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Apple Axes Head of Mapping Team

New submitter drkim writes "'Apple has reportedly fired the head of its mapping team following software glitches which annoyed customers and rained mockery on the company.' Mr. Williamson promptly left Apple headquarters in Antarctica, and walked to his home in Middelfart, Denmark." Nerval's Lobster adds: "Cue is also 'seeking advice from outside map-technology experts' as well as 'prodding maps provider TomTom to fix landmark and navigation data it shares with Apple.'"

35 of 372 comments (clear)

  1. Was it justified by Ravaldy · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Was this guy setup for failure by having to meeting google map standards overnight?

    Firing people sometimes is an escape goat for companies mistakes.

    1. Re:Was it justified by dintech · · Score: 4, Funny

      Mr. Williamson promptly left Apple headquarters in Antarctica, and walked to his home in Middelfart, Denmark.

      10,000 miles on Google Maps, just 2 or three on Apple Maps...

    2. Re:Was it justified by tomknight · · Score: 5, Funny

      An escape goat? Is that the opposite of a Trojan horse?

      --
      Oh arse
    3. Re:Was it justified by Edgewize · · Score: 5, Interesting

      No. Failing to deliver a quality product isn't the problem. The problem is if you promise to deliver a quality product, and then you fail.

      It seems to me like Apple wouldn't have made the switch right away on iOS 6 if they weren't confident that the software was ready. Someone had to stand up and say, "This is ready" or "This is not ready". If Mr. Williamson was in charge of it, and he told his bosses with confidence that it was ready, he should be fired. That's pretty straightforward.

    4. Re:Was it justified by Ravaldy · · Score: 5, Funny

      Thanks. I'm French and honestly didn't know. Scapegoat looks better on paper :)

    5. Re:Was it justified by MickyTheIdiot · · Score: 5, Insightful

      The real idiocy here was the fact that there was some idiot executive that insisted that the wheel be reinvented. They let hatered of Google get in the way of day-to-day business here. They could of made sure the google maps were easy to use on their devices and spent the effort coming up with something that Android doesn't do instead.

      They should be firing the person that a "mapping team" was a good idea to begin with.

    6. Re:Was it justified by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Clearly you've never worked for a large company before.
      It wouldn't surprise me if he said over and over again "There's no way in hell this is ready", but they deployed it anyway.
      They probably also asked him "does it work at all?" to which he responded "sort of", and that was enough for them.
      That's how big companies work, they don't give a damn about your input.

    7. Re:Was it justified by Attila+Dimedici · · Score: 5, Informative

      No, scapegoat did not start with the Greeks. Scapegoat comes from the book of Leviticus where a goat was designated to be cast out into the desert as part of atonement for sins. The Greeks actually used a cripple, a beggar or a criminal for the practice you are thinking of, not a goat.

      --
      The truth is that all men having power ought to be mistrusted. James Madison
    8. Re:Was it justified by MightyYar · · Score: 5, Insightful

      You almost have it right. They certainly do ignore the worker bees who shout "it won't work", but they don't ignore management saying the same thing. Instead, people who never say "it won't work" slowly get promoted over people who do, and you end up with no one in management who will ever say "it won't work".

      I'm quite certain that this Mr. Williamson probably didn't say no to his bosses very often, and I don't particularly feel bad for him.

      --
      W..w..W - Willy Waterloo washes Warren Wiggins who is washing Waldo Woo.
    9. Re:Was it justified by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

      Google offered to do turn by turn navigation for the inclusion of google branding. I don't think it's unreasonable to be expected to give credit to a company who's product is contributing one of the most useful software features to your phone. Apple is just trying to position themselves to defeat Android. It's too late, and they've come to a desperate point where they're trying to do things they aren't currently capable of.

    10. Re:Was it justified by interkin3tic · · Score: 5, Insightful

      I don't know, it sounds more likely to me that it went
      "Rich, are the maps ready?"

      "What? No, we haven't finished testing."

      "Well, we told Google to fuck off this morning, so it's ready. Don't worry, I'll make sure everyone who matters knows that it went out too soon."

      (That afternoon in boardroom)

      "Yeah, Williamson assured me the maps were ready to go, so we told Google we weren't interested. My stock options just got a little sweeter."

    11. Re:Was it justified by History's+Coming+To · · Score: 4, Interesting

      Alternative source: a "scapegoat" was a hobbled goat left with a flock of sheep. As the (less valuable) goat couldn't run it would be taken down by an attacking wolf, leaving the more valuable livestock to escape.

      --
      Please consider this account deleted, I just can't be bothered with the spam anymore.
    12. Re:Was it justified by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      It's pretty likely that the practice didn't start with the bible, but was merely documented in the bible based on an existing practice. Unless, of course, you consider the bible to be Word of God, in which case maybe he did use the bible to instruct his followers to sacrifice goats. He was pretty weird back then.

    13. Re:Was it justified by shellbeach · · Score: 5, Insightful

      There was no way to get key features (turn-by-turn directions) without meeting google's demands (for more user data).

      No, but they could have met Google's demands in the short-term easily enough until they had an alternative ready for release, rather than rushing out something prematurely. When you're already losing market share hand over fist, why give people another reason to switch to Android?

    14. Re:Was it justified by Azure+Flash · · Score: 5, Funny

      I believe that is called a Netscapegoat.

    15. Re:Was it justified by shutdown+-p+now · · Score: 4, Interesting

      They had no control over the maps app from google

      The old iOS Maps app was written by Apple, actually. Google was only supplying the data.

      There was no way to get key features (turn-by-turn directions) without meeting google's demands (for more user data).

      The "more user data" part is bullshit. What Google asked is for them to add Latitude support to Maps. Latitude is an opt-in service that lets users (and therefore also Google) track each others' location. Unless users specifically enable it, no data is provided. And, personally, I find it a useful enough service that its absence in iOS Maps is actually a point against it.

    16. Re:Was it justified by wealthychef · · Score: 4, Insightful

      The thing is, the problem they are trying to fix is one they created purely out of a spiteful desire on Mr. Jobs' part to poke a finger in Googles' eye. It backfired and Apple looks foolish. I guess I have to say here that I love Apple but chasing Google Maps off the iPhone has to be one of the all time stupidest things they ever did.

      --
      Currently hooked on AMP
    17. Re:Was it justified by Zalbik · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I'm quite certain that this Mr. Williamson probably didn't say no to his bosses very often, and I don't particularly feel bad for him.

      Quite certain? Really? Quite certain?

      And on what, pray tell, do you base this certainty? Did you work for Mr. Williamson? Had you prior dealings with him? Have you worked for Apple and know their management style?

      Or is it just some self-justifying "this is the way I believe the world works, and I'm going to cover my ears and shout 'LA LA LA' ever time it doesn't"

      I'm quite certain the sun will rise tomorrow.
      I somewhat certain that it'll snow later this week
      I think that the LHC probably found the Higgs Boson.
      I have to f'ing clue whether Richard Williamson was a yes man or not.
      And neither do you.

    18. Re:Was it justified by mjwx · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I'm quite certain that this Mr. Williamson probably didn't say no to his bosses very often, and I don't particularly feel bad for him.

      Quite certain? Really? Quite certain?

      And on what, pray tell, do you base this certainty?

      The fact his bosses have openly and publicly acted like complete self adsorbed sociopath and will attack people who tell them they are wrong. The saying "Steve Jobs did not suffer fools" means that Steve Jobs did not like hearing things that he didn't want to hear.

      Look at Job's actions towards Google and Android OEM's, then get back to us. If that's not enough, go back to Antennagate when he told his own customers that they were the problem. If you don't understand the answer to your question by then, you have a problem.

      --
      Calling someone a "hater" only means you can not rationally rebut their argument.
  2. Impossible by Covalent · · Score: 5, Funny

    "Mr. Williamson promptly left Apple headquarters in Antarctica, and walked to his home in Middelfart, Denmark."

    That's impossible. Apple maps says Middelfart is south of Antarctica. Sheesh.

    --
    Great warrior...hrmph! Wars not make one great.
  3. I like the new maps.. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Personally I still like the new maps app. Even on my old iphone4 it's faster and easier to read and does everything I want. It's even got more features than the previous map app.
    Then again, I live in California and don't suffer from the bad map issues that other regions have had.

    Let's hope apple learns from this lesson. Old Jobs hasn't been in the ground long and already their first "convenience over QC" choice has come back to bite them. Jobs was a QC /fanatic/ and would not have let the shitty maps slip out (Or stay there for long) even if staying with google was a thorn in their side.

    And it was a thorn. Google is a competitor now. Google also wanted better terms if apple wanted to add new mapping features. Apple decided that it was not worth it.. And they were wrong.

    I think if Jobs was still here he'd have slapped people around, re-negotiated with Google, and quickly have a patch issued to revert the maps. We'll see if apple continues to stumble in this very un-apple like manner.

    With any luck google will issue a new maps app and everyone will be happy.

    1. Re:I like the new maps.. by ColdWetDog · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Jobs was a QC /fanatic/ ... .

      You definition of either Quality Control or fanatic differs from mine. In particular, Apple has NEVER been about QC. You don't buy Rev 1 of anything Apple unless you are a dyed in wool fanboy. You don't load x.x.0 of any Apple OS unless you are a dyed in wool masochist.

      Yeah, Apple eventually gets it right, mostly. But they've never adhered to the 'fix it before it ships' mentality.

      --
      Faster! Faster! Faster would be better!
  4. Keep the firing going by slashmydots · · Score: 5, Funny

    Some people tried to take a photo with their iPhone 5 of him leaving Apple headquarters but there was a huge purple flare over most of it so you can't even tell who it is. They must have been holding it wrong or the sun in that part of the US actually is purple.

  5. Google Maps was bad when it first appeared by GreatDrok · · Score: 4, Informative

    I was a frequent user of MapQuest when Google Maps appeared and for a good while there were glitches with Google Maps just like Apple is experiencing so I stuck with MapQuest. Google Maps are only as good as they are now because of all the time invested but even now they get it wrong. I was visiting a friend in Alabama and Google put his street address two miles away from the actual location.

    The major loss with Apple Maps is the lack of public transport directions and for that reason alone, Google Maps needs to return. Until then, my phone is staying on iOS 5.

    --
    "I have the attention span of a strobe lit goldfish, please get to the point quickly!"
  6. Re:Wrong problem? by BasilBrush · · Score: 4, Informative

    It would have been wiser to let it mature a bit more like Google did.

    Huh? Google maps was full of errors and omissions when it came out. It improved over the years.

  7. Re:Lessons by MachDelta · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Apple shot themselves in the foot on this.

    Option A) was to negotiate with Google (which they did) and accept paying more money and letting Google put their logo somewhere (which they didn't).

    Option B) was to to let it ride with no navigation (their contract with Google for just map data still had a year or two left before renewal) and work on their own map/nav system in the meantime, launching it when it was ready or the contract was up.

    Option C) was to abandon common sense, drop Google because they are evil, and quickly roll their own "superior" map/nav system on a greatly accelerated timespan. And pray that it's not a horrible, brand-damaging mess. Oops!

  8. Taking the fall... by erp_consultant · · Score: 5, Insightful

    The problem wasn't so much that the Apple maps were terrible. With a few notable exceptions it actually wasn't bad for a first attempt. Remember, Google Maps wasn't very good at first either. The problem was promoting the Apple Maps as this awesome, fantastic piece of software. Someone in the Apple management chain needed to say "Uh Tim, maybe we should dial back the excitement a bit on this maps thing. Have you seen it? It needs work.". Evidently nobody did so Cook rolled it out thinking it was great and it wasn't.

    Cook looks like an idiot, and by extension so does Apple, so something had to be done about it. He can't allow that to happen. If they lie to him about Maps then how can he trust them to tell him the truth about the next product? If I were him I would have done exactly the same thing. He needs to send a message to management that this sort of thing won't be tolerated. If the product is not ready then fine, we'll figure out something but don't bullshit me and leave me hanging out to dry in front our customers. It might seem harsh but these people are getting paid a ton of money to make the right decisions. If you screw up you're gone.

  9. Tim Cook next? by TheSkepticalOptimist · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Anybody thinking Tim Cook should remain CEO of Apple needs their head read.

    I think that is wasn't the man in charge of Maps that should have gotten the ax, but the guy that decided to drop a working product in favor of a broken product and then stood on a stage and claimed it was better then all the rest.

    I know the decision to drop Google Maps all began with Steve Jobs, however after his passing and Tim Cook taking over certainly there should have been some review of the companies projects to determine if Apple should stay on the same course. At some point I am sure someone must have fired up the Maps app and realized it was no-where near ready for prime-time.

    If Tim Cook is going to blindly follow in Jobs footsteps and not make any executive decision that didn't originate from something Jobs began then I think he should step down or be ousted. Any sane CEO should have yanked the Maps product from the iOS 6 release schedule for lacking to match the quality of the app it was replacing. Yes, maybe it would have looked like egg on his face for postponing a highly publicized new feature, but it would have been far less worse then issuing an apology for releasing the app in the first place.

    And what the f*ck about iTunes 11? There is only 2 days left in November and Apple still proudly boasts it is coming in November. Just like they proudly boasted it was coming in October. I think iTunes 11 is another fiasco in the making.

    You can't just keep firing your top exec's without realizing that that man at top needs to start taking responsibility for the state of the company he is supposedly running. Apple doesn't need a caretaker, it needs a leader, Cook is not a leader.

    --
    I haven't thought of anything clever to put here, but then again most of you haven't either.
  10. You forgot option D by dutchwhizzman · · Score: 5, Interesting

    Option D: They could have straight forward have bought Tom Tom and use their application. TomTom's own devices that use the same map information had no trouble navigating where Apple was leading you nowhere. At the current share price it would be affordable for Apple to buy it and it would buy them an entrance into the dashboard of several large brands, that are already using built-in TomTom navigation devices.

    --
    I was promised a flying car. Where is my flying car?
  11. Not reinvention, freedom. by SuperKendall · · Score: 4, Insightful

    They let hatered of Google get in the way of day-to-day business here.

    Actually the opposite is true. They let reliance on Google go on for too long, using it as a crutch that hurt day-to-day business for years.

    Android had built-in turn by turn for years; not only could Apple not provide it in iOS, but developers could not write apps that provided turn-by-turn directions on top of the built in iOS mapping framework (it was against Google's TOS). So the whole platform was limited for years by Google restrictions on not just what Apple could do, but what any developer could do.

    Now that Google is out of the picture iOS users have turn by turn directions. They have vector maps. iOS developers can do whatever they want with the built in mapping framework now, without arbitrary Google limitations like limits on reverse geocoding per day, or having to avoid covering up the Google logo on the map, or (as stated) being able to show turn by turn directions on a map.

    Apple should have ditched Google maps much earlier before it got more painful for more users. But the fact is they had to do so, and at least now that it is done Apple can clean up the map data (the hardest part of mapping) and within a year should be essentially caught up for most areas. Already they have better satellite data in many areas than Google does, and they work better in China/Japan for native users (not as well for english users).

    --
    "There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
    1. Re:Not reinvention, freedom. by flimflammer · · Score: 4, Insightful

      You think in a year, Apple is going to be caught up to Google who has been constantly working on their mapping data all this time? You vastly underestimate the effort required in this type of job.

    2. Re:Not reinvention, freedom. by farble1670 · · Score: 4, Informative

      Android had built-in turn by turn for years; not only could Apple not provide it in iOS, but developers could not write apps that provided turn-by-turn directions on top of the built in iOS mapping framework (it was against Google's TOS). So the whole platform was limited for years by Google restrictions on not just what Apple could do, but what any developer could do.

      do you think a company should get paid for the software they develop and the services they offer? apple didn't have turn-by-turn navigation because google refused to offer it, it's because apple wouldn't meet the licensing requirements. as far as any of us know and has been reported, the main sticking point was apple refused to have (more prominent) google branding on the app.

  12. Lots of people fired at Apple under Jobs by SuperKendall · · Score: 4, Informative

    I can't recall too many high profile firings during Steve Jobs tenure

    You mean like Mark Papermaster over the iPhone 4 antenna issues? Or the Mobile Me team lead?

    Oh.

    Has everyone here got some kind of amnesia? Because Jobs stories are rife with him firing people that displeased him. The current firings seem quite mild by comparison.

    Oddly people now seem to think Apple under Steve Jobs was some kind of perfect mecca of products without issues and never an employee fired. That was never the case, but Apple Haters sure like to claim it was.

    --
    "There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
  13. Not so by Kupfernigk · · Score: 4, Insightful
    That is what we call an ex post facto justification. I don't think that stoning people to death for a bit of nooky comes under "how to live a healthy life".

    Leviticus is a complete mishmash of prohibitions, but at least some of them are believed to be simply banning the practices of non-Jahwist religions, and others are deeply rooted in the concept of women as property which still applies in the more backward parts of the Middle East. It's about as realistic as telling us that the Orpheus myth is a warning about the dire consequences of eating food in basement restaurants.

    --
    From scarped cliff or quarried stone she cries "A thousand types are gone, I care for nothing, no not one."
  14. Re:iOS Google maps ALREADY had branding by shutdown+-p+now · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Because they do NOTHING to help users. You know, the poor bastards that actually have to use the maps? How does it help to hide more map data under a bigger logo? How does it help to push a location based social media system no-one uses through the official maps app?

    No-one has entitled you to speak for all the users. I am a heavy Latitude user. If I still owned an Apple device, I'd use Latitude with Maps if it was available there.

    Besides, the whole "doesn't help the users" argument as it pertains to iOS Maps debacle is completely inane, since switching to obviously inferior-quality data not only did nothing to help the users, it did a lot to hurt them - hence all the vocal backlash from the userbase that is trivial to find online. And what, exactly, the users get in return? A pretty but ultimately mostly useless ability to see 3D buildings in satellite mode, and?..