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Build Your Own Camera, Launch It Like a Grenade

angry tapir writes "Meet the Firefly. Israeli defense contractor Rafael Armament Development Authority calls it a 'revolutionary concept in tactical intelligence,' but really it's a wireless camera that's shot 500 feet in the air by a grenade launcher. And if a couple of hackers at the Defcon hacking convention get their way, soon anyone will be able to buy this type of military grade technology for only US$500."

20 of 117 comments (clear)

  1. Re:Am I the only one... by hcs_$reboot · · Score: 4, Funny

    You probably spend too much time on Angry Birds...

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  2. Re:What good is this for? by davester666 · · Score: 5, Insightful

    This is a great business model. Sell a product where your clients will just launch it away and immediately have to buy another one.

    Lather, rinse, repeat.

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  3. You should just buy one of these by SecurityTheatre · · Score: 3, Interesting

    You should just buy one of these bad boys.

    http://www.draganfly.com/uav-helicopter/draganflyer-x6/

    Military grade and can stay aloft more than 7.2 seconds, while capturing realtime HD video that can be transmitted to a cool pair of goggles on the ground.

    Plus, you can whip it out of a backpack in 10 seconds. :-D Cool!

    http://www.draganfly.com/video/gallery/show-single-video.php?video_number=2&product_id=DF-X6&r=837

    1. Re:You should just buy one of these by Zibodiz · · Score: 3, Insightful

      One simple reason why this new camera is so awesome: speed. Try shooting something out of the sky when it's moving at 2 - 4 mph. Not that hard (heck, a skeet it moving a lot faster than that). Besides, try getting it 500 feet into enemy territory in 8 seconds. Something shooting at the speed of a grenade launcher has such obvious superiorities. Granted, the whole 'one time use' thing kinda sucks, but they're the military; they're used to using it once and replacing it.

      Although I do have to say... you're totally right when it comes to civilian uses. I really can't think of a time when civilians would benefit more from the firefly than from the UAV you linked to.

    2. Re:You should just buy one of these by iamhassi · · Score: 3, Interesting

      Wait until the military figures out you can do the same thing with a $11 keychain camera and a toys 'r us r/c helicopter.

      I have a few of those 808 keychain cameras and they shoot remarkably good video considering their size and disposable price.

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  4. Re:What good is this for? by shmlco · · Score: 3, Insightful

    "This is a great business model. Sell a product where your clients will just launch it away and immediately have to buy another one. "

    Yawn. Arms merchants have been doing it for years. "Notice you just fired your last RPG. Want to buy another one?"

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  5. everything for war by roman_mir · · Score: 3, Interesting

    more stuff created for war. These cameras instruments are not going to be sold to civilians, here is the purpose:

    Soldiers shoot it off and for eight glorious seconds it gives them a bird's eye view of the terrain around them, tipping them off to enemy positions. Then it crashes back to earth.

    Private citizens can't buy these flying cameras, much less the 40mm grenade launchers used to shoot them. But Vlad Gostom and Joshua Marpet think they'd be great tools for a search and rescue operation, or maybe a boon to some local police force's SWAT (special weapons and tactics) team. So they're building their own version and showing off what they've learned at Defcon this week.

    of-course outside of a war or a 'rescue operation' there may be not much use for these things, but it just adds to resources that are mis-allocated for wars instead of going towards normal consumer market. The only use for consumer market I can think of is war games unfortunately, like paintball.

    1. Re:everything for war by Toze · · Score: 2

      more stuff created for war. These cameras instruments are not going to be sold to civilians, here is the purpose:

      Yeah! Like the Internet. Or satellite phones. Or guns.

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    2. Re:everything for war by villageidiot357 · · Score: 2

      No civilians can by grenade launchers in the US, its just a $200 tax stamp.

  6. begs for improvement by catmistake · · Score: 2

    Seems to me that increasing that 8 seconds of recon should be relatively academic. How about adding a little parachute that could increase hang time immensely? Also, perhaps adding a gps transmitter would allow for reuse.

    1. Re:begs for improvement by iamhassi · · Score: 2

      Seems to me that increasing that 8 seconds of recon should be relatively academic. How about adding a little parachute that could increase hang time immensely? Also, perhaps adding a gps transmitter would allow for reuse.

      8 seconds is with a parachute. FTFA: "Their first test -- launched from a 37mm flare gun last week at a neighbor's farm -- wasn't exactly a raging success: The powder didn't fully ignite, the miniature camera flew about 30 feet into the air -- apparently too fast to transmit images back to the 5.8Ghz wireless receiver they were using -- and their parachute partially incinerated."

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  7. Re:What are your wishful thinking gadget projects? by semi-extrinsic · · Score: 2

    Well, for the first trick, just do what firemen do. Wear a vest containing phase-changing gel underneath a thick layer of insulation. It only works for 3-5 hours at a time in hot conditions, but that's not too bad.

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  8. Already old news in Finland by Cow+Jones · · Score: 2, Funny

    The Fins have been doing that since 2006. The don't even need a fancy grenade launcher.

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  9. Re:What good is this for? by jpapon · · Score: 4, Informative
    From TFA:

    The powder didn't fully ignite, the miniature camera flew about 30 feet into the air -- apparently too fast to transmit images back to the 5.8Ghz wireless receiver they were using -- and their parachute partially incinerated.

    So clearly it has a parachute. Why don't you read before you complain about how you think it should work?

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  10. A lot more successful... by moonbender · · Score: 2

    The new idea turned out to be a lot more viable than the opposite approach: Build Your Own Grenade, Hold It Like a Camera

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  11. Re:What benefits? by itsdapead · · Score: 2

    You can currently get a remote controlled helicopter based camera that has a run time of 10+ mins.

    I'm guessing that this is for spying on the sort of people who are likely to shoot down any suspicious looking mini-helicopters before they can get close.

    Not a lot you can do about a ballistic camera apart from try and find where it landed so you can moon the operators.

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  12. Re:What good is this for? by whargoul · · Score: 2

    Why don't you read before you complain about how you think it should work?

    You must be new here.

  13. Re:Launcher barrels rifled! by redelm · · Score: 2

    Some flares are on parachutes -- longer duration. These would have serious troubles if rifled -- the parachute would twist into uselessness.

  14. 40mm flare launchers are legal by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

    You can buy a 40mm or 37mm flare launcher and strap it to your gun. It looks, acts, behaves, and 'is' a grenade launcher. If you have a grenade in the same building, area, etc. then you have two destructive devices. As long as it only has flares with it, its fine. I assume a camera should be a form of flare or inert projectile (ask the ATF), so these are likely completely legal.

  15. Article is Incorrect about civilian ownership by Thesis · · Score: 2

    As a collector of NFA weapons myself, I can say that the article is incorrect about private citizens in the US not being able to purchase a 40mm grenade launcher. The 40mm grenade launcher is classified as a Destructive Device (DD) by the BATFE, and is regulated by the National Firearms Act of 1934, commonly referred to as NFA. All NFA weapons are tracked with mandated registration with the BATFE. Weapons regulated by the NFA are Title 2 weapons (Title 1 weapons are "normal" firearms you see in most gun stores) include Destructive Devices, Suppressors (aka Silencers), machineguns made prior to May 1986, Short Barreled Rifles (SBR), Short Barreled Shotguns (SBS), and lastly the Any Other Weapon (AOW) category. These items can be purchased and transferred to you from any FFL who has paid an annual Special Occupation Tax (SOT) on file with the BATFE. Not all states allow you to purchase or posses these items, but most do. That being said, Federal law is clear that you can own these items if you pass the background check done by BATFE, which generally takes a few months due to the volume of applications they process. State law however, can limit or prohibit your possession, as well as use of the items. When you purchase any of the items above, you pay a one time $200 transfer tax to the BATFE per serial numbered item. The only exception are the AOW's which have a $5 transfer tax.

    To own any of the above items, it simply must be legal to posses in your state with the proper federal registration. You purchase the item, then the dealer or individual you purchased it from helps you to complete what is called a Form 4, finger print cards, and a certificate of compliance. Put all that in an envelope, then mail it off with a check for the appropriate NFA transfer tax. If you have a clean criminal record the item will be transferred to you in a few months, and you can take possession of it when an approved Form 4 is returned.

    The purchase price for a M230 40mm grenade launcher starts around $1300 and goes up from there, depending on who makes it and the configuration or collectability. Suppressors are much cheaper for the most part, and transferable (to the public) machineguns are the most expensive of all, starting at $3500 and going up as high as 500k depending on what it is, for the supply is fixed and cannot be replenished due to the ban in 1986.

    You can learn more about the National Firearms Act here:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Firearms_Act

    Places which make or sell various NFA items:
    http://www.subguns.com/classifieds/?db=nfafirearms&category=All+Items+in+this+Category&query=category&search_and_display_db_button=on&results_format=headlines&website=&language=&session_key=
    http://www.sturmgewehr.com/webBBS/nfa4sale.cgi
    http://www.swrmfg.com/
    http://www.libertycans.net/
    http://www.gem-tech.com/store/pc/home.asp
    http://www.advanced-armament.com/
    http://www.thompsonmachine.net/
    http://www.silencerco.com/
    http://www.suppressedarmament.com/
    http://www.surefire.com/Suppressors