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China's Green Data Center Plans

Posted by timothy on from the ho-ho-ho-green-giant dept.

itwbennett writes "It's no surprise that China's internet-using population is growing fast. And so it's also no surprise that the country is planning to build new data centers by the dozen. What is surprising, at least to those of us who expect to read stories about widespread pollution in China, is that China is working with both The Green Grid and Lawrence Berkeley National Laboratory to develop standards for energy performance."

20 of 45 comments (clear)

  1. Not that suprising by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

    China is the largest investor in renewable energy of any country in the world.

    1. Re:Not that suprising by vought · · Score: 4, Insightful

      China is the largest investor in renewable energy of any country in the world.

      China is also the largest provider of toxic adulterants in exports. They build factories where people are given 15-minute breaks twice a day to urinate and defecate, and four hours to sleep. Western companies make a show of trying to police these factories, but when it comes down to brass tacks, there are simply too many factories, too many bodies, and not enough oversight for any of it to make a lot of difference. The solution to factory suicides in China? Bars on the windows.

      Because we're apparently now a nation that simply consumes things made elsewhere - mostly China, it seems at times - it's easiest to just trust them when it comes to things like baby formula (melamine), pet food (more melamine), drywall (formaldehyde and H2S), paint on toys (lead)....and when your relatives get sick because they can't breathe due to the toxic wallboard, well, there's no one to sue for recovery of lost money, time, and health. Oh, well!

      The Chinese culture does not define trust the same way Western societies do. Most of their factories are owned by former military generals. The standards being developed will come with lots of access to LBNL's own methodologies, networks, people, and other trusted entities, which China will be happy to use for their own benefit.

      Trust me on this.

  2. Meh by Osgeld · · Score: 4, Funny

    It will probably end up being lead based paint tinted green with used radiator fluid

  3. No mystery here. by Mannfred · · Score: 5, Informative

    Energy performance is especially relevant when faced with high energy costs. From thegreengrid.org's press release: "The Green Grid will help promote the improvement of resource efficiency in business computing throughout China, a country with huge potential for energy efficiency increases."

    1. Re:No mystery here. by Sir_Sri · · Score: 4, Insightful

      and it's not like china is opposed to clean energy, they're just cheap and corrupt, so at least one part of their society is trying, which is better than nothing.

    2. Re:No mystery here. by TheLink · · Score: 5, Informative

      They've been getting low on coal every now and then - as in burning coal faster than they can get it (from their own mines and other places). They're using so much energy that they even run out of dirty energy, so they need to reduce consumption and also add clean energy.

      http://news.theage.com.au/business/china-coal-shortage-to-continue-20080116-1m7u.html
      http://www.smh.com.au/business/world-business/coal-shortage-causes-power-cuts-in-china-20101221-193d5.html
      http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/04/18/china-power-shortage-idUSL3E7FI1ED20110418
      Consuming less energy = consuming less coal = fewer power cuts = fewer pissed off people = easier and more peaceful reign for those at the top.

      IIRC Japan is many times more efficient in terms of productivity (goods, GDP etc) vs energy used. So there's actually quite a lot of room for improvement in terms of energy efficiency.

      They've also been working on building lots of nuclear reactors. Hope they get those right though, or there'll be major disasters (China does get big quakes).

      --
  4. Going the right direction by mcrbids · · Score: 5, Informative

    From a regulatory standpoint, the most important thing isn't the effectiveness, it's the standards used to gauge effectiveness. If you want the right answer, you have to start by asking the right questions.

    Is datacenter efficiency important? Doesn't appear to be so from where I sit. We host a significant number of servers in a local (Sacramento) colo, and we buy contracts for bandwidth and power. The charges we pay are rather small given the size of our company, the actual power costs are infinitesimal compared to the other costs that we have to do business. I care not a whit about power costs, given that our marginal costs are so low compared to the value we present.

    Is it important? Sure! But in the USA, we have no operational standards for what constitutes "green" data center technologies. If there was an actual standard for DC power, I'd consider buying servers with DC power inputs, etc...

    --
    I have no problem with your religion until you decide it's reason to deprive others of the truth.
    1. Re:Going the right direction by Skapare · · Score: 5, Informative

      You don't have to do DC to be reasonably green. DC still has a number of issues, including safety. And just having DC alone does not make it green (you have to do DC smartly).

      Just being smart about AC as well as the cooling systems can make improvements. For example, run your servers on 208 or 240 volts instead of 120 volts. And if you are building a new data center in North America, get your power from the utility at three phase 416Y/240 volts instead of 208Y/120 volts for the computer room (get separate 208Y/120 volts for the offices where needs for 120 is common). Use lights-out platforming as much as you can (last one out turn out the lights).

      Use UPSes that can switch to "line interactive mode" instead of doing everything in "double conversion". Only extremely sensitive equipment needs double conversion all the time Don't do "whole data center" UPSes because you lose the ability to gradually migrate to greener models over time. About one UPS per rack should be sufficient.

      Split your cooling load across multiple systems so the temperature stays more stable (one giant HVAC causes temperatures to go up and down a lot). Once stable, you can target the temperature at a higher level.

      --
      now we need to go OSS in diesel cars
    2. Re:Going the right direction by TheLink · · Score: 2

      They can also copy some ideas from Facebook (or others):
      http://www.wired.com/wiredenterprise/2011/12/facebook-data-center/all/1
      http://opencompute.org/
      http://opencompute.org/2011/11/17/learning-lessons-at-the-prineville-data-center/

      They'd probably have to modify the air filter/intake sections since in many places the air there is rather dirty. And sometimes it's not just "conventional" pollution but dust/sand blown in from the desert areas

      --
    3. Re:Going the right direction by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

      Monetary cost is one thing... efficiency, sustainability, availability and environmental impact are another. The purpose of green energy isn't to save money (in fact, in many industrial applications of sustainable models, implementation and operational monetary costs are higher than the competing and existing models). It's about ensuring longevity by using methods which either integrate with the organic processes of nature, or minimize the impact on said processes by being more efficient and less destructive; whether it's energy production, materials production, transportation and infrastructure development, communication, consumption, waste/bi-product management, metropolitan development... whatever. The grand idea is appreciation of the interconnectedness of all of the world's biological, geological, and technological systems. Not to sound like an environmental fanatic or a tree hugger, but ultimately all of our stuff, and the ways we make it and move it around, depends on the Earth carrying out its own natural processes. Everything we do impacts those processes in some way, so it's in humanity's interest and the world's interest to reduce the destructive impacts and use non-destructive means whenever possible, to ensure that the big rock can keep up with our ever-increasing demand.
      So what you say is true, from a financial perspective it may not be important. But from China's perspective - a nation of over a billion people that is rapidly expanding and growing and industrializing - throughput of energy, the impact of its availability and consumption, and the efficiency at which it is consumed is terribly important. As mentioned, they are making efforts to be "green" and efficient in many industries - data centers are just one more place to do that.

  5. FTFY by alfredos · · Score: 3, Insightful

    China is the largest investor in renewable energy of any country in the world.[citation needed]

    1. Re:FTFY by Rennt · · Score: 3, Informative

      China is the largest investor in renewable energy of any country in the world. [ http://lmgtfy.com/?q=largest+renewable+energy+investor+by+country ]

    2. Re:FTFY by Hermanas · · Score: 4, Informative

      [1] China leads world in green energy investment
      [2] Top Countries For Renewable Energy Capacity
      [3] Actually, China accounts for 70% of green energy investment

  6. Citation provided. by ColdGrits · · Score: 4, Funny

    China is the largest investor in renewable energy of any country in the world.[citation needed]

    China is the largest investor in renewable energy of any country in the world.[1]

    [1] http://hardware.slashdot.org 2 Jan 2012.

    --
    People should not be afraid of their governments - Governments should be afraid of their people.
  7. Chinese are pragmatic by G3ckoG33k · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Chinese are pragmatic, or at least the government.

    They realize that if they will need to provide a future for 1.x billion people they need to do something about the local environment.

    Climate change appears to be another matter on today's agenda. But, I'm sure that will change too. There are other large pollutors which will be more difficult to change, despite having a better general awareness.

    1. Re:Chinese are pragmatic by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Interesting

      The environment has something to do with it ... hey they do sell to the rest of the world. Image is important.

      But another driver is efficiency. Bottom line, if you reduce the inputs to a product it becomes cheaper to produce. Use less energy, use less materials ... and the product cost comes down.

      That's one reason I've been surprised by resistance amongst Western countries to environment and climate treaties. I mean, all they are being asked to do is either substitute energy sources (expensive any way you look at it), or to reduce energy use (thereby making their production process more efficient and cost effective).

      Then again, I suppose Western countries aren't producing much in the way of product nowadays and don't plan to make their processes more efficient anyway.

    2. Re:Chinese are pragmatic by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Interesting

      What is a bit worrying is that the common people on the street do not care about pollution. Or at least not enough. I never set a foot in the US, but found that in Europe people clean up their mess. Mostly (some countries are worse). People think about what they throw in the garbage tray and are generally mindful of not using needless amounts of energy.

      Things you will see in China on an everyday basis is:
      - People throwing garbage out of their houses on the street (not my problem attitude).
      - Opening windows and turning on air-conditioning at the same time. Both in summer and in winter.
      - Leaving PCs, TVs and what not running all the time, whether you use it or not.
      - Throwing the most horrible poisons, or glass, or needles, or whatever in the garbage (I worked in a chemistry lab). Rules work, until you turn your back for 5 min.
      - Also, whatever you do, you must absolutely have a big car. Or two...
      - Absolutely no idea what you are talking about when you try to explain this kind of behaviour does not a good society make...

      This is just the normal man/woman in the street. I am not even talking about industry and how they deal with toxic waste (hint: it is more or less the same).

      I only met a fraction of the people here (obviously), but if a fifth of the world population behaves like this. I despair...

    3. Re:Chinese are pragmatic by koxkoxkox · · Score: 3, Informative

      Do not despair, India is much worse and they will soon outnumber China.

  8. Re:sounds good but... by Skapare · · Score: 2

    China does not have a monopoly on that. They didn't even create it. Cutting corners and cheating people existed in the industrial boom of the 19th century in the US, as carried out by big corporations. Even today that is still going on. And it's not just in technology. Financial services is doing this big time. China is just copying it.

    --
    now we need to go OSS in diesel cars
  9. surprising? by Tom · · Score: 3, Insightful

    For whom is that surprising?

    China is huge - four to five times the population of the USA. Any attempt to clean up existing problems while at the same time realising record growth year-after-year is a mean task. So concentrating on making new things future-proof is the best approach. If you are good there, it may turn out that replacing the old, dirty stuff is better than modernizing it.

    And the chinese government, for all the faults it has, is certainly one of the best governments in regards to long-term planning right now. Other than most of the career politicians in the west, they regularily look beyond the next election.

    --
    Assorted stuff I do sometimes: Lemuria.org