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Aviation Security Debate: Bruce Schneier V. Kip Hawley (Former TSA Boss)

Posted by Soulskill on from the rumble-in-the-terminal dept.

Fluffeh writes "A nice summary at TechDirt brings word that Bruce Schneier has been debating Kip Hawley, former boss of the TSA, over at the Economist. Bruce has been providing facts, analysis and some amazing statistics throughout the debate, and it makes for very educational reading. Because of the format, the former TSA administrator is compelled to respond. Quoting: 'He wants us to trust that a 400-ml bottle of liquid is dangerous, but transferring it to four 100-ml bottles magically makes it safe. He wants us to trust that the butter knives given to first-class passengers are nevertheless too dangerous to be taken through a security checkpoint. He wants us to trust that there's a reason to confiscate a cupcake (Las Vegas), a 3-inch plastic toy gun (London Gatwick), a purse with an embroidered gun on it (Norfolk, VA), a T-shirt with a picture of a gun on it (London Heathrow) and a plastic lightsaber that's really a flashlight with a long cone on top (Dallas/Fort Worth).""

6 of 291 comments (clear)

  1. I stopped flying. by OFnow · · Score: 5, Interesting

    I cannot speak for others, but I have stopped flying. Period. Instead we drive where the distance is reasonable and simply don't go many places we once went. So the argument that 'people are flying anyway, the security theater must be ok' is weak as the number flying might be much higher. Not that airports have the capacity for more air travel anyway...

    1. Re:I stopped flying. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Interesting

      I cannot speak for others, but I have stopped flying. Period. Instead we drive where the distance is reasonable
      and simply don't go many places we once went. So the argument that 'people are flying anyway, the security theater must be ok' is
      weak as the number flying might be much higher. Not that airports have the capacity for more
      air travel anyway...

      Actually, one of schneier's points is that this effect has caused some 500 deaths in road accidents per year. I have not read the book he cites as a source for this number...

    2. Re:I stopped flying. by dkleinsc · · Score: 5, Interesting

      So have I, including being willing to spend about 5 days and a not-insignificant amount of money to travel from Ohio to California by rail. Which I consider to be a small price to pay for not having my rights trampled.

      Especially because rail travel is rather fun if you do it right. Sleeper cars are basically moving hotel rooms, meals are included, and you can hide in your room or try chatting in the lounge depending on your willingness to get to know complete strangers. I've met some interesting people on trains, including a nun in a spiritual crisis, a guy who was a well-known campaign adviser in Texas, some ardent Tea Partiers, Boy Scouts heading back from hiking trips, etc. And you also get a real sense of how big the United States really is, and all the variety of landscapes in it - I was thinking of Woodie Guthrie's "This Land is Your Land" along much of the ride.

      Of course, the TSA now is trying to get into the business of searching rail passengers and creating highway checkpoints so that those of us who don't want to be searched without probable cause can't avoid it. I don't mind seeing bomb-sniffing dogs in major rail stations, because that makes some sense. But what doesn't make sense is trying to take away any object that could be lethal - as George Carlin pointed out, you probably could beat a guy to death with the Sunday New York Times.

      --
      I am officially gone from /. Long live http://www.soylentnews.com/
  2. Re:Leave the TSA alone! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Interesting

    We no longer visit the United States. Instead, we go to other parts of Canada or to Mexico or to Europe where, each year, we drop 2-3 K dollars for holidays. Grabbing my nutsack and/or pushing me into a microwave oven isn't exactly what I would call laying out the welcome mat. That's why we don't go to the US anymore. Oh well, lots of other places to see in the world.

  3. Re:Leave the TSA alone! by 0111+1110 · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Would you rather drive for 48 hours or be raped? I prefer to only have my knob polished by attractive females, and I prefer not to have my anus or ass crack or even my scalp explored by curious, impatient, eager fingers. I honestly don't understand people who are willing to be sexually violated in order to avoid losing a few hundred dollars or being seriously inconvenienced.

    It brings to mind that joke about Winston Churchill and a socialite:

    "Madam, would you sleep with me for five million pounds?"
    "My goodness, Mr. Churchill... Well, I suppose I would."
    "Would you sleep with me for five pounds?"
    "Mr. Churchill, what kind of woman do you think I am?!"
    "Madam, we've already established that. Now we are just haggling about the price."

    --
    Quite an experience to live in fear, isn't it? That's what it is to be a slave.
  4. Structural solution by Beryllium+Sphere(tm) · · Score: 5, Interesting

    > more intelligence-driven

    An Israeli expert suggested separating risk assessment from implementation. A simple organizational change, but it would mean that the TSA could no longer expand its empire by exaggerating risks.