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PlayStation Boss Defends Vita, Slams Social Gaming

donniebaseball23 writes "Sony Computer Entertainment America boss Jack Tretton has come out swinging to defend the lackluster response the games industry has seen with the PS Vita. He deemed the sales level for the portable as 'acceptable' so far, and he brushed off any notion that social and free-to-play games are putting huge pressure on the portable and dedicated consoles market. 'I think the opportunity to be in the console business is greater than ever before,' he said. '[Social and free-to-play] is a business I think a lot of companies are learning is difficult to sustain for the long term. It's an adjunct or it's an add-on, but it's not where gaming is headed. It's an additive diversion. There's a place for social and freemium, but it's not going to replace the business models that are out there.'" The company is having a hard time getting third-party developers interested in the Vita platform.

28 of 147 comments (clear)

  1. It's amazing how many business people.. by BMOC · · Score: 5, Insightful

    ...managed to convince themselves that giving their customer choices will be bad for business.

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    1. Re:It's amazing how many business people.. by Kergan · · Score: 2

      Even more amazing is how they can get into such a state of denial. This looks like RIM 2.0.

    2. Re:It's amazing how many business people.. by cpu6502 · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Which is not what he said.
      He was defending himself against the accusation that the PS Vita is a flop and should be terminated. He's saying that people SHOULD have choices..... both free on the phone and professional-level games on portables like Nintendo DS and PSP/Vita.

      I think the real problem here is trying to overcome Nintendo's dominance. Atari tried. Sega tried. Wonderswan tried. Sony tried (with PSP and then Vita). Nobody's been able to do it because Nintendo has a lock on portable game machines. Maybe because the primary audience for portables is kids (riding on buses, in cars, etc) and that is also Nintendo's primary audience.

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    3. Re:It's amazing how many business people.. by FitForTheSun · · Score: 2

      Sometimes yes, sometimes no. Apple sells fewer products than in the mid 90s, but it sells more product than in the mid 90s. In general, I'm like you, I like choices, which is why I'm not an Apple customer, but what you said is not at all a universal market truth.

    4. Re:It's amazing how many business people.. by petsounds · · Score: 3, Insightful

      Tell that to Steve Jobs.

      That might be a bit hard at this point.

      I think what is happening is not so simple as you make it out to be. The average gamer age continues to increase, and Vita certainly is more on the side of this demographic than the kid market. Sony is obviously concerned about Apple biting off this already slim piece on the portable market, but it might be a losing battle.

      As people age, they tend to move towards the casual end of the spectrum. Less free time in their life, less games that appeal to them as an adult. And I think many adults start to see portable gaming devices as a 'kid thing'. A lot of this is women influencing men. Most adult women see men who do any gaming more than the occasional game with their friends as immature. So guys who want to get dates start leaving that hobby behind. So they naturally gravitate towards the casual games on smartphones. It's already a device they carry and it's more socially acceptable [to women].

      So with this in mind, I think it will be hard for Sony to expand. One on side they have the unbeatable kid company, Nintendo. On the other, they have iPhones/Android devices taking away the hardcore-turned-casual adult gamers. So their main market seems to be the 13-22 segment. It's a profitable segment, but Sony is a bit stuck.

    5. Re:It's amazing how many business people.. by petsounds · · Score: 2

      So, basically, what you're saying is: Blame the FemeNazis? I don't buy that.

      FemeNazis? What? I'm talking about your typical adult woman who hasn't played a game since she was a kid. It's just sociology. Look at that recent study about females being the main driver of speech patterns in language. Males in general alter their behaviors in order to win the affection of females. And most of the women I've known haven't had a real high view of console/portable gaming. And well, the media hasn't really helped them form a proper opinion, either -- between the news reports trying to associate anti-social behavior with gaming and movies portraying slacker characters as gamers. Think about your married guy friends who self-identify as gamers (or at least the ones who aren't married to gamers), and think about whether they play more or less games after they got married. I can pretty much say everyone I know in that category plays a small fraction of the amount they used to. And when they do, it's something they can play for 15-30 minutes, aside from the times a friend is over to play on xbox/ps3. The PS3 gets into households because it plays Blue-Ray. I think this has changed a bit with younger generations of women coming up; a wider swath of women play games these days. But I've talked to a fair number of sub-25 females who won't date guys who play a lot of games.

      I agree with most of what you said, though I don't know how it relates to what I was talking about. You're speaking as a developer, I was just speaking to the sociological reason we're seeing a switch to portable-casual from portable-hardcore. You're talking about supply, I was talking about demand.

      And yeah, I remember when arcades hit the scene also. The other day I was remembering that it would take a quarter just to figure out how not to die! And there was always that one guy who could sweep every stage of Donkey Kong, and trying to memorize his patterns. There was a great friendly, social aspect about early videogaming in those arcades that is no longer present; strangers giving tips, cheering each other on. Glad I got to experience that period in videogame history.

  2. That's a shame by geekoid · · Score: 3, Informative

    the Vita platforms has a ton of really cool potential.

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    1. Re:That's a shame by iplayfast · · Score: 2, Interesting

      So did the PS3, until they killed the Linux use of it. Now it is only Sony blackbox hardware. I'll never buy from Sony again!

    2. Re:That's a shame by thePowerOfGrayskull · · Score: 4, Funny

      So did the PS3, until they killed the Linux use of it. Now it is only Sony blackbox hardware. I'll never buy from Sony again!

      You forgot to dramatically wipe away a single tear.

    3. Re:That's a shame by Mondoz · · Score: 5, Funny

      That was implied in the performance, you insensitive clod.

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  3. Hot News Flash! by killmenow · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Executive in entrenched industry doesn't like new disruptive technology driving industry shift!

    The thing is, he could even be right that social/casual/freemium gaming is not sustainable and not going to supplant his business model. But it's hardly news that he thinks so.

    1. Re:Hot News Flash! by fuzzyfuzzyfungus · · Score: 2

      Executive in entrenched industry doesn't like new disruptive technology driving industry shift!

      Unfortunately for him, it isn't even just the disruptive technology that he has to worry about... A Vita will run you ~$250, plus the essentially-obligatory proprietary memory card. PSPs are down around 120-130 new, less used or refurbed, and Nintendo handhelds are less than that. Even in its relation to the classic console market, the Vita targets only the (relatively narrow) niche of comparatively serious gamers who are on the go enough that having a portable as a primary or secondary console makes sense. Now that a great many cellphones are moderately competent as well, that niche isn't getting any wider.

  4. It ain't "social" that's killing ya... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 3, Insightful

    ...it's that everyone already has an iPhone or Android in their pocket and doesn't want a whole separate device for gaming.

  5. they should have... by theweakend · · Score: 2

    ... made the playstation phone like every one wanted

  6. Sony should be scared. by SternisheFan · · Score: 3, Funny

    Sony, Microsoft, Nintendo, etal... They shouldn't be scared, they should all be very, VERY Frightened! Coming in March 2013, OUYA's gonna get 'em! http://www.ibtimes.com/articles/372183/20120809/ouya-kickstarter-pre-order-release-date-specs.htm

    1. Re:Sony should be scared. by Desler · · Score: 2

      And yet it will sell a fraction of what either of those comapnies will with their next gen consoles. Let alone make any dent with current gen stuff.

  7. He's right, but missing the point by asmkm22 · · Score: 5, Insightful
    Phones and social media are eating away at portable gaming consoles, but it has nothing to do with the gaming aspect of either. Previously, you'd carry a handheld like the Gameboy so that you had *something* to do while sitting around waiting in line or for a bus or wasting time and grandmas or whatever. Today, most everyone has a phone, even teens or preteens. Yes, they can play games on them, but they can also simply browse the internet or post stuff on social media sites.

    Gaming was never the draw for most people using portable devices; occupying time was the draw. People can do that with more stuff now, so of course the value of a strictly-gaming device is going to fall.

    1. Re:He's right, but missing the point by zephvark · · Score: 5, Funny

      or wasting time and grandmas

      I can have no sympathy for people who are wasting grandmas. A grandma is not a thing to waste.

  8. Lulz by TheSpoom · · Score: 4, Funny

    The company is having a hard time getting third-party developers interested in the Vita platform.

    Aww, poor Sony. Why on Earth would developers not like them?

    ...Oh yeah, everything.

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  9. It's the OpenPandora I'm waiting for! by Maquis196 · · Score: 2

    I have a Vita, it's a nice piece of kit, lack of games is a bit of a concern, I've had mine for months yet only 3 games so far. It doesn't help that when on the tube (London Underground) you're lucky to be in a position where you have both hands free. I prefer reading on my kindle, least you're certain to have one hand free during rush hour!

    Now portable wise it's the 1Ghz Pandora that I should be receiving next week. Generally it seems qemu is able to emulate roughly a 75Mhz Pentium on there. Just hope that Master of Orion 2 is playable on the move. Oh and I'm not trying to sell one to you (I'm not affiliated in anyway), you should really check it out;

    http://www.openpandora.org/index.php

  10. Vita - Great hardware, not much else. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Informative

    I can't buy a vita because looking at one makes me sad.
    Amazing hardware with great controls. Fast quad core CPU, OLED screen, everything you want. .. And fatally crippled by it's software. Sony so completely, amazingly out of touch with what the consumer wants that it can not make a functioning game ecosystem. They've taken their previous. "You'll take our shit and /like/ it" development model to the extreme and wonder why developers are giving it a pass.

    I know most of you reading this have a bias and predisposition that makes you unable to understand that iOS and andriod devices are now competing for the same dollars that traditional handheld game systems once had tied up.. But they do. Ask any young kid what they want between an ipad, iphone, andriod phone, andriod tab, vita, and 3ds. If you're over ~23 years old be prepared to be shocked. Kids want ipads. Not the machines you used to play pokemon growing up.

    Portable gaming without traditional d-pad and button controls is here. Understand it, or be shoved aside. .. Imagine if nintendo sold an official iphone game controller shell and sold pokemon games on the app store. Yeah, they'd make a killing. You know it. I know it. Why don't they do it? Pride. Plain old stubborn Japanese pride will be the death of Nintendo and Sony in the portable arena. It's 2012 and they're products have not budged one nanometer from their previous iterations.

    1. Re:Vita - Great hardware, not much else. by Gizzmonic · · Score: 3, Informative

      Oh, you bitter AC...what is it about this comment:

      "You'll take our shit and /like/ it" development model to the extreme and wonder why developers are giving it a pass.

      That makes this comment sound so hypocritical?

      Portable gaming without traditional d-pad and button controls is here. Understand it, or be shoved aside.

      It really has nothing to do with controls, and everything to do with the convenience of only having 1 device to carry around.

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    2. Re:Vita - Great hardware, not much else. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Right. And we're talking about current generation systems. 2012. Today, not yesterday.
      The vita was dead before it launched and the 3ds is at best a substandard product based on 4 generations old technology. It's hardware is comparable with the original iphone and it's architecture resembles an overstuffed DS, not the modern dual or quad core SOC based systems that are now now common. It's 3D display is an expensive gimmick that's not panning out particularly well and doesn't add much real value.

      Your argument resembles those that defended the now doomed RIM and their blackberry empire. "Hey! Our previous products were great and sold well. We're set forever!" Do you not notice the ever declining number in your own post? 150.. 93..27..

  11. Having trouble not just with third-parties by gman003 · · Score: 3, Insightful

    Sony's having a hard time getting *gamers* interested in the Vita. It's an amazingly powerful handheld, but it's trying to offer $60, 40-hour console-level games in a portable.

    It's competing not just with Nintendo's handheld, but with the iPhone and Android, and even to an extent Facebook games. Which are shorter and less involved, yes, but also cheaper, possibly even "free" (or at least, free-to-play, pay-to-win).

    Problem is, portable gaming has shifted. It's not something you sit in front of for hours and play, it's something you play for a few minutes on your coffee break. Nintendo at least tries to make games that you *can* play for just a few minutes. They're not perfect at it (as evidenced by their own sales problems), but they're at least aware of the problem. Sony seems to be betting the house on people wanting full-sized games on a handheld, and that's just not really true anymore (to an extent, I doubt it ever really was). In the time it takes to *load* some Vita games, I can have finished a round of Angry Birds or Edge or whatever.

    The other problem is that there's just no must-have games for it yet. For either handheld, really. They have a few good games apiece, but nothing that will sell not just the game, but the console. Third-parties rarely make those games - it's usually first-parties - but it doesn't help to not have them.

  12. I think he is missing another point. by PeanutButterBreath · · Score: 2

    Curent portables have made huge advances in technology, but the form factor doesn't support these capabilities. When I am using a mobile device, I am not looking for a deeply immersive gaming experience. Even if I did want that, a 4 inch screen isn't going to cut it, regardless of the resolution. Just because hardware makers can port much of the graphic and input technologies into a mobile device, doesn't mean that they should.

    For portable gaming, it is clear that people are satisfied with relatively simplistic gameplay and graphics. A "retro" arcade type game is much better suited to the capabilities of a mobile device and the amount of attention being mobile allows.

  13. Re:Then why did you cancel our PS Vita game??? by cpu6502 · · Score: 2

    The Vita's only been in North America since February. (In Japan since one week before Christmas.) It has already sold ~2 million units. Of course that's tiny compared to the 18 miilion sold for 3DS, but it's par for how Sony v. Nintendo operates. In the previous generation:

    DS - 130 million
    PSP- 70 million

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  14. Re:Once again Nintendo comes out on top by cpu6502 · · Score: 2

    Everybody is always predicting Nintendo's doom. They predicted it with the Gamecube (with merit since it finished in 2nd) (statistically-tied with Xbox), then the DS because they said nobody wants two screens, then the Wii because they claimed it was underpowered. The later two are now the #1 portable and TV console respectively. So much for people's prognostications.

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  15. Re:Xperia Play by poly_pusher · · Score: 2

    And they put outdated hardware in it. What was nice about it was the slide out controller. Everything else was substandard. I couldn't help but feel the motivation was to not cannibalize anticipated sales of their upcoming Vita. As a result they have a variety of devices all trying not to compete with one another at the sacrifice of functionality and/or performance.