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Bill "The Science Guy" Nye Says Creationism Is Not Appropriate For Children
timeOday writes "BigThink has released a video missive by Bill Nye ('The Science Guy') in which he challenges the low level of acceptance of evolution, particularly in the United States. He does not mince words: 'I say to the grownups, if you want to deny evolution and live in your world, in your world that's completely inconsistent with everything we observe in the universe, that's fine, but don't make your kids do it because we need them. We need scientifically literate voters and taxpayers for the future. We need people that can — we need engineers that can build stuff, solve problems.'"
uses the theory of evolution?
Can't you believe in God and evolution at the same time? I don't see why it's so hard. I am a Christian and I believe that God created the Earth, sun, planets, and the universe. But I don't think he literally did it in a week. Why can't we just agree that Genesis uses story-telling devices create a kind of "establishing shot" for Judaism/Christianity and get on with the more important parts of our lives.... like being kind to one another?
and he is of course as the current fashion requires dismissing the huge body of evidence that shows that There Is An Order to things
i would put that the first couple picoseconds of Time are beyond what Science can state as Truth and also show me an entire line of Fossils that show how a Proto-Quadraped became say a Horse (with complete skeletons at each stage).
oh and how is it that we are finding Fossils in ground that should have been washed off the Land surface a half million years ago??
Every Scientist needs to start assuming
In The Beginning [GOD|BANG]
and then go from there.
(oh and some sort of Plasma explosion can in no way shape or form prove that a Big Bang Occurred)
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How on earth can one say that creation is inconsistent with evidence? We have no evidence that was _observed_ two million years ago. We have observations from a few decades, and all else is extrapolation. Those who know the issues with extrapolating from data, and what can go wrong if ones assumptions as to the continuation of observed trends do not go as expected should be taught along with evolution. What should be taught is that, if everything always was as it is now, and our current theories of physics are exact, and there is no silly business going on that we cannot test experimentally (and this really is a big untestable assumption whose falsification opens a massive can of worms) then evolutionary origins give a theory that is consistent with evidence. But only consistency with evidence, and the past illustrated by the theory is only an apparent past, like the image of yourself in the mirror is an apparent 'you' that isn't really there. We do not, and cannot know conclusively where we came from, and there really are two possible approaches. One is the kind of creation story you see in Genesis or in other creation myths there, and there you have to assume that the universe did not, at creation time, look or work like it does now, but that it changed, either slowly or abruptly, in ways that may leave no material evidence, converge to the reality which we observe now (which is perfectly possible, and indeed is what happens in your Linux system every time you do a fresh install).
Science is, and should be, about what is happening in the here and now, and where they're going. Saying that things are consistent with an evolutionary origin tells us much about what is going on now and where it's going, which is why it's useful. It tells us nothing concrete about where we actually came from, since as explained above, that requires a massive extrapolation and hence a leap of faith as great as that of a hardcore Bible belter's belief in Genesis.
In short, teach philosophy of science, not just 'scientific facts', so that people understand scientific reasoning, its power and its limitations, and can decide for themselves. But please, please stop this pointless religion vs science war. Religion is about how you live in the here and now. The Bible is a guide to help you. Belief in it is part of a faith that allows your mind to get deeper in to the subtler aspects of the world around us, for those of a more mystical bent. The faith glues a community together, and the Biblical text gives innumerable powerful life lessons if read and taught properly. Get faith right, science right, philosophy right and there is no war between them. The science vs faith thing is as clueless as the protestant vs catholic thing: it misses the point, wastes time and gives the false impression that one is right and the other is wrong. The only antidote to this crap is true understanding. I did my PhD in mathematics, with a heavy amount of foundational stuff, read eastern, middle eastern and western spiritual texts, including the Bible, taught myself physics, psychology, economics and computer science from textbooks and find all inspiring and useful. Faith is a crucial part of how I live now, as is my grasp of physics, mathematics and model theory (which probably has a lot to do with how I can happily have multiple mutually incompatible worldviews in my head without issue). Anyway, I can't think how to conclude this little rant, just to note that level headed thinking that both sides respect is what is really needed.
-- The Grand Teddy Bear has Spoken: "Windows 8 Source Code Available NOW! more disgusting than your pr..."
Bill Nye is in a position to get laws passed that favor his viewpoint (force children to abandon god, allah, yahweh, Reincarnation, etc). He's not a tyrant himself but he's friends with those who are tyrants in the CA Legislature and Congress. As for why I'm "tired" of being bossed around?
Mainly because I'm tired of people telling what to do. "Don't smoke weed". Really? Who the hell am I hurting if I'm just sitting here watching Star Trek? If I am DUI then sure: Arrest me and throw me in jail with the alcohol drunks, but not when I'm just sitting at home not hurting anybody.
And what's the deal with forcing me to buy hospital insurance. At least with car insurance I can opt out (don't drive a car; walk. Or use a horse. Or take the train). So what's next? Congress mandates we all must drive hybrid cars? We all must install solar panels on our roofs? We all must buy CFLs or LED bulbs? Being forced to buy something you don't want to buy.
That my friend is the opposite of liberty. It's tyranny.
My AC stalker: " I personally agree with your posts most of the time, but that won't keep me from modding you troll"
Bill is a clueless idiot. Evolution is not in conflict creationism; only the "young earth theory" idiots. If it weren't for his ignorance about this he'd be an all-around intelligent guy. Oh well.
FAIL Bill, LOL.
It led to an interesting discussion. I posted the following comment:
"I like Bill Nye's approach to a lot of scientific teaching, loved most of his TV show growing up, but he does not in any way put forward an argument for evolution or against creationism in this video. He simply waves his hand and says - without offering a logical, this 'leads-to-that' argument - that by not believing in evolution your world view is inconsistent. I'm afraid that doesn't pass muster for me, though I would be interested in hearing a more in-depth discussion on the subject from him.
Personally, I don't believe in *macro* evolution (one species evolving into another) - and yet my world view is 100% functional and, I believe, logical. The great thing in the end, though, is that if evolution is true my worldview remains intact: evolution itself is not integral to it one way or the other :) I believe God created the universe and everything in it, and while I believe He did it within the literal amount of time described in the Bible it would also be entirely believable that He did so over eons and used evolution in the process - it would not change the fact that He did it!"
My friend replied saying that just because I disagreed with the video didn't mean I should disparage it. I almost couldn't believe what he was saying: I felt like I had been very respectful in my comment, and I was responding to a video that I felt was disparaging my position (not the other way around). Thus I replied with this:
"I in no way meant disrespect! I tried to use very civil words in my comment above, and if I came across impolite in any way then I apologize.
However, I do find it somewhat funny that your reaction would be to accuse me of disparaging something I disagree with when that is exactly what the original video you linked to was itself. Bill Nye, who again I respect greatly for his skill at combining education and entertainment, put forward the following:
1) The idea that the denial of evolution is unique to the US - which I very much doubt, as both Christians and some other religions (Islam, in particular) tend to hold views that contradict with macro evolution.
2) That not believing in evolution - which we cannot measure and observe in a lab - is comparable to not believing in plate tectonics (which we can observe and measure).
3) That we need good scientists and engineers, and therefore should not teach our children creationism. This in effect implies that someone cannot hold a creationist viewpoint and also contribute in those fields, which is preposterous (I personally know several scientists and engineers who hold beliefs similar to my own, and who are still very effective in their work - and I have read the works of many others who are much higher up in their respective fields).
These things all disparage creationist viewpoints, without any actual argument from logic about why evolution is right. That was all I was trying to point out previously, and I tried to do so in every bit as nice and calm of a way as Bill Nye portrayed in his video."
I have not yet heard back from him again.
William George
Who the fuck is Bill Nye. He is a failed actor and media whore. Why should anyone give a flying fuck what he thinks about Global Warming, modern society or anything at all. What a huge important story to put on /. And cue the nerd whorship: The first poster thinks the guy is awesome. Call Nye's agent and book him for your next birthday party. Maybe he'll suck your dick for an extra $10.
This is why I don't bother with this place anymore.
"I didn't spend six years in Evil Medical School to be called 'Mr.Evil,' thank you very much!"
When I was a child, I thought as a child... 1 Cor. 13:11
Perhaps now that you are older you might consider buying a study Bible and studying what it says about the whole timeline from Gen. 1:1 to the end. You won't find any place in it where it says Gen. 1:1 was 6,000 years ago. There's plenty of leeway for an old earth, dinosaurs, evolution, and all the rest. If you stop to consider just when Satan rebelled against God (since he was already fallen at the time of the Garden of Eden in Genesis yet had led nations from earth in rebellion against God as told in Isaiah), an older earth is indeed required.
The Bible doesn't dwell on this because it is a book speaking of God's relationship to man and his relationship to God and how to get back together again in the end. It doesn't get in the way of science (or at least there are reasonable ways to sort out the scriptures that leave room for science to exist without breaking what the Bible says and for the Bible to be correct without breaking science).
Give God another chance - you might be pleasantly surprised. Just read the Bible on your own terms and make sure what you hear actually lines up with what it says. You won't have nearly has many problems with God if you do that.
I too would like to see some of the old science shows come back - but we are cursed with hour upon hour of reality TV.