands, thee is a good reason you do not get many hits.

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41% of Chinese Websites Shut Down In 2010

203 comments