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Will NASA Ever Recover Apollo 13's Plutonium From the Ocean
An anonymous reader writes "'Houston, we've had a problem,' said astronaut Jack Swigert on April 13, 1970. But the problem wasn't as simple as three astronauts potentially trapped in the void of space, 200,000 miles from Earth. The catastrophic risk came from the SNAP-27 radioisotope thermoelectric generator (RTG), a small nuclear reactor that was going to be placed on the moon to power experiments, carrying Plutonium 238 in Apollo 13's lunar module. As luck would have it, NASA had experience losing RTGs – a navigation satellite failed to reach orbit in 1964 and scattered small amounts of plutonium over the Indian Ocean. The SNAP-27 had been engineered to make it back to Earth intact in such an incident. The plutonium, like the astronauts, apparently survived reentry and came to rest with what remained of the lunar module in the Tonga Trench south of Fiji, approximately 6-9 kilometers underwater (its exact location is unknown). Extensive monitoring of the atmosphere in the area showed that no radiation escaped."
6Km under the ocean is probably the safest place for it.
In the early 1970s book "The Flight That Failed" by S.F. Cooper mentions as the spacecraft was approaching earth, someone (I think from the AEC) said they need to consider where the RTG will land. Ugh, there was already enough going on as crews were powering up the command module, a looming storm in the landing area, spacecraft attitude close to gimbal lock as it positions for re-entry. All this when many had very little sleep, then this guy brings up the RTG. Interesting book as it was written years before the fame brought on by the movie, also lots of esoteric details for techies.
mfwright@batnet.com
The Plutonium 238 is suitable for RTG (radioisotope thermoelectric generator) but not for bombs.
Maybe this info will spare us most "nuke" posts (terrorist jokes, etc).
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_sunken_nuclear_submarines and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lists_of_nuclear_disasters_and_radioactive_incidents.
Anyway, if it was in the LEM, did the LEM even survive rentry? Since it had no heat shield, etc.? Is the LEM still attched to the CM during re-entry even? Pretty sure it's not.
The LEM was attached to the CM until just before re-entry; the SM was separated from the CM before the CM separated from the LEM, since the LEM was providing most of the life support and the SM was just dead weight. The LEM was not designed for reentry and burned up, but the RTG itself was designed to survive accidental reentry intact and is probably sitting on the sea-bed somewhere.
This is on Cohen's wikipedia page:
When Ralph Nader described plutonium as "the most toxic substance known to mankind", Cohen, then a tenured professor, offered to consume on camera as much plutonium oxide as Nader could consume of caffeine,[17] the stimulant found in coffee and other beverages, which in its pure form has an oral (LD50) of 192 milligrams per kilogram in rats.[18]
Just another day in Paradise
Not if the mermen militarise the plutonium and use it against the land people.
They're vicious SOBs down there.
This may be a joke, but it is worth pointing out that the Plutonium used in RTGs is not fissile, and can't be used to make bombs. Pu-238 is only useful for RTGs. The isotope used in bombs is Pu-239, which is a common product of Uranium based reactors.
Producing Pu-238 is actually very difficult, as described in the above link. Unfortunately, the worlds supply is dwindling, and this endangers many upcoming space missions. One attractive option for creating more is to use Liquid fluoride thorium reactors, where Pu-238 is one of many useful products created.
Rather, it's the SNAP reactor buried in an avalanche at the headwaters of the Ganges river.
Autumn 1965
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Because people believe the media's saber rattling and they believe Ralph Nader who said that plutonium is “the most toxic substance known to mankind.” Even though it isn't. It's just too bad Ralph didn't accept Dr. Bernard Cohen's challenge to ingest equal amounts of caffeine to plutonium.
You do realize that this RTG is powered by Pu-238, which is *completely* different from the Pu-239 found in fission reactors?
Pu-239 is mildly radioactive. Maybe you wouldn't have ill effects from eating chunks of the ceramic oxide and pooped them out within a day or two. (Notice that he didn't offer to eat it in a bioavailable form. That's kind of like claiming that chlorine is always safe because it's in table salt.)
Pu-238, OTOH, is hundreds of times more radioactive, and it glows red hot. That's a whole other ball of wax.
So please, before you go around accusing people of being idiots, get your own facts straight.
PU 238 doesn't undergo fission and doesn't release neutrons. The decay chain is almost all alpha particles (non radioactive helium and blocked by your skin. There are some very rare decays that could produce neutrons but not in any meaningful number.
Pu 238 -> U 234 + alpha (h/l 100 years)
U 234 -> Th 230 + alpha (h/l 250,000 years)
Th 230 -> Ra 226 + alpha (h/l 75,000 years)
Ra 226 ->Rn 222 + alpha (h/l 1,00 years)
Rn 222 -> Po 218 + alpha (h/l 4 days)
Po 218 -> Pb 214 + alpha (h/l 3 minutes)
I love Jesus, except for his foreign policy.
I'm a nuclear engineer.
These things are not cheap. We have recovered one from the ocean floor before to fly it on a later mission. (albeit, the relative shallows of the florida coast.) If its possible to build a remote sub that could find it, I would bet the cost of recovery would be less than the cost of manufacture. (radar, sonar? how many right angles are on that thing? HOW would you find it?)
Its not dangerous. PU-238 cannot be used to make weapons.
Ref:
http://www.ne.doe.gov/space/neSpace2c.html
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SNAP-19B2
Nimbus-B-1
Meteorological
18-May-68
Status: Mission was aborted because of range safety destruct. RTG heat sources recovered and recycled.
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