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Bonobos Join Chimps As Closest Human Relatives

sciencehabit writes "Chimpanzees now have to share the distinction of being our closest living relative in the animal kingdom. An international team of researchers has sequenced the genome of the bonobo for the first time, confirming that it shares the same percentage of its DNA with us as chimps do. The team also found some small but tantalizing differences in the genomes of the three species—differences that may explain how bonobos and chimpanzees don't look or act like us even though we share about 99% of our DNA."

52 of 259 comments (clear)

  1. Bonobo Chimpanzee by busyqth · · Score: 4, Interesting

    What reason is there to consider the Bonobo and Chimpanzee different species?
    Is it just a matter of behavior? If so, has it been proven that the behavioral differences aren't cultural?

    1. Re:Bonobo Chimpanzee by i+kan+reed · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Assuming you're not trolling here:

      There's morphic phenotypes that are different, for one. Bonobos are actually a lot smaller than chimps as mature adults. They are also much less able to solve complex puzzles, a difference that persists even when raised in complete separation of others from their own species. There's also the biological definition of species that requires that they be able to interbreed, we have never seen that happen.

    2. Re:Bonobo Chimpanzee by NoNonAlphaCharsHere · · Score: 2

      They are morphologically different, but probably no more so than human racial differences. I am unaware if they can or cannot cross-breed and produce fertile offspring, which is what many use to differentiate what is a "species" and what is not.

    3. Re:Bonobo Chimpanzee by wastedlife · · Score: 3, Informative

      I read about this yesterday on Ars. In the second-to-last paragraph, they talk about how Bonobos are well within the standard deviation for chimps, so genetically speaking, they should be the same species. I believe they were even once considered to be the same species, but were separated due to the size and behavior differences. In light of this new evidence, I believe it may cause them to be considered a "sub-species", much like dogs are to wolves.

      --
      Said, "It's just like dice but it's got more sides And it tells me who lives and who dies"
    4. Re:Bonobo Chimpanzee by nospam007 · · Score: 4, Funny

      "Is it just a matter of behavior? "

      That too. Chimps will fuck you up, given the chance, Bonobos will just fuck you.

    5. Re:Bonobo Chimpanzee by i+kan+reed · · Score: 4, Informative

      Irrelevant. Geographic separation is a direct cause of speciation. Gene pools stop mixing, genetic drift pushes two similar groups far enough apart that they are no longer compatible.

    6. Re:Bonobo Chimpanzee by ShanghaiBill · · Score: 3, Interesting

      They are also much less able to solve complex puzzles,

      I believe bonobos are usually considered to be more intelligent.

    7. Re:Bonobo Chimpanzee by busyqth · · Score: 2

      Irrelevant. Geographic separation is a direct cause of speciation. Gene pools stop mixing, genetic drift pushes two similar groups far enough apart that they are no longer compatible.

      Yeah I get that, but if the physical separation has not existed long enough to allow genetic divergence, then they would just be isolated populations.

    8. Re:Bonobo Chimpanzee by Insanity+Defense · · Score: 2

      There's morphic phenotypes that are different, for one. Bonobos are actually a lot smaller than chimps as mature adults.

      There's also the biological definition of species that requires that they be able to interbreed, we have never seen that happen.

      So Chihuahuas and Great Danes are different species?

    9. Re:Bonobo Chimpanzee by busyqth · · Score: 2

      Is this an accurate depiction of the genetic situation, or did you just make it up?

    10. Re:Bonobo Chimpanzee by ShanghaiBill · · Score: 4, Informative

      So Chihuahuas and Great Danes are different species?

      No. They may be physically incompatible, but they are not genetically incompatible. If you inseminate a Great Dane with Chihuahua semen, it would have fertile puppies. Additionally, they could both interbreed with dogs of intermediate size. If A is the same species as B and B is the same species as C, then A is the same species as C.

    11. Re:Bonobo Chimpanzee by jez9999 · · Score: 4, Funny

      I take issue with that campaign about bonobos being the most intelligent ape. Humans deserve at least an honourable mention.

    12. Re:Bonobo Chimpanzee by Mindcontrolled · · Score: 4, Funny

      That's for history to decide. Which, of course, will be written by the victorious species. I for one preemptively welcome or future bonobo overlords.

      --
      Ubi solitudinem faciunt, pacem appellant.
    13. Re:Bonobo Chimpanzee by busyqth · · Score: 2

      When I'm the one posting, it makes sense to assume troll.

    14. Re:Bonobo Chimpanzee by brusk · · Score: 3, Informative
      --
      .sig withheld by request
    15. Re:Bonobo Chimpanzee by rthille · · Score: 4, Insightful

      Bonobos spent a greater percentage of their lives copulating. I think it's pretty obvious which species is more intelligent...

      --
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    16. Re:Bonobo Chimpanzee by rthille · · Score: 4, Informative

      Not so. See "Ring Species"

      --
      Awesome furniture, accessories and cabinetry in Santa Rosa, CA: http://humanity-home.com/
    17. Re:Bonobo Chimpanzee by pecosdave · · Score: 3, Informative

      I decided to look, I found this:

      Hybridizations

              Hybrids between common chimps and bonobos in captivity have occurred

      But I can't find a lot more than that. I was looking for pictures.

      --
      The preceding post was not a Slashvertisement.
    18. Re:Bonobo Chimpanzee by Smauler · · Score: 3, Insightful

      The ability to freely (without human intervention) interbreed and produce fertile offspring is central to the definition of what a species is.

      This definition is crap though. If animal A can interbreed with animal B, and animal B with C, but A cannot with C, then you cannot define the species. There are real world examples of this, albeit a little more convoluted : see the herring gull and lesser black backed gull.

    19. Re:Bonobo Chimpanzee by ZigiSamblak · · Score: 5, Funny

      Well, that does explain why they don't visit Slashdot.

    20. Re:Bonobo Chimpanzee by Intropy · · Score: 3, Informative

      They aren't. Chimpanzee is a genus (Pan) not a species. Bonobo (Pan paniscus) is a species on chimpanzee. The other extant species of chimpanzee is the common chimpanzee (Pan troglodytes). Those two species of chimpanzee are diffierent species from one another for the same reason any other two species of animal in the same genus are, they can't reliably produce offspring that can themselves reliably produce offspring.

    21. Re:Bonobo Chimpanzee by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      It seems like Parent is trolling for "You can't define a species, therefore Evolution is a bunch of bullshit", so I'm going to nip that in the bud. "Species" as we define them in the family tree of organisms are merely labels of convenience for common animals of the present, and those of the past that are of significance due to either their place in the evolutionary timeline and/or the fact that they're one of the rare few we've gotten good fossil evidence for (fossil formation is a rare event). When you take a big picture view of all life on the planet over all time, the distinction of "species" actually has very little meaning. Most animal populations, on the large timescale, are in a constant process of evolution.

      Speciation is fluid. AnimalX from year Y, and something very like AnimalX from year Y+1000 might be able to inter-breed if they met through a time machine, although they probably already differ in several minor features. Fast-forward another several hundred thousand years, and you might be hard-pressed to even identify which (zero or more) surviving animals are descendants of AnimalX's genetics and which aren't, much less try to interbreed them.

      The notion of a fixed "Species" is really only even remotely relevant when you're talking about one localized animal population at a single point in time. Trying to come up with a rigorous definition for the "boundary" between distinct species is futile: Species will fluidly evolve into other things over time gradually. Even experts in the field regularly argue over the boundaries between well-known species, but they also realize that their arguments aren't about the science of speciation, they're about convenient labels and categorization systems for pools of beings of interest.

    22. Re:Bonobo Chimpanzee by __aaltlg1547 · · Score: 2

      But have they been separated long enough to become reproductively incompatible? For 12000 years, aboriginal Americans were separated from old world humans, but when Columbus sailed, lo and behold the people were reproductively compatible. Australian aborigines were separated even longer, and dingos longer than that if you count generations instead of years, but no speciation occurred.

      Reproductive isolation is apparently necessary for speciation, but not sufficient.

    23. Re:Bonobo Chimpanzee by sFurbo · · Score: 2

      This definition is crap though. If animal A can interbreed with animal B, and animal B with C, but A cannot with C, then you cannot define the species.

      This makes all definitions of species crap. Species is a human construct that nature does not care about. As long as you are aware of that, it is fine to use definitions with problematic corner cases.

    24. Re:Bonobo Chimpanzee by RivenAleem · · Score: 2

      If animal A can interbreed with animal B, and animal B with C, but A cannot with C, then you cannot define the species.

      Seriously, if A can breed with B, then we have a scenario where A is male and B is female. This makes the Pairing between B and C such that B is female and C is Male. Animals A and C could never (successfully) breed as they would be both male.

      Also B is somewhat of a slut.

  2. No real surprise here by doston · · Score: 5, Funny

    Always figured they were closely related to man, considering how endlessly horny they are.

    1. Re:No real surprise here by knappe+duivel · · Score: 2, Funny

      Always figured they were closely related to man, considering how endlessly horny they are.

      Always figured they were closely related to me, considering how endlessly horny they are.

    2. Re:No real surprise here by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      humans: somewhere between licentious bonobos and face tearing chimpanzees.

  3. I've suspected this for a long time actually. by conspirator23 · · Score: 2, Funny

    I always figured that conservatives evolved from the innocent-seeming but violent, territorial, face-eating chimpanzees, and liberals evolved from those oversexed, touchy-feely bonobos. Now we know the truth!

    1. Re:I've suspected this for a long time actually. by bill_mcgonigle · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I always figured that conservatives evolved from the innocent-seeming but violent, territorial, face-eating chimpanzees, and liberals evolved from those oversexed, touchy-feely bonobos. Now we know the truth!

      Real liberals, yeah. The socialists who think nothing of threatening others with violence to get their way - chimps.

      --
      My God, it's Full of Source!
      OUTSIDE_IP=$(dig +short my.ip @outsideip.net)
    2. Re:I've suspected this for a long time actually. by Curunir_wolf · · Score: 2

      Let me guess, the "violence" you are talking of is actually the fact that you have to pay taxes to finance part of the society that is supporting you?

      Just like chimps, the coercive hierarchy is primarily enforced by the mere threat of violence. And, similarly, an occasional example must be made.

      --
      "Somebody has to do something. It's just incredibly pathetic it has to be us."
      --- Jerry Garcia
    3. Re:I've suspected this for a long time actually. by bill_mcgonigle · · Score: 2

      So, you would be "fine" with paying taxes, as long as no one enforced it on you? I.e. making it basically voluntary?

      Absolutely. Except you can't call them taxes, because taxes, by definition, are backed by violence or threats thereof. Voluntary payments are not a problem.

      Except, say in the case of welfare, I'd donate money to the organization that has the best services and the lowest expense ratios. The government's expense ratios for welfare are sky-high, but if the same people were competing peacefully for my money and doing a great job, I'd donate to them too.

      I'd also happily pay to travel on well-maintained roads and support the local schools that do a good job teaching their students.

      Since I'd have nearly double my current income, I'd have plenty to donate too. I already volunteer at least 600 hours a year for nonprofits, but without wasteful taxes I'd have some money to give them as well.

      --
      My God, it's Full of Source!
      OUTSIDE_IP=$(dig +short my.ip @outsideip.net)
    4. Re:I've suspected this for a long time actually. by Coren22 · · Score: 2

      You point out the repubs that don't pay taxes, but I'll bet there are just as many demos that don't pay...

      --
      APK likes to ask for responses to the same things over and over. Maybe he just likes the responses?
  4. 1% of three billion by Bill,+Shooter+of+Bul · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Three billion DNA pairs in human dna. 1% is 30 million. So we differ by 30 million dna pairs. To the layperson, saying we have 30 million differences explains the differences quite well versus 99% in common.

    --
    Well.. maybe. Or Maybe not. But Definitely not sort of.
    1. Re:1% of three billion by codewarren · · Score: 4, Informative

      The difference from humans to other humans can be 3 million base pairs, (0.1%), for perspective. 30 million (a factor of 10) doesn't seem like that much.

    2. Re:1% of three billion by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 4, Funny

      Humans have 23 chromosome pairs.... 46 chromosomes in total. In women, there are 2 X and in males, 1X and 1Y. Males of our species share 45/46 or 98% with females.

      Explains why I understand male monkeys much better than female humans

      Oooh Oooh Ah Ah Ah

  5. Re:Nope... by UnknownSoldier · · Score: 2

    That's OK you are still an ass :)

    I jest, I jest.

  6. Re:False by dietdew7 · · Score: 4, Funny

    Is she a bonobo or a chimpanzee?

  7. Re:What next? by NoNonAlphaCharsHere · · Score: 2

    What species is that thing on his head?

  8. Re:Two different closest living relatives? by bmo · · Score: 2

    Young Earth Creationists scoff at any science related to genetics, no matter how it's presented.

    OECs, less so, but Creationism as an "ism" that takes Biblical allegory and perverts it into something else.

    --
    BMO

  9. Re:Comparison by Cosgrach · · Score: 2

    Since you posted as AC, I guess that this makes sense.

    --
    Why is it that most of the people that I encounter seem to have been shat from the Sphincter of Mediocrity?
  10. Re:Two different closest living relatives? by Empiric · · Score: 2

    Well, no, "Creationism" as it's commonly-used is a deliberate invalid collapsing into one word two different and non-dependent notions, first that the universe was created, and second the entirely distinct notion that it is 6000 years old.

    Though commonly-used this way (particularly by atheists), to attempt to sneak a False Dichotomy Fallacy into the discussion by offering only one word implying both, and thus demanding the listener either accept or reject both premises together, this is invalid usage of any word, going all the way back to Aristotle...

    ...but that's a conversation for another day.

    --
    ~ Whence do you come, slayer of men, or where are you going, conqueror of space?
  11. Re:Chimps? by Baloroth · · Score: 2

    Dog == wolf == dingo, yes (they are all in the canis lupus species). The other three are different species, but bonobos and common chimps are both often referred to as chimps: the only real reason they are considered separate species is that they have never been observed to interbreed (which doesn't mean they can't). They do have a few physical differences, but then again so do Asians and Caucasians.

    --
    "None can love freedom heartily, but good men; the rest love not freedom, but license." --John Milton
  12. Re:Chimps? by alva_edison · · Score: 4, Informative

    Well dog == wolf == dingo is true, they are all Canis lupus (C. lupus familiaris, C. lupus lupus, C. lupus dingo).

    Coyote and Jackal (and occassionally wolf) are used for other species within the Canis genus, so are closely related.

    Foxes are members of the same sub-family, but a different genus, so the least related among the bunch.

    Also Canis Lupus and Canis latrans are able to produce viable offspring, but the viability decreases across generations. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canis_lupus_X_Canis_latrans

    --
    He effected a bored affect.
  13. No... by Kupfernigk · · Score: 3, Interesting
    Foxes are members of the genus vulpes (the ones we see around are vulpus vulpus). The wolf is canis lupus and the domestic dog is considered to be a subspecies, canis lupus familiaris. Coyotes are a different genus again. Jackal is not a taxonomic description. The dingo is a subspecies of canis lupus and is derived from domestic dogs run wild.

    So the GP is right, and you are creating a complete straw man. Wolf, dog and dingo are all part of the same genus but for historic reasons dogs and dingos are only formally called wolves, not in colloquial speech. Foxes and coyotes are from different genera and are not dogs. "Jackal" is a colloquialism. Because pan paniscus and pan troglodytes are in the genus pan, they can both quite properly be called chimpanzees, just as we refer to members of the genus homo as "men", though we are no more like h. afarensis than bonobos are like p. troglodytes. When I tell my dog not to behave like a little wolf, he can reasonably argue that he is one, just one adapted for a specific ecological niche.

    --
    From scarped cliff or quarried stone she cries "A thousand types are gone, I care for nothing, no not one."
    1. Re:No... by Tyler+Durden · · Score: 4, Funny

      When I tell my dog not to behave like a little wolf, he can reasonably argue that he is one, just one adapted for a specific ecological niche.

      If your dog's making reasonable arguments then he's filling a rare ecological niche indeed. Impressive!

      --
      Happy people make bad consumers.
  14. Re:uninteresting consequence of the decimal system by SpeZek · · Score: 5, Insightful

    We're related to just about every living thing on this planet that has a face. I think that's pretty mind blowing.

    Nope. We're related to every living thing on this planet full stop .

    After all, we all share the same ancestor if you go back far enough.

  15. Re:Nope... by Grayhand · · Score: 4, Funny

    I didn't come from no monkey's butthole

    It's an honest mistake. Most people just assume there's a family resemblance.

  16. Re:Two different closest living relatives? by Empiric · · Score: 2, Insightful

    Okay, I -accept- the universe was created, and -reject- that it is 6000 years old.

    Pick the word you want to use for that, as they're never mutually dependent.

    The rest is the standard boilerplate Ad Hominem and Genetic Fallacy, so I'll be skipping that. Code to do.

    And yes, I did test it. The test confirmed.

    --
    ~ Whence do you come, slayer of men, or where are you going, conqueror of space?
  17. I fail to see how this is surprising by Xtifr · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Doesn't the evidence show that bonobos and chimps split from their common ancestor long after protohumans split from the common ancestor of all three? In which case, isn't this more-or-less exactly what you'd expect?

    1. Re:I fail to see how this is surprising by Michael+Woodhams · · Score: 2

      Yes, but in science we still test what we expect to be true. Also, I'm sure that the '% difference from humans' number was not the primary goal of this research, just an easy and interesting number to calculate once you have the data for other purposes.

      Rates of genetic evolution can vary along different lineages, so it is possible that since the Bonobo/Chimp split, one had evolved faster than the other. It would have been surprising, however, for the rates to be substantially different after such a short time.

      --
      Quattuor res in hoc mundo sanctae sunt: libri, liberi, libertas et liberalitas.
  18. Re:Two different closest living relatives? by Empiric · · Score: 2

    You already fully demonstrated your failure to understand what a Genetic Fallacy is, so no need to cut-and-paste regarding Dover.

    Other than that, I'm not sure why the topic-switch. I never contended that "Creationism" isn't "Religion", nor would that in any way be relevant to it being correct.

    I contended that usage of a single concept to indicate two distinct and independent premises, is invalid formation and/or use of a concept. This remains your issue, which, again, some introductory epistemology should cure you of.

    --
    ~ Whence do you come, slayer of men, or where are you going, conqueror of space?