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Twitter Bots Drown Out Anti-Kremlin Tweets

tsu doh nimh writes "It appears that thousands of Twitter accounts created in advance to blast automated messages are being used to drown out Tweets sent by bloggers and activists this week who are protesting the disputed presidential elections in Russia. Trend Micro first observed on Wednesday the bogus tweets flooding popular hashtags being used by Russians protesting the election and the arrests of hundreds of protesters, including prominent anti-corruption blogger Alexei Navalny. Today, blogger Brian Krebs posted evidence that thousands of accounts apparently auto-created in mid-2011 were being used to flood more than a dozen hashtags connected to the protests, and appear to be all following each other and one master account, presumably the botnet controller."

125 comments

  1. Figures. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    But seriously, hashtags are ephemeral things. Change it up while someone works on knocking out the C&C and getting the bogus accounts blacklisted.

    1. Re:Figures. by tripleevenfall · · Score: 4, Funny

      In Soviet Russia, tag hashes YOU!

    2. Re:Figures. by tomhudson · · Score: 4, Insightful

      No no, comrade. In Soviet Russia, hash tags YOU!

      Funny how the governments and the political chattering class put more importance on twitter than the average person does.

      I can't remember the last time I even looked at twitter.

    3. Re:Figures. by Karl+Cocknozzle · · Score: 2

      This.

      Twitter: Yawn. It's millions of idiots blathering on senselessly. For every pithy, funny, legible tweet, there are half-million messages that are just dreck. I had some fun impersonating a politician on Twitter for a while... but he didn't run for President, and I let it die... Nobody offered me a book deal. ...Not yet, anyway.

      --
      Who did what now?
    4. Re:Figures. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      You don't matter.

    5. Re:Figures. by isorox · · Score: 0

      This.

      Twitter: Yawn. It's millions of idiots blathering on senselessly.

      The collective noun for users of Twitter is "twits"

  2. I wonder by jpwilliams · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Is Twitter going to be like Switzerland and stay neutral? Also, how well can this tactic work against a critical mass? And what is that critical mass? I can't read Russian, but I imagine it would be pretty easy to pull out fake comments from real comments.

    1. Re:I wonder by klingens · · Score: 5, Insightful

      If it's really a Botnet, then Twitter can't be inactive, or they risk botwars for all kinds of controversial topics in the future. Twitter will then very soon become a wasteland of botnet #topic wars and real humans will leave in droves since they can't get any useful info anymore and Twitter, the company, will crater.
      As long as this presumable russian government botnet was not widely known, Twitter could have ignored it since the public didn't know that Twitter was gamed by special interests. Now however, they have to act or rather give the impression of acting. Acting in this case means to stop the Botnet of course, the other still existing botnets won't be affected since they've not been exposed (yet).

    2. Re:I wonder by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Interesting

      and Twitter, the company, will crater

      And nothing of value will be lost. Serious journalists will just have to spend a few bucks a month hosting their own web sites. The horror!

    3. Re:I wonder by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      we can only hope

    4. Re:I wonder by TheSpoom · · Score: 1

      Twitter should identify accounts that are repeatedly Tweeting the same thing to public hashtags or accounts, then disable them and their previous tweets until a human operator completes a challenge of some kinda (like a ReCAPTCHA).

      I'm kinda surprised they're not doing this now.

      --
      It's better to vote for what you want and not get it than to vote for what you don't want and get it.
      - E. Debs
  3. sysadmin fail by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

    There is something fundamentally wrong with any social media that does not autofilter, grade and weight posts based on a metric other than sum (#topic).

  4. In Soviet Russia by tokencode · · Score: 2

    Twitter tells you what to think.

  5. Seems dumb by Rich0 · · Score: 2

    Why have those accounts all follow each other? It would make exterminating them trivial assuming twitter can be bothered to do so. Just implement any communications on the back end, or using less-obvious forms of communications.

    Of course, with all the twitter spam out there it wouldn't surprise me if people just have these networks ready to go all the time and sell them to the highest bidder when the price gets high enough.

    Twitter is obsolete in any case.

    1. Re:Seems dumb by AZURERAZOR · · Score: 2

      Follower count for each would make each account look more popular. Follower count is used in some of the third party twitter searches to improve relevance... *fail*

    2. Re:Seems dumb by GameboyRMH · · Score: 1

      The controller account is @master_boot. Take it down to score one for free speech.

      --
      "When information is power, privacy is freedom" - Jah-Wren Ryel
    3. Re:Seems dumb by Richard_at_work · · Score: 1

      How would that be "scoring one for free speech"? The very act of what this controller is doing is still free speech, regardless of how much you disagree with it. However, it is an internal matter for Twitter to deal with as an abuse of their system.

    4. Re:Seems dumb by GameboyRMH · · Score: 1

      I thought someone might say this, but isn't astroturfing inherently anti-free-speech? It's impersonation. The IRL equivalent would be to form a protest with a mob of androids for the purpose of making an unpopular viewpoint seem more popular. I'd argue that one person deceptively impersonating a large group is damaging to free speech.

      --
      "When information is power, privacy is freedom" - Jah-Wren Ryel
    5. Re:Seems dumb by tehcyder · · Score: 1

      How would that be "scoring one for free speech"? The very act of what this controller is doing is still free speech, regardless of how much you disagree with it. However, it is an internal matter for Twitter to deal with as an abuse of their system.

      Right, so anyone who distributes malware is also just expressing their right to free speecj?

      Fucking Kremlin shill!

      --
      To have a right to do a thing is not at all the same as to be right in doing it
    6. Re:Seems dumb by Richard_at_work · · Score: 1

      No, astroturfing isnt anti-free-speech at all - its not preventing anyone else from expressing their own views, its providing the view that someone has paid to be provided alongside others views, and while that may be unethical it isn't anti-free-speech.

      Remember, everyone has a right to their view, but no one has a right to be heard.

      Your "IRL" equivalent is a little off as well - the real life equivalent would be for Nike to pay 1,000 actors to mingle with the anti-Nike protesters and offer whatever public view that Nike wishes them to offer. Those anti-Nike protesters are not the only ones with the right to be there and they are certainly not the only ones with the right to express an opinion. If they want complete control over what message is coming from the group of people they form, then they should not do it in a public place where anyone can join their group and represent them?

      While its certainly sucky ethically, there's nothing wrong with it regarding free-speech - you can't claim that X has the right to have a say while Y doesn't, on the same spot at the same time.

    7. Re:Seems dumb by Richard_at_work · · Score: 1

      Who is distributing malware here? And what contortionist moves did you have to make to wring whatever tenacious link you did out of my post to support your comment?

      Yes, the posts may be being made with computers infected by malware - but thats a different issue to the one of free speech, and anyway what if they aren't? The issue of whether this has free speech issues still remains even if the astroturfing parties are using Amazon EC2 or their own servers.

      Oh, and give up with the "shill" accusations - its childish to claim "shill" when someone is expressing a view point you disagree with. Your attempt to label me as a "shill" has as much, if not more of a negative link to free speech than the topic we are discussing - you are trying to devalue my view by publicly linking it with an automatically negative position. Nice try, but I reject the attempt.

    8. Re:Seems dumb by GameboyRMH · · Score: 1

      I think you misunderstand how this particular scheme is working. This isn't a bunch of paid human astroturfers, this is a group of bots all repeating the same message, so my android analogy was spot on.

      Still I don't think a single person being able to drown out the voice of many using money or hacking skill is a good thing for free speech. That's pretty close to preventing others from expressing their own views. Let's say for the sake of argument, using the Android analogy that I think is well-supported, that on the first day of the Occupy protests the Koch brothers had their turf-droids storm Wall St, mixing with and outnumbering real protesters with a counter-protest. That's basically what's happening on Twitter with the Russian protests. Sounds highly questionable at the least.

      --
      "When information is power, privacy is freedom" - Jah-Wren Ryel
  6. Offensive Tweeting? by scubamage · · Score: 1

    Somewhere in here there is an angry birds joke.

    1. Re:Offensive Tweeting? by ksd1337 · · Score: 1

      You forgot to put the ".com" in your signature link.

    2. Re:Offensive Tweeting? by scubamage · · Score: 1

      So there wasnt, thanks for the heads up! :)

  7. I think this makes sense by mwfischer · · Score: 0

    So you're saying in Soviet Russia bot follows you?

  8. #OccupyFEMAcamp by Jeremiah+Cornelius · · Score: 2

    Coming soon!

    --
    "Flyin' in just a sweet place,
    Never been known to fail..."
  9. Astroturfing by onyxruby · · Score: 4, Informative

    This is just astroturfing. Pretty much any type of popular forum site is going to have large numbers for accounts that have been set up for astroturfing my third parties.

    I recall a while back fark all of sudden got crapflooded by pro-chavez bots. Admins simply need to find astroturfing accounts and delete them. Nothing new here.

    1. Re:Astroturfing by Vintermann · · Score: 1

      The amazing thing is that Twitter became so dominant, despite providing extremely little new, and in no way solving the problems related to spam or DoS attacks like these. As if that wasn't enough, it has uptime unworthy of a top 100 site.

      --
      xkcd is not in the sudoers file. This incident will be reported.
    2. Re:Astroturfing by mirix · · Score: 1

      I remember hearing recently that ER has been paying people 15 roubles per pro-ER astroturf post.

      Not sure if there is any truth to it, and my russian is too shitty to research.

      --
      Sent from my PDP-11
    3. Re:Astroturfing by mirix · · Score: 1

      I guess I should have elaborated that ER = United Russia, Putin's party.

      sorry for self reply

      --
      Sent from my PDP-11
    4. Re:Astroturfing by rolfwind · · Score: 1

      It's actually pretty ingenious invention for the tl;dr generation.

    5. Re:Astroturfing by hitmark · · Score: 1

      Yep, seen it regarding various topics on both Boingboing and Arstechnica. In both cases the accounts will appear, dump a crapload of text and then not be used again until the next time the topic shows up. No attempts at entering a dialog with the commenter will get a response.

      --
      comment first, facts later. http://chem.tufts.edu/AnswersInScience/RelativityofWrong.htm
    6. Re:Astroturfing by 21mhz · · Score: 1

      The correct way to refer to it is "the party of crooks and thieves." I don't know if there is an established abbreviation yet.

      --
      My exception safety is -fno-exceptions.
    7. Re:Astroturfing by Luckyo · · Score: 1

      Doesn't really make sense, considering that most young people in the country who are politically active vote UR. Communists are for old people, Zhirinovski is for people who are as stupid as US far right or just plain entertained by him, and everyone else is deeply unpopular.

      So all they'd have to do is ask their own youths to troll those opposing. Wouldn't even have to pay.

    8. Re:Astroturfing by JadedIdealist · · Score: 1

      From now on the POCAT ;)

    9. Re:Astroturfing by Mikkeles · · Score: 1

      That should be: ÐÐÐÐÐ (ÐÐÑÑÐÑ ÐÑfÐÐÐоРРÐоÑоР- courtesy of google translate :)

      --
      Great minds think alike; fools seldom differ.
    10. Re:Astroturfing by 21mhz · · Score: 1

      We'll see on Saturday, but it looks as though they are running out of those willing to troll. Might have been easy to do with our normal 100-strong opposition meeting, but this time it promises to be different. Now they resort to desperate measures such as making this Saturday an exceptional mandatory school day.

      --
      My exception safety is -fno-exceptions.
    11. Re:Astroturfing by isorox · · Score: 1

      I guess I should have elaborated that ER = United Russia, Putin's party.

      sorry for self reply

      Ahh, I was confused, I thought you meant Queen Elizabeth!

    12. Re:Astroturfing by dunkelfalke · · Score: 1

      PZhiV.
      But I prefer VEdRo ;-)

      --
      "It's such a fine line between stupid and clever" -- David St. Hubbins, Spinal Tap
    13. Re:Astroturfing by Nivag064 · · Score: 1

      ER: Elizabeth Rex
      (Queen Elizabeth)

  10. Well, I guess that twitter had its 15 minutes... by forkfail · · Score: 1

    ... of fame as a political force (in Iran).

    --
    Check your premises.
  11. Not surprised... by AngryDeuce · · Score: 1

    After reading about HBGary Federal's own work in Astroturfing software when they were hacked by Anonymous earlier this year I figured that everyone would be getting in on that action. Now that mainstream media doesn't have their death grip on the spread of information (or disinformation), the G-men in black suits standing off camera need to come up with other ways to cloud things.

    Trying to cut off the internet completely would just result in the population going apeshit, so now they're utilizing shadier methods that are harder to detect. In reading some of the comments on news stories here in the states over the last year or so, I'm sure there are people doing this here as well. You can only see so many "NOBAMA 2012!!!" posts by people with names like Chuck17359 before you start to wonder if there is actually a human being on the other side.

  12. What happened to Russia? by iONiUM · · Score: 2, Interesting

    I thought they were getting more progressive in the recent years? Is this not the case? It seems like it's just getting closer and closer to another dictatorship and extreme socialism.

    Can someone more informed than me on the subject explain what's going on there? None of the sites seem to say more than "Putin is being an asshole."

    1. Re:What happened to Russia? by Nadaka · · Score: 5, Insightful

      There is very little socialist about Russia. It is basically a capitalistic authoritarian kleptocracy with a surging nationalist police state agenda.

    2. Re:What happened to Russia? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      Putin is just going for tzar, nothing new.

    3. Re:What happened to Russia? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      There is very little socialist about Russia. It is basically a capitalistic authoritarian kleptocracy with a surging nationalist police state agenda.

      Or in other words, converging to the same asymptote as the US...

    4. Re:What happened to Russia? by swb · · Score: 5, Insightful

      My unvarnished take on it is that when the USSR dissolved, Russia went from a totalitarian socialism to a kind of weak Democratic capitalism, dominated by organized crime and "the oligarchs". Most of the "backbone" Russian institutions like the KGB and the military (in particular) were significantly weakened, and all manner of social ills began to rear their ugly head.

      Putin kind of stepped in and with something of an iron fist in a velvet glove began to kind of re-invigorate the institutions of Russia. A number of oligarchs who wouldn't toe his line (whether politically, financially, or both) were essentially stripped of their wealth, imprisoned and some even killed (cf. Kordokovsky, who ran Lukoil, is still in jail and Litvenenko was poisoned with Polonium, although he was ex-KGB/FSB, not an oligarch).

      Publicly, Putin sort of created a new "strong" Russian image and with high oil prices was sort of able to create an improved economic climate and tamp down the chaos of Russian civil life.

      That being said, Democracy took a back seat if not being reduced to a mere performance. Lots of suppression of the press, the opposition. He moved from President to Prime Minister, appointing a puppet President (they traded jobs in the most recent and probably rigged election).

      My guess is that the global economic downturn has taken the shine off of living in his dictatorship (along with the corruption and everyday difficulties).

      You would think he would either guide a more democratic transition and fade away to private life, but I think he's going to hold on to power until he gets clipped. I think too much of the top end of Russian politics is run like organized crime for anyone to get on top and stay on top to just say "game over, I'm done".

    5. Re:What happened to Russia? by wickerprints · · Score: 5, Insightful

      I thought they were getting more progressive in the recent years? Is this not the case? It seems like it's just getting closer and closer to another dictatorship and extreme socialism.

      Extreme socialism? No, that's not correct. Russia is what one would legitimately call a plutocratic oligopoly, where control of the government and economy is tightly confined to those who became extremely wealthy after the disbanding of the Soviet Union opened up economic markets. Once that happened, various well-connected individuals were able to profit immensely from the sale of natural resources (i.e., Russian oil and natural gas) to Europe, and political corruption increased in direct proportion as these individuals leveraged their wealth to gain political influence in a freshly post-Communist country. What happened, basically, was a period of unrestrained capitalism culminating in monopoly power infiltrating a weak political system and the subsequent disenfranchisement of the vast majority of Russian citizens from actual political power. That is not "extreme socialism."

      Some might argue that much the same will happen, is happening, or has already happened, in the United States--just with less flagrant violence and impunity, but that is a topic for another thread.

      This is why the Communist Party is seeing a revival in Russian politics. Not because the voters actually wish for a return to communism--after all, they know full well what it was like to live under that failed system--but because things have gotten so horrifically bad and obviously corrupt under Putin's effective dictatorship, that a vote for the Communists is basically like giving Putin's party the middle finger.

    6. Re:What happened to Russia? by roman_mir · · Score: 2

      1. Russian mafia-government buys the votes with promises of the dole.

      2. The only thing 'capitalist' about it is that a limited number of people are making a capital for themselves alright.

      3. The mafia-bosses on the top of the political pyramid are making sure that nobody knows or hears about any viable alternatives, the 'Channel 1' is bought and paid for (and the rest of the channels are heavily monitored and censored, maybe even self-censored). Only a small percentage of the country is on the Internet, and it's mainly the younger people. The majority of folks don't know that there are alternatives, that's how successful the mafia-bosses on top are at what they do.

      4. The nationalist agenda is just a cover to create a false sense of 'unity'. For example Putin and Medvedev love to talk about USA and other Western nations trying to undermine the Russian government in order to take over and give Russia to some nefarious people.

      It's really a mafia-ran state right now.

    7. Re:What happened to Russia? by PolygamousRanchKid+ · · Score: 5, Funny

      So Vladimir Putin and Dmitry Medvedev are sitting in a bathtub . . .

      Putin: "Dmitry, which one of us is President today?"

      Medvedev: "Which day of the week is it today?"

      Putin: "Friday."

      Medvedev: "That means that you are President, Vladimir."

      Putin: "Ok, that means that you must get out of the tub to fetch us another bottle of vodka from the kitchen."

      --
      Schroedinger's Brexit: The UK is both in and out of the EU at the same time!
    8. Re:What happened to Russia? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1

      2. The only thing 'capitalist' about it is that a limited number of people are making a capital for themselves alright.

      In case you haven't noticed, that's the exact same pattern happening in every capitalist country right now.

      Of course, you just handwave all of that pesky "reality" stuff aside, right? GO RON PAUL!!! GO 1%ERS!!!

    9. Re:What happened to Russia? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      So, just like the good old US of A, eh?

    10. Re:What happened to Russia? by petsounds · · Score: 3, Insightful

      You're missing a bit there. "Organized crime" IS the KGB. When the KGB was disbanded, those guys no longer had jobs. Some now work for the Russian security forces, but most seem to have gone into the underworld in those chaotic post-USSR years. And let's not forget that Putin is ex-KGB. There's not much difference between the Russian mafia and the Russian government. Similar to America's corporatocracy, but more brutal.

    11. Re:What happened to Russia? by roman_mir · · Score: 2

      Nonsense. Ron Paul is the exact opposite of what US government and Russian government represent today - lack of law. Lawlessness on the government level.

      The laws must apply to the government just as well as they apply to individuals and the government must not be allowed to do things that individuals cannot do by law.

      USA and Russia have similar problems, however what you call '1%' in USA consists of all sorts of people - mostly owners of businesses. Those are the people who actually run the economy. The MAKE the products that everybody wants and they profit in the process.

      The problem in USA of-course is that a small number of the very rich (maybe 0.01%) found ways to subvert the law that applies to the government and they found a way to give themselves all sorts of privileges nobody should have.

      However OTOH the about 50% found a way to give themselves something they didn't earn in USA as well, and it's paid by the top 50%.

      USA has a problem, it's a different problem. USA can in fact return to the Constitution and can again have a government that lives by the law. It's going to be hard, but it does not have to be violent.

      In Russia it will likely be violent before it gets better, and the problem with Russia is that since 1917 the working class the real 1% and the top 50% were systematically destroyed by the state, making sure that the population has little initiative by design and cannot imagine how not to be poor, how to work for themselves, how to start and run businesses.

      People in Russia are learning this again, but it's a tiny percentage of people who are learning and are successful, and it's all despite the government, not because of it.

      Of-course USA had the right idea and since about 1913 it also turned to the wrong side, but it can rediscover the right idea if it wanted to and it would take much less work to do it, because the initiative and self reliance haven't been bred out of people, so there are much fewer mental blocks.

      But there are mental blocks, many are created by these false idea that socialism is good for economy and society. It's a false idea and it's slowly failing everywhere today, where it has been implemented.

    12. Re:What happened to Russia? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      There is very little socialist about Russia. It is basically a capitalistic authoritarian kleptocracy with a surging nationalist police state agenda.

      So, exactly the same as America then?

    13. Re:What happened to Russia? by Mojo66 · · Score: 1
      The Twitter revolutions started off in totalitarian countries and are now slowly progressing towards more open countries. It's just a matter of time until so called 'democratic' countries like the US or Europe are affected.

      --

      "In the 1980s capitalism triumphed over communism. In the 1990s it triumphed over democracy." --David Korten

    14. Re:What happened to Russia? by shutdown+-p+now · · Score: 1

      The problem for people in power is that there is no viable democratic transition in sight. If they step down, the most likely replacement today would be some broad leftist/socialist coalition, since that's where popular support is. And one thing these guys have consistently brought up is reviewing Russian privatization of early 90s (which is well known to have had numerous severe process violations), and reviewing economic activities of consequent heads of state. Putin in particular has some recorded participation in pocketing the oil profits, so there's no way he could retire - he'd end up on the court bench within a week.

    15. Re:What happened to Russia? by FoolishOwl · · Score: 1

      There are competing definitions of socialism. The one I prefer is democratic management of the economy. By that definition, Russia has never been socialist, and only briefly had some localized experiments with socialism in a few places in 1905 and 1917.

    16. Re:What happened to Russia? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Sounds oddly familiar to its former enemy.

    17. Re:What happened to Russia? by Hatta · · Score: 1

      So it's about as socialist as Obama is then?

      --
      Give me Classic Slashdot or give me death!
    18. Re:What happened to Russia? by khallow · · Score: 1

      Of course, you just handwave all of that pesky "reality" stuff aside, right? GO RON PAUL!!! GO 1%ERS!!!

      I guess that's the burden of libertarians. They get to be a target for all the idiots out there. Well, we got the society you all wanted and it just so happens to be run by fools and scoundrels.

    19. Re:What happened to Russia? by khallow · · Score: 1

      And one thing these guys have consistently brought up is reviewing Russian privatization of early 90s (which is well known to have had numerous severe process violations)

      My understanding is that this was a theft of tens of billions of dollars in Russian assets by cronies of Yeltsin. When Putin took over, he seized those assets and transferred them to his cronies. I bet there's a good chance the next government whenever that comes will do much the same. Any relatively honest government is going to get some heat from all the dishonest politicians out there.

    20. Re:What happened to Russia? by Lotana · · Score: 1

      where control of the government and economy is tightly confined to those who became extremely wealthy after the disbanding of the Soviet Union opened up economic markets. Once that happened, various well-connected individuals were able to profit immensely from the sale of natural resources (i.e., Russian oil and natural gas) to Europe, and political corruption increased in direct proportion as these individuals leveraged their wealth to gain political influence in a freshly post-Communist country.

      I am under an impression that the the massive division of wealth that happened after the dissolution of the Soviet Union happened in a much more quick and simple way. I don't have the in-depth story, but this is the gist of what my friend living in Russia told me. According to him the oligarchs have nearly instantly gained their wealth by gaming the voucher privatization system in the 90s.

      In essence, in order to privatize the assets of the former Soviet Union every single person (Including minors) were issued a voucher that granted them a portion of the national wealth. After the finalization of the voucher distribution, I believe the intention was that the people would use them to buy ownership of various formerly government-owned assets like factories. By its look it is an extremely simple and fair system.

      Now where the whole thing went wrong is that somehow relatively small portion of population ended up aquiring the majority of vouchers. I am not clear how they done that, but it couldn't of been clean or honest. My guess is that simple, worker folk did not understand the value of the vouchers and sold them off for trivial ammounts. Perhaps there are some russians on Slashdot that could give us a full story on how they accomplished that.

    21. Re:What happened to Russia? by shutdown+-p+now · · Score: 2

      Yes, that would be a concise but broadly correct summary. The only thing worth noting is that the sets of "Yeltsin's cronies" and "Putin's cronies" partially intersect.

      The main hope is that, if the next government comes to power as a result of honest elections - and especially as a result of a vote recount demanded by citizens - they will have to play it more careful than the thugs currently in power, because the viability of kicking them out next elections would have been demonstrated. But then, that's also what Ukrainians hoped in 2004, and they were proven wrong.

    22. Re:What happened to Russia? by GodfatherofSoul · · Score: 2

      Classic Friedmannite failure. Post Soviet Union, the Free Marketeers went in and got them to follow the IMF/WTO playbook on "developing" a nation. That entails cutting taxes on the rich, eliminating social commitments, and selling off government assets. You end up with a wealth transfer to the top, and government with only one tool in its toolkit (the military) to deal with domestic strife, organized crime where government no longer can protect the people, and a whole lot of mega-rich bureaucrats who took the bribes to sell of government assets at cut-rate prices.

      --
      I swear to God...I swear to God! That is NOT how you treat your human!
    23. Re:What happened to Russia? by Darinbob · · Score: 1

      It's only given a surface impression of change. But essentially they changed socialism for capitalism but left in place all the cronies and the one-party system. Putin has always been an asshole, but he's been a popular asshole for a long time. He has a very large following who are only too happy to shout down the opposition. Corruption in the party is very evident but it seems to not stick so much to Putin until now, and even now not very much actually sticks. Almost all the media is state run media and there's a tight clampdown on any negative coverage of Putin. Putin is like the capitalist version of Chavez.

      I think there's a large Russian contingent who just likes having the strong authoritarian ruler, especially since the Yeltsin era was so chaotic. There is essentially no sizeable opposition and no other national leader figure so Putin stays in power despite everyone hating his party.

      As for the Twitters, this sounds just like more of the same from The Putin Youth.

    24. Re:What happened to Russia? by mirix · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Do you know what Socialism is? It's not what Putin is after, and it's not the boogeyman either.

      I'll give you dictatorship though. Seems some folk (particularly Americans) have some sort of mix-up between authoritarianism and socialism.

      Those poor Scandinavians, living under their evil totalitarian socialist regimes... better liberate them.

      --
      Sent from my PDP-11
    25. Re:What happened to Russia? by CrimsonAvenger · · Score: 1

      The problem in USA of-course is that a small number of the very rich (maybe 0.01%) found ways to subvert the law that applies to the government and they found a way to give themselves all sorts of privileges nobody should have.

      Useful hint: If there's a multi-trillion dollar pie to divide up, spending a few billion to get a piece of it is a no-brainer.

      Which is pretty much what's been happening in the USA for a long time now. All it takes is a look at how much it costs to be President (>$1 billion, in Obama's case) (Or Senator or Representative), and you can pretty much predict who's going to own that particular politician....

      --

      "I do not agree with what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it"
    26. Re:What happened to Russia? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Now where the whole thing went wrong is that somehow relatively small portion of population ended up aquiring the majority of vouchers. I am not clear how they done that, but it couldn't of been clean or honest. My guess is that simple, worker folk did not understand the value of the vouchers and sold them off for trivial ammounts. Perhaps there are some russians on Slashdot that could give us a full story on how they accomplished that.

      "Where whole thing went wrong" was by design - the same people who brought us derivatives and the housing bubble designed the "economic transition" of the USSR post-communism, and once again those expert talking heads couldn't see a simple basic truth that was right in front of their faces. Massive cost of living increases hit Russia in the months following the end of communism and the average people had nothing to eat but they had these wonderful pieces of paper from the government that kindly mob gentlemen bought up for pennies on the dollar, because hey it's better than starving to death.

      TL;DR: The "economic experts" from the USA created the Russian oligarchy. Much the same as the American oligarchy now that I think about it..

    27. Re:What happened to Russia? by NightFears · · Score: 1

      "So you'd like to know what party I gave my voice to? That's what I'd like to know, too."

      "The Central Elections Commission said in an official statement that it would not allow the voters to fake elections results."

      "Putin, accompanied by Gryzlov and Mironov, enters a restaurant.
      Waiter: Good day, Vladimir Vladimirovich! What would you like to eat?
      Putin: I will have some meat!
      Waiter: What about vegetables?
      Putin: The vegetables will have the same."

    28. Re:What happened to Russia? by hitmark · · Score: 2

      Given that post-soviet Russia was basically guided into much the same shock treatment that Iraq has been going thru in recent years by US economists sent over to "help" a former enemy become capitalist, it should not be a surprise. There is a religion masking as science out of Chicago called neo-classical/monetarist economics that is the source.

      --
      comment first, facts later. http://chem.tufts.edu/AnswersInScience/RelativityofWrong.htm
    29. Re:What happened to Russia? by hitmark · · Score: 1

      "Most of the "backbone" Russian institutions like the KGB and the military (in particular) were significantly weakened, and all manner of social ills began to rear their ugly head."

      This guided by US economists of the Chicago monetarist school, sent over to "help" turn Russia capitalist.

      The same shit was first tried in South America, and is now being applied in the middle east. In all places the overall effect have been very negative for the masses, but highly positive for a small percentage (that you are as likely to find in Miami or Monaco as in their home nation).

      --
      comment first, facts later. http://chem.tufts.edu/AnswersInScience/RelativityofWrong.htm
    30. Re:What happened to Russia? by hitmark · · Score: 2

      And this has been basically the status quo in Russia since day one. Russian communism basically replaced one despot with another, and even Yeltsin ran the place like some fiefdom.

      --
      comment first, facts later. http://chem.tufts.edu/AnswersInScience/RelativityofWrong.htm
    31. Re:What happened to Russia? by hitmark · · Score: 1

      Why liberate when one browbeat into obedience? Sadly a lot of the old guard on the Norwegian left considered it repaying a debt to dance to the US flute in international politics, a debt from WW2 and the Marshall plan.

      And now a rising right have some elements that are avowed Randian libertarians, pushing populist promises and islamic fearmongering for all it is worth. to paraphrase the supposed Chinese proverb, there be interesting times ahead...

      --
      comment first, facts later. http://chem.tufts.edu/AnswersInScience/RelativityofWrong.htm
    32. Re:What happened to Russia? by Luckyo · · Score: 1

      That sounded like Bill and Hillary talking, only Bill telling Hillary that since she's the president today, he's going to boink his assistant.

    33. Re:What happened to Russia? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Russia's one of the few states left where supreme rulers are not all puppets. And it was a complex amalgam of sociological pressures even before the capitalist revolution:

      Winston Churchill 1939:

      "I cannot forecast to you the action of Russia. It is a riddle, wrapped in a mystery, inside an enigma; but perhaps there is a key. That key is Russian national interest."

    34. Re:What happened to Russia? by khallow · · Score: 1

      It's drivel like this that mystifies me. Just because you can use the word "liberty" in a sentence doesn't mean the resulting verbiage has anything to do with libertarianism. The liberty of the tyrant is not the liberty of the People. Your conflation of the two is not only disingenuous, but insulting.

      It's my view that we have the society that we ordered. Every abuse of the state or its exploiters (such as "corporations") has been rationalized to be to the greater good or merely because they can. If stated intent were good enough, we'd be in utopia. But when someone tries to reduce that power and expand freedom, they get blamed as being the cause. Makes no sense to me.

      Also, your use of the term "1%" identifies you as a member of the group who thinks the rich should be paying more in taxes (among possibly other things). But I ask, for what? Every public welfare gimmick just means less money for productive jobs, more for the portion of the "1%" who are gaming the system, more power for governments and corporations, and grossly inefficient programs. That's not much of a deal. I can do better by not playing the game in the first place.

      Rather than construct some massive strawman having nothing to do with reality, do you have anything sensible to share?

    35. Re:What happened to Russia? by RCL · · Score: 1

      I am Russian. Your guess is basically correct. It was perhaps not wise to distribute state property that way. Vouchers should have been tied to particular person (i.e. with his name and surname printed on it) and forbidden to be resold. But nobody knew back then, and everyone wanted to get out of economical crisis as fast as possible - instant privatization was supposed to turn unprofitable state enterprises into prospering businesses and make everyone rich (voucher was promised to be worth two luxury cars by one of Russian officials).

      What actually happened is that people already in power (including Communist party apparatus and semi-legal Soviet entrepreneurs which started to appear towards the end of 1980s) took over the state enterprises they had managed as public functionaries and turned them into their own private property, buying shares from workers for two bottles of vodka (anecdotal evidence). Arguably, privatization goal was achieved - some of those enterprises eventually became profitable in private hands (after extreme 'cost cutting'), but a lot of people feel robbed of their property... which was "theirs" (i.e. public) only formally anyway.

    36. Re:What happened to Russia? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It's drivel like this that mystifies me. Just because you can use the word "liberty" in a sentence doesn't mean the resulting verbiage has anything to do with libertarianism

      Except I never claimed my verbiage has anything to do with libertarianism. I just said what we have now is what libertarians wanted.

      The theory of libertarianism (the stuff that has "anything to do with" libertarianism) is that if libertarians got what they want, things would be great. I'm just saying you already got what libertarians wanted. The results aren't what you expected but hey that wasn't the point of my contention.

      The liberty of the tyrant is not the liberty of the People.

      Which is exactly my point. When you try to give libertarians what they want, which is to maximize individual liberty, tyrants end up with a different (better) set of liberties than the People, because what we have is capitalism, where the owners of capital (that is, the tyrants) get to enjoy the fruits of their labor. A tyrant's maximum would end up being higher/better than the People's maximum.

      Your conflation of the two is not only disingenuous, but insulting.

      I'm not conflating the two. I'm pointing out the two exist. The fact you realize there are actually two sets of liberties instead of one is admitting to my point: the theory of libertarianism is nice, but what we see now is the result of trying to reach that ideal (thus my statement: you already got what libertarians want)

      Also, your use of the term "1%" identifies you as a member of the group who thinks the rich should be paying more in taxes (among possibly other things)

      No it doesn't. I'm just using the same parlance other people are using. If you didn't notice, I was praising the 1% that they are already very benevolent (the poor can cry all they want, but if the 1% really wanted to cut everything, they can, since it's *their* money).

      I would say YOU are the one conflating. As you said it: just because I use the word "1%" in a sentence doesn't the resulting verbiage has anything to do with taxing the rich.

      Rather than construct some massive strawman having nothing to do with reality, do you have anything sensible to share?

      LOL what? I'm pointing out the reality that there are two sets of liberties, and you even agreed through reiterating it. And you're saying what I said have nothing to do with reality and not sensible?

      I would say you're the one making a strawman. The whole bit of pinning me as wanting to tax the rich and the subsequent argument against taxing the rich (the part I didn't quote). Again, I was PRAISING the rich for being so generous in the first place.

    37. Re:What happened to Russia? by khallow · · Score: 1

      The liberty of the tyrant is not the liberty of the People.

      Which is exactly my point. When you try to give libertarians what they want, which is to maximize individual liberty, tyrants end up with a different (better) set of liberties than the People, because what we have is capitalism, where the owners of capital (that is, the tyrants) get to enjoy the fruits of their labor. A tyrant's maximum would end up being higher/better than the People's maximum.

      This is doublespeak. In a system with "maximized" individual liberty, you don't have tyrants. Further, there is no real world system where the tyrant has less freedom than his subjects. You can make the same irrelevant criticism of any real world system.

      And yes, I do admit here that the libertarian ideal most likely cannot be implemented in the real world.

      But this is sort of nonsense I was talking about earlier. Libertarianism is supposed to be invalid because tyrants have more power (and "liberty") than their subjects? Who doesn't get that?

      Then attempting to turn the tables by claiming that the current society (presumably the US one) is already what libertarians wanted. That ignores that a) it isn't (government too powerful and centralized, taxes too high, huge deficit spending, and conflating of public and private interests) and b) there's an awful lot of people flocking to libertarian ideals right now.

      I suppose this is what I get for replying to an A.C. in the first place.

    38. Re:What happened to Russia? by sourcerror · · Score: 1

      In Europe socialist has a different meaning.

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socialist_republic

    39. Re:What happened to Russia? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      This is doublespeak. In a system with "maximized" individual liberty, you don't have tyrants.

      It's not doublespeak. I'm very consistent in my meaning of words

      And no, in a system with "maximized" individual liberty, you can and do have tyrants, because people differ in other ways (my focus was on capital), and through those differences it is possible to gain/lose liberties.

      Hey, we all have the liberty to free speech, right? But if I'm a better speaker, or I have more control over the media, I'm going to be able to get more mileage out out of my liberty than you. From there, I can influence the masses, and if I influence them enough that the law gets changed, then BAM - you just lost some of your liberty.

      Further, there is no real world system where the tyrant has less freedom than his subjects. You can make the same irrelevant criticism of any real world system.

      I wasn't making a criticism, and I never said other systems don't exhibit the same thing.

      Libertarianism is supposed to be invalid because tyrants have more power (and "liberty") than their subjects? Who doesn't get that?

      As *I* said earlier, whether the results match the expectations was not the point of my contention. I wasn't arguing about the validity or invalidity of libertarianism.

      And since you ask rhetorically "who doesn't get that", this means you agree with me. So what's the problem?

      Then attempting to turn the tables by claiming that the current society (presumably the US one) is already what libertarians wanted. That ignores that a) it isn't (government too powerful and centralized, taxes too high, huge deficit spending, and conflating of public and private interests)

      My point doesn't ignore this. It fits perfectly into my point: all the government and huge spending etc. is a result of those with power/wealth (the tyrants) slowly but surely use their liberties to grab hold of more liberties.

      and b) there's an awful lot of people flocking to libertarian ideals right now.

      So? There's also an awful lot of people flocking to other ideals too right now (i.e the ideal that asks for the rich to pay more... I'd associate that ideal with OWS, but then one of them OWSers would evoke a no True Scotsman and say "that's not what we want"... nobody seems to know what they want)

      You're conflating people flocking to an ideal with people not getting what they want.

      Really, the fact that more people flock to libertarian ideals is proof that libertarians are getting what they want. See, in today's (western) society, libertarians have the liberty to state their beliefs, gather, and use their numbers to affect change. As long as you can affect change, all else follows

      Furthermore, the fact that even opposing views can voice themselves show just how libertarianism permeates our society. We're so free, we give other people the freedom to have a different opinion/belief. Unlike totalitarian regimes, libertarianism can tolerate dissent.

      I suppose this is what I get for replying to an A.C. in the first place.

      I don't know what exactly you expected to get from replying to an AC, but I hope what you expected was a response that, while it may not be something you agree with, came from another human being who, under libertarian ideals, deserve the same liberties as you do.

    40. Re:What happened to Russia? by khallow · · Score: 1

      Furthermore, the fact that even opposing views can voice themselves show just how libertarianism permeates our society. We're so free, we give other people the freedom to have a different opinion/belief.

      Oh, so you're confusing "liberalism" with "libertarianism". They aren't the same. Libertarianism goes much further. As to the rest of your post, there's too much argument through assertion and "I meant some other thing than what I said". You still haven't explained why you think "tyranny" is a particular problem with libertarianism. I really wish you'd think this out before wasting other peoples' time.

      And it goes back to my fundamental complaint. Why tilt at the libertarian windmill when you can't even be bothered to understand what the ideology is or to make a relevant argument?

  13. So are you saying I shouldn't have friended them? by WillAffleckUW · · Score: 0, Offtopic

    Come on, everyone wants lots of Russian friends on both Twitter and Facebook!

    But us calling them a dictatorship?

    Please, have you looked in the mirror lately?

    --
    -- Tigger warning: This post may contain tiggers! --
  14. Reverse Effect by Kamiza+Ikioi · · Score: 4, Interesting

    This will ensure the hashtags make it to trending topics. If the hashtags in question are something like #FuckingLiarPutin, doesn't really matter what they add to it. Let's hope the hashtags themselves say enough, like Jeff Jarvis' #fuckyouwashington that went viral quickly.

    --
    I8-D
  15. 632305222316434? by alhague · · Score: 1

    Who can explain what this 632305222316434 thing is about? It tells: "Everyone who disagrees with criminal behaviour of Russian president, government and all those rascals, must do that." but what does it mean?

    1. Re:632305222316434? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It means nothing, it's only a silly scheme to count protesters. See http://yoush.homelinux.org:8079/tech/632305222316434/comment-page-1#comment-4549

      I guess this is what kind of tactics have to be taken in Soviet Russia to protest elections. At least they still do that in the East unlike we...

  16. Terms of Service Enforcement? by El+Fantasmo · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Aren't situations like this when Twitter should, at the very least, temporarily suspend the obvious, automated "spam" accounts? All they need to do is quote some vague line in their "terms of service," which I haven't seen (I don't have a twitter account) but I would be surprised if it doesn't exist.

    1. Re:Terms of Service Enforcement? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Twitter is looking into it.
      --A Twitter Anonymous Coward, not speaking officially by any stretch of the imagination.

    2. Re:Terms of Service Enforcement? by uglybugger · · Score: 1

      Twitter is looking into it? Wow. I'm overwhelmed.

      I've been at several conferences recently at which Twitter was being used as a live back-channel for the presentations. Obvious spam-bots flooded the hashtags so we turned it off. Now, I don't even bother :(

      Seriously, what sort of sample size does Twitter need to develop some algorithms?

  17. Oh my, by M0j0_j0j0 · · Score: 1

    This is a very strong bad sign for where Russia is heading, this is bad , too bad to be true, also means they were already expecting this, and they prepared, they prepared to hold the country to the Czars and not the people. Future does not look bright in Soviet Russia.

    1. Re:Oh my, by shutdown+-p+now · · Score: 1

      Oh, look, we've got some bots on Slashdot, too.

      Pray tell, if they won the elections, why all the fraud with the votes?

    2. Re:Oh my, by Lotana · · Score: 1

      Future does not look bright in Soviet Russia.

      Of course the future doesn't look bright. Because Soviet Russia doesn't exist and haven't existed since 1991!

      20 years is not such a short time. Try to keep up.

    3. Re:Oh my, by dunkelfalke · · Score: 1

      Probably out of habit ;-)

      --
      "It's such a fine line between stupid and clever" -- David St. Hubbins, Spinal Tap
  18. False equivalence lately? by jensend · · Score: 5, Insightful

    *Sigh* here we go again with the false equivalence squad.

    If you can't see why your "hurr durr so is amerikuh" statement is a bunch of crap, let's make the following deal: I'll go stand in an anti-government protest here in the States, and you go stand in Red Square with those protesting Putin's latest power grab.

    If we're lucky, you'll be able to write letters from prison telling us how it went.

    1. Re:False equivalence lately? by NeutronCowboy · · Score: 4, Insightful

      What the hell does your dick-waving have to do with the fact that you are indeed comparing apples and oranges? Yes, the US isn't the shining beacon of hope, freedom and liberty it thinks it is. But it is still a very, very far cry from the autocratic and kleptocratic country that is Russia. Comparing the two and implying that the US is somehow on the same level of government mismanagement, anarchy and oligarchic abuses of power makes me think you haven't spent enough time in Russia.

      --
      Those who can, do. Those who can't, sue.
    2. Re:False equivalence lately? by badboy_tw2002 · · Score: 1

      Nice dodge. How about a direct question:

      Who would be more likely to be thrown in jail:

      * Guy in DC with "Obama is Hitler" photo
      * Guy in Moscow with "Putin is Hitler" photo

      I'd love for a discussion of "Country X is doing some messed up shit!" without "Fuck you America sucks too!" always thrown in there. Who cares? America sucks, big deal, lets talk about Russia.

    3. Re:False equivalence lately? by andre1s · · Score: 1

      Seams the way the Occupy wall street was dealt with is almost on par with how Russia handles such situations. If you carefully compare US and Russia the only metric where US would clearly be in better situation - level and openness of corruption

    4. Re:False equivalence lately? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Look everybody! I don't have the slightest fucking idea what the hell I'm talking about.

      FTFY

    5. Re:False equivalence lately? by jensend · · Score: 2

      Look, having been in the military has nothing to do with anything. Sure, you may have taken some risks, but those risks have nothing to do with the risks taken by Russian protesters (likely to be jailed just for showing up in a public square) and opposition figures (likely to be assassinated by grotesque means like Politkovskaya or Litvinenko).

      Thanks for your service and all, but I'm sorry if what you learned from it was to be a total jerkwad.

  19. Just another little bit of history repeating by photonyx · · Score: 1

    Looks like /. already covered that. Oh, wait, that was 4 years ago...

    This is a good (albeit somewhat rudimentary) explanation of a clear indication of the elections being rigged. The first graph shows the histogram of the % of the votes for different parties vs. the number of the voting locations that registered that figure. Under standard circumstances the curves should be close to normal (Gaussian) distribution. Different curves correspond to different parties; the presidential party is brown. All of the curves exhibit a clear bell-shaped behavior, except for the brown one, which has the obnoxious right tail and artificial peaks at nice-looking values (50 to 100% with a step of 5). This means that according to lots of voting locations, exactly 55, 60, 65, ... 100% of voters voted for the presidential party. This can only be achieved by injection of fake ballots and/or stealing the votes.

    1. Re:Just another little bit of history repeating by Alex+Belits · · Score: 1

      When population sees the incumbent as the "default" choice that loses popularity and opposition is weak, incumbent's distribution will have an upside down "protest vote" component. The rest of parties closely reflect ideological relationships -- randroid extremist Yabloko (green line) is almost universally hated, clowns from Liberal-Democratic Party (black) and major Socialist opposition A Just Russia (blue) share relatively low popularity but not bad enough to be irrelevant, Communists (red) is a somewhat popular and typical protest vote choice because they, despite their name, do not promote anything fundamentally incompatible with proclaimed goals of United Russia (brown).

      --
      Contrary to the popular belief, there indeed is no God.
    2. Re:Just another little bit of history repeating by I+Read+Good · · Score: 1

      Sorry, photonyx, /. did not cover this story before. This wasn't an article about Russian election fraud. TFA covers an instance of twitter-bombing by supporters of the Kremlin. The target of this article was something completely different.

  20. Re:So are you saying I shouldn't have friended the by shutdown+-p+now · · Score: 2

    But us calling them a dictatorship? Please, have you looked in the mirror lately?

    Have you looked at the videos documenting widespread electoral fraud?

    It's an open question whether U.S. has free elections or not, but I'm pretty confident that one thing that you don't have in your election is things like ballot boxes pre-stuffed with ballots with the "right" vote marked already. Or, even more bluntly, counting the ballots, and then changing the numbers in the protocol before it is submitted (and kicking out any observers that protest or try to photo it).

  21. Re:So are you saying I shouldn't have friended the by makomk · · Score: 1, Interesting

    It's an open question whether U.S. has free elections or not, but I'm pretty confident that one thing that you don't have in your election is things like ballot boxes pre-stuffed with ballots with the "right" vote marked already.

    From what I've heard lot of the US doesn't even have ballot boxes any more. It's all done on electronic voting systems created by friends of one of the two parties, with massive security holes and some well-hidden backdoors suited to vote rigging.

  22. bots by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Why has not twitter killed the master account?

  23. Correction by slonik · · Score: 4, Informative

    ... Tweets sent by bloggers and activists this week who are protesting the disputed presidential elections in Russia.

    It was Russian parliament elections. Presidential elections are in March 2012.

    1. Re:Correction by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      What?!? I had to get down here until I see someone else noticed that? Many folks above are projecting what they think is happening there, to what they think is happening here...and both are wrong :(

    2. Re:Correction by gl4ss · · Score: 1

      technically I think that Putin the wrestler needs parliament to enable him to run for presidency though?
      which might explain the rabid cheating this time around.

      you know what's really sad about it? a lot of the people doing fraud in the voting process probably think they're doing Russia a favor since Putin is god.

      but yeah, the same article will run next year again.

      --
      world was created 5 seconds before this post as it is.
    3. Re:Correction by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      > technically I think that Putin the wrestler needs parliament to enable him to run for presidency though?

      nope.

    4. Re:Correction by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      mod parent up . . . that is, correct the original post. It's misleading.

  24. LOL by redwraith94 · · Score: 1

    I don't even have a twitter account lol @ a nation-state-sponsored-twitter-terrorism.

    --
    I art more snarky, and terse than thou. I art Slashdot!
  25. Twitblock already does this by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Aren't situations like this when Twitter should, at the very least, temporarily suspend the obvious, automated "spam" accounts? All they need to do is quote some vague line in their "terms of service," which I haven't seen (I don't have a twitter account) but I would be surprised if it doesn't exist.

    Someone already thought of a spam blocker for twitter:

  26. hahahahahaha by unity100 · · Score: 1

    I'll go stand in an anti-government protest here in the States, and you go stand in Red Square with those protesting Putin's latest power grab.

    the moment your protest becomes something noticeable you will be beat down by **PD just like how it happened with ows. and as long as your protest is a dozen guys with placards daily picketing some place, they wont give a damn about you.

    in russia, they will instantly take you seriously and beat you down.

    the only difference in between these cases, is the speed the beatdown happens. and the level you are taken seriously.

    1. Re:hahahahahaha by jensend · · Score: 1

      Bull. In most cities, OWS folks who got arrested were trying to get arrested. They'd been warned well in advance that though protesting was fine the tent cities could no longer be tolerated (rampant sanitation issues, crime, and the nuisance to locals) and they should clear out their personal belongings. This was after cities had been lenient towards about two months of camping in places where camping is not legally allowed.

      Many people decided to clean out their tents, find another place to sleep, and continue to gather for daytime and evening protests; daytime protests continued well after the tent city evictions and in most cities these protests faced no police intervention. Others wanted to defy the police and get arrested "for the cause" -- they stayed in their tents and got their wish. Other arrests have mostly been for completely blocking roadways, business entrances, etc, deliberately trying to make it impossible for other citizens to go about their normal business.

      Sure, police actions in making the arrests and in clearing the camps haven't been great, but the protesters put the police in a tough spot where they had to use some force to enforce the law.

      This is nothing like the protests in Russia where people are arrested en masse just for showing up in a public square and voicing their opinion.

  27. so by unity100 · · Score: 2

    Yes, the US isn't the shining beacon of hope, freedom and liberty it thinks it is. But it is still a very, very far cry from the autocratic and kleptocratic country that is Russia.

    is that why police departments all over usa had beaten down occupy protesters in a move coordinated by FBI ?

    http://www.examiner.com/top-news-in-minneapolis/were-occupy-crackdowns-aided-by-federal-law-enforcement-agencies

    talk about democracy.

  28. cyber war vs.... by sociocapitalist · · Score: 1

    Regardless of whether it's twitter or some other medium, the point might be that not only is someone planning ahead for disrupting social networks when they're used to organize, but also for actively using it against the people.

    Predictably now other regimes might use similar tactics when social networking is used to organize for other situations ranging from occupy to outright rebellion and rioting.

    Maybe the only surprise is that we haven't seen this until now.

    --
    blindly antisocialist = antisocial
  29. more PIE please! NO Pie for You, mom/dad spent. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    your pie has been spent.

    Would you like to see how long a pile of the top .01%'s cash would last if it was split up fairly?

    Hmm, it could be used to pay down some of the national debt.