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Sprint Details Shift To LTE

Posted by Soulskill on from the anticipating-iphone-data-hogs dept.

New submitter jmeboi writes "Engadget reports that Sprint has announced a rollover from WiMAX to LTE for its 4G needs. The company is 'converting its 1900MHz holdings and LightSquared's 1600MHz spectrum ("pending FCC approval") to LTE,' and also re-purposing the section of 800MHz spectrum that was set aside for the defunct iDEN push-to-talk network. 'The company plans for a rapid deployment of this new 4G, with the first LTE markets and handsets to hit in mid-2012 with the full rollout mostly completed by 2013. Current subscribers signed up for WiMAX plans won't have to worry, as their devices will continue to be supported throughout 2012.'"

18 of 183 comments (clear)

  1. uhh... by metalgamer84 · · Score: 3, Insightful

    So my new Evo Shift 4G will no longer have WiMAX/4G capability after 2012? Unlike some people, I don't buy new phones every 2 years...

    1. Re:uhh... by TheRaven64 · · Score: 4, Insightful

      This is what happens when you let the free market decide on standards with geographical monopolies. This is why a particular protocol is mandated with spectrum sales in most of the world. Irrespective of the relative technical merits of GSM versus CDMA, it's pretty clear that GSM is superior to CDMA and GSM with incompatible client devices for the two networks and customers locked in to one or the other depending on what phone they bought. It appears that the USA didn't learn from this mistake the first time around...

      --
      I am TheRaven on Soylent News
    2. Re:uhh... by ahow628 · · Score: 4, Informative

      The submitter is wrong. They said they would sell Wimax devices through 2012. They will mostly likely support Wimax for far long than that.

    3. Re:uhh... by pancake_lover · · Score: 2

      WiMax is not CDMA.

      --
      Homer no function beer well without.
    4. Re:uhh... by Bengie · · Score: 3, Informative

      lawl.. GSM better than CMDA...

      CDMA uses 1/3 to 1/10th the power of GSM, all the while having better range, more resilient to interference, signal bouncing can actually improve signal strength, tower hand-off rarely results in dropped calls, and supports more customers per tower by several factors. oh, and they're easier to setup because they all use the same frequency, so you don't have to check with any other tower operators.

      I guess GSM is cheaper to implement.. so it's clearly better.

    5. Re:uhh... by gad_zuki! · · Score: 3, Insightful

      None of that matters if you like to travel. Or if you like to actually own a phone and can swap out SIM cards to change phone numbers and carriers quickly.

      Or if you like fast 3G (EVDO vs UMTS/HSPDA).

      So CDMA is technically better, in theory but in practice its a lot of lock-in and slow ass 3G. There's more to deciding which is better than just tech specs on a piece of paper, but this being slashdot, we have the "TECHNICALLY CORRECT IS THE BEST KIND OF CORRECT" crowd.

    6. Re:uhh... by Registered+Coward+v2 · · Score: 3, Insightful

      This is what happens when you let the free market decide on standards with geographical monopolies. This is why a particular protocol is mandated with spectrum sales in most of the world. Irrespective of the relative technical merits of GSM versus CDMA, it's pretty clear that GSM is superior to CDMA and GSM with incompatible client devices for the two networks and customers locked in to one or the other depending on what phone they bought. It appears that the USA didn't learn from this mistake the first time around...

      That's so right. I really like the ability to pay 20Euros a month and roam anywhere within the EU without paying any roaming charges since all my calls/texts are included in the flat fee no matter where I am in the EU. Add in a data plan and I don't have to worry about data charges while I roam either.

      Different markets evolve differently - for 90% of the US phone use the incompatibility is a non-issue - they have a phone that works wherever they go. They get a flat price no matter where they roam in an area roughly as big as the EU. With the advent of "free" mobile to mobile and nights and weekends even the minute caps are largely a non-issue. Nor do I have to worry if I call a cell phone form a land line - no extra charge their either.

      While what we have is different than what you have, it's not inherently better or worse - just different and an adaptation to our market characteristics.

      --
      I'm a consultant - I convert gibberish into cash-flow.
    7. Re:uhh... by Bill_the_Engineer · · Score: 2

      Range and ultimate power requirements are a function of the frequency not necessarily the protocol being used.

      CDMA is spread spectrum which makes it more resistant to interference than GSM. However due to the signal-to-noise ratio being influenced by the number of people using the band, CDMA does require more power to operate during peak usage times. On the other hand, GSM uses time division for multiple users on the same frequency and frequency division to spread the load which allows it to use less power compared to CDMA when operating on similar bands.

      I think it may be a little unfair to use anecdotal evidence against GSM since CDMA networks tend to be on the 800MHz band and GSM tend to be in the 1700-1900 MHz band which means CDMA usually penetrates buildings better and have higher range per watt transmitted. When I am in a sparsely populated state like New Mexico, my quad-band phone uses the 800 MHz band for GSM and I don't detect much difference between my T-Mobile phone using Prairie Wireless Towers and my co-workers Verizon phone using CDMA.

      As for your other points, I like to see some references.

      --
      These comments are my own and do not necessarily reflect the views or opinions of my employer or colleagues...
  2. And nothing of value was lost by Erich · · Score: 3, Insightful
    The WiMAX network is pretty bad. Coverage is virtually nonexistant, even in cities "with WiMAX coverage" In Austin, there are very few places where WiMAX works ... and seemingly never in places like the airport where you actually want it. If you ever happen to get it working, speeds are marginally better than EVDO.

    LTE should work much better, and it will align with the rest of the industry.

    --

    -- Erich

    Slashdot reader since 1997

  3. Re:Wow. A whole year? by mcavic · · Score: 2

    Right, it doesn't actually say anything about discontinuing Wimax.

  4. Re:iPhone by DdJ · · Score: 2

    Nope, there is no such thing as an iPhone that works woth 4G, on the market or announced. The Sprint iPhone 4S is a strictly 3G device, just like the Verizon, AT&T, and unlocked iPhone 4S.

  5. Re:iPhone by DikSeaCup · · Score: 2

    Read some of the iPhone 4S doco/articles, and you'll discover that it's not a 4G device. On *anyone's* network.

    It will do HSPA+ 14.4, but that's supposedly only marginally faster than 3G speeds (I haven't done more than read an article or two about it).

    One would theorize that when Apple finally makes a 4G device, it will be LTE (which is what Verizon and AT&T are already deploying) and not WiMAX (which is what Sprint deployed and will probably abandon by 2014). So, best that Sprint at least have some LTE deployed by the time Apple releases a 4G capable iPhone.

    On a personal note, I've been a Sprint user for eons, and got an Epic 4G on release day. I've got until probably second quarter 2012 on the contract, so I'll probably wait to see what's available and if my area has LTE before I upgrade. The Epic Touch 4G is nice, but I'd rather save the money (and wait to see how things are next year).

    And it probably won't be an iPhone when I do upgrade.

    --
    I talk about stuff.
  6. V.90 by clinko · · Score: 3, Funny

    So it looks like X2 and K56flex have a new challenger...

  7. Now all carriers are going to LTE... by generalhavok · · Score: 2, Interesting
    I'm excited with the developments in LTE, because it's nice to see that all carriers in the USA will eventually be supporting the same standard. For far too long in the states we've had so much confusion and complication because of CDMA vs GSM. I'm glad that the CDMA carriers (Verizon and Sprint) are finally upgrading to a better standard.

    I'm dreaming of a future where the USA will be like the rest of the world, where we'll be able to buy an unlocked phone, and use it on any carrier we chose. I'm currently using an unlocked phone, but my choice in carriers is limited to just AT&T (being as T-Mobile doesn't cover here). It's still cheaper, if you buy an unlocked phone, and then get a prepaid SIM card. Life would be so much simpler if all the carriers supported one standard, and an LTE phone would work with any network.

    It might be Apple that pushes us to this point. As they've repeatadly shown, they prefer to only build one model of phone. The iPhone finally got a CDMA variant last year, but this year, it's all one model again, because they found a chip that supports both CDMA and GSM, as well as all 3g frequencies. Apple wants to build an LTE phone, and all carriers want to have it, and Apple will not want to build two different LTE phones. Meaning we'll get one LTE phone, and as LTE is backwards compatible with GSM, it requires a SIM card. When they do that, and other manufactures start doing it, we'll see an era where it might just be possible to buy an unlocked phone in the USA, and be able to buy a SIM card from any network you want to use.

    This is my dream, but I'm thinking there has to be a catch. Why would the carriers want this kind of arrangement? They want to be able to lock people in, because they don't want to compete based just on who has the best service / price. But maybe, this is just an inconvenient fact for them, as the rest of the world moved on and developed standards, and in our global world, it just doesn't make sense to have your own proprietary standards anymore. CDMA is dying, and now so is WiMax. Both standards were only used by a few carriers, manufacturing phones and equipment to support them was more expensive just based on economies of scale, and they were unfriendly for the consumer. GSM is vastly more consumer friendly than CDMA, in terms of convenience and customer choice.

    So, does the USA finally enter the 21st century, and have mobile phone systems that don't confuse the rest of the world?

    1. Re:Now all carriers are going to LTE... by Miamicanes · · Score: 2

      Untrue. Sprint's phones are 100% frequency-compatible with Verizon's, and vice-versa. Sprint phones roam on Verizon every day. Sprint just refuses to allow anybody to use phones they didn't sell, because it enables Sprint to be the middleman and wholesaler for every single Sprint phone sold and pocket the profit. When Sprint sells an Evo 3D for $199 to somebody, their real "loss" is less than a hundred dollars compared to what they paid for it. When somebody buys a full-priced Evo 3D to replace his broken phone, Sprint makes about $200-300 of pure profit.

      In the old days, Sprint's mantra was that Verizon phones couldn't work, because they had to be programmed specifically for Sprint. Then the Hero arrived, got rooted, and had AOSP ported. For about a week, people scratched their heads wondering about all the wacky text messages that the phones suddenly started showing, and then it hit us... THAT was what Sprint was talking about all along. Less than a month later, the protocol was reverse-engineered, and was a complete non-issue.

      At the Verizon end, it's a little uglier... hacked Sprint phones reflashed to be faux Verizon phones can't do EVDO on Verizon, because Verizon does some wacky stuff at the radio modem level that can't be tampered with by end users. In theory, though, all it should take to make a Sprint-branded phone with Qualcomm MDM6600 chipset to work on Verizon is ripped firmware intended for some genuine Verizon phone with the same modem chipset. The problem is, Verizon phones don't have the radio modem firmware neatly abstracted out, and the bootloaders are hardware-encrypted, so nobody (I'm aware of) has ever successfully gotten a reflashed Sprint phone to do EVDO on Verizon (for what it's worth, Sprint phones can't roam on Verizon EVDO, either... they're stuck with 1xRTT; whether that's a technical limit of Sprint firmware, or a business policy decision by Verizon, is anybody's guess). Either way, it's not a hardware-imposed limit -- it's 100% software.

      To Verizon's credit, if by some miracle of ${deity} you're able to hack a Sprint phone to work natively on Verizon, they won't stop you. They won't HELP you, but they won't throw insurmountable roadblocks in your face that make it impossible (the way Sprint's magic database of approved MEIDs does).

      Elsewhere in the world, CDMA phones are as interoperable with other CDMA networks as GSM phones are with other GSM networks. The phones come with a R-UIM card, which is a superset of the GSM SIM standard (and optional subset of USIM).

  8. Re:iPhone by afidel · · Score: 2

    HSPA+ offers download up to 14.4Mbps, way faster than most initial 3G tech and over twice as fast a EVDO revB.

    --
    There are 4 boxes to use in the defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, ammo. Use in that order. Starting now.
  9. No you are just confusing things by Sycraft-fu · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Saying GSM is "better" than CDMA implies a technical benefit, that the standard itself is superior. That is not the case. GSM is much more widely adopted than CDMA. Now that is a very legit reason to use it. But let's not confuse "widely adopted" with "better".

    As to what is best for you to use, well that is up to the individual.

  10. You're confusing standards and technology. by jpstanle · · Score: 3, Insightful

    CDMA is a multiplexing/multiple access technique. GSM is a standard (and a rather old one at that). UMTS/HSPA, though they use SIM cards and were developed by the same standards body as, and somewhat backwards compatible with, GSM, they are not GSM. GSM is a 2G standard like cdmaOne. UMTS is a 3G standard like CDMA2000 (the actual standard that Sprint and Verizon use).

    Good thing someone actually recognized the technical merit of CDMA though, because UMTS/HSPA ditched the TDMA scheme used in GSM for a CDMA-based scheme.