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Ask Slashdot: What Language Should a Former Coder Dig Into?
An anonymous reader writes "I was a consultant for nearly 20 years and I got into projects where I had to work with a huge variety of software, operating systems, hardware, programming languages, and other assorted technologies. After retiring from that I have spent the last 10 years in a completely different sector. Now I find myself wanting to really focus on coding for personal reasons. You can imagine how out-of-touch I am since I never really was more than a hack to begin with. I can learn syntax and basics in a weekend, question is, what Language should I become native to? Never liked anything 'lower-level' than C, and I don't have the funds to 'buy' my development environment....help me Slashdot, you're my only hope."
n/t
"...help me Slashdot, you're my only hope."
You're screwed.
Forgive me for sounding rude, but to give you advice about what languages to get into, without giving even a hint what you're trying to create, is ridiculous.
Languages have evolved around their purpose. No purpose, no advice.
It's clean, elegant. Has consistent, well thought out syntax, is easy to debug (PHP Parse error: syntax error, unexpected T_PAAMAYIM_NEKUDOTAYIM) and is secure by default.
Best all-around: Python
Best for enterprise work: Java
Best for OS dev, e.g. device drivers: C
Best for system programming above OS, e.g. database internals: C++
Best for game programming: C++
Best for financial apps: C#
Best social networking startup interview: Ruby
Best for web dev: JavaScript
Best for bioinformatics: R, SAS
C and Java are the leading languages by a lot of measures right now. C will easily get you a job, you'll get back into it easily because you already know it, but you'll have to learn how to write code without leaking. Java is a fine language, but the number of enterprise libraries you have to learn can feel overwhelming. C# can get you a job if you want live in Microsoft world, and it's designed to be easy to pick up.
Really I'd say focus on what you want to do, then learn what language is popular in that area. Embedded? Learn C. Enterprise code? Learn Java. Games? C++. If you want to do general scripting, learn Python. If you want to write web apps, focus on Javascript, and learn a bit of Java/Python/PHP/Ruby (choose your favorite, Ruby is fun) to figure out the server side. Choose one database (oracle/MySQL/Postresql) to start out with, the knowledge will transfer to the others. Figure out what you want first, then choose a language that will support it.
"First they came for the slanderers and i said nothing."
Yes. C# (VB.NET and C++ as well) has the free Visual Studio Express from Microsoft. While it doesn't officially support Python, it does become a very good Python IDE by using the equally free (and unimaginatively named) Python Tools for Visual Studio.
Because they don't want to say "I'm a noobie, what should I code in?"
If he was a seasoned programmer, he would have included little tidbits like what he intended to do, and what his experience was.
Web page? PHP.
High load gaming? a flavor of C.
3d gaming without reinventing the engine? Whatever that engine needs.
Phone apps? Java.
Simplify how his Linux machine boots? Bash.
Some new hardware that he just invented? Probably assembly.
"Hello World"? Any language he'd like.
I started real development with Perl. I've mostly moved away from it, but there are still a few things that I need the Perl modules to do, that are difficult to find good interfaces anywhere else.
Serious? Seriousness is well above my pay grade.
As I noted in my post I never was a seasoned programmer, I was a total hack, aw hell you guys prolly don't even know what a hack is, you probably think I had an area of expertise too. I HACKED SHIT TOGETHER and got PAID! I learned whatever I needed to know to accomplish what others couldn't. I probably forgot more about the languages I've used than most 'experts' know of any single language. I couldn't possibly have listed all the languages and technologies I have done work with. But here's a sample.... BASIC, C, Pascal, Ada, COBOL, Perl, CGI, vbscript/asp, scripting (*ux shells mostly), VB, most recently PHP. I am only interested in general purpose work, utilities, hell I don't even know yet exactly where I will go with this. I was hoping for some informed guidance and expert advice but maybe slashdot isn't what it used to be...
"Evil man makes you kill me...evil man makes me kill you..even tho..we're just families apart.."
Right on! You are totally correct about all languages being equal. That's why all our largest projects are done in COBOL. Since that's the only language we're comfortable with, it just makes sense to use it for everything from throwaway scripts to enterprise software and shrink-wrapped products.
You must be one of the Ruby nuts that the GP warned about. I've had to interview a bunch of them recently. Apparently they can't find any work using Ruby, so they've been applying for the C++ jobs that I have open at the moment. I seriously can't believe how some of them behave. One of the first guys I interviewed wouldn't take off his fedora, wouldn't shake hands with anyone, and openly admitted that he wouldn't work with any of our female developers and testers for some reason. Another guy refused to use C++, while interviewing for a C++ programmer position! During his interview, we asked him to write some small sample programs in C++, but he turned in some Ruby code, and told us it was "more efficient" or some bullshit like that. The rest usually don't even get that far. Some of them don't even know what the STL or Boost are! I could easily see these guys considering a 4,000-5,000 line web app as being a "huge project".
Definitely agreed here. There is plenty of movement away from Java towards C#. Microsoft is working hard to be fair to the community and let the language become a real standard without severe restriction.
Also, C# lets you develop on a wide array of platforms, Windows, WP7/8, iOS (Mono), OSX (Mono), Android (Mono), Linux (Mono again).
Versus Java, C# affords a better opportunity to stay within one language for the entirety of a program. Higher performance doesn't mix with Java, video games for example, frequently need modules coded in C/C++ in order to achieve reasonable performance levels. Some of the Java -> C# porting has shown massive performance gains.
Unless Oracle changes their policies regarding Java, the language is likely to languish as it has for the past several years.
I'm not a fan of Python like others. I've always felt the language doesn't encourage the best coding practices because of the ease and lax style. I will give it credit as probably one of the faster to implement languages for one-off rapid application development. C# strikes me a better language to continue your existing knowledge while modernizing and have a path forward.
There are no Java projects that weren't huge. Even the trivial ones.