Opera Proposes Switching Browser Scrolling For 'Pages'

Barence writes "Opera has proposed a new browsing system that swaps scrolling on websites for flippable pages. The Norwegian browser maker is looking to remove the side scroll bar for documents or articles in favor of 'pages' of a set-size, similar to an ebook. Text can be reflowed into a column layout, and ads will be moved into the right spot in the text, with different ones displayed depending on the orientation of the device. Pages are flipped with gestures on tablets or with mouse clicks on the desktop. It's an 'opportunity to rethink the ads on the web and the user interface,' said Hakon Wium Lie, Opera's CTO." Their main focus for this is browsing on tablets.

Comments

Sounds interesting

[rhyder128k]

The only problem with Opera innovating is that, if an new idea works out, the other browsers will add it. The only alternative is if Opera can patent the ideas. Not something that would prove very popular 'round here.

Re:Sounds interesting

[locopuyo]

Opera isn't that kind of company. If Opera patented all their ideas web browsers would be stuck in 1999.

Re:Sounds interesting

[Local ID10T]

The only problem with Opera innovating is that, if an new idea works out, the other browsers will add it..

That is not a problem, that is a GOOD THING.

Re:Sounds interesting

[Anonymous Coward]

It's a good thing to have everybody copying Opera even though we don't use Opera because we don't like it?

Firefox already suffers from an inferiority complex with regards to Chrome, and feels as though it must copy every annoying aspect of Chrome until there's nothing to differentiate the two. Once functionality of my favorite extensions is available in another browser I'm going to ditch FF like nobody's business. It's like IE vs. Netscape all over again, but now it's FF that's got people itching to leave.

Re:Sounds interesting

[Rary]

Actually, what you're describing about Tom's or Wired is exactly why this would be a good idea.

A website can split a document across multiple pages if they want to. But to do that, they're actually creating multiple documents. What Opera seems to be proposing is the idea that a single document could be rendered as a multi-page document. In other words, it's up to the browser to render it as multiple pages.

So, why is that a good idea? Because, if it's up to the browser to render a single document in multiple pages, then the browser could also choose not to render that document in multiple pages. The decision of how to view the document lies on the client side, not the server side.

So, instead of complaining about not having a "view all" option, those commenters would simply select the "view as single page" option in their browser and be happy.

Re:Sounds interesting

[AnonGCB]

Not sure about the randian part, but as a regular old libertarian (or anarcho capitalist, anyway) IP is stupid.

Re:Sounds interesting

[Anonymous Coward]

bonus to the inventors, that'll get them to spend even more time on R&D

No, bonus to the middlemen (e.g. lawyers) and managers. The reality, not the fiction that you're spouting, is that inventors are rarely rewarded. Look it up. Not tp mention the enormous financial load to society that are patents.

In that effort to get around that patent, we'd find out, instead of becoming complacent and settling for poor carbon copies of features.

No, people still compete. Removing patents doesn't stop that. On the other hand patents do stop competition. By definition; they're a monopoly. Whose to say somebody else wouldn't have a much better implementation of the patent's ideas?

Those alternatives are how innovation starts.

No, completely arbitrary similarities and differences as defined by ivory towered PTO bureaucrats do not constitute innovation.

People copying, using, learning, improving and competing is what true innovation is all about. Almost always incremental.

All I can say to that is at least with the patent approach they'd have to detail every little aspect that makes it work.

With just the tiny little downside, hardly worth mentioning, of blocking billions from using an idea just so one person can have increased profit from an idea that was probably going to be independently rediscovered many times anyway.

Engineers are specifically advised not to read patents in case it increases damages. What's the point in reading a patent if it's almost all downside?

Re:Sounds interesting

[hvm2hvm]

Yep, what's wrong with page up/page down? If the text is properly formatted into paragraphs it should work just as a specially made page-centric site.

Re:Sounds interesting

[cgenman]

So that people know what they're talking about, Opera was the first (or one of the first) browsers to offer:

Tabbed interface (and MDI before tabs)
Saved Sessions
Previous windows re-opening when you launch the browser
Mouse Gestures
Virtual folders in Mail
RAM Cache
Zooming
Integrated search
Speed dial
Undo of closing tabs
Using the user's CSS and Javascript instead of the site's

A lot of others that failed because they were shots in the dark (integrated web server? voice control?)
Others that succeeded that I'm probably forgetting.

Really, if you follow the development of the browser for the past 10 years or so, Opera has basically been the experimental branch of the tree. Features are created by opera, then integrated into other browsers. Recently, Chrome has done some nice experimentations, and Firefox's extensions saw a burst of weird creativity. But for day-in, day-out browsing, Opera has really defined a lot of the features we now take for granted.

Crappy websites already do this

[LateArthurDent]

A lot of ad-supported sites will do this. They'll release an article and split it up into multiple pages so they can display more ads. What happens when an article like that gets posted to slashdot? Everyone understandably complains that it's harder to read the article, and somebody posts a link to the printer-friendly version.

Multiple pages are not easier to navigate. Not even on tablets.

'Pages'

[fleeped]

You have to love how they specify 'pages' in quotes, like it's something new or has some overloaded meaning.

Re:Nobody even uses tablets. That's the problem.

[Anonymous Coward]

It's probably closer to 95% of tablet users who don't use it past the first few weeks, rather than the mere "over 50%" that you propose.

There are a few main reasons why people aren't returning them, and rather just letting them sit there:
1) They're too lazy to drive back to the Apple store to return the device.
2) They're too ashamed to admit that they wasted a lot of good money on a useless gadget.
3) They don't want to waste their time going back to the Apple store to return the device.
4) Their parents or trust fund paid for it, so it's not like they actually had to work to earn the money in the first place, and thus don't feel any urge to return the device to get the money back.
5) Some silly ass corporate manager drone bought into the hype and is forcing his subordinates to use the tablets he wasted a lot of money on, in a pathetic attempt to save face, even though it's a huge burden to the staff and actually decreases their productivity significantly.

standard resolution?

[Americium]

Considering the plethora of screen sizes and resolutions across smartphones, tablets, netbooks, laptops and pcs, this seems like an absurd idea. I'm sure I'm not the only one, but I want the text I'm reading to be at a certain location on the screen. This location covers perhaps 1/4-1/2 of the vertical space depending on the screen. I scroll pdfs all the time, especially textbooks with mathematical equations.

I also enjoy the dynamic rendering of html that changes as I make the window wider or thinner on a wide screen monitor. Depending on the size and resolution I will find a perfect width and zoom level.

This standardization, at it's best, would render pages based on both the screen size and resolution which the browser is running on. However many problems would occur, the simplest would be merely sitting closer or further from a large 1080p screen. I'm assuming if this was implemented by someone other than apple with a new revolutionary device, the result would be chaotic where most pages wouldn't play across all devices well at all. Perhaps apple products would work well since they have a larger enough user base for those standards to work well.

However, this missed the already dynamic nature of the web. As in one of the other posts, badly designed and spammy type websites employ this already. The only site I came across that used it was the IFW, Maine's government agency overseeing fishing and hunting. They post their yearly informative newletter, magazine, which is printed, in a horrible flash 'book' where the page flips are animated. No high resolution pdf, which would be great, where I can control the zoom, think of it, you could just load pdfs if you wanted pages.

Pages that I can scroll down are nicer anyway, like high quality search engines and all the porn sites.

So clearly, if this was something useful, it would have taken off. Unless there are thousands of website developers, catering to tablets, that are begging for this feature, it seems like another mistake from Opera.