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Judge Suggests Apple, Motorola Should Play Nice

Posted by samzenpus on from the keep-your-litigation-to-yourself dept.

sl4shd0rk writes "Federal Judge Richard Posner seems to be a man who gets the screwed up patent system in the U.S. As Apple pressed for more injunctions against Motorola regarding alleged patent infringement, Judge Posner has stressed the two companies should just 'get along' and pay each other royalties. A jury trial set to start last week was cancelled when Posner ruled that neither side could prove damages, and grilled Apple's legal team saying an injunction against Motorola would be 'contrary to the public interest.' Furthermore, as Apple tried to plead its injunction case concerning four patents, Posner called the U.S. patent system 'chaos' and said an order barring the sale of Motorola phones could have 'catastrophic effects.'"

3 of 140 comments (clear)

  1. Finally by Vskye · · Score: 5, Informative

    A judge that gets it. A refreshing change for once.

    --
    Life was hell, then I discovered Linux...
    1. Re:Finally by haploc · · Score: 5, Informative

      He's the judge that really adroitly handled the Microsoft antitrust trial, then flubbed it by speaking to the press about the trial before it was over. That gave Microsoft the grounds for an appeal (and subsequent 'slap on the wrist' punishment) based on him 'not being impartial'. Which was bunk, but his mistake gave the appearance, and that was enough.

      That judge was Thomas Penfield Jackson.

  2. Re:Yes, that's what FRAND means. by jo_ham · · Score: 4, Informative

    You're arguing semantics. I offered an opinion and a question - that's the point of a discussion, no? I'm asking why, not proclaiming that they can't.

    Here's a scenario for you.

    A: I slipped over on a wet floor, it's the store's fault

    B: How is it the store's fault?

    A: They didn't have a sign up warning me.

    B: I see, well I'd suggest that you watch your step in future, but I agree that the store should put up a sign - perhaps they hadn't noticed yet?

    The question does not mean "you are not allowed to assign blame".

    I'm also not sure how I can have a "pretend moderate" voice. Either I'm being moderate or I'm not? Do you see me raging and cursing at anyone?

    You're claiming "Apple don't want to pay that price [the licence cost of a FRAND patent]" - but on what grounds? Do you have a citation on that? They were in negotiation with Nokia for years over the value of cross-licenced patents to come to an agreement. There was certainly never any indication that they "didn't want to pay" - they just want to pay what's fair.

    As far as lawsuits with Motorola and Samsung over FRAND patents, well that's where the water gets murky. For some reason both Samsung and Moto seemed totally fine with Apple's payment to use the 3G patents, right up until they needed a stick to beat them with, then all of a sudden "ooh, they are infringing on this patent, and haven't paid for it!". Funny that. I'm not sure how they can only partially have paid to use the 3G patents. If they have not paid for one, then they must also be in violation of all of them. Apple uses pretty standard 3G radios and chipsets - if it took Samsung 5 years to determine that there was one patent that Apple didn't pay for (given that they've been licensing their part of the 3G pool for years) then I have to wonder what on earth they were doing for all that time? Surely not holding one back that they could use in the event they got sued? How blameless of them! The alternative is extreme incompetence on Samsung's part. I'm not sure what's worse.

    The 3G patent pool does not require that "you put patents in the pool" in order to licence what is currently in there (and this is what we're discussing here). If it did then the 3G standard would be meaningless, since the patent pool would continue to grow. What happens to older devices if new "essential" patents are added to the pool? The 3G FRAND patents are set the way they are to ensure interoperability across all the different cellular manufacturers, otherwise there would be chaos. The pool is static, containing the patents necessary for the standard to work.

    Just for completeness, I am aware that different licence conditions are possible for FRAND patent pools, but that in general they are used when an industry standard is involved, so they tend not to grow (in terms of patents) once the standard is set, unless that standard is extended.