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Android User Spends 60 Days In WebOS Land
An anonymous reader writes "About six months ago, however, I began to wonder about how the other mobile products had grown. When the HTC HD7 crossed my path a little while ago, I decided to abandon my Nexus S and live among the Windows Phone folks for awhile. The experience was fun, but I eventually went back to my Nexus S. About a month later, I was presented with the opportunity to repeat the experiment, only this time with a Palm Pre Plus. With the HP Touchpad on its way, I wanted to get a feel for how WebOS worked, explore the differences, and take a look into the community that was still loyal to WebOS."
Android rules.
They go spend time with new things, bear with teething troubles and root out bugs so that normal consumers like me don't have to a couple of years down the line. Go Russel Holly!
"A door is what a dog is perpetually on the wrong side of" - Ogden Nash
More than how the OS works, I think a more important question is the availability of apps for the platform. There are many people whose worlds lie outside apps provided for Flixster, Facebook and Twitter. Are there any apps any webOS users found no substitute for, when they shifted from Android? Or other way round? Note: I bumped across this on doing a simple Google search: http://www.hpwebos.com/us/products/software/mobile-applications.html A lot like a market/app store for webOS.
1. Konami code activates developer mode (i.e., root or jailbroken). No muss, no fuss.
2. The "card" metaphor to represent running apps. Slide to switch, throw away to kill.
3. It's Linux, and mostly open source. (Shares that with Android.)
3b. Not M$, not Apple, for people that care (shares that with Android).
4. Apps are in HTML/Javascript. Easy. Or C++ (harder but faster to run)
5. Touch to move stuff between Pre and TouchPad.
6. Looks nice. Fonts, layout, icons, etc.
7. The homebrew community
I'm not a lawyer, but I play one on the Internet. Blog
I always think that if I left iOS I would try WebOS. It is the closest thing in consistency and well thought out design.
There simply isn't a unified Android UI and it would annoy me to have to choose which hardware I bought based on the UI it would run. I might want a Samsung phone but with the Sense UI.
Of course there's Windows Phone 7, I have owned a few Windows based phones before and liked them. But I can't help but think their patent tax on Android and others is too much about the money rather than preventing products being sold.
As for WebOS phones, they are pretty cheap.
The main problem with WebOS is the same main problem with iOS... it only runs on one platform. As such, it is doomed to failure. Android has become the Windows of the smartphone world. The hardware platform manufacturer is now nothing but a commodity.
I'm a devoted and loyal WebOS fan. It's better than Android, subjectively speaking. The appstore doesn't have nearly as much stuff though, and the device on sprint is dated and barely functions by today's standard. I grew extremely tired of waiting to see if (not when, but if) HP would finally release the pre3 on sprint. As the summer wore on, I finally broke down and got an EVO 3d. I really like Android. It's fantastic. I like WebOS better, and I think Android could learn a lot from it. The card paradigm is much better than what we have in Android land. I also think the android hardware peeps could learn something about the HP/Palm love for developers. It's a fantastic platform to develop for and rooting your phone doesn't void your warranty -- it's literally supported (search for webos doctor).
So overall, I'm happy I switched, but WebOS is clearly better. Clearly better if you can handle being a second class citizen on your network of choice (not sprint, apparently). Ultimately, I left WebOS to stay with sprint. It goes the other way too. See precentral for the split. Seems 60/40 to me? But in any case, HP is too damn slow. Mobile is fast. The I cannot wait three years for my next device. HP (or possibly sprint) has failed.
Imagine if you weren't allowed to use roads because a bus company complained about your driving 3 times. --skunkpussy
Palm Pixi had a damn good design, never mind the OS. Woulda brought it if it had lasted long enough to get launched in India.
Speaking as a former Mac developer and someone currently having to work with Android network stacks, WebOS seems to have thought more about human factors in a coherent way than either iOS or Android.
One word: Notifications. The notifications system in WebOS is the epitome of "considerate." Whether it's of users' time or attention or screen real estate, they have created a UI that very capably tells the user when something important happens, and gets out of the way while discreetly leaving a telltale that there's something to acknowledge. The notifications systems on both iOS and Android are clunky by comparison.
Apple traditionally spends a lot of time thinking about human factors, but compared to their almost religious fervor for human interface guideline compliance in the pre-OSX era, these days they're on a fast track to MS Windows-level UI inconsistency. Well, perhaps not quite that fragmented, but it is what it is.
Android vendors have approached this by grafting on their own proprietary chrome, but some of those are better than others.
I invite anyone who really cares about intuitive usability to try out WebOS. Even on a first generation Palm Pre, it's noteworthy.
From a hacking and customization perspective, I have yet to see a system as friendly as WebOS. Palm and HP have taken their sweet time with some of the SDK/PDK releases, but they've also done things to make it about as easy for developers as one can imagine. Having a full IDE running in a web browser is both a neat hack and rather convenient. Pretty much everything other than time-critical code is in Javascript.
That openness does not come without some potential downsides. While I love that I can customize my phone by tweaking a line of Javascript, I can't help but feel a nagging concern that there are security implications inherent in some of the choices Palm/HP made. It remains to be seen how pervasive those might be, but I'm remaining wary. It won't stop me from using the handset (yet), as I have yet to find anything else as friendly, open, and customizable.
OS/2 is still in use today among many many companies.
I write bullshit
Android was a lot like Desktop Linux: I spent more time tweaking in than using it, praying for that mythical configuration where it would actually feel polished.
Obviously you either don't have any work to do on your computer, or you're lying about using linux.
The purpose of customization isn't to look "polished" it is to make it a more effective tool.
Next time, don't bother with linux. You're worried mostly about how it looks, instead of what you can do with it. It will never be for you, and we don't need the pollution.
Of all of the mobile platforms, this was the one that I was really looking forward to, not just as a user, I was looking forward to program things for it. It seemed just so nice, well developed, well planned, and it even had some nice touches such as the Konami code. I didn't care about iOS and android just wasn't as interesting, this was, and I was very sorry to see it fail and fade away.
I know that HP bought it, and that it plans to do something with it. I just hope that they handle this correctly because it is an interesting concept, and I would like to see it become something great.
Seems like an odd blogpost, bordering on a paid advertisement. I owned a Pre for 2 years, and never saw squat from bloggers on it. Now the new touchpad is out someone decides to write a review of a 1.5 y/o device???? Meh.
--WooooHoooo--
OS/2 is still in use today among many many companies.
And I expect it does so in a legacy role, used strictly in places where there is too much risk / expense involved in moving to something else more modern. It's fate was sealed a long time ago through a pincer head attack of MS anti-competitiveness and IBM incompetence.
I assume Palm is going away since its popularity continues to shrink. :(
Ant(Dude) @ Quality Foraged Links (AQFL.net) & The Ant Farm (antfarm.ma.cx / antfarm.home.dhs.org).
Perhaps, but because Android OS is implemented so many different ways on so many different manufacturers' handsets, it lacks the consistency possible by marrying the OS to one vendor's specific handset or handsets.
EG. Netflix for Android. Will it run on my Android phone after I download it? Depends.... Until recently, only worked on about 3 of them, total! Or take Google Goggles, where it never would launch without crashing on my Kyocera Zio (apparently because they didn't support that phone's particular camera hardware).
Sounds pretty much like a horror story to me.
Why anyone would choose anything over Android at this point is well beyond my understanding. The code is easy to write (Java/XML or Native C-based) runs excellently on even old hardware, as long as it's not Crysis, and the developer community is the size of the friggin' moon. It's been around for a good while, so people have gotten most of the bugs out of the base programming. The app store doesn't require approval/scrutiny to upload your programs, and the developer resources headed up by Google are amazing. The entire system is open source as well, so developers are able to 'compile their own' version of the OS to suit their devices and needs.
Until I see that on these other systems, I'm at a loss for why anyone but Mac Cult members would use anything non-android.
If the only way you can accept an assertion is by faith, then you are conceding that it can't be taken on its own merits
Sadly, it's being phased out becuased Windows XP Embedded can do the same things, is as secure, and can dso fancier greaphics.
"Polished" doesn't equal "shiny." Actually, it means "someone put thought into the design." Sadly, this is not true for a lot of desktop Linux implementations. In a lot of ways, using the latest GNOME feels like going back in time to Windows 3.1. Instead of acknowledging this, you're advising people not to use Linux. Probably good advice.
(-1, Raw and Uncut is the only way to read)
If Nokia, may they swallow a tram and have it drive around inside them with people getting on and off at their livers and their kidneys, kayn anoreh, hadn't screwed up Maemo I would have stuck with it- but the redacted redacteds have screwed the pooch. The Pre 2 has a workable screen and keyboard, which is what I need. I can now wait as long as it takes for a new contract and the next Pre, and I'm prepared to do it because I suspect I will never miss a call on webOS.
From scarped cliff or quarried stone she cries "A thousand types are gone, I care for nothing, no not one."
How many dual-core options does Apple have again?
iPad 2 (until the iPhone 5).
What if you want a physical keyboard?
You use any bluetooth keyboard on the planet, with phone or iPad.
Different screen size or display technology?
iPad/iPhone/Touch.
If you just want Apple to make all your choices for you, then it's pretty plain to see that your options are far more limited.
They are more limited but not "far more" limited.
However it's rather funny that you speak of "limits" as a positive in any way for the Android device space, since the ultimate point of any device is to run software you can make use of - and there the iPhones/iPads truly offer "far more" choice. If choice were really your primary concern you would drop Android in a heartbeat. So stop pretending choice really matters to you and admit why you are making the choices you make.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
I really really wanted to try out a WebOS phone. It's Linux, you can get root without cracking or jailbreaking, there are development tools for Linux, the form factor is nice.
BUT to use one you HAVE to have a data plan through your cell phone provider. I do not have a data plan. I get wireless for my N900 for free at home, work, the church, the pool, my favorite restaurant, starbucks, the library, my friend's homes, etc.
On top of that HP strongly recommends that you get an unlimited data plan because WebOS chews so much data. Great, especially now that providers are dropping their unlimited plans.
Oh well. My next plan is to offer someone an absurd amount of money for a N950.
It should be obvious that creating a learning curve where there should be non goes against everything "UI design" stands for and that you fail as a nerd.
Try e17, then. GNOME is weird and KDE is like Vista on X11.
I switched the other way (to android) last year. I owned a palm pre for a year and absolutely hated it. Yes, the OS is nice and I liked the cards user interface however, the actual "phone" capability was shocking and the phone system would shut down and I'd only realise some hours later when no calls had come through. it wouldn't switch between 3G, HSPDA and 2G cleanly, often failing completely (even during a call in good signal area) and rebooting (which is a nightware where I live in a hilly area because the signal strength fluctuates as cell towers come into line of sight.)
whilst the touchstone was cool, you'd be using it a lot since the battery would last 6 to 8 hours and if you charged it directly using the micro usb then the little plastic cap would eventually fall off. Often, after charging, the data storage would not be accessible.
the webos "market" is different for each region and had a lot more carrier influence than android market and itunes store. The community did sort this out by offering homebrew solutions, but it took time and a lot of patience.
If you look at the O2 UK palm pre forum when they came out - you'll see endless customers venting their frustrations at a system with such poor quality hardware that it really didn't matter how technically good the OS was. Also, O2 Uk made a bit of a cockup with the support of this phone, see the Reg article about unlocking sims
KDE is "windows", I'll give it that. It can feel a lot snappier than Vista or 7, though, depending on hardware / tweaks.
I'd recommend KDE to people who like the Windows environment.
There's plenty of lightweight stuff out there, though, like LXDE(with Openbox), but in my experience, they sacrifice a lot of Just Works attitude for speed and being lightweight. Perfect for someone who can drop to a terminal and edit config... not so good for a newbie.
If anyone is deploying XP Embedded at this late stage they need a good smacking. XP has less than 3 years until EOL so now is NOT the time to deploy anything XP based! I haven't had a chance to play with it yet but I hear Windows 7 Embedded is nice and low resource although frankly I think MSFT needs to hire the pirate that makes those custom Tiny versions of Windows like TinyXP and Tiny7 because frankly after trying WinFLP and XP Embedded neither held a candle to the Tiny variants.
Hell for shits and giggles I installed Windows 7 Tiny on an old socket 478 P4 2.4Ghz with the craptastic Intel 845 chipset and 512Mb of RAM and damned if the thing wasn't peppy! Sure it couldn't run Aero without a Dx9 GPU but the thing surfed the web great! It is just a damned shame MSFT doesn't sell Tiny7 for older systems as I'd happily pay $35-$55 a pop for copies of Tiny 7 legally. But as for OS/2 frankly the only places I've seen actually using it anymore is banks who still have some OS/2 software running on the back end.
As for TFA? while I wish WebOS lots of luck I have a feeling it will end up as little used as OS/2. My final prediction? Apple and Google trading the #1 and #2 spots while if MSFT does what I think they'll do and tie the XBL gaming into the Nokia WinPhone they'll take third place simply because of the huge install base of Xbox. RIM will be gone within 2 years, possibly bought by Google, and HP just doesn't really do innovative work anymore IMHO and while they'll try I have a feeling the field is already too crowded and they missed their chance. Final tally...Apple #1, Google a VERY close #2, and MSFT with a solid but pretty far behind #3 and RIM and WebOS DOA.
ACs don't waste your time replying, your posts are never seen by me.
They bought EDS, and now have the most developers in the WORLD collecting paychecks signed by HP.
How hard would it be for them to offer their developer employees a free Pre (or better, a WebOS-powered tablet) and the WebOS SDK and let them develop apps on their own?
Instead, they get offered a 10% discount...pfft. They have an incredible resource available, and a 10% discount seems like an insult. Giving developers a tablet as incentive to write WebOS apps might cost some money, but as a capital expense, it makes sense. They'd also be tapping a large body of bug hunters who could articulate issues found in the system through daily use, much better than the average user.
For some reason WebOs continues to have the same problem with trailing a generation on the hardware side that Palm did. I remember going into assorted places looking at the Palm OS devices in the late '90s when all the wince machines were color, and the sad little palms were all black/white. Then when they finally came out with a color version the screen looked like it was two generations behind. Sure my palm would go 3 months on a set of batteries vs a daily charge on the wince devices, but they should have been making a color version to sell to the people who wanted color, and a BW version for people that cared about battery life.
That said the OS's have always been better in their own quirky ways. Not necessary better from a bullet list of features, but better from a more carefully thought out perspective.
I was in the Verizon store a couple of days ago, and the Verizon guy told me that, since I have a smartphone with unlimited now, as long as I continue to keep a smartphone my unlimited plan remains. They aren't canceling old plans. But if I go to a dumb phone (even for a month), then I will lose my unlimited plan and won't get it back. I have not switched phones yet, so I don't have any proof, but if you're thinking of switching phones, it's worth asking them.
It's easier to be a result of the past, but more fun to be a cause of the future! http://www.spacefinancegroup.com/
Well, I don't really get the whole appitis thing that seems to have infected everyone in the 1st world...
I mean isn't there a point where too much info is just that? Are all these applications really important to everybody's daily activities or are they just more white noise? Yes sure it is informative to see how many hours you have spent traveling underground, queing before others or in the loo (playing iFart) but is it really necessary? sure stats are good but at some point stats just encumber you and eat away on your productivity.
I haven't used webOS yet but I will in the near future and from what I can see and read It is a very well designed package and very developer friendly, which in turn means that probably I will be able to get much more out of it.
-- no sig today
The hardware sucked, there's no question. I had three phones in two years and thanked my stars I had the phone insurance each time. I didn't have any phone system crashes like that, and suspect it was your carrier's comcard or possibly the drivers for it. Who really knows. Another really common hardware problem that bugged me to death was the headphone port. Occasionally, often enough to be really really irritating, it would fail to sense the removal of the wire and your audio would be essentially disabled until you 1) blow in the hole and 2) replug a few times.
There were many problems with the platform. All of them, I think, were due to a combination of resource problems at Palm (hence the ensuing bankruptcy) and a very very low adoption rate.
Ultimately, I don't think you read my post very carefully at all though since I switched *TO* android last week. So it's the same way around. :p
Imagine if you weren't allowed to use roads because a bus company complained about your driving 3 times. --skunkpussy
Seriously webos is my backup plan if all of these everyone else v. Android lawsuits go badly(TM)...